My Super Evil Plan to Win PvP in 3.0

TheBonesXXX

1) Run reduce set.
2) Run reduce jewelry
3) Put into damage stuff on CP.
4) Defile and Stun


Just kidding.

The first idiot who lands 60% reduce costs stam and magicka poisons is going to win Cyrodiil.

ZOS, you confuse the hell out of your player base, you have a game with probably one of the best currently base combat systems in the gaming industry today and you do not manage to see how *** dumb PASSIVES in a pro-active, re-active game are.

Its been said by the pop streamers, its been said here a thousand times.. I'm just gonna be a *** and be blunt about it because I do not care if you ban me.

THE CP SYSTEM IS GARBAGE.

Can you encourage pro and reactive game play? I do not give a *** about the PvErs who would get mad about this, far as I am concerned they're the bane of any good PvP combat anyway.

How about in the CP system I have a window to damage players or mobs when they're off-balanced. Or animation speeds, dodge roll speeds, ACTION SPEEDS are faster... how about I get a few yards on a gap closer, or reach on my soul harvest goes an extra meter or two?

How about, since you want to throw flat numbers into gear, you let the CP system enhance the base gameplay, NOT THE ALGORITHMS. Jesus, you guys are DEFINITELY engineers who never turned a wrench in your life, so you actually do not know how *** works.

MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS

I'LL SAY IT LOUD IN THE BACK FOR YOU *** WHO LIKE TO MATH NOW AND WONDER WHY *** BREAKS LATER

MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS

Holy *** Christ man. Devs are like virtual engineers, in theory your *** works, in practice it usually takes the Welder, Mechanic, or Machinist whos got years of experience to explain to you why you don't know what the hell you are doing.

And I hate snowflakes, so I'm going not be cordial about it.

You lock all the best gear behind a bunch of mobs, trials, and other *** content that most of us hate doing. Its the equivalent to putting the *** oil filter in a place where someone with a big ass hand cant *** reach it.

To top it off, statsluts LOVE their *** RNG.

THINK OF SOMETHING BETTER.

Bang bang! Have a nice day!

Hutch679

I wish I could have the 2 minutes of my life it me to read this back ....

psychotic13

It's now 30% not 60%.

Waffennacht

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE

My dad was a welder, growing up I always heard how, "yeah it may work on paper, but come onto the floor and see how it doesn't in reality"

Or many variations there-of.

You so remind me of him lol

Look. I tried other video games, there is a reason im still playing ESO.

TheBonesXXX

Waffennacht wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE

My dad was a welder, growing up I always heard how, "yeah it may work on paper, but come onto the floor and see how it doesn't in reality"

Or many variations there-of.

You so remind me of him lol

Look. I tried other video games, there is a reason im still playing ESO.

I love ESO, I got love for the Devs or else I wouldnt give em ***.

I love everyone, Im just an unapologetic roughneck from Appalachians, I weld, wrench, machine, and about to get my psych degree.

Ive done the maths, will get an Engineer degree too.

A lot of ESOs flaws is in the lack of expierience in the scientific application, the good on paper only crap.

Theres a lot of loss of understanding of haptics, kinetics, and mechanics and it shows in the game when theres already flat percentages in the game coupled by more flat percentages.

Im just not gonna fancy it up or write an essay to appease a few snobs, the stats in this game are already too inflated.. Theres to many stupid sets. Theres not enough sets that make a difference.

If people cant play ESO with their eyes and ears first, because its a pro-active and re-active game, then they need a new damn game instead of screaming "but muh numbarrrrs!". Seriously, those types can FO into a volcano.

Same types of dudes that advocate for all the information they can get possible so they can get the game dumbed down instead of making it more action based like it should be.

Cathexis

Fasold666

Lol. I couldn't agree more.

Turelus

REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING

I'LL SAY IT LOUD IN THE BACK FOR YOU *** WHO LIKE TO WHINE NOW AND WONDER WHY *** SAY L2P LATER

REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING

TheBonesXXX

Turelus wrote: »

REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING

I'LL SAY IT LOUD IN THE BACK FOR YOU *** WHO LIKE TO WHINE NOW AND WONDER WHY *** SAY L2P LATER

REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING
REAL TEST EXAMPLES BEFORE RANTING

Test examples? 3 years of the exact same method good enough for you?

