I read every stam character is running Blackrose. What is the mag alternative for mag character?

altemriel

Hi guys, I am not an expert in build theory crafting, but I have read many times on the forums here, that Blackrose set is pretty much a meta for stam characters in PVP.
http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Black+Rose+Set

Is there any similar magicka alternative (as Blackrose) for mag character? (edit: highlighted red, bold) A mag NB? Or should I just run 5 Magnus (or 5 Lich) + 4 Julianos (2 armor, 2 dual wield) or 5 Clever Alchemyst/4 Vicious Death, or anything better?

I am looking for crafted sets, as I do not do grinding much and I am a noobie casual, so no trials, no vet dungeons (only very few vet dungs so far)...

thanx in advance !

Mustard

You simply just need to run black rose as a magicka player also!

altemriel

Mustard wrote: »

You simply just need to run black rose as a magicka player also!

hmm, but the 2., 3., 4. piece bonuses seem to me more like for tanky or stam players, not so much for magicka players. but I might be wrong...


and also as a mag player, should I run 5 heavy armor? Is it not better to go 5 light and maybe 2 heavy? or 1 medium, 1 heavy?

susmitds

Heavy Kags

altemriel

for example @Sypher in this video runs 5 Lich/4 Julianos/3 Willpower. He said there also, that if we do not have (or can not afford to buy) Lich set, we can run 5 Magnus (or 5 Seducer)/4 Julianos/3 Willpower
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrsbZK-EUw0
(video uploaded 13.06.2016)


What do you say to that?

CapuchinSeven

altemriel wrote: »

Mustard wrote: »

You simply just need to run black rose as a magicka player also!

hmm, but the 2., 3., 4. piece bonuses seem to me more like for tanky or stam players, not so much for magicka players. but I might be wrong...


and also as a mag player, should I run 5 heavy armor? Is it not better to go 5 light and maybe 2 heavy? or 1 medium, 1 heavy?

I've not done it but he's probably right, you could probably run BR on a magic character as well.
To answer your question, there are some "good" magic sets (enjoying Elegant right now, cheap to buy and find and actually has worked really well for my Destro build) but none of them come close to sets like Viper, BR etc off the top of my head.

Calboy

Don't listen to the forums. Everyone is not wearing black rose. In fact there are more people wearing medium according to hard data supplied from zos.

ClockworkArc

I mean Blackrose is a farmed set. Farmed sets are powerful generally because they provide raw numbers in a way that crafted sets can't. The reason TBS, Clever, Tava's, Armor Master, Pelinal's, and Kag's, and Eternal Hunt are all powerful is because there is no other way to obtain similar bonuses from anything else in the game, thus keeping them relevant.

I will say that I've had pretty amazing luck with Amberplasm though. It provides a nice chunk of sustain and some damage stats.

Lokey0024

susmitds wrote: »

Heavy Kags

GreenSoup2HoT

Calboy wrote: »

Don't listen to the forums. Everyone is not wearing black rose. In fact there are more people wearing medium according to hard data supplied from zos.

30% of the piayerbase is still wearing heavy. How many MMO's can you count that have had that amount of players using heavy armour? In my opinion not that many.

I'd like to see some stats that show which heavy sets are being used by that percentage. I could probably pick out 3 that will be the majority.

DannyLV702

Forum users typically don't reflect actual open world environments. You have no idea how many times I've tried to convince people that blackrose is a good set but they're all "nah lol". Most people don't even seem to know it exist

thankyourat

altemriel wrote: »

for example @Sypher in this video runs 5 Lich/4 Julianos/3 Willpower. He said there also, that if we do not have (or can not afford to buy) Lich set, we can run 5 Magnus (or 5 Seducer)/4 Julianos/3 Willpower
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrsbZK-EUw0
(video uploaded 13.06.2016)


What do you say to that?

That's a good build. when I play dual wield on my magblade that's the gear set up I run also, have you looked into playing a destro/restro magblade. It's a better option in my opinion

Emma_Overload

After wearing Black Rose for a while on my mag Sorc, I've come to the conclusion that Seducer (or Magnus) would be a better choice if you want to run Heavy Armor.

Lokey0024

Emma_Overload wrote: »

After wearing Black Rose for a while on my mag Sorc, I've come to the conclusion that Seducer (or Magnus) would be a better choice if you want to run Heavy Armor.

Na dont say that. It doesnt fit into this story of BR being so OP magika toons can use it.

Berenhir

Actually the light armor equivalent of Black Rose is Desert Rose.
But what do you mean by equivalent?
A defensive light armor set? Transmutation. A heavy armor set viable for magicka sustain? Seducer.

altemriel

thankyourat wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

for example @Sypher in this video runs 5 Lich/4 Julianos/3 Willpower. He said there also, that if we do not have (or can not afford to buy) Lich set, we can run 5 Magnus (or 5 Seducer)/4 Julianos/3 Willpower
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrsbZK-EUw0
(video uploaded 13.06.2016)


What do you say to that?

