Pets and werewolves in bg

DaoFeiLung

It is pretty stupid. If you are facing a team with 2 or 3 werewolves and a sorc, they will have 6 pets, + atronach, + sometimes the daedroth helmet. You can't focus any player, usually the werewolves only run in circles spamming LA, and a lot have Grothdarr so they can hit you hard while they don't need to aim at all.

I know , ww players will come and say L2P, but there is absolutly no skill at all needed in this pet gameplay, you just run and let your pet and random LA do the kills, while taking little to no single target dmg. It' s really becoming an issue.


It's more a nerf pets than nerf ww thread by the way, ww are strong but have weaknesses, but fighting a team with 6 to 8 pets kills all the fun, imho.

Aurielle

I’ve been saying this for ages now. Stacked pet groups that hide behind their zoos are so frustrating to play against. The werewolf pet groups are bad, but the sorc groups with twilights, scamps, Maw of the Infernal, Storm Atro, and Knight Slayer are the worst. They just heavy attack and Endless Fury their way to an easy, skill-less win because no one can target them through twelve pets while also dealing with a ton of Oblivion damage and Implosion procs. Worst of all? That feeling when you try to burst one of the sorcs down and a pet eats your ultimate...

Targeting priority in PVP zones needs to change.

brandonv516

Not even worth it to come out and fight on my Magicka NB when I get matchups like this.

There's too many pets that get in the way of the target I want and if I try to Cloak to get away, a lot of the time the pets still follow you (wolves especially).

Betty_Booms

Sadly, due to matriarch being the only useful heal mag sorcs have we are forced into at least the one pet. I generally only run the matriach unless I am feeling a bit trolly.

I would prefer the heal to be a seperate skill and i wouldnt run a pet at all. Would also free up a much needed skill spot.
Knight slayer is a pretty underwhelming set. I would personally think frost blockade with torugs and infused would be better to kite ppl around your pets whilst doing much oblivion damage.

The trick for me to killing other pet sorcs is to get up close and pressure them. Stick right on them. They have limited skills to burst you down due to pets taking the slots.

I do understand the frustration though. I have seen whole groups run from my daedroth and I was like....why? Lol.

bardx86

Zoo specs are the most wuss spec of them all.

We had a saying back in EQ. "Those that are good a PVP do, those that aren't summon pets."

kalunte

i think the actual meta with aoe-zerg group (spin2win, frost-storm wardens, jab spamers) can solve your problem. pack well, aoe for dmg, aoe for heal, and you shouldnt matter so much about pet. you may miss a few light attacks for sure, but this wont be a great loss

barshemm

Tab target

jediodyn_ESO

Not really just about WW. Ignore pet targeting option for single target attacks in pvp needs to be a thing. Many other threads have been made on why, with the community overall agreeing that abusing pets from monster helms and sorc zoos is poor gameplay, and promotes worse counterplay.

jcm2606

barshemm wrote: »

Tab target

To quote myself from an earlier thread:

In which case you fight the targeting system to tab-target the player, taking us right back to square one. Believe me, when you're having issues targeting players through a field of pets, tab-targeting wastes so much time, just trying to tab onto the player, let alone target them.

When fighting against some random dude with pets who isn't exactly abusing the targeting issues (by weaving in and out of their pets to throw off targeting), you can maybe tab-target them, but you really have to be paying attention, which puts you at risk.

When fighting against somebody who knows the game has targeting issues with pets, knows it can be exploited, and knows how to exploit it? Actually impossible to tab-target them.

So, yeah, no, tab-targeting isn't the solution. Either have an option to ignore pet targeting, or just remove it altogether. To quote myself from that same thread with regards to removing targeting:

Nobody in their right mind intentionally targets pets in their current state. Aurielle is right, it is far more efficient to just kill whoever owns the pets, because they generally go down far quicker than the pets do.

jediodyn_ESO

Tab targeting doesn’t work in PvP on console.

validifyedneb18_ESO

Werewolves only seem to be an issue in sub-50 where they have overtuned self-sustain and decent damage seemingly without even having the gear to back it up. At max level where other players can expect to be geared, they're no longer overtuned compared to their opponents.

Aurielle

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Werewolves only seem to be an issue in sub-50 where they have overtuned self-sustain and decent damage seemingly without even having the gear to back it up. At max level where other players can expect to be geared, they're no longer overtuned compared to their opponents.

The issue is not that werewolves are “OP”; the issue is that multiple werewolves with pets out make targeting a nightmare. So many direwolves have eaten single target ultimates not intended for them... SO MANY.

As I’ve said in another thread: PVP stands for “player versus player”, not “player versus pet.”

validifyedneb18_ESO

Aurielle wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Werewolves only seem to be an issue in sub-50 where they have overtuned self-sustain and decent damage seemingly without even having the gear to back it up. At max level where other players can expect to be geared, they're no longer overtuned compared to their opponents.