"Guys the engine has been making this knocking sound, but I should put it on the dyno first"

Turelus

I've been talking and reading information from people who are going on PTS, doing content and testing everything.

Yes they have some negative feedback (which is fine) but they're giving exact examples of where an issue is and why it's an issue. How X inadvertently effects Y, how X gives back Y numbers etc.

There are so many posts on these forums where people are ranting about a change they haven't even tested. Then there are those who everyone looks up to who are on testing and giving actual feedback.

Telling someone the engine is knocking is not the same as showing them where it's knocking, why it's knocking, how that knocking is detrimental to the engine and then give some solutions to that issue.

DHale

The new meta to win pvp... The patch notes go live the good players leave potatoes become the new "elites" running around heavy and light attacking.... no bueno.

TheBonesXXX

Turelus wrote: »

I've been talking and reading information from people who are going on PTS, doing content and testing everything.

Yes they have some negative feedback (which is fine) but they're giving exact examples of where an issue is and why it's an issue. How X inadvertently effects Y, how X gives back Y numbers etc.

There are so many posts on these forums where people are ranting about a change they haven't even tested. Then there are those who everyone looks up to who are on testing and giving actual feedback.

Telling someone the engine is knocking is not the same as showing them where it's knocking, why it's knocking, how that knocking is detrimental to the engine and then give some solutions to that issue.

If I know why the engine is knocking, experience tells me as a mechanic what the problems are, because they will ALWAYS, be those same problems, it'll never be a new problem until a new system is introduced into the vehicle.

That's how engineering actually works vs how it works in "theory".

Anyone can learn theory, not anyone can actually have the mechanical aptitude to know why those theories applied will not actually work and that is the point. Not only can I design an Engine, I actually spent years of knowing how the metal is cast, knowing HOW to built the engine from scratch, knowing how to put the engine together, and actually fixing it.

Until those "testers" show me that they have the aptitude to actually know how things ACTUALLY work vs how they work on paper is two different things.

But you missed the underlying point, I hate the flat bonuses given in the Champion system, vs boosting the actual mechanics of the game.

Damage is a mechanic, but dodge rolling, off balance, move speed, attack speed, conditions, stunned, CC or lack of appropriate categories is what I was getting at, that's where I rather see the Champion system moved to.

We have been getting the same ***, many players have said it.. It's just extra armor - not really game enhancing, enriching, just the same *** without having to farm for it.

I don't trust the testers, why? Because they're statsluts instead of trying to enrich the mechanics.. They're looking for X amount of damage, not the game enhancements I am looking for.

TheBonesXXX

DHale wrote: »

The new meta to win pvp... The patch notes go live the good players leave potatoes become the new "elites" running around heavy and light attacking.... no bueno.

This game has yet to reach its full potential. So as much as there so much passive math and not pro-active/re-active emphasis on the mechanics of the game, it'll always go to the potatoes.

It used to be great, I used to be able to bust up a zerg with Cold Fire back when it was invisible. Far as I am concerned, if everyone wants to clump together and become an easy target they die.

Cant defend yourself, you die plain and simple.

Waffennacht

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

The new meta to win pvp... The patch notes go live the good players leave potatoes become the new "elites" running around heavy and light attacking.... no bueno.

This game has yet to reach its full potential. So as much as there so much passive math and not pro-active/re-active emphasis on the mechanics of the game, it'll always go to the potatoes.

It used to be great, I used to be able to bust up a zerg with Cold Fire back when it was invisible. Far as I am concerned, if everyone wants to clump together and become an easy target they die.

Cant defend yourself, you die plain and simple.

I remember that, and it was never intended to be invisible lol.

THEDKEXPERIENCE

Waffennacht wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

The new meta to win pvp... The patch notes go live the good players leave potatoes become the new "elites" running around heavy and light attacking.... no bueno.

