Shield Breaker in ESO 4.2 and beyond

zyk

Damage shields in ESO used to be very contentious. They allowed for Max Magicka builds, especially Sorcs, to have very high damage and stack very large shields.

As a counter to these very strong builds, ZOS introduced the Shield Breaker set which has the following 5 piece bonus:

(5 items) When you deal damage with a Light or Heavy Attack against a Player with a damage shield, you deal an additional 2150 Oblivion Damage to them.

As a reminder, Oblivion Damage cannot be mitigated in any way and is not affected by the 50% damage reduction of Battle Spirit.

In 4.2, ZOS dramatically changed how Damage Shields function:

- Max shield cap of 40-50% of max health
- You can now deal a Critical Strike against an enemy with a damage shield.
- Your Spell and Physical Resistance now reduces incoming damage before it is applied to your damage shield.
- Poisons and Weapon Enchantments can now proc even if the damage done by the Light Attack, Heavy Attack, or Weapon Ability is fully absorbed by a damage shield.

Also consider that Shield Breaker doesn't only impact shield builds, but any build that might gain an incidental shield; for example, a Stam DK using the Obsidian Shield line.

Damage Shields can no longer be considered OP, so why do we still have an OP counter in the form of the Shield Breaker set?

Should Shield Breaker be removed or changed?

helios777

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

zyk wrote: »

Damage shields in ESO used to be very contentious. They allowed for Max Magicka builds, especially Sorcs, to have very high damage and stack very large shields.

As a counter to these very strong builds, ZOS introduced the Shield Breaker set which has the following 5 piece bonus:

(5 items) When you deal damage with a Light or Heavy Attack against a Player with a damage shield, you deal an additional 2150 Oblivion Damage to them.

As a reminder, Oblivion Damage cannot be mitigated in any way and is not affected by the 50% damage reduction of Battle Spirit.

In 4.2, ZOS dramatically changed how Damage Shields function:

- Max shield cap of 40-50% of max health
- You can now deal a Critical Strike against an enemy with a damage shield.
- Your Spell and Physical Resistance now reduces incoming damage before it is applied to your damage shield.
- Poisons and Weapon Enchantments can now proc even if the damage done by the Light Attack, Heavy Attack, or Weapon Ability is fully absorbed by a damage shield.

Also consider that Shield Breaker doesn't only impact shield builds, but any build that might gain an incidental shield; for example, a Stam DK using the Obsidian Shield line.

Damage Shields can no longer be considered OP, so why do we still have an OP counter in the form of the Shield Breaker set?

Should Shield Breaker be removed or changed?

Trash it

Emma_Overload

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Get rid of it or make it so that it just increases damage against shields, like the Shattering Blows passive.

Gilvoth

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

the set is even weaker now in PvP because now the sorc shields are even Stronger.

and NO thats not a joke.
being serious.
this is the only patch i have ever seen in all of eso history that took what was meant to be a shield nerf and turned it into making shields Stronger in PvP.

in pve they are made weaker but in PvP they are stronger now then they have ever been.

if anything the shield breaker set needs to be doing more damage against shields.

THE_BIG_BOSS

Every damage skill is now shieldbreaker

MetalHead4x4

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

the set is even weaker now in PvP because now the sorc shields are even Stronger.

and NO thats not a joke.
being serious.
this is the only patch i have ever seen in all of eso history that took what was meant to be a shield nerf and turned it into making shields Stronger in PvP.

in pve they are made weaker but in PvP they are stronger now then they have ever been.

if anything the shield breaker set needs to be doing more damage against shields.

How the hell are shields stronger when you can now crit them? My shield doesn't last as long as it used to before this patch. I used to be able to Streak through ball groups, now I just die cause my shield can be crit. What a load of BS. I fought a Stam Sorc 1v1 in Vivec last night and his Hurricane melted my shield like it was made of paper.

Zelos

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

nah shield breaker fine it has counter play, if you dont want to take oblivion damage stop putting up shields easy solution. If you cant survive after that then thats your problem and if you want to learn how to live without shields watch Speed Kills. If you want to complain about it go ahead but you can now I just run 2 oblivion enchants with torugs infused and get 2200 oblivion damage every second if you count the back bar too. This is not a relevant problem at the moment.

ATomiX96

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

I dont see a reason to use it over torugs infused oblivion enchant tbh. Because torugs infused oblivion always works and isnt situational. If some people want to gimp their build using this *** go ahead.

Beardimus

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

the set is even weaker now in PvP because now the sorc shields are even Stronger.

and NO thats not a joke.
being serious.
this is the only patch i have ever seen in all of eso history that took what was meant to be a shield nerf and turned it into making shields Stronger in PvP.

in pve they are made weaker but in PvP they are stronger now then they have ever been.

if anything the shield breaker set needs to be doing more damage against shields.

Lol, good one. The issue is that views like this lead to the change. And no wards aren't stronger all told..