That's a good build. when I play dual wield on my magblade that's the gear set up I run also, have you looked into playing a destro/restro magblade. It's a better option in my opinion

well, not yet, could you please share a good destro/restro build?

The biggest advantage of running dual wield on the main bar (as in this Sypher`s build) is the 2 piece bonus of dual wield weapons imho.

Alucardo

I use heavy Seducer. It's nice to see an older crafted set still be useful.

altemriel

Alucardo wrote: »

I use heavy Seducer. It's nice to see an older crafted set still be useful.

hmm, I am thinking about 5 Magnus/4 Julianos (dual wield) for my mag NB. But I am not sure which one is better, if Magnus or Seducer. My NB is only lv 10 or so, but I like her to play ganker burst damage style.


Edit: hmm, I see that the 5th bonus of Seducer is "always", but the 5th of Magnus is only 8% chance...

Alucardo

altemriel wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

I use heavy Seducer. It's nice to see an older crafted set still be useful.

hmm, I am thinking about 5 Magnus/4 Julianos (dual wield) for my mag NB. But I am not sure which one is better, if Magnus or Seducer. My NB is only lv 10 or so, but I like her to play ganker burst damage style.

Magnus 4 pc is great, but I wouldn't recommend the fifth bonus to anyone. It very rarely procs, and when it does it usually only likes to negate the cost of cheap spells. At least with Seducer you're getting a constant cost reduction, which I found is actually cheaper than running 5 Magnus. But for a burst build I can't imagine Seducer doing you much good.
Siphoning attacks on NB is fairly strong for resource management as long as you keep it up.

Sharee

I'm using 5 pieces kagrenac, 3 willpower jewelry(rings are sturdy), 2 torug s/s on primary bar(offensive), 2 seducer s/s on back bar(defensive), shoulder and helm i change a lot, but standard is 1 kena 1 seducer, or 2 bloodspawn, depending on whether i need to be more tanky or have more damage.

And i carry fasalla jewelry and mace/shield in my pack for special occasions.

(this is on a heavy armor magicka DK)

DKsUnite

you can legit use black rose and instead of running tri food, run bi food for mag and health

altemriel

Alucardo wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

I use heavy Seducer. It's nice to see an older crafted set still be useful.

hmm, I am thinking about 5 Magnus/4 Julianos (dual wield) for my mag NB. But I am not sure which one is better, if Magnus or Seducer. My NB is only lv 10 or so, but I like her to play ganker burst damage style.

Magnus 4 pc is great, but I wouldn't recommend the fifth bonus to anyone. It very rarely procs, and when it does it usually only likes to negate the cost of cheap spells. At least with Seducer you're getting a constant cost reduction, which I found is actually cheaper than running 5 Magnus. But for a burst build I can't imagine Seducer doing you much good.
Siphoning attacks on NB is fairly strong for resource management as long as you keep it up.

very good point, thank you!!

altemriel

Sharee wrote: »

I'm using 5 pieces kagrenac, 3 willpower jewelry(rings are sturdy), 2 torug s/s on primary bar(offensive), 2 seducer s/s on back bar(defensive), shoulder and helm i change a lot, but standard is 1 kena 1 seducer, or 2 bloodspawn, depending on whether i need to be more tanky or have more damage.

And i carry fasalla jewelry and mace/shield in my pack for special occasions.

(this is on a heavy armor magicka DK)

ok, thanx, but I was asking for a mag NB (I have highlighted it more in the OP now)

altemriel

and as second set (2 armor, 2 dual wield weapons) is Julianos viable for PVP, when two of the bonuses are to spell critical and everyone wears impenetrable armor traits for PVP?

I believe for PVE it is good, but which crafted set would you recommend for PVP @Alucardo ?

my primary armor set will be 5 Seducer.

I will run DW/restro build probably. Mag NB, ganker burst style.


edit: Kagrenac or Torug? or anything better for a mag NB?

http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Kagrenac's+Hope+Set
http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Torug's+Pact+Set

altemriel

altemriel wrote: »

and as second set (2 armor, 2 dual wield weapons) is Julianos viable for PVP, when two of the bonuses are to spell critical and everyone wears impenetrable armor traits for PVP?

I believe for PVE it is good, but which crafted set would you recommend for PVP @Alucardo ?

my primary armor set will be 5 Seducer.

I will run DW/restro build probably. Mag NB, ganker burst style.


edit: Kagrenac or Torug? or anything better for a mag NB?

http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Kagrenac's+Hope+Set
http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Torug's+Pact+Set

anyone else?

CapuchinSeven

thankyourat wrote: »

It's a better option in my opinion

I agree, DW has its movements but I find the ability to attack weave as well as being able to cloak and then heavy attack very useful. I have to admit though nearly every skill I use is a class skill, other than Reach and Ward. I find Swallow Soul a much better choice than Shock.