This game has yet to reach its full potential. So as much as there so much passive math and not pro-active/re-active emphasis on the mechanics of the game, it'll always go to the potatoes.

It used to be great, I used to be able to bust up a zerg with Cold Fire back when it was invisible. Far as I am concerned, if everyone wants to clump together and become an easy target they die.

Cant defend yourself, you die plain and simple.

I remember that, and it was never intended to be invisible lol.

It took me a good 6 months to figure this out. Haha. Those darn invisible siege!

TheBonesXXX

Waffennacht wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

DHale wrote: »

The new meta to win pvp... The patch notes go live the good players leave potatoes become the new "elites" running around heavy and light attacking.... no bueno.

This game has yet to reach its full potential. So as much as there so much passive math and not pro-active/re-active emphasis on the mechanics of the game, it'll always go to the potatoes.

It used to be great, I used to be able to bust up a zerg with Cold Fire back when it was invisible. Far as I am concerned, if everyone wants to clump together and become an easy target they die.

Cant defend yourself, you die plain and simple.

I remember that, and it was never intended to be invisible lol.

Shoulda stayed that way. Hit like a truck and was an easy counter.

deepseamk20b14_ESO

Do not make the proposed changes.

Keep CP in PvE.

Remove CP from all PvP campaign's.

Slightly nerf heavy armor and slightly buff light and medium.

Stop nerfing classes. If anything buff where needed.

This is all we need.

Gilvoth

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

1) Run reduce set.
2) Run reduce jewelry
3) Put into damage stuff on CP.
4) Defile and Stun


Just kidding.

The first idiot who lands 60% reduce costs stam and magicka poisons is going to win Cyrodiil.

ZOS, you confuse the hell out of your player base, you have a game with probably one of the best currently base combat systems in the gaming industry today and you do not manage to see how *** dumb PASSIVES in a pro-active, re-active game are.

Its been said by the pop streamers, its been said here a thousand times.. I'm just gonna be a *** and be blunt about it because I do not care if you ban me.

THE CP SYSTEM IS GARBAGE.

Can you encourage pro and reactive game play? I do not give a *** about the PvErs who would get mad about this, far as I am concerned they're the bane of any good PvP combat anyway.

How about in the CP system I have a window to damage players or mobs when they're off-balanced. Or animation speeds, dodge roll speeds, ACTION SPEEDS are faster... how about I get a few yards on a gap closer, or reach on my soul harvest goes an extra meter or two?

How about, since you want to throw flat numbers into gear, you let the CP system enhance the base gameplay, NOT THE ALGORITHMS. Jesus, you guys are DEFINITELY engineers who never turned a wrench in your life, so you actually do not know how *** works.

MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS

I'LL SAY IT LOUD IN THE BACK FOR YOU *** WHO LIKE TO MATH NOW AND WONDER WHY *** BREAKS LATER

MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS
MECHANICS BEFORE ALGORITHMNS

Holy *** Christ man. Devs are like virtual engineers, in theory your *** works, in practice it usually takes the Welder, Mechanic, or Machinist whos got years of experience to explain to you why you don't know what the hell you are doing.

And I hate snowflakes, so I'm going not be cordial about it.

You lock all the best gear behind a bunch of mobs, trials, and other *** content that most of us hate doing. Its the equivalent to putting the *** oil filter in a place where someone with a big ass hand cant *** reach it.

To top it off, statsluts LOVE their *** RNG.

THINK OF SOMETHING BETTER.

Bang bang! Have a nice day!

he's right.

Lexxypwns

ITT: OP complains about mechanics before algorithms while not understanding mechanics

TheBonesXXX

Lexxypwns wrote: »

ITT: OP complains about mechanics before algorithms while not understanding mechanics

That's why the game is in the state it is in right? Dumbed down combat and algorithms all over the place, instead of making sure the movements are fluid and then are supported by mathematics. Or perhaps the results of my movements allow another active effect.

Instead of something stupid like passive mathematics first so damage is more important than the active combat fluidity of the game.

