Grey Host/NA AD getting low population bonus while all factions are full populations

TechMaybeHic

Seems AD is getting focused now. Maybe because of this whether on purpose or not.

Delphinia

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

AD has been the highest pop faction the entire day, now having held emp almost 5hrs.

Interesting. Just curious, did you happen to notice if the "bonus" was actually factored into the eval for final scoring? The time I checked and took screen shots was right before eval and after.

AD in fact, did not receive the points. EP and AD both received lower points than those that were showing and DC ended up receiving more upon final eval.

I did submit that report to ZoS for their own investigation.

So, although I've seen the symbol/icon appear for the low pop, it seems that it does not always apply to the final eval score.

I really wish they'd fix this as just the accusations and conspiracy theories alone are excuse enough for some players to partake in double teaming.

Agrippa_Invisus

A couple days ago I watched the points values before and after while the Low Pop bonus was active. If the Low Pop was active at the moment of the eval, the beneficiaries of the Low Pop bonus did, indeed, receive full value with the low pop bonus.

I didn't take any before/after screenshots because, frankly, I was disgusted by the whole system at that point, but I assure you if the bonus is in place right as the eval happens, whomever has the bonus gets the points.

Let's be clear here -- I don't think there's any particular group or faction that's deliberately exploiting it. It's too haphazard and too obvious at this point.

I don't think 'Oh XYZ guilds are doing it. Or XYZ faction has it all organized." I may have moaned about it in zone at one point, but I'm well beyond that rational, and I admit I've always kvetched more than I should let myself.

That it's happening on other platforms as well shows that this is system yet another systemic failure of ZOS's pvp system. It's unraveling at the seams more and more every single day. Between the lag that worsens as the player base shrinks, the play balance being circumspect at the best of times, the rewards being uninspiring on a good day, and now even the vaguest hint at "fair" results being a ghost of a memory, I don't know what to tell you as a PVPer. How do you keep your optimism at this point any more?

That they've gone utterly radio silent and not at least said 'we are investigating this issue' is a criminal failure of customer service on top of things. Talk to us, ZOS, please. Most of us are paying customers (for reasons beyond my comprehension at this point).

TechMaybeHic

Delphinia wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

AD has been the highest pop faction the entire day, now having held emp almost 5hrs.

Interesting. Just curious, did you happen to notice if the "bonus" was actually factored into the eval for final scoring? The time I checked and took screen shots was right before eval and after.

AD in fact, did not receive the points. EP and AD both received lower points than those that were showing and DC ended up receiving more upon final eval.

I did submit that report to ZoS for their own investigation.

So, although I've seen the symbol/icon appear for the low pop, it seems that it does not always apply to the final eval score.

I really wish they'd fix this as just the accusations and conspiracy theories alone are excuse enough for some players to partake in double teaming.

The person you quoted posted 2 sets of screenshots with.campaign timers. Looks to be less than 2 hours apart and AD earned almost 600 points.

Which is odd as it's neither the amount of 2 evals nor 1 eval but certainly more than a regular score would be after 2

Really doesn't matter. It causes toxic responses in the player base to see one faction running roughshod over the map AND showing a pop bonus

xylena_lazarow

Delphinia wrote: »

Just curious, did you happen to notice if the "bonus" was actually factored into the eval for final scoring?

The 2nd pair of screenshots shows AD moving into 1st from a 380+ Low Pop eval tick, after they had been the dominant faction (with emp and 4 scrolls) for well more than the supposed 3hr interval for which Low Pop is calculated. The bonuses shown in the 1st pair of screenshots did disappear before the corresponding eval tick, but...

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

Really doesn't matter. It causes toxic responses in the player base to see one faction running roughshod over the map AND showing a pop bonus

Yea that sums it up pretty well.

Delphinia

@Agrippa_Invisus and @xylena_lazarow thanks for sharing your perspective. I appreciate you taking the stance that it's not a singular faction concocting some diabolical mastermind plot to throw the scores. There is enough drama in the world (and unfortunately, in games) that we really don't need more of it here.

As I mentioned, I also took screenshots, as I have just recently come back to the game and the forums and saw the immense amount of confusion and allegations (which as has been pointed out, causes a great deal of “toxicity”). Of course, it is always there in this pvp realm, but it’s just one more thing adding fuel to the fire.

I happened to be on and took notice of the “bonus” right at final eval and about 29 mins after just to see if AD actually did receive it. I posted both of those to the other thread about this already and sent to zos.
Unlike your experience, @Agrippa_Invisus , these shots show AD did not in fact receive the bonus. I understand from what you saw @Agrippa_Invisus, that this was not the case. I only took screenshots as proof as why would anyone have reason to believe me? Plus, I wanted to have something for zos to use to investigate.

Thank you again for sharing your experiences with this @Agrippa_Invisus and @xylena_lazarow . As we can see from the numerous complaints and accusations towards AD, this needs to be rectified by zos in order for these players to play without the added toxic behavior this seems to have instilled further into their game.

@TechMaybeHic , those shots @xylena_lazarow took, were yes, about two hours apart. The curious part was what did zos' "calculations" come up with for the eval in between? I understand the intent of sharing those. I was wondering about the missing eval. If you can see the "bonus" reflected in the final scoring. I do appreciate her clarification and expanded response to my inquiry.
My point in sharing mine is that it shows the accusations are false. The "bonus" was not reflected in the final score. This is a confusion among players yes, but a manipulation by one faction, it is not.

Unfortunately, the entity we need to do the research on this and communicate their findings is either not ready to share, or perhaps just as confused as the rest of us. I would like to think, the former. They may choose not to communicate, but rather are working on a fix as we speak. However, until such time, all we can do is to try and have some understanding and tolerance; not continue to poison each other's minds with conspiracy.

