Magicka sorc damage

Makkir

Surge- 2% spell dmg from passive, can pre-cast, flat heal on crit
Entropy- 5% health, 2% magicka regen/2%max magicka from passive, weak DOT and Heal, empowers


Only time I used surge would be running Julianos. Otherwise, I still prefer Entropy.
I never messed with Degeneration.

Minalan

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

His point, is that in the time it takes to cast entropy you can hit the enemy with a force pulse instead, and do as much damage as a 20% frag bonus (4-5K damage, plus the chance for a chill or burning DOT effect). Note I mean just the 20% bonus not the whole frag.

My biggest issue with surge is that it never heals (less than half of all attacks, and not for much) and when it does its for a tiny amount. Entropy gives more health and is more dependable that way.

Now if Magicka sorcs could apply a DOT it would be better, which is why I want to try destructive reach instead of pulse. That does Slightly less damage than force pulse (much more on vampires) and a DOT to trigger surge heals.

LegendaryMage

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

His point, is that in the time it takes to cast entropy you can hit the enemy with a force pulse instead, and do as much damage as a 20% frag bonus (4-5K damage, plus the chance for a chill or burning DOT effect). Note I mean just the 20% bonus not the whole frag.

My biggest issue with surge is that it never heals (less than half of all attacks, and not for much) and when it does its for a tiny amount. Entropy gives more health and is more dependable that way.

Now if Magicka sorcs could apply a DOT it would be better, which is why I want to try destructive reach instead of pulse. That does Slightly less damage than force pulse (much more on vampires) and a DOT to trigger surge heals.

Yeah, I've been using destructive reach and it's a good skill, especially with the new master update staff. However, the thing about entropy is, I know what you mean about casting one more pulse, I thought it was like that too, but the 20% buff on both frags and curse seems much more efficient in a way. I've been testing this against good sorcerers, and I can't explain it, but whenever I try to keep sustained dps on them, they go on and on with no problems somehow. Then, after a few rotations of carefully buffing up pretty much all hard hitters, they die. It's weird, but it's true.

Makkir

Just curious, what's the heal from surge with major vitality up? 1800ish?

Derra

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

His point, is that in the time it takes to cast entropy you can hit the enemy with a force pulse instead, and do as much damage as a 20% frag bonus (4-5K damage, plus the chance for a chill or burning DOT effect). Note I mean just the 20% bonus not the whole frag.

My biggest issue with surge is that it never heals (less than half of all attacks, and not for much) and when it does its for a tiny amount. Entropy gives more health and is more dependable that way.

Now if Magicka sorcs could apply a DOT it would be better, which is why I want to try destructive reach instead of pulse. That does Slightly less damage than force pulse (much more on vampires) and a DOT to trigger surge heals.

Yeah, I've been using destructive reach and it's a good skill, especially with the new master update staff. However, the thing about entropy is, I know what you mean about casting one more pulse, I thought it was like that too, but the 20% buff on both frags and curse seems much more efficient in a way. I've been testing this against good sorcerers, and I can't explain it, but whenever I try to keep sustained dps on them, they go on and on with no problems somehow. Then, after a few rotations of carefully buffing up pretty much all hard hitters, they die. It's weird, but it's true.

What good sorcs are there left ?

Minalan

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

His point, is that in the time it takes to cast entropy you can hit the enemy with a force pulse instead, and do as much damage as a 20% frag bonus (4-5K damage, plus the chance for a chill or burning DOT effect). Note I mean just the 20% bonus not the whole frag.

My biggest issue with surge is that it never heals (less than half of all attacks, and not for much) and when it does its for a tiny amount. Entropy gives more health and is more dependable that way.

Now if Magicka sorcs could apply a DOT it would be better, which is why I want to try destructive reach instead of pulse. That does Slightly less damage than force pulse (much more on vampires) and a DOT to trigger surge heals.

Yeah, I've been using destructive reach and it's a good skill, especially with the new master update staff. However, the thing about entropy is, I know what you mean about casting one more pulse, I thought it was like that too, but the 20% buff on both frags and curse seems much more efficient in a way. I've been testing this against good sorcerers, and I can't explain it, but whenever I try to keep sustained dps on them, they go on and on with no problems somehow. Then, after a few rotations of carefully buffing up pretty much all hard hitters, they die. It's weird, but it's true.

