What the BG?

DanielWinterborn

Nothing about battlegrounds premade in this coming update, I guess stupid level is rising! Add a new mode : group or without group to join!

How is this good for business? You get 2x premade teams rocking BG for 3 hours and the rest of the players without premade raging and quitting. That's 8 people happy in 3 hours and at least 40 swearing and cursing, smart thinking!

It's one thing to fight on even ground and win/lose because of your gear/skill/build and another get thrown in against people on skype with a dungeon group, wth?

I don't even know why I'm trying anymore, it's like this guys WANT you to quit lol. Is there like a blockage somewhere in Zos development team? Do you guys need any help adding the option?

Apache_Kid

Seeing as how they aren't even willing to put in two different queues for CP and non-CP they feel that the queues will not be populated enough if you split them.

They need to make battlegrounds more fun and rewarding so people will be more inclined to participate, thus allowing for more queues.

I also think it's time to open up BGs to all players and not just those who have Morrowind.

DanielWinterborn

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Seeing as how they aren't even willing to put in two different queues for CP and non-CP they feel that the queues will not be populated enough if you split them.

They need to make battlegrounds more fun and rewarding so people will be more inclined to participate, thus allowing for more queues.

I also think it's time to open up BGs to all players and not just those who have Morrowind.

Wait I had no idea it was a pay to play thing lol!

Well they should open it to everyone, what a ridiculous thing! But then for sure they need to make them not premade otherwise it's another completely broken thing, now it's 90% broken so there's still a shot for it.

Make the thing free for all and just add a new "group" mode, you do know that the majority of players everywhere are looking for PvP and not PvE. This is mind blowing.

Leave the CP as it is and you're done. Do you want me to write you the code for that?

Leandor

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Apache_Kid

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

DanielWinterborn

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

That's my point, give it to everyone and make premade and no group options. That way everyone is happy. Premades get competition and pugs get... No more premades!

OFC nothing like this is going to happen, Zos is like talking to a rock. Such a conversation...

Leandor

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

DanielWinterborn

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

I for one don't do BG for any rewards, the crystals are good I admit that but I do them mostly for the fun of it. It's lag free PvP.
So I don't mind the low rewards and I'm sure there are a lot of people out there thinking the same thing. What I do mind are the premades, that's almost a deal breaker for me, there's only so much of this crap one can take.

Beardimus

Saying ZOS don't listen means you dont read the updates, they do. Sadly they listened too much on nerfing sorcs, but restoring no-CP as an example, adding transmute, transmorg, storage in homes etc etc to name a few

Sure the premade v pug thing is next on the list, but its way less of a problem than enabling CP was.

Leandor

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

I for one don't do BG for any rewards, the crystals are good I admit that but I do them mostly for the fun of it. It's lag free PvP.
So I don't mind the low rewards and I'm sure there are a lot of people out there thinking the same thing. What I do mind are the premades, that's almost a deal breaker for me, there's only so much of this crap one can take.

Exactly my opinion, too. I would love to be able to enjoy BGs and I don't need any incentive. But I don't do BGs, since as a typical average, nothing-special player, they are just too frustrating.

But you would need those incentives to get people who did not buy morrowind to participate in them just because ZOS opened them for non-morrowind owners. As I said above, those that want BGs for the sake of BGs, will by now have bought morrowind, at least the overwhelming majority of those players.

Apache_Kid

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

DanielWinterborn

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Leandor

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

Yes, that is the big question. Why don't they separate queues?

My guess is that if they would separate them, they could only allow duo and full group queueing, since a trio queueing would need a solo player in the group queue to work. That is also the only reason overall that I can think of.

Whatever the reason, having BGs restricted to morrowind owners or having them ffa, will in and of itself not change a thing about the current state of BGs. See also my reply to @DanielWinterborn above.

Apache_Kid

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4751912#Comment_4751912

I for one am glad they are bringing back no-CP. While you find pre-made groups to be what keeps you from having fun in BGs, what keeps me from having fun are perma-blocking builds standing on flags and holding on to relics for 15 straight minutes.

CP enables these perma-blocking builds and while these builds do not over-perform in Cyrodiil (because you can just walk away from the player and go somewhere else) they over-perform in small-scale objective gameplay. Which is exactly what BGs is except the rare times you get deathmatch. I've played very few BGs since they went to CP enabled and I will now be able to play again without fear of a perma-blocker holding on to my team's relic for the entire match. yay

ParaNostram

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Nothing about battlegrounds premade in this coming update, I guess stupid level is rising! Add a new mode : group or without group to join!

We're getting new maps and please, for the love of all that is holy, ZOS if you are reading this, do not take OPs advice of more game modes. Please, designing maps is the much safer route as game modes that have to be retroactively applied to every map are a nightmare to design right.

The_Brosteen

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Can't play without cp?

L2p

WillhelmBlack

BG's need to become popular before you can start splitting up the queue.

Nobody plays BG's in ESO. I used to until they made them CP, that literally ruined all the competitiveness straight away. They're removing CP again so now we can move things forward. People will start playing them again, streamers will stream them again. Hopefully they might get recognised, they probably would if you could choose the modes, they'd be a hell of a lot more appealing to existing players anyway.

I came back to the game after playing several MOBA's. I could immediately tell what BG'S were lacking. Pretty much everything for a competitive environment and players because of it.

WillhelmBlack

The_Brosteen wrote: »

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Can't play without cp?

L2p

I hate throwing L2P around so I'll just quote this guy.

LadyLavina

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

@DanielWinterborn , gods forbid , the playing field evens out a bit more.

The_Brosteen wrote: »

Can't play without cp?

