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Overland Content Feedback Thread
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disky✭✭✭✭✭
Counterpoint: For some players, the fun is in putting together a build that is most effective. It is like solving a puzzle, and seeing higher damage numbers is satisfying to a lot of them. For other players (myself included), the fun is the challenge itself, seeing how far you can push yourself and still defeat the boss.
Just because we like harder content or are running more optimal builds, doesn't mean we're not having fun.
Yeah, exactly this. You should be able to find fun in a game while utilizing every tool that the game provides to you, and that includes challenge. Builds are a big part of what people who like challenging content find enjoyable about the game, and telling them that they should deliberately hobble themselves in order to have fun is misunderstanding the perspective entirely.3 -
Nilandia✭✭✭
I was more replying to your specific choice of words.
Counterpoint: For some players, the fun is in putting together a build that is most effective. It is like solving a puzzle, and seeing higher damage numbers is satisfying to a lot of them. For other players (myself included), the fun is the challenge itself, seeing how far you can push yourself and still defeat the boss.
Just because we like harder content or are running more optimal builds, doesn't mean we're not having fun.
That’s not a counter to my point, it’s a sidestep of my point.
Let’s say there is a game with 10 classes, and one of those 10 has by far the best numbers and can do the hardest content, while the other 9 lag far behind. Some people may have fun playing that 1 class so they can have the biggest numbers and do the hardest content, but the choice of class itself isn’t based on what class feels the most fun.
Having 90% of builds/playstyles lag far behind to the point they cannot do the content is functionally equivalent.
"I'm glad someone on the pro increased difficulty side is acknowledging that the game is only easy if a player limits themselves to specific builds/playstyles instead of doing what is fun."
Your wording here implies that you can run an optimized build or you can do something fun. My reply was to point out that, for some people, running the optimized build is the fun thing. I don't know if it was your intention with your words, since text can easily fail at conveying one's actual meaning, but I wanted to clarify.
I would agree with you on the idea of certain classes far outperforming others, though. Ideally, all classes should be competitive rather than a select few outclassing (sorry) the rest.1 -
Deserrick✭✭✭
I was more replying to your specific choice of words.
Counterpoint: For some players, the fun is in putting together a build that is most effective. It is like solving a puzzle, and seeing higher damage numbers is satisfying to a lot of them. For other players (myself included), the fun is the challenge itself, seeing how far you can push yourself and still defeat the boss.
Just because we like harder content or are running more optimal builds, doesn't mean we're not having fun.
That’s not a counter to my point, it’s a sidestep of my point.
Let’s say there is a game with 10 classes, and one of those 10 has by far the best numbers and can do the hardest content, while the other 9 lag far behind. Some people may have fun playing that 1 class so they can have the biggest numbers and do the hardest content, but the choice of class itself isn’t based on what class feels the most fun.
Having 90% of builds/playstyles lag far behind to the point they cannot do the content is functionally equivalent.
"I'm glad someone on the pro increased difficulty side is acknowledging that the game is only easy if a player limits themselves to specific builds/playstyles instead of doing what is fun."
Your wording here implies that you can run an optimized build or you can do something fun. My reply was to point out that, for some people, running the optimized build is the fun thing. I don't know if it was your intention with your words, since text can easily fail at conveying one's actual meaning, but I wanted to clarify.
I would agree with you on the idea of certain classes far outperforming others, though. Ideally, all classes should be competitive rather than a select few outclassing (sorry) the rest.
That was not my intention, and I appreciate you telling me how much wording came across. So many conversations spiral because there was no idea that the core of the argument was a miscommunication.
My intention was the same as choosing a class in my other example. Some people may genuinely find the gameplay of the 1 overpowered class the most fun, and some people may feel neutrally about how the classes play and find fun in getting the biggest numbers and the most content; but the game is only easy if people limit themselves to that 1 class instead of just doing whatever class they find to be fun.
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ChaoticWings3✭✭✭I'm just going to post my comment from a previous topic since it got closed because I wasn't aware of this one. Mostly doing this since I still think it had good points and typing out everything again to say it on here would take too long.
From my previous post:
I should just mention that we don't know yet how overland difficulty is planned to be implemented and how hard it would actually be. Until we have more information we can only speculate so nothing is truly set in stone. Personally on my end I would prefer the overland at times to be a bit harder (like have story bosses have about the same amount of health as the first cycle boss in the infinite archive so I don't kill them in 5 seconds like I have been. The amount of build up to a major let down battle makes me feel like I entered an episode of One Punch Man. I really shouldn't be forced to light attack......every.....5.....seconds to keep an all powerful entity alive to be slightly perceived as a threat to the world) but I don't want to have overland content be completely changed for everyone at the same time. I sometimes just like to chill and relax with the game and being able to not worry about combat while during surveys tends to be fairly relaxing when I'm doing the task.
The best way I can see something implemented for overland content is by using a shrine to issue a buff/debuff system that alters the scaling algorithm for your current character. It honestly can work similarly to how the infinite archive gets harder over time. Probably have a difficulty between 1 to 5. 1 being pretty much what we have now and 5 either being around the 1st arc or 2nd arc difficulty of the infinite archive but now spread across the overland. 2 through 4 will be a middle ground if 5 is too hard and 1 is too easy. Think like around the level of craglorn at level 3 (again speculation). I would then say having an increase drop rate of gold, higher tier loot, and maybe some collectibles from doing the harder levels of difficulty would be a good incentive to trying out or possibly staying with the higher difficulty.
That is kind of what I wish would happen within reason. Realistically the difficulty I envision for the toughest level may be made easier. I don't think the developers want to have the content be so hard that it would push newer players away. If they did implement an all around difficulty increase I would say it wouldn't go higher then what craglorn is now which I think is a pretty decent difficulty level.
Again all we have at the moment is speculation until there is more clarification. Which unfortunately probably means we won't know until April.1