Stam Sorc For Morrowind, Thoughts?

Vapirko

I'm running a simple, effective build 2H/dw for my playstyle right now, 5 pc ravager all the time, 3 agility ring, 2 pc bloodspawn and 2pc way of the air on my dw for extra stam regen on that bar.

Stats are good. With the ravager proc my wpn damage is near to 4K, stam regen is 1200-1500, stam is around 33k and health around 25k. Phys and spell resist sit at around 26k with hurricane up.

Will this be okay for Morrowind? I'm not sure if I will go cp or non cp yet, depends on where the action is. I'm thinking of switching out agility for bone pirates but if I want both ravager and pirates up on my 2H then I need to sacrifice a monster set which isn't the end of the world for me, I sometimes do it now. Any ideas? Anyone with experience on pts have any comments about how this build might do there or where I might want to focus more resources or points? Thanks.

Chilly-McFreeze

While I can't contribute with hard numbers I might think that bone pirates is the better choice IF you don't want to use dark deal.
Also mind that ravager does not proc on flurry afaik.

Edit: For the flurry bug https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/344661/ravager-set-bugs-with-flurry-flurry-is-not-a-melee-attack

Vapirko

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

While I can't contribute with hard numbers I might think that bone pirates is the better choice IF you don't want to use dark deal.
Also mind that ravager does not proc on flurry afaik.

Edit: For the flurry bug https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/344661/ravager-set-bugs-with-flurry-flurry-is-not-a-melee-attack

I used rapid strikes to proc ravagers on my target skele. Weird though, cause I thought it wasn't procing in battle.

Vapirko

That's bs that it doesn't proc on rapid strikes. So temps have a way to proc on spam and Stam sorcs/DKs do not? That's broken.

Chilly-McFreeze

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

Benn G x

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

I'm thinking Blackrose myself, I don't use it currently but I'd imagine come the update it would give the same kind of sustain my 5pc heavy does now. With dark Deal it may work but we'll have to wait and see

Vapirko

Benn G x wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

I'm thinking Blackrose myself, I don't use it currently but I'd imagine come the update it would give the same kind of sustain my 5pc heavy does now. With dark Deal it may work but we'll have to wait and see

I know a lot of people love BR, I really don't care for it much. I much prefer to run just agility jewelry or draugr or some other sustain set and a damage set. Maybe it's lag or something but I just don't see that much of a return running BR. And I think we're going to new actual stamina recover next patch and if you run BR with stamina regen glyphs on your jewelry the damage is gonna be too low.

Chilly-McFreeze

Vapirko wrote: »

Benn G x wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

I'm thinking Blackrose myself, I don't use it currently but I'd imagine come the update it would give the same kind of sustain my 5pc heavy does now. With dark Deal it may work but we'll have to wait and see

I know a lot of people love BR, I really don't care for it much. I much prefer to run just agility jewelry or draugr or some other sustain set and a damage set. Maybe it's lag or something but I just don't see that much of a return running BR. And I think we're going to new actual stamina recover next patch and if you run BR with stamina regen glyphs on your jewelry the damage is gonna be too low.

BR adds 35% constitution. On live 5pc heavy base constitution is 930 per 4 sec. With 5pc heavy + BR it's 1255 /4s. Means BR equals to an extra 162 stamina regen (every 2s). More than a full set-piece regen bonus. + 150 dmg and all stats. Sounds nice.

On PTS however constitution gets gutted by 42%, leaving a base constitution of 540 /4s. +35% via BR = 729/4s. Remains with an extra 94 stamina every 2 seconds.

Question is if 94 extra stam regen are worth the low 150 wpn dmg.

Benn G x

Vapirko wrote: »

Benn G x wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

I'm thinking Blackrose myself, I don't use it currently but I'd imagine come the update it would give the same kind of sustain my 5pc heavy does now. With dark Deal it may work but we'll have to wait and see

I know a lot of people love BR, I really don't care for it much. I much prefer to run just agility jewelry or draugr or some other sustain set and a damage set. Maybe it's lag or something but I just don't see that much of a return running BR. And I think we're going to new actual stamina recover next patch and if you run BR with stamina regen glyphs on your jewelry the damage is gonna be too low.

As @Chilly-McFreeze explained constitution is getting nerfed.

The reason for thinking Blackrose is it may be the only option if you want to run heavy Armor. I can sustain fine with 5pc heavy on live with dark deal, that's with absolutely zero into stam regen, no mundus no set bonus nothing. If Blackrose is going to equal near enough what Heavy does now on live I still may be able to run heavy and sustain.