People moaned about them needing to crit, and moaned about Pen not mattering. The nerf sorc band wagon went on and on. So Zos gave in.

HOWEVER Before I was a glass cannon, no impen, wards down and pop dead. Now I'm forced to run impen, resistances and health. So wards down I'm WAY more tanky

Are wards buffed, no don't be obsurd. Are sorcs tankier, yep.

People need to be careful what they moan about......

arkansas_ESO

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

All of the people that voted to not nerf Shieldbreaker run it lol

Zelos wrote: »

nah shield breaker fine it has counter play, if you dont want to take oblivion damage stop putting up shields easy solution. If you cant survive after that then thats your problem and if you want to learn how to live without shields watch Speed Kills. If you want to complain about it go ahead but you can now I just run 2 oblivion enchants with torugs infused and get 2200 oblivion damage every second if you count the back bar too. This is not a relevant problem at the moment.

"If you don't want to take damage then just stop using your defensive skills!"

Also mag sorc isn't the only class that uses shields, and some people want to be able to PVP in anything other than heavy armor. Shield Breaker needs to go.

Biro123

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

the set is even weaker now in PvP because now the sorc shields are even Stronger.

and NO thats not a joke.
being serious.
this is the only patch i have ever seen in all of eso history that took what was meant to be a shield nerf and turned it into making shields Stronger in PvP.

in pve they are made weaker but in PvP they are stronger now then they have ever been.

if anything the shield breaker set needs to be doing more damage against shields.

Shields arent stronger.. but sorcs are when unshielded now since theyre all stacking resists/impen...

Jules

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Even with how strong shields were, this set was always incredibly broken because it didn't "break" the shield as the name implies, it simply circumvented it.

Shoulda been changed years ago, and definitely should be now.

Sacredx

Biro123 wrote: »

Shields arent stronger.. but sorcs are when unshielded now since theyre all stacking resists/impen...

"stacking resists/impen" which now apply to shields.... read the patch notes.

Deep_01

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Sacredx wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

Shields arent stronger.. but sorcs are when unshielded now since theyre all stacking resists/impen...

"stacking resists/impen" which now apply to shields.... read the patch notes.

Why use shields if you are stacking resist and impen. Use and stack heals if that's the case.

Deep_01

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Any advice on how to make gold if I cant sell gold shieldbreaker jewels for 300k gold each!?

Sacredx

Deep_01 wrote: »

Sacredx wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

Shields arent stronger.. but sorcs are when unshielded now since theyre all stacking resists/impen...

"stacking resists/impen" which now apply to shields.... read the patch notes.

Why use shields if you are stacking resist and impen. Use and stack heals if that's the case.

To increase you max survivability. 24k hp + 12k shield > just 24k hp. pvp is about surviving bursts hence why low hp players usually resort to shields for extra survival. and healing is an rng mechanic in that if you get cced then you can't heal and are more likely to die.

long story short for anti burst.

Biro123

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Sacredx wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

Shields arent stronger.. but sorcs are when unshielded now since theyre all stacking resists/impen...

"stacking resists/impen" which now apply to shields.... read the patch notes.

Jeez, I've spent the last few weeks doing nothing but thinking about and experimenting with sorc' setups given that. I mean that's exactly why sorcs are now stacking those stats.

But the simple fact is that crits and status effects apply and they have a cap makes shields weaker on all but the more tanky setups, and those start hitting limits to shield size due to how much mag they can stack.

Minalan

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Shield breaker should be buffed. Add a 10% proc to permanently delete the shield user's toon.

If you're not playing a stamblade, that's your fault.

Biro123

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Minalan wrote: »

Shield breaker should be buffed. Add a 10% proc to permanently delete the shield user's toon.

If you're not playing a stamblade, that's your fault.

But, but, I added a shield enchant to one of the weapons on my DW stamblade....

Feanor

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

I find the response that Shieldbreaker should stay as is because DW Glyphocalypse is much stronger anyway most illuminating.

Amdar_Godkiller

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

Where is the buff option?

Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.

sharquez

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

Magsorc main. It's perfectly fine. Leave it. It's a niche set, and only once like ever has killed me. Can it be used to great effect? Sure. Is it the best 5pc in the game? Not by a long shot.

CatchMeTrolling

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

When they first introduced the changes I made a thread in pts about removing this outdated set.

zyk

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

Where is the buff option?

Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.

That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.

Gilvoth

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

When they first introduced the changes I made a thread in pts about removing this outdated set.

the set is not outdated, However ...
shields in PvP for sorcerers are even Stronger then they were previously. therefore, if you insist this set is outdated, then i would suggest Strengthening Shield Breaker set to do even more Damage would be appropriate.

Biro123

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

When they first introduced the changes I made a thread in pts about removing this outdated set.

the set is not outdated, However ...
shields in PvP for sorcerers are even Stronger then they were previously. therefore, if you insist this set is outdated, then i would suggest Strengthening Shield Breaker set to do even more Damage would be appropriate.

oh, god..