Please, shut up.

Lexxypwns

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

ITT: OP complains about mechanics before algorithms while not understanding mechanics

That's why the game is in the state it is in right? Dumbed down combat and algorithms all over the place, instead of making sure the movements are fluid and then are supported by mathematics. Or perhaps the results of my movements allow another active effect.

Instead of something stupid like passive mathematics first so damage is more important than the active combat fluidity of the game.

Please, shut up.

You got it chump, die in ignorance

Waffennacht

Nothing to see here

Lexxypwns

Waffennacht wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

ITT: OP complains about mechanics before algorithms while not understanding mechanics

That's why the game is in the state it is in right? Dumbed down combat and algorithms all over the place, instead of making sure the movements are fluid and then are supported by mathematics. Or perhaps the results of my movements allow another active effect.

Instead of something stupid like passive mathematics first so damage is more important than the active combat fluidity of the game.

Please, shut up.

Except that even with the nerfs in place there are mechanics that allow for near infinite sustain. Its not my fault you and many others are so busy crying that you can't see that there's still going to be infinite sustain builds that have VERY HIGH damage this patch. The mechanics are currently in place to continue to have asinine amounts of sustain at the cost of very little damage next patch. Add in front loaded damage CP and I actually think I'll be pushing similar or more damage this patch while having virtually the same amount of sustain.

All of these changes just make the way we seek sustain different, not more difficult.

You clearly don't understand how to play the game properly if you can't see that the mechanics still exist to do the same things we're doing today.

@lexxypwns stop it! You're gonna say too much!

@Waffennacht I think we're going to ruin the game bro, they not ready. Edit that quote out

TheBonesXXX

Lexxypwns wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

ITT: OP complains about mechanics before algorithms while not understanding mechanics

That's why the game is in the state it is in right? Dumbed down combat and algorithms all over the place, instead of making sure the movements are fluid and then are supported by mathematics. Or perhaps the results of my movements allow another active effect.

Instead of something stupid like passive mathematics first so damage is more important than the active combat fluidity of the game.

Please, shut up.

You got it chump, die in ignorance

The numerical inflation that has affected this game from the start is due to people talking about parts of the game that aren't actually based on movement or creating an action is not surprising.

The design itself is flawed, because instead of building on top of combat animations, missile movements, dodge rolls, and fluidity; achieving conditions based off of combat decisions rather than relying on the hardest hitting ability and some passive numbers based on a RNG chance.

"Infinite sustain", good job genius that's the algorithm before mechanics I was talking about. Passively getting back stats is NOT movement based, ie mechanics.

Dodge rolling resulting in the imbalance effect then a light attack to knock an opponent down is good design. Using the champion tree to passively boost things that are not pro-active and re-active is a *** design.

Lexxypwns

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

ITT: OP complains about mechanics before algorithms while not understanding mechanics

That's why the game is in the state it is in right? Dumbed down combat and algorithms all over the place, instead of making sure the movements are fluid and then are supported by mathematics. Or perhaps the results of my movements allow another active effect.

Instead of something stupid like passive mathematics first so damage is more important than the active combat fluidity of the game.

Please, shut up.

You got it chump, die in ignorance

The numerical inflation that has affected this game from the start is due to people talking about parts of the game that aren't actually based on movement or creating an action is not surprising.

The design itself is flawed, because instead of building on top of combat animations, missile movements, dodge rolls, and fluidity; achieving conditions based off of combat decisions rather than relying on the hardest hitting ability and some passive numbers based on a RNG chance.

"Infinite sustain", good job genius that's the algorithm before mechanics I was talking about. Passively getting back stats is NOT movement based, ie mechanics.

Dodge rolling resulting in the imbalance effect then a light attack to knock an opponent down is good design. Using the champion tree to passively boost things that are not pro-active and re-active is a *** design.

except that building for all those things makes the game that much more resource intensive to run, thus further decreasing the audience and making it impossible to work on current gen consoles. You're forgetting that video games are commerce? Enjoy your ignorance.

bg22

30%... not 60.