With sorcs, there's a big difference between tearing their shields down in one hit versus two. One empowered frags can leave a sorc on his back with no shields. Assuming curse goes off and another frag while they're CC breaking, and it's over.

A good sorc is going to block once they see that entropy refresh!

Makkir

Derra wrote: »

Yeah, I've been using destructive reach and it's a good skill, especially with the new master update staff. However, the thing about entropy is, I know what you mean about casting one more pulse, I thought it was like that too, but the 20% buff on both frags and curse seems much more efficient in a way. I've been testing this against good sorcerers, and I can't explain it, but whenever I try to keep sustained dps on them, they go on and on with no problems somehow. Then, after a few rotations of carefully buffing up pretty much all hard hitters, they die. It's weird, but it's true.

What good sorcs are there left ?

Think the only sorcs left are in this thread.

Aedaryl

I'm still here, after testing stamblade and stamsorc, I come back on Magsorc, more funny in my opinion

I choose to do a pet build on my sorc, seems effective to me, sorcs here tested it in SOTH pts ? I want to have some opinions/feedback

Minalan

Makkir wrote: »

Surge- 2% spell dmg from passive, can pre-cast, flat heal on crit
Entropy- 5% health, 2% magicka regen/2%max magicka from passive, weak DOT and Heal, empowers


Only time I used surge would be running Julianos. Otherwise, I still prefer Entropy.
I never messed with Degeneration.

Master staff will reduce cost and increase damage on destructive touch. The DoT from that should also trigger surge a few times, regardless if you're running Julianos or not. Problem is getting a sharpened master fire staff.. I'm going to live in DSA until I do.

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Yeah, I've been using destructive reach and it's a good skill, especially with the new master update staff. However, the thing about entropy is, I know what you mean about casting one more pulse, I thought it was like that too, but the 20% buff on both frags and curse seems much more efficient in a way. I've been testing this against good sorcerers, and I can't explain it, but whenever I try to keep sustained dps on them, they go on and on with no problems somehow. Then, after a few rotations of carefully buffing up pretty much all hard hitters, they die. It's weird, but it's true.

What good sorcs are there left ?

Think the only sorcs left are in this thread.

There are a lot of good sorcs out there still. I'm not one of them, but I'm working on it!

Makkir

Minalan wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Surge- 2% spell dmg from passive, can pre-cast, flat heal on crit
Entropy- 5% health, 2% magicka regen/2%max magicka from passive, weak DOT and Heal, empowers


Only time I used surge would be running Julianos. Otherwise, I still prefer Entropy.
I never messed with Degeneration.

Master staff will reduce cost and increase damage on destructive touch. The DoT from that should also trigger surge a few times, regardless if you're running Julianos or not. Problem is getting a sharpened master fire staff.. I'm going to live in DSA until I do.

YEP. Going to miss the interrupt from Crush but we're really getting a lot of neat options today. Hell, with Amberplasm regen I wonder if you can run a vitality pot instead for bigger ticks.

Methariorn

Derra wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

His point, is that in the time it takes to cast entropy you can hit the enemy with a force pulse instead, and do as much damage as a 20% frag bonus (4-5K damage, plus the chance for a chill or burning DOT effect). Note I mean just the 20% bonus not the whole frag.

My biggest issue with surge is that it never heals (less than half of all attacks, and not for much) and when it does its for a tiny amount. Entropy gives more health and is more dependable that way.

Now if Magicka sorcs could apply a DOT it would be better, which is why I want to try destructive reach instead of pulse. That does Slightly less damage than force pulse (much more on vampires) and a DOT to trigger surge heals.

Yeah, I've been using destructive reach and it's a good skill, especially with the new master update staff. However, the thing about entropy is, I know what you mean about casting one more pulse, I thought it was like that too, but the 20% buff on both frags and curse seems much more efficient in a way. I've been testing this against good sorcerers, and I can't explain it, but whenever I try to keep sustained dps on them, they go on and on with no problems somehow. Then, after a few rotations of carefully buffing up pretty much all hard hitters, they die. It's weird, but it's true.

What good sorcs are there left ?