Kordai

Ad got low pop bonus at 3 bars while dc didn't at 1 bar...

Agrippa_Invisus

Locked AD, 2 bars both EP and DC.

AD got the bonus for multiple evals in a row, jumping right into first, then proceeded to gate camp for an hour with their locked pop.

This is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, ZOS.

maxjapank

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Locked AD, 2 bars both EP and DC.

AD got the bonus for multiple evals in a row, jumping right into first, then proceeded to gate camp for an hour with their locked pop.

This is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, ZOS.

2 hours later. EP has pop advantage. Along with DC, they double team AD. Get all scrolls back. Currently AD has no population and tri-keeps and scrolls soon to be gone. That is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, either. And it's a daily recurrence.

TechMaybeHic

maxjapank wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Locked AD, 2 bars both EP and DC.

AD got the bonus for multiple evals in a row, jumping right into first, then proceeded to gate camp for an hour with their locked pop.

This is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, ZOS.

2 hours later. EP has pop advantage. Along with DC, they double team AD. Get all scrolls back. Currently AD has no population and tri-keeps and scrolls soon to be gone. That is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, either. And it's a daily recurrence.

That's been a daily occurrence because of how this low pop thing, however it happens; tends to land AD. You know that right?

maxjapank

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Locked AD, 2 bars both EP and DC.

AD got the bonus for multiple evals in a row, jumping right into first, then proceeded to gate camp for an hour with their locked pop.

This is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, ZOS.

2 hours later. EP has pop advantage. Along with DC, they double team AD. Get all scrolls back. Currently AD has no population and tri-keeps and scrolls soon to be gone. That is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, either. And it's a daily recurrence.

That's been a daily occurrence because of how this low pop thing, however it happens; tends to land AD. You know that right?

No, mate. It's been a daily occurrence even before this pop thing. If you played during that timezone, you'd know that.

TechMaybeHic

maxjapank wrote: »

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Locked AD, 2 bars both EP and DC.

AD got the bonus for multiple evals in a row, jumping right into first, then proceeded to gate camp for an hour with their locked pop.

This is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, ZOS.

2 hours later. EP has pop advantage. Along with DC, they double team AD. Get all scrolls back. Currently AD has no population and tri-keeps and scrolls soon to be gone. That is not a fun, enjoyable play experience, either. And it's a daily recurrence.

That's been a daily occurrence because of how this low pop thing, however it happens; tends to land AD. You know that right?

No, mate. It's been a daily occurrence even before this pop thing. If you played during that timezone, you'd know that.

Yeah honestly not sure about those hours. Prime time EST; I know it used to be pushes between Ash to Roe, Ales to Chal back and forth for DC, but it's been often all fighting at AD tri keeps a lot more often lately

starlizard70ub17_ESO

Minnesinger wrote: »

NordSwordnBoard wrote: »

Speculation:
1 - If you only had 1 bar or less
2 - Take two full alliance groups or more into a delve before every or every other eval is taken
3 - Remain at/extend low pop buff until the groups refuse to enter delves near prime time.

The server thinks your pop is lower than it is because the real number were in a delve which is not Cyro technically. Most refuse to believe the enemy can be that organized. I'm not sure myself.
The people who play all day/night long, pushing for Emp and such see this stuff happen in real time. Just a little info from devs here would end some toxic banter and at least give some insight.

And this speculation has caused DC to enter the delves in the hope of catching these groups. Any luck yet?

Thought so

So that's why I see so many DC in delves when I'm just farming bosses there.

adirondack

I’m glad some people still believe the campaign score is important. It shows dedication and support for the game.

Unfortunately I have lost all dedication and care I ever felt. I don’t play competitively any longer.

I hope ZOS fixes this on going issue and follows the suggestions Izy made years ago for a dynamic scoring system.

I do hope everyone enjoys their playtime, whatever form that takes.

xFocused

Currently on PS4/5 GH NA it's EP controlling the entire map with all 6 scrolls as well. They even had 3 bars and a queue at 3am the other day, lol. I'm a AD player and while I'm sure there might be a glitch or something causing AD to have low pop, it's also because we genuinely don't have the number of players online that EP and DC have. Even when it's showing AD with 3 bars, that's usually not the case. Just look at any big keep fight and we're very much outnumbered

ilander

Hi,
The low population bonus from what i can make out is a 24hr calculation, not the last 3 evaluations so if the population was low "yesterday" then the low pop bonus will trigger "tomorrow" at the same time if you get what i mean.
PC/EU Gray Host had it for ages for Daggerfall Covenant until just over 3 or 4 months ago and was basically triggered by having 2 bars population when another faction is poplocked. Any more than 2 bars and it wasn't happening.
This meant that all the sweats and ap hunters etc were appearing on the server for that specific hour then would disappear off the server the following hour so each day, the low pop bonus was staggered but regularevery day because the population would only increase for the low pop bonus in the first place then drop again for the following hour.
It is pretty clear that some people have known how to manipulate this since at least 2015 so it is nothing new that this causes what some see as an imbalance in scoring etc.

With the low score bonus, from what i've seen in over 8 yrs in cyro, it is something that appears close to the start of the campaign then just stops appearing so it is likely that this is calculated as a % amount where a score difference of 800 to 3000 is bigger than a score of 15000 to 20000 despite the second score having a larger deficit of actual points. Let's be honest, some of the score differences at the start of the final week are tens of thousands and even with low score bonus, there's no chance of winning but there's still no low score bonus but in the first few days, the worst faction tend to get it at least a few times.