The issue is not that werewolves are “OP”; the issue is that multiple werewolves with pets out make targeting a nightmare. So many direwolves have eaten single target ultimates not intended for them... SO MANY.

As I’ve said in another thread: PVP stands for “player versus player”, not “player versus pet.”

ah, well thats fair, rarely ever seen a second WW in the same match myself. But I can imagine its an issue, ESO really wasn't designed for tab targeting no matter how many people come here and shout it.

wheem_ESO

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Werewolves only seem to be an issue in sub-50 where they have overtuned self-sustain and decent damage seemingly without even having the gear to back it up. At max level where other players can expect to be geared, they're no longer overtuned compared to their opponents.

If they're exploiting Torug's Pact the damage is absolutely overtuned.

Aurielle

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Werewolves only seem to be an issue in sub-50 where they have overtuned self-sustain and decent damage seemingly without even having the gear to back it up. At max level where other players can expect to be geared, they're no longer overtuned compared to their opponents.

The issue is not that werewolves are “OP”; the issue is that multiple werewolves with pets out make targeting a nightmare. So many direwolves have eaten single target ultimates not intended for them... SO MANY.

As I’ve said in another thread: PVP stands for “player versus player”, not “player versus pet.”

ah, well thats fair, rarely ever seen a second WW in the same match myself. But I can imagine its an issue, ESO really wasn't designed for tab targeting no matter how many people come here and shout it.

Precisely. Targeting is especially useless on console. You have to hold down one button (in my case, the left directional button) for one second to highlight a player to achieve what is known as “tab targeting” on PC. In order to do that, the player has to be squarely located in your targeting reticule for the entire duration of that second. If the player slips behind a pet while you’re attempting to target them, you end up wasting a GCD on highlighting the pet. This is abused frequently on console. There are sorcerers who use their scamp, their twilight, their storm atronach, and Maw of the Infernal in BGs. Some of these sorcs form premades with this setup. If timed appropriately, there can be up to twelve pets tightly clustered around four players who simply heavy attack and spam executes. It’s completely ridiculous.

cheifsoap

Yeah, I'm fully convinced that WW premades is more cheese than sloads in BGs

Aurielle

cheifsoap wrote: »

Yeah, I'm fully convinced that WW premades is more cheese than sloads in BGs

People who hide behind pets are the worst. It makes me sad when they make themselves appear offline so you can’t even whisper them to ask if they want any wine to go with all their cheese... such skill-less cowards.

TheYKcid

Betty_Booms wrote: »

Sadly, due to matriarch being the only useful heal mag sorcs have we are forced into at least the one pet. I generally only run the matriach unless I am feeling a bit trolly.

We've played enough BGs together for you to know firsthand that non-pet Sorcs are entirely functional and can even dominate the match.

Zoo Sorcs are absolutely abusing the targeting system at the moment. I'm not sure what the ideal solution would be, but perhaps making an option in the game menu to disable targeting of pets might help. It would have to be toggleable, though, since some way wish to have the option (eg. to interrupt Engine Guardians).

Undefwun

jediodyn_ESO wrote: »

Not really just about WW. Ignore pet targeting option for single target attacks in pvp needs to be a thing. Many other threads have been made on why, with the community overall agreeing that abusing pets from monster helms and sorc zoos is poor gameplay, and promotes worse counterplay.

lol 'poor gameplay', bless your cotton socks...

People flock to poor game play. Rune Cage was broken. Magsorc numbers soared. Draining Shot is broken. Suddenly every bowtard is running it. Sload's was broken, what felt like at least half or more of BG players ran it... there is many more examples of this I am sure.

Most people don't care about 'good' game play, only the easiest way to get a kill. Unless ZOS makes changes, it is considered ok, good game play be damned. No one is going to 'self police' when there is always going to be some flop (ab)using broken mechanics.

And yes zoo sorcs are even more annoying than the shield stackers were. I had 2 zoo sorcs on opposing BG team who stuck together. 8 pets doing 'free' damage while you try to weave through them to get to the 2 cowards breaking LoS hiding in their zoo.

People suck. They suck even more online because no one can slap the taste out of their mouth..... get used to it or find a different hobby.

Weesacs

jediodyn_ESO wrote: »

Not really just about WW. Ignore pet targeting option for single target attacks in pvp needs to be a thing. Many other threads have been made on why, with the community overall agreeing that abusing pets from monster helms and sorc zoos is poor gameplay, and promotes worse counterplay.

This. I think it will become more apparent once they bring in a necro class. They need to implement ignore pet targeting or it will just get worst.

jediodyn_ESO

Aurielle wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Werewolves only seem to be an issue in sub-50 where they have overtuned self-sustain and decent damage seemingly without even having the gear to back it up. At max level where other players can expect to be geared, they're no longer overtuned compared to their opponents.

The issue is not that werewolves are “OP”; the issue is that multiple werewolves with pets out make targeting a nightmare. So many direwolves have eaten single target ultimates not intended for them... SO MANY.