Elo'Dryel, Illuminati,Tuvi are still around. Sometime I've meet Baldmage but most time he's on his alt.

bardx86

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

Gonna have to disagree. I used entropy most of my time as a sorc but if you are using a staff, every cast of entropy is a waisted 5-7k damage GCD in Heavy attack>crushing. And that 5-7k is more than the might of the guild proc added to a dodge-able frags, waisted pressure and ult gen, in my mind.

LegendaryMage

bardx86 wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

Gonna have to disagree. I used entropy most of my time as a sorc but if you are using a staff, every cast of entropy is a waisted 5-7k damage GCD in Heavy attack>crushing. And that 5-7k is more than the might of the guild proc added to a dodge-able frags, waisted pressure and ult gen, in my mind.

True. It does look better on paper, but as Minalan said - entropy is good for setting up burst, which is often mandatory against excellent magicka opponents. And with opponents that use reflective scales, it helps with doing more damage as well. So it just depends on playstyle. Personally, I go with entropy based on what I 'feel' I need to do in terms of dps, but some people out there prefer to just keep spamming damage. Which you can also do with entropy, there's no reason why surge performs better in that scenario. Apart from a heal or two (which I don't really need on the sorc) it gives no more benefits than entropy (2% spell dmg vs 2% max mag and regen etc).

Minalan

I've confirmed that destructive touch ticks off surge at least 3-4 times each shot with the DOT. That almost makes it worthwhile...

The problem is that it costs more, quite a bit without the master fire staff.

ToRelax

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

Makkir

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

psychotic13

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

Xeven

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

Minalan

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

This pretty much. It's not worth losing the spell damage enchant though I think. That and the two piece Magnus gives you about the same Magicka bonus without farming the DSA forever.

The knock back on destructive reach is fun, I've got to remember to use it on people up on keep walls. The fire dot helps more with surge heals. You can also use it to make a follow up frag undodgeable if you manage to hit someone.

With crits, the heal on destructive reach DOT was 5K or so and it hit for 6-8K or so damage wise.

Crushing shock counts as three separate hits though right? For reflect?

Xeven

Minalan wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

Crushing shock counts as three separate hits though right? For reflect?

No that was a "bug". All the DKs cried.

Xeven

Minalan wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

farming the DSA forever.

I'm always top 2% in my campaign so I'll likely get one eventually, but I don't really care.

Minalan

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

I wonder if the sun set would do any better with destructive reach. Between that and fire heavy attacks, both would gain another 400 spell damage.

Methariorn

I'm too old to even hope to get on top 2% wife and daughter are the worst pvp enemy so I've to stick on more common equip

loki547

Minalan wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

I wonder if the sun set would do any better with destructive reach. Between that and fire heavy attacks, both would gain another 400 spell damage.

Silks of he sun only helps fire abilities, so light and heavy attacks aren't counted iirc

loki547

Makkir wrote: »

Surge- 2% spell dmg from passive, can pre-cast, flat heal on crit
Entropy- 5% health, 2% magicka regen/2%max magicka from passive, weak DOT and Heal, empowers


Only time I used surge would be running Julianos. Otherwise, I still prefer Entropy.
I never messed with Degeneration.

Structured Entropy morph for a Magicka sorc is 1000% worthless and even hurts you in some situations. All having an extra 5℅ health on one bar while you constantly switch between weapons is makes your execute range larger on that bar (usually your offensive bar) which is bad. Degeneration on the other hand has a chance (albeit a small one) to heal on light attacks which is actually very good. Structured is only good if you are a dk or Templar using health based dmg shields and effects - Igneous, Dragon Blood, Blazing shield etc

Derra

Minalan wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

This pretty much. It's not worth losing the spell damage enchant though I think. That and the two piece Magnus gives you about the same Magicka bonus without farming the DSA forever.

The knock back on destructive reach is fun, I've got to remember to use it on people up on keep walls. The fire dot helps more with surge heals. You can also use it to make a follow up frag undodgeable if you manage to hit someone.

With crits, the heal on destructive reach DOT was 5K or so and it hit for 6-8K or so damage wise.

Crushing shock counts as three separate hits though right? For reflect?