Destro for me is about the light and heavy attack (to the point where I've been trying out the elegant set).

altemriel

CapuchinSeven wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

It's a better option in my opinion

I agree, DW has its movements but I find the ability to attack weave as well as being able to cloak and then heavy attack very useful. I have to admit though nearly every skill I use is a class skill, other than Reach and Ward. I find Swallow Soul a much better choice than Shock.

Destro for me is about the light and heavy attack (to the point where I've been trying out the elegant set).

yes, the sypher`s DW/restro build, video above, is also using only class skills (no DW skill), only some restro skills from restro staff.
I did not master animation cancelling yet....

or what do you mean by "attack weave"?

But the great advantage of DW is that it counts as 2 pieces bonus to set bonus

Kerioko

I am still running an old argonian sap tank in PVP:

- 5 Heavy Kagrenacs
- 2 Heavy Malubeth
- 3 Willpower Jewelry with Spell Damage
- Torug's SnB
- Malestrom Resto (really helps with magicka sustain)

Also tried 5 Black Rose, 5 Fasalla, 2 Malubeth for pure troll tank, but lacks ability to kill anything like the above set-up.

Occasionally run 5 Fasalla, 5 Transmutation, 2 Engine Guardian for heavy armored NB healer.

altemriel

Kerioko wrote: »

I am still running an old argonian sap tank in PVP:

- 5 Heavy Kagrenacs
- 2 Heavy Malubeth
- 3 Willpower Jewelry with Spell Damage
- Torug's SnB
- Malestrom Resto (really helps with magicka sustain)

Also tried 5 Black Rose, 5 Fasalla, 2 Malubeth for pure troll tank, but lacks ability to kill anything like the above set-up.

Occasionally run 5 Fasalla, 5 Transmutation, 2 Engine Guardian for heavy armored NB healer.

really thank you for sharing, but I was asking about crafted sets , I am a noobie casual player, I only did maybe like 2 vet dungeons, no trials, so crafted sets are the best for me. Kagrenac is crafted one I know, but the rest not.

Berenhir

altemriel wrote: »

Kerioko wrote: »

I am still running an old argonian sap tank in PVP:

- 5 Heavy Kagrenacs
- 2 Heavy Malubeth
- 3 Willpower Jewelry with Spell Damage
- Torug's SnB
- Malestrom Resto (really helps with magicka sustain)

Also tried 5 Black Rose, 5 Fasalla, 2 Malubeth for pure troll tank, but lacks ability to kill anything like the above set-up.

Occasionally run 5 Fasalla, 5 Transmutation, 2 Engine Guardian for heavy armored NB healer.

really thank you for sharing, but I was asking about crafted sets , I am a noobie casual player, I only did maybe like 2 vet dungeons, no trials, no crafted sets are the best for me. Kagrenac is crafted one I know, but the rest not.

But you can buy stuff from the guild stores. It's usually cheaper than crafting and upgrading your own gear.

If you want to be a tanky NB with burst potential I recommend:

5 Julianos (Heavy on Legs and Chest)
5 Transmutation (Head, Shoulders, Jewellery)
2 Torugs Pact DW sharpened/infused OR 1 sharpened Destro Staff (Destro highly recommended)
1 resto staff

5 Impen, 2 well-fitted, Hakeijo on chest/head/leg

Slot Radiant Magelight on main bar.
Transmutation should be always up with Strife.
One siphoning ability on every bar at least.
Use blurr.

altemriel

Berenhir wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

Kerioko wrote: »

I am still running an old argonian sap tank in PVP:

- 5 Heavy Kagrenacs
- 2 Heavy Malubeth
- 3 Willpower Jewelry with Spell Damage
- Torug's SnB
- Malestrom Resto (really helps with magicka sustain)

Also tried 5 Black Rose, 5 Fasalla, 2 Malubeth for pure troll tank, but lacks ability to kill anything like the above set-up.

Occasionally run 5 Fasalla, 5 Transmutation, 2 Engine Guardian for heavy armored NB healer.

really thank you for sharing, but I was asking about crafted sets , I am a noobie casual player, I only did maybe like 2 vet dungeons, no trials, no crafted sets are the best for me. Kagrenac is crafted one I know, but the rest not.

But you can buy stuff from the guild stores. It's usually cheaper than crafting and upgrading your own gear.

If you want to be a tanky NB with burst potential I recommend:

5 Julianos (Heavy on Legs and Chest)
5 Transmutation (Head, Shoulders, Jewellery)
2 Torugs Pact DW sharpened/infused OR 1 sharpened Destro Staff (Destro highly recommended)
1 resto staff

5 Impen, 2 well-fitted, Hakeijo on chest/head/leg

Slot Radiant Magelight on main bar.
Transmutation should be always up with Strife.
One siphoning ability on every bar at least.
Use blurr.

thank you for sharing, I will try that out.

I have a question, how do you mean this Transmutation should be always up with Strife. ??
I somehow do not see the connection there.


http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Robes+of+Transmutation+Set
http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Strife