Did people really think that when a class get slapped with a huge defensive nerf that they wouldn't make sacrifice in other areas so their defence is still at an acceptable level? Not everyone can disappear and take 0 damage in the blink of an eye y'know! Sorcs especially have to survive long enough under fire to deliver their delayed burst (note DELAYED). So they will ALWAYS prioritise defence over damage.

No matter how much you whine, the class that you think should be squishy just because of its name, never will be. In fact, most are built more like tanks now with such a low spell-damage and mediocre max mag..

But you still want an easy 'I-Win' button.. against this one class only.


I mean, oblivion damage... Ignores all forms of mitigation and shields.. So all those resists, and crit resists, and short duration major protection buffs, and shield I've built for mean nothing. This is what a sorc has to defend with - it's heals are crap. Yet heals are the only thing that deals with oblivion damage.
Now imagine if there was a set that completely made heals useless.. even if for only 4 seconds or so (as opposed to constantly like shieldbreaker).. Imaging the outcry if something like that ever existed.. Ohh.. that's right.. It was nerfed to oblivion before it ever went live!!

Kadoin

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

Ugh as much as I hate to admit it, there are already builds where its possible to shieldstack more effectively than ever possible with little to no downsides. I honestly can't believe I don't see it all over Cyrodil yet, but I guess these things need time...

EDIT: Also barely anyone slots it anymore from what I've seen...hm...

Biro123

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Kadoin wrote: »

Ugh as much as I hate to admit it, there are already builds where its possible to shieldstack more effectively than ever possible with little to no downsides. I honestly can't believe I don't see it all over Cyrodil yet, but I guess these things need time...

EDIT: Also barely anyone slots it anymore from what I've seen...hm...

There are definite downsides. I can say that my survivability is now slightly better than before - but I think its as much down to mobility nerfs as it is to creating a build that keeps my one shield relevant. Note there is no stack...

The cost is the loss of around 400 spell-damage, 7000 max magica, and an execute. That's a sizable loss to damage and burst potential.

I mean, I'm running 2 full defensive sets, and have over half my ability bars stacked with abilities to help survivability. I *Should* be hard to kill - whether its via shields, strong heals, or sustained blocking, or great avoidance, defensive buffs etc.... Just so happens that certain people seem to hate shields being a large part of it.

Derra

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Biro123 wrote: »

Kadoin wrote: »

Ugh as much as I hate to admit it, there are already builds where its possible to shieldstack more effectively than ever possible with little to no downsides. I honestly can't believe I don't see it all over Cyrodil yet, but I guess these things need time...

EDIT: Also barely anyone slots it anymore from what I've seen...hm...

There are definite downsides. I can say that my survivability is now slightly better than before - but I think its as much down to mobility nerfs as it is to creating a build that keeps my one shield relevant. Note there is no stack...

The cost is the loss of around 400 spell-damage, 7000 max magica, and an execute. That's a sizable loss to damage and burst potential.

I mean, I'm running 2 full defensive sets, and have over half my ability bars stacked with abilities to help survivability. I *Should* be hard to kill - whether its via shields, strong heals, or sustained blocking, or great avoidance, defensive buffs etc.... Just so happens that certain people seem to hate shields being a large part of it.

I´ve said this prior to the patch - i´ll say it again.

A huge part of the perceived problem with shields is their display in the games interface. If we had a seperate shieldbar that we actually could see getting dmg in the base UI there would be a lot less complaining because there´d be less difference between someone shielding and someone healing.

People perceive shields as problematic and unsatisfying to fight against because contrary to fighting a templar (who might even be more tanky than a sorc) they don´t ever see the HP bar moving - so everything they do might seem futile.

Minalan

Remove/Change Shieldbreaker

Biro123 wrote: »

Kadoin wrote: »

Ugh as much as I hate to admit it, there are already builds where its possible to shieldstack more effectively than ever possible with little to no downsides. I honestly can't believe I don't see it all over Cyrodil yet, but I guess these things need time...

EDIT: Also barely anyone slots it anymore from what I've seen...hm...

There are definite downsides. I can say that my survivability is now slightly better than before - but I think its as much down to mobility nerfs as it is to creating a build that keeps my one shield relevant. Note there is no stack...

The cost is the loss of around 400 spell-damage, 7000 max magica, and an execute. That's a sizable loss to damage and burst potential.

I mean, I'm running 2 full defensive sets, and have over half my ability bars stacked with abilities to help survivability. I *Should* be hard to kill - whether its via shields, strong heals, or sustained blocking, or great avoidance, defensive buffs etc.... Just so happens that certain people seem to hate shields being a large part of it.

You have the build and the damage of a heavy armor DK block tank...

Amdar_Godkiller

Leave Shieldbreaker as it is

zyk wrote: »

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

Where is the buff option?

Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.

That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.

It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.

It requires absolutely no defensive sets.