The value if destromaster is not the increased dmg but the 12% cost reduction on reach which enables certain builds to replace crushing shock with it while still maintaining good enough DPS to kill opponents.

loki547 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Surge- 2% spell dmg from passive, can pre-cast, flat heal on crit
Entropy- 5% health, 2% magicka regen/2%max magicka from passive, weak DOT and Heal, empowers


Only time I used surge would be running Julianos. Otherwise, I still prefer Entropy.
I never messed with Degeneration.

Structured Entropy morph for a Magicka sorc is 1000% worthless and even hurts you in some situations. All having an extra 5℅ health on one bar while you constantly switch between weapons is makes your execute range larger on that bar (usually your offensive bar) which is bad. Degeneration on the other hand has a chance (albeit a small one) to heal on light attacks which is actually very good. Structured is only good if you are a dk or Templar using health based dmg shields and effects - Igneous, Dragon Blood, Blazing shield etc

SHHHHT - don´t you tell them. I´ve had it happen a couple of times now that a sorc switched bar and as a result procced mages wrath by having structured slotted.

Minalan

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Destructive Reach is there to kick people down from things. Not good as a spammable dps ability. ^^

paired with the cp160 Masters Staff

How much does the master staff increase the damage by?

516, halved by battle spirit and further reduced by resistances. I don't see the value. You also lose actually useful enchants.

1k magicka is nice, but youre giving up a set bonus for it. A Seducer staff, for example.

I see it's place in a max magika build, but I think I'll hold out for the crushing shock master weapon. This one is underwhelming. So is the malestrom staff IMO.

This pretty much. It's not worth losing the spell damage enchant though I think. That and the two piece Magnus gives you about the same Magicka bonus without farming the DSA forever.

The knock back on destructive reach is fun, I've got to remember to use it on people up on keep walls. The fire dot helps more with surge heals. You can also use it to make a follow up frag undodgeable if you manage to hit someone.

With crits, the heal on destructive reach DOT was 5K or so and it hit for 6-8K or so damage wise.

Crushing shock counts as three separate hits though right? For reflect?

The value if destromaster is not the increased dmg but the 12% cost reduction on reach which enables certain builds to replace crushing shock with it while still maintaining good enough DPS to kill opponents.

loki547 wrote: »

Makkir wrote: »

Surge- 2% spell dmg from passive, can pre-cast, flat heal on crit
Entropy- 5% health, 2% magicka regen/2%max magicka from passive, weak DOT and Heal, empowers


Only time I used surge would be running Julianos. Otherwise, I still prefer Entropy.
I never messed with Degeneration.

Structured Entropy morph for a Magicka sorc is 1000% worthless and even hurts you in some situations. All having an extra 5℅ health on one bar while you constantly switch between weapons is makes your execute range larger on that bar (usually your offensive bar) which is bad. Degeneration on the other hand has a chance (albeit a small one) to heal on light attacks which is actually very good. Structured is only good if you are a dk or Templar using health based dmg shields and effects - Igneous, Dragon Blood, Blazing shield etc

SHHHHT - don´t you tell them. I´ve had it happen a couple of times now that a sorc switched bar and as a result procced mages wrath by having structured slotted.

1. With seducers, Breton, and five light armor, the cost difference is about 900. The value of CC, the burning DOT and surge can't be overstated. I've been using it, and guzzling magicka pots. But it's been effective. Fire heavy -> destructive reach -> frags -> curse.

It's different, and I got so sick of that stupid beam and the horrible buzz sound.

2. So if someone is at 28%, then bar switches to the off bar (without entropy) to heal and suddenly drops below 20%. Kaboom!

Caza99

My mag sorc I either use:
5x Seducer
3x Willpower
2x Engine Guardian
Random Lightning Staff and Restoration Staff (will use Master Staves now that they are CP160)

OR

5x Seducer
3x Willpower
2x Arch-mage
1x Molag Kena

I tend to prefer the first setup more, but the second produces more damage. I have trouble taking out tank characters with the engine guardian setup but I usually get them one way or another.

Hexys

Make Dawnbreaker of Smiting, Magic Damage again.

mtwiggz

Hexys wrote: »

Make Dawnbreaker of Smiting, Magic Damage again.

Agree that one of the morphs should be Magicka damage. Would gladly give one of the morphs of Meteor physical damage in exchange. FFS it's a giant meteor of intergalactic space rocks, it should cause physical damage!