magic shields mitigate siege damage, but armor rating does not

xylena

that makes this heavy armor user kinda sad QQ

Panda244

Heavy Armor, is, and always shall be, utterly. Useless. I honestly only wear my chest piece for the looks... The physical mitigation is so asinine I'd be better off using another piece of Light Armor for more cost reduction.

Only thing you want to wear a full set of Heavy Armor for is Tanking, after 3-4 pieces of Heavy you start to sacrifice way to much cost reduction and recovery rate for the mitigation that does absolutely nothing.


DK Tank Spec - 44.57% Mitigation - Wrecking Blow - 7k Damage

DK Light Armor Spec - 9% Mitigation - Wrecking Blow - 10k Damage
(Not legitimate test numbers, just the average damage that WB did to me while tanking or in my LA spec.)


It's not worth it. Never was, never will be. ZOS hates Heavy Armor.

RinaldoGandolphi

The problem with armor in game has been what I and other have said since beta.

Medium Armor in this game is actually the Light Armor from Oblivion And Skyrim. This is the problem.

The Light Armor in ESO should not be Light Armor, It should be renamed Clothes and Robes. they should be clothes/robes as they were in Oblivion/Skyrim that offers ZERO Armor and Spell Resist. In return it should give more magic regen, more cost reduction, and more pen, and more spell critical then they do currently, but Robes should offer no armor rating or spell resistances whatsoever. Casters have damage shields, active defenses should be their defense, not armor.

Medium Armor should be renamed to Light Armor and should give 50% of the Armor and Spell Resistance of Heavy Armor.

Heavy Armor stays as is, give it a passive to reduce break free cost without slotting a skill, and add a melee weapon damage bonus to Juggernaut, and i think your gold.

Robes should offer no protection at all, but they should make a caster able to deal a ton of damage. Like say...Robes should have a passive that allows them to ignore 60% of their enemies spell resistance, A passive that gives them 60% cost reduction in full clothing, it should give them a 60% increase in magic regeneration, and add one last passive that increases their max magic by 1% per piece of light armor equipped.

Yes Robes will be powerful for casters, they will also be dead in 1 hit without a shield up...that's the trade off, make the trade off worth it. I always thought it was ridiculous that robes offered any protection at all considering they have never offered protection in any other TES game. This games Medium Armor is the Light Armor from the other games. ZOS just needs to go back to that model so Heavy Armor will actually be viable.

Septimus_Magna

woodsro wrote: »

The problem with armor in game has been what I and other have said since beta.

Medium Armor in this game is actually the Light Armor from Oblivion And Skyrim. This is the problem.

The Light Armor in ESO should not be Light Armor, It should be renamed Clothes and Robes. they should be clothes/robes as they were in Oblivion/Skyrim that offers ZERO Armor and Spell Resist. In return it should give more magic regen, more cost reduction, and more pen, and more spell critical then they do currently, but Robes should offer no armor rating or spell resistances whatsoever. Casters have damage shields, active defenses should be their defense, not armor.

Medium Armor should be renamed to Light Armor and should give 50% of the Armor and Spell Resistance of Heavy Armor.

Heavy Armor stays as is, give it a passive to reduce break free cost without slotting a skill, and add a melee weapon damage bonus to Juggernaut, and i think your gold.

Robes should offer no protection at all, but they should make a caster able to deal a ton of damage. Like say...Robes should have a passive that allows them to ignore 60% of their enemies spell resistance, A passive that gives them 60% cost reduction in full clothing, it should give them a 60% increase in magic regeneration, and add one last passive that increases their max magic by 1% per piece of light armor equipped.

Yes Robes will be powerful for casters, they will also be dead in 1 hit without a shield up...that's the trade off, make the trade off worth it. I always thought it was ridiculous that robes offered any protection at all considering they have never offered protection in any other TES game. This games Medium Armor is the Light Armor from the other games. ZOS just needs to go back to that model so Heavy Armor will actually be viable.

Lol, this would be impossible to balance. Good luck surviving any ganker with such a glass canon build. I would be oke with a passive which decreases AOE/siege damage by 2% per heavy armor piece. Imo its better to balance the game by slight buffs and tweaks instead of magnifying the pro's and con's even more.

Rune_Relic

woodsro wrote: »

The problem with armor in game has been what I and other have said since beta.

Medium Armor in this game is actually the Light Armor from Oblivion And Skyrim. This is the problem.

The Light Armor in ESO should not be Light Armor, It should be renamed Clothes and Robes. they should be clothes/robes as they were in Oblivion/Skyrim that offers ZERO Armor and Spell Resist. In return it should give more magic regen, more cost reduction, and more pen, and more spell critical then they do currently, but Robes should offer no armor rating or spell resistances whatsoever. Casters have damage shields, active defenses should be their defense, not armor.