L2p

^ this

Leandor

On the CP question, I by now only say, to each his own. I used to insist on having my CP in BGs when they were without CP. Then I played more. Then I started to prefer no-CP due to the fact that the worst builds only work because of CP.

Nowadays, I don't even play CP cyro except if my team mates want to play there, and only as group of three.

Malmai

It should be solo queue as well...

Malmai

It should be solo queue as well... Meaning that you wouldn't be put in premade team but rather random.

Kolache

+1 for solo queue
+1 for all players (not just Morrowind)

While I'm against segmenting population, my guess would be that pugs getting roflstomped by premades will lead to longer queues for the average player than 2 queues that prevent this from happening.

If you want to incentivize people to group v. group then let them do it outside of 4v4v4 with better rewards, leaderboards, and whatever makes them happy aside from ruining new meat on PvP for life.

Shimmer

woops accidental post ...

DanielWinterborn

Wrong...

DanielWinterborn

LadyLavina wrote: »

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

@DanielWinterborn , gods forbid , the playing field evens out a bit more.

The_Brosteen wrote: »

Can't play without cp?

L2p

^ this

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

The_Brosteen wrote: »

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Can't play without cp?

L2p

I hate throwing L2P around so I'll just quote this guy.

The_Brosteen wrote: »

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Can't play without cp?

L2p

This right here ladies and gentlemen are classic cases of noobs. Believe it or not they have nothing to add to the discussion so they spam the classic "l2p".

If I need to l2p without cp then does that mean that you have no idea to p with it? Here's an idea kids, how about we remove all the skills together and use just click? Better for you this way?

It's not my fault you can't master the CP system or you're too lazy to level it. Even giving the sorts of you my time to write this reply should be considered a kind gesture. I for one don't have all the 690 CP and only have 600 but I can see its benefits, what's the point in having it if you're not able to use it anywhere?

This classic l2p answer is from people that suck at the game, they wish to drag everyone down to their level so then maybe just maybe they can hit a bird out of the sky. If you can't take the complexity then just stick to the non CP campaigns and have fun there, don't run around the forums calling people bad at the game, you need to git gud at it.

The thread is about groups vs pugs, so think for once in your life before you bash the keyboard.

Thank you,
Sincerely,
The guy with the CP kicking your ass in game.

badmojo

Not enough players for a solo queue, but the lack of a solo option keeps players from playing BG.

Seems like a vicious cycle.

DanielWinterborn

badmojo wrote: »

Not enough players for a solo queue, but the lack of a solo option keeps players from playing BG.

Seems like a vicious cycle.

There are more than enough players for solo at least on PC, I can see one group playing in BG for 2 hours and the others are randoms, so there are enough...

zassasaurus

It would be good if they could implement a ranking system, maybe based on a players average points per match or something, so then everyone could join the same queue, but would be more likely to be put in a match with people at their level. But if that's too complicated I would love separate solo vs pre-made queues.

Beardimus

The_Brosteen wrote: »

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Can't play without cp?

L2p

Spot on sir

Bryong9ub17_ESO

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

I do not think that opening battlegrounds for everyone over morrowind owners only will make any kind of difference. It will still be premade roflstomp everything. Whether it's two premades or twenty, and 40 disappointed soloers or 400, doesn't change the inevitable.

Unless they make it impossible to queue with a premade, or have separate queues for solo and grouped players, BGs will be a fail for most players.

NoCP is in my opinion a slight improvement, since it minimizes the possibilities for trollbuilds and makes even premades vulnerable to a certain extent.

The only real solution in any case is separation of solo and group queues, irrespective of whether it's a full premade or a duo queueing together.

Of course making it open to everyone wouldn't change the problem of pre-made groups vs PUGs but it will increase the queue population making seperate queues for grouped players and not grouped 'mercenary' players something that is viable.

I do not believe that it is not feasible as of now. People interested in BGs have bought morrowind, of course with some budget restricted exceptions, but most will have done by now with discount prices at retailers as well as the ZOS store.

Opening it for all will most probably have a negligible effect on queue size and will reduce to what we have now in short order without the other change.

The incentive to play BGs, aside from the dyes, is much too low to bring in more people.

Yeah but if it is feasible why aren't there seperate queues yet? Seeing as how they took the time to change it from non-cp to CP and as was announced by Gina in another thread it will be going back to non-CP only the answer to why isn't that they don't want to spend the time, so the only explanation for why there aren't queues for both is that they don't feel the population of it is enough to support multiple queues. ZoS are the only ones who have and see the data on how many people are playing and queueing for it so only they know whether or not multiple queues is feasible. I thought the same thing that you did about people who are interested in BGs have already bought morrowind but there are still plenty of players out there who haven't bought morrowind because they feel it is a rip-off that it offers so little content for not being a part of a ESO plus and not worth the price even on sale. Was having this discussion with 2 players in my PvP guild like 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Although i agree that the incentive to participate in BGs content is not high enough and if the rewards were better that more people would play it. I mentioned that in my OP though along with giving it to everyone who hasn't bought morrowind as ways to increase the player pool for it.

They are planning to make it non-CP only? I hope this is a joke. I want my CP otherwise I could go back to Lineage 2 and use 3 skills all the time in mindless PvP. Cp is the only thing separating this game from the others, nothing else. There are some class balance issues but taking out CP all together is a newb move and proves they can't balance the game. They obviously lack with Cyrodiil with all the lag, this is the only place you can truly test your build and your skill but if you take CP out of the question even the weakest PUG can take you out with that lucky crit so it becomes a RNG game, nothing more.

Excuse me, but far more people where pissed that it went CP than not. Hence why they are changing it back. A lot, including myself completely stopped playing battlegrounds because of the change. Its going back. Have fun playing Lineage...