Chilly-McFreeze

Thing is even with 5 heavy + black rose you won't get base constitution as it is on live. I'm too running 5 BR, 3 Agility, 2 Skoria and 2 Leki in PvP with all weapon dmg enchants. If I switch one or, bc of higher base costs, better two of them to regen the weapon dmg will be far too low.

Nerfed constitution will also affect how often you can use surge, streak and dark deal. The latter you will definitly need more often with the loss of warlord cp and increased stam costs (around 5% and 30% for vigor).

If I change BR to the upcoming shacklebreaker I lose a tad wpn dmg and 1K health but gain some regen and 1K mag and stam. Maybe health could be set of with full prismatic glyphs.

I also thought about running prisoners rags to help me fund enough magicka for d/d (instead of leki+agility), but then I need a full dmg HA front set. Also it's quite situational. I usually d/d when I run out of stam, therefore I will have a hard time to sprint long enough to offset a given lack of magicka.

Senche's bite comes to mind to for a dmg heavy backbar set. Also the already mentioned Bone Pirates.

Or simply run 5 alchemist + 2 monster + 3 endurance + 2 leki/ anything with 2pc regen. Probably the easiest way out.

Vapirko

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Benn G x wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

I'm thinking Blackrose myself, I don't use it currently but I'd imagine come the update it would give the same kind of sustain my 5pc heavy does now. With dark Deal it may work but we'll have to wait and see

I know a lot of people love BR, I really don't care for it much. I much prefer to run just agility jewelry or draugr or some other sustain set and a damage set. Maybe it's lag or something but I just don't see that much of a return running BR. And I think we're going to new actual stamina recover next patch and if you run BR with stamina regen glyphs on your jewelry the damage is gonna be too low.

BR adds 35% constitution. On live 5pc heavy base constitution is 930 per 4 sec. With 5pc heavy + BR it's 1255 /4s. Means BR equals to an extra 162 stamina regen (every 2s). More than a full set-piece regen bonus. + 150 dmg and all stats. Sounds nice.

On PTS however constitution gets gutted by 42%, leaving a base constitution of 540 /4s. +35% via BR = 729/4s. Remains with an extra 94 stamina every 2 seconds.

Question is if 94 extra stam regen are worth the low 150 wpn dmg.

Well, might be time to experiment with medium armor? Personally my first try will be bone pirates with dubious Comoran and ravagers. Might forgo a 2pc monster set for 5 pc uptime on both bone pirates and ravagers and then either extra regen from 1pc bloodspawn or damage from 1 kena. Another interesting option could be to run impregnable armor which takes care of your need for impen leaving you free to run Infused for resources or divines with serpent mudnus for increased regen. Or run warrior mundus and put regen glyphs on some jewelry with bone pirates again.

Chilly-McFreeze

Vapirko wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Benn G x wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Yep, probably bc the uptime would be too high if it would proc on dots. However, that doesn't explains why flurry doesn't count but jabs do.

I also would be interested if Black Rose is still worth it in the lights of the 42% constitution nerf.

I'm thinking Blackrose myself, I don't use it currently but I'd imagine come the update it would give the same kind of sustain my 5pc heavy does now. With dark Deal it may work but we'll have to wait and see

I know a lot of people love BR, I really don't care for it much. I much prefer to run just agility jewelry or draugr or some other sustain set and a damage set. Maybe it's lag or something but I just don't see that much of a return running BR. And I think we're going to new actual stamina recover next patch and if you run BR with stamina regen glyphs on your jewelry the damage is gonna be too low.

BR adds 35% constitution. On live 5pc heavy base constitution is 930 per 4 sec. With 5pc heavy + BR it's 1255 /4s. Means BR equals to an extra 162 stamina regen (every 2s). More than a full set-piece regen bonus. + 150 dmg and all stats. Sounds nice.

On PTS however constitution gets gutted by 42%, leaving a base constitution of 540 /4s. +35% via BR = 729/4s. Remains with an extra 94 stamina every 2 seconds.

Question is if 94 extra stam regen are worth the low 150 wpn dmg.

Well, might be time to experiment with medium armor? Personally my first try will be bone pirates with dubious Comoran and ravagers. Might forgo a 2pc monster set for 5 pc uptime on both bone pirates and ravagers and then either extra regen from 1pc bloodspawn or damage from 1 kena. Another interesting option could be to run impregnable armor which takes care of your need for impen leaving you free to run Infused for resources or divines with serpent mudnus for increased regen. Or run warrior mundus and put regen glyphs on some jewelry with bone pirates again.