Medium Armor should be renamed to Light Armor and should give 50% of the Armor and Spell Resistance of Heavy Armor.

Heavy Armor stays as is, give it a passive to reduce break free cost without slotting a skill, and add a melee weapon damage bonus to Juggernaut, and i think your gold.

Robes should offer no protection at all, but they should make a caster able to deal a ton of damage. Like say...Robes should have a passive that allows them to ignore 60% of their enemies spell resistance, A passive that gives them 60% cost reduction in full clothing, it should give them a 60% increase in magic regeneration, and add one last passive that increases their max magic by 1% per piece of light armor equipped.

Yes Robes will be powerful for casters, they will also be dead in 1 hit without a shield up...that's the trade off, make the trade off worth it. I always thought it was ridiculous that robes offered any protection at all considering they have never offered protection in any other TES game. This games Medium Armor is the Light Armor from the other games. ZOS just needs to go back to that model so Heavy Armor will actually be viable.

Mostly agree. Armour was a hindrance to magic wielders as it hindered the gestures they need to make hence the need for robes to enhance magic rather than armour to hinder it. But then people couldn't have their battlemage.

I think battlemage would still be possible.. just that you sacrificed spell potentcy for weapon potency.
And for that you would be wearing more heavy than light anyway.

iseko

Stam heavy armor with block is worth it. But with some sets and 5 medium/2H I think you could get the relative same effect with added bonus of: more weapon dmg/ sustain. The CP's are a nice touch in that respect. Upgrade your passives where you need them most. Instead of being bound to passives per armor/weapon/skill set.

Ezareth

xylena wrote: »

that makes this heavy armor user kinda sad QQ

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

Cody

Damage shields will now be known as "magical heavy armor"

there we go, much better:)

Vis

What are you talking about? Magicka shields mitigate siege damage?

Cody

Vis wrote: »

What are you talking about? Magicka shields mitigate siege damage?

yes, they do.

ZOS wants players in LA spamming/stacking damage shields to be the tanks it seems.

Vis

Cody wrote: »

Vis wrote: »

What are you talking about? Magicka shields mitigate siege damage?

yes, they do.

ZOS wants players in LA spamming/stacking damage shields to be the tanks it seems.

How so? Explain.

ScruffyWhiskers

Ezareth wrote: »

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

I know you are kind of joking but I wish it were just that easy. If you are a melee type character it's a different experience than a pew pew character. You don't always have the situational awareness luxory that pew pewers have. While you are pew pewing away holding block or scanning to make sure your hardened ward and harness magicka are 5/5 you tend to notice the big red circle a lot more....still can't always tell whose side the big red circle is but that's another problem. Oh and just hit bolt to get out of the big red circle isn't something we can all do. I know you can sprint, dodge roll or in my case double take it out of danger but a lot of other melee builds don't have it that easy.

Vis

Someone explain how magic shields are mitigating siege damage?

Ezareth

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

I know you are kind of joking but I wish it were just that easy. If you are a melee type character it's a different experience than a pew pew character. You don't always have the situational awareness luxory that pew pewers have. While you are pew pewing away holding block or scanning to make sure your hardened ward and harness magicka are 5/5 you tend to notice the big red circle a lot more....still can't always tell whose side the big red circle is but that's another problem. Oh and just hit bolt to get out of the big red circle isn't something we can all do. I know you can sprint, dodge roll or in my case double take it out of danger but a lot of other melee builds don't have it that easy.

I am joking haha. I get 1-shotted by siege all the time. I fought off an entire raid of DC last night in a 20 minute rolling back and forth (with a bunch of AD as well obviously) and didn't die once....until I was hit point blank by a fire ballista.

I died so many times in a tower farm my guild and I set up from getting 1-shotted from trebs *through* my shields that I had to stay downstairs.

Vis wrote: »

Someone explain how magic shields are mitigating siege damage?

Damage shields absorb damage. If you get hit by a 20K siege and you have a 10K shield, your health takes 10K in damage instead of 20.

I can usually stand in fire ballistas since I can absorb the initial hit, purge the dots tick and then reapply the shield.

Vis

Ezareth wrote: »

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

I know you are kind of joking but I wish it were just that easy. If you are a melee type character it's a different experience than a pew pew character. You don't always have the situational awareness luxory that pew pewers have. While you are pew pewing away holding block or scanning to make sure your hardened ward and harness magicka are 5/5 you tend to notice the big red circle a lot more....still can't always tell whose side the big red circle is but that's another problem. Oh and just hit bolt to get out of the big red circle isn't something we can all do. I know you can sprint, dodge roll or in my case double take it out of danger but a lot of other melee builds don't have it that easy.