As I’ve said in another thread: PVP stands for “player versus player”, not “player versus pet.”

ah, well thats fair, rarely ever seen a second WW in the same match myself. But I can imagine its an issue, ESO really wasn't designed for tab targeting no matter how many people come here and shout it.

Precisely. Targeting is especially useless on console. You have to hold down one button (in my case, the left directional button) for one second to highlight a player to achieve what is known as “tab targeting” on PC. In order to do that, the player has to be squarely located in your targeting reticule for the entire duration of that second. If the player slips behind a pet while you’re attempting to target them, you end up wasting a GCD on highlighting the pet. This is abused frequently on console. There are sorcerers who use their scamp, their twilight, their storm atronach, and Maw of the Infernal in BGs. Some of these sorcs form premades with this setup. If timed appropriately, there can be up to twelve pets tightly clustered around four players who simply heavy attack and spam executes. It’s completely ridiculous.

Even if you have a player targeted on console your attack will still be intercepted by pets. Targeting doesn’t seem to do work properly in Battlegrounds.

Betty_Booms

TheYKcid wrote: »

Betty_Booms wrote: »

Sadly, due to matriarch being the only useful heal mag sorcs have we are forced into at least the one pet. I generally only run the matriach unless I am feeling a bit trolly.

We've played enough BGs together for you to know firsthand that non-pet Sorcs are entirely functional and can even dominate the match.

Zoo Sorcs are absolutely abusing the targeting system at the moment. I'm not sure what the ideal solution would be, but perhaps making an option in the game menu to disable targeting of pets might help. It would have to be toggleable, though, since some way wish to have the option (eg. to interrupt Engine Guardians).

To be honest I prefer a more group centric play style where I can heal others and matriach is the only option for this.

I do agree with pet zoos being an issue though i have never had an issue taking down a full pet sorc.

Get_Packed

I play a magden so I can counter a petsorc pretty easiliy but i can see how a single target build would have issues with a petsorc.
Recently I have noticed petsorcs that have gone back and made their charaters physically smaller and will hide inside the avatar of one their pets. First time I saw that I so confused that all the pets were attacking me and and couldnt even see the petsorc. I sent a deep fissure into a pet and this petsorc midget dodgerolls “out” of his pets avatar, i was totally unaware at the time that the petsorc was even there. I just kinda assumed the pets were doing typical pet things by being on the other side of the map as their conjurer.

BuddyAces

Get_Packed wrote: »

I play a magden so I can counter a petsorc pretty easiliy but i can see how a single target build would have issues with a petsorc.
Recently I have noticed petsorcs that have gone back and made their charaters physically smaller and will hide inside the avatar of one their pets. First time I saw that I so confused that all the pets were attacking me and and couldnt even see the petsorc. I sent a deep fissure into a pet and this petsorc midget dodgerolls “out” of his pets avatar, i was totally unaware at the time that the petsorc was even there. I just kinda assumed the pets were doing typical pet things by being on the other side of the map as their conjurer.

If you think about that for a sec, that's pretty fricken hilarious.

WacArnold

Was there something on the patch notes about your pets getting the same damage and resists as you?

StarOfElyon

Betty_Booms wrote: »

Sadly, due to matriarch being the only useful heal mag sorcs have we are forced into at least the one pet. I generally only run the matriach unless I am feeling a bit trolly.

I would prefer the heal to be a seperate skill and i wouldnt run a pet at all. Would also free up a much needed skill spot.
Knight slayer is a pretty underwhelming set. I would personally think frost blockade with torugs and infused would be better to kite ppl around your pets whilst doing much oblivion damage.

The trick for me to killing other pet sorcs is to get up close and pressure them. Stick right on them. They have limited skills to burst you down due to pets taking the slots.

I do understand the frustration though. I have seen whole groups run from my daedroth and I was like....why? Lol.

Those things are a pain to deal with. I can't fight a sorc and his three or four summons with this thing breathing fire in my face.

StarOfElyon

I had to deal with a team like this the other night. I couldn't aim at all. It was so aggravating.

NyassaV

brandonv516 wrote: »

Not even worth it to come out and fight on my Magicka NB when I get matchups like this.

There's too many pets that get in the way of the target I want and if I try to Cloak to get away, a lot of the time the pets still follow you (wolves especially).

Just stop playing mNB, I went to stamblade. I should've a long time ago but healing ward was the last straw.

Trinity_Is_My_Name

LOL. This is good stuff!

jediodyn_ESO

How hard is it really to make this a toggle option?

They are changing at least one “proc set” pet next patch to not be targeted.

If they can’t toggle them on or off just get rid of them being targeted. It’s ridiculous how much damage mitigation even one pet gives a player. Targeting system + pet movement is super aggravating.

PvP pls, not PvUI

StarOfElyon

Don't you love it when you try to execute a player on low health but your beam hits the pet BEHIND YOU instead of the target in front of you?