I thought about Impregnable armor as well and was very interested.
Let's look at it this way. With both BR and Impreg you get 1k health, stam and mag, so that's equal on both.

On pts: BR you get 154 weapon/ spell dmg, 94 extra regen through constitution. 7 Impen result in 1806 crit resist.
As it is right now, you need 28 points in the resistant cp to hit that 2500 crit resistance. With frontloading even less, don't know how much exactly. Or am I mistaken?
Plus that 210 standard stamina regen from serpent mundus.
-> means 304 regen
Via glyphs: 507 stam regen/ 0 dmg OR 338 regen/ 174 dmg OR 169 regen and 348 dmg OR 0 regen/ 522 dmg.


With Impreg armor you recieve 2500 crit resist. 7 golden divines.
Plus 210 base stamina regen via mundus + 110 extra regen through armor trait.
Plus 522 weapon dmg from jewls.
OR
166 + 47 weapon dmg from warrior mundus.
Via glyphs: 507 stam regen/ 0 dmg OR 338 regen/ 174 dmg OR 169 regen and 348 dmg OR 0 regen/ 522 dmg.



Results (7 impen black rose - 7 divines impregnable armor)

3 Dmg Glyphs/ Serpent Mundus
BR: 676 weapon dmg, 304 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 522 weapon dmg, 320 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)

3 Regen Glyphs/ Serpent Mundus
BR: 154 weapon dmg, 601 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 0 weapon dmg, 827 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)

2 Regen & 1 Dmg Glyphs/ Serpent Bundus
BR: 328 weapon dmg, 432 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 174 weapon dmg, 648 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)

1 Regen & 2 Dmg Glyphs/ Serpent Mundus
BR: 502 weapon dmg, 263 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 348 weapon dmg, 489 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)


3 Dmg Glyphs/ Warrior Mundus
BR: 842 weapon dmg, 94 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 735 weapon dmg, 0 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)

3 Regen Glyphs/ Warrior Mundus
BR: 320 weapon dmg, 601 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 213 weapon dmg, 507 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)

2 Regen & 1 Dmg Glyph/ Warrior Mundus
BR: 494 weapon dmg, 432 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 387 weapon dmg, 338 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)

1 Regen & 2 Dmg Glyph/ Warrior Mundus
BR: 668 weapon dmg, 263 regen, 1806 crit resist (2504 with 20-28 something cp) + 154 spell dmg, 94 mag regen
IA: 561 weapon dmg, 169 regen, 2500 crit resist (and 20 something free cp)



Conclusion:

On the first look BR seems to always be better. But couldn't you achieve the missing regen from IA via cp? Sure, but you will probably already have 100 points in mooncalf, therefore probably not. The extra mag regen could help you to sustain your dark deal resource pool, but it's rather tiny.
Also since the resistance CP is in RED and regen in GREEN you coul achieve higher overall defense with IA but better slightly offense with Black Rose. Regen is up to your enchants

The differences are tiny in some combinations. It depends much on what you run it with. 154 dmg difference might seem less but if your overall dmg is already low your probably would be better of with the extra from BR.

But what I haven't tested but I'm nearly certain is: regen can be cut through new cp's + light attacks. Constitution probably will remain the same.

Edit: I checked it again, some numbers where off. Should be okay now. Hope I haven't overlooked or miscalculated and embarass myself here.

Lexxypwns

Im rerolling a stam sorc specifically fr BGs. running 5 widow maker 5 red mountain 2 troll king.


Also, no matter what anyone else says, you should NEVER, for any reason, run ANY mundus except thief or shadow for Pvp.

Thief gives 4 set bonuses worth of crit. Atro/serpent give ~1.5 set bonuses of regen.
Warrior/apprentice also give ~1.5 set bonuses of damage.

This means you should start with Thief/Shadow stone and find other ways to get your sustain

Chilly-McFreeze

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Im rerolling a stam sorc specifically fr BGs. running 5 widow maker 5 red mountain 2 troll king.


Also, no matter what anyone else says, you should NEVER, for any reason, run ANY mundus except thief or shadow for Pvp.

Thief gives 4 set bonuses worth of crit. Atro/serpent give ~1.5 set bonuses of regen.
Warrior/apprentice also give ~1.5 set bonuses of damage.

This means you should start with Thief/Shadow stone and find other ways to get your sustain

Right, thief not only grants the most values in comparison to set boni it also raises your overall dmg output and your surge healings (twice - how often and via healing crit).