I am joking haha. I get 1-shotted by siege all the time. I fought off an entire raid of DC last night in a 20 minute rolling back and forth (with a bunch of AD as well obviously) and didn't die once....until I was hit point blank by a fire ballista.

I died so many times in a tower farm my guild and I set up from getting 1-shotted from trebs *through* my shields that I had to stay downstairs.

Vis wrote: »

Someone explain how magic shields are mitigating siege damage?

Damage shields absorb damage. If you get hit by a 20K siege and you have a 10K shield, your health takes 10K in damage instead of 20.

I can usually stand in fire ballistas since I can absorb the initial hit, purge the dots tick and then reapply the shield.

That's not the definition of mitigation. I am still taking the same 20k damage even if some of it is absorbed.

Ezareth

Vis wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

I know you are kind of joking but I wish it were just that easy. If you are a melee type character it's a different experience than a pew pew character. You don't always have the situational awareness luxory that pew pewers have. While you are pew pewing away holding block or scanning to make sure your hardened ward and harness magicka are 5/5 you tend to notice the big red circle a lot more....still can't always tell whose side the big red circle is but that's another problem. Oh and just hit bolt to get out of the big red circle isn't something we can all do. I know you can sprint, dodge roll or in my case double take it out of danger but a lot of other melee builds don't have it that easy.

I am joking haha. I get 1-shotted by siege all the time. I fought off an entire raid of DC last night in a 20 minute rolling back and forth (with a bunch of AD as well obviously) and didn't die once....until I was hit point blank by a fire ballista.

I died so many times in a tower farm my guild and I set up from getting 1-shotted from trebs *through* my shields that I had to stay downstairs.

Vis wrote: »

Someone explain how magic shields are mitigating siege damage?

Damage shields absorb damage. If you get hit by a 20K siege and you have a 10K shield, your health takes 10K in damage instead of 20.

I can usually stand in fire ballistas since I can absorb the initial hit, purge the dots tick and then reapply the shield.

That's not the definition of mitigation. I am still taking the same 20k damage even if some of it is absorbed.

I agree but you see this is a Nerf Sorceror thread so it's OK to bend the facts a little bit.

RinaldoGandolphi

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

The problem with armor in game has been what I and other have said since beta.

Medium Armor in this game is actually the Light Armor from Oblivion And Skyrim. This is the problem.

The Light Armor in ESO should not be Light Armor, It should be renamed Clothes and Robes. they should be clothes/robes as they were in Oblivion/Skyrim that offers ZERO Armor and Spell Resist. In return it should give more magic regen, more cost reduction, and more pen, and more spell critical then they do currently, but Robes should offer no armor rating or spell resistances whatsoever. Casters have damage shields, active defenses should be their defense, not armor.

Medium Armor should be renamed to Light Armor and should give 50% of the Armor and Spell Resistance of Heavy Armor.

Heavy Armor stays as is, give it a passive to reduce break free cost without slotting a skill, and add a melee weapon damage bonus to Juggernaut, and i think your gold.

Robes should offer no protection at all, but they should make a caster able to deal a ton of damage. Like say...Robes should have a passive that allows them to ignore 60% of their enemies spell resistance, A passive that gives them 60% cost reduction in full clothing, it should give them a 60% increase in magic regeneration, and add one last passive that increases their max magic by 1% per piece of light armor equipped.

Yes Robes will be powerful for casters, they will also be dead in 1 hit without a shield up...that's the trade off, make the trade off worth it. I always thought it was ridiculous that robes offered any protection at all considering they have never offered protection in any other TES game. This games Medium Armor is the Light Armor from the other games. ZOS just needs to go back to that model so Heavy Armor will actually be viable.

Lol, this would be impossible to balance. Good luck surviving any ganker with such a glass canon build. I would be oke with a passive which decreases AOE/siege damage by 2% per heavy armor piece. Imo its better to balance the game by slight buffs and tweaks instead of magnifying the pro's and con's even more.

Thats the point, Shirt and Robes are not Light Armor, they are clothes. They should offer no protection whatsoever, and instead should enhance the ability of spellcasters in return.

Casters are supposed to rely on active defenses(defense spells and buffs) anyways in lieu of armor. Damage Shields, and to be frank a Stoneflesh Spell should be added under the "World Skill Tree" that would make your body glow and give you X amount of armor rating for x number of seconds that must be cast like shields when they expire in order to give you active defense. Want to survive a gank? Keep your Ward up all the time. it is what it is.

As a Light Armor users, I think its absurd i can survive an Arrow Shot, or being hit with a sword wearing nothing but some plain old clothes, you would be lucky to survive that in chainmail let alone cotton LOL!

Give me more regen, more spell cost reduction, more max magicka, more spell penetration, and more spell critical as passive to light armor and i'll take that anyday in return for Robes being what they are which is robes that offer no protection. Just my 2 cents.

xylena

i survive being hit by siege fine... thanks to igneous shield, not my armor

players shouldnt be punished for investing in armor as opposed to magic shields

this isnt "nerf shields" its "buff armor"

@ezareth plz dont turn this into another dumb sorc thread, idc about sorcs, i care about armor

Ezareth

xylena wrote: »

i survive being hit by siege fine... thanks to igneous shield, not my armor

players shouldnt be punished for investing in armor as opposed to magic shields

this isnt "nerf shields" its "buff armor"

@ezareth plz dont turn this into another dumb sorc thread, idc about sorcs, i care about armor

Roger that, it's easy to confuse these days all things considering.

I'd say I don't think armor should mitigate siege damage though as heavy armor is already extremely powerful and not only would allowing armor to reduce siege damage make heavy armor even more powerful compared to others, it would nerf siege damage across the board as even light armor users would receive some mitigation.

Vis

You can ask for buffs to armor, but please do not spead any nonsense that magicka shields mitigate siege damage.

Cody

Ezareth wrote: »

Vis wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

I know you are kind of joking but I wish it were just that easy. If you are a melee type character it's a different experience than a pew pew character. You don't always have the situational awareness luxory that pew pewers have. While you are pew pewing away holding block or scanning to make sure your hardened ward and harness magicka are 5/5 you tend to notice the big red circle a lot more....still can't always tell whose side the big red circle is but that's another problem. Oh and just hit bolt to get out of the big red circle isn't something we can all do. I know you can sprint, dodge roll or in my case double take it out of danger but a lot of other melee builds don't have it that easy.

I am joking haha. I get 1-shotted by siege all the time. I fought off an entire raid of DC last night in a 20 minute rolling back and forth (with a bunch of AD as well obviously) and didn't die once....until I was hit point blank by a fire ballista.

I died so many times in a tower farm my guild and I set up from getting 1-shotted from trebs *through* my shields that I had to stay downstairs.

Vis wrote: »

Someone explain how magic shields are mitigating siege damage?

Damage shields absorb damage. If you get hit by a 20K siege and you have a 10K shield, your health takes 10K in damage instead of 20.

I can usually stand in fire ballistas since I can absorb the initial hit, purge the dots tick and then reapply the shield.

That's not the definition of mitigation. I am still taking the same 20k damage even if some of it is absorbed.

I agree but you see this is a Nerf Sorceror thread so it's OK to bend the facts a little bit.

must you make every single thread talking about damage shields into a nerf sorcerer thread?

you need to lighten up Ezareth.

Oughash

Ezareth wrote: »

I am joking haha. I get 1-shotted by siege all the time. I fought off an entire raid of DC last night in a 20 minute rolling back and forth (with a bunch of AD as well obviously) and didn't die once....until I was hit point blank by a fire ballista.

If you're talking about the fights between Ash and Nikel on Haderus last night you hardly "fought us off." We were there farming AD bads -- no desire to take anything. Standing orders not to engage you (e.g. stay on crown) since you always just bolt escape. Yes, you picked off people (including me), got some kills, didn't die. But your presence had no influence on the outcome of any of those fights, only the total AD numbers did and their siege. After a while we had to go defend North against EP.

Ezareth

Ishammael wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

I am joking haha. I get 1-shotted by siege all the time. I fought off an entire raid of DC last night in a 20 minute rolling back and forth (with a bunch of AD as well obviously) and didn't die once....until I was hit point blank by a fire ballista.

If you're talking about the fights between Ash and Nikel on Haderus last night you hardly "fought us off." We were there farming AD bads -- no desire to take anything. Standing orders not to engage you (e.g. stay on crown) since you always just bolt escape. Yes, you picked off people (including me), got some kills, didn't die. But your presence had no influence on the outcome of any of those fights, only the total AD numbers did and their siege. After a while we had to go defend North against EP.

Aye, wasn't trying to say anything other than everyone dies to siege, even *** who don't like to die like me ( =

You were farming AD pugs in a pack and I was the lone wolf farming the lambs who strayed from the fold. You guys did a good job of not letting me pull you apart. Ball tactics make anyone in the "Ball" practically invincible to any single target damage. Every time I dropped 20K damage on someone they were instantly healed back to full.

You made a ton of AP, I made a ton of AP, we both were sated until the Ballista Gods claimed their sacrifices ) =

Tankqull

Ezareth wrote: »

xylena wrote: »

i survive being hit by siege fine... thanks to igneous shield, not my armor

players shouldnt be punished for investing in armor as opposed to magic shields

this isnt "nerf shields" its "buff armor"

@ezareth plz dont turn this into another dumb sorc thread, idc about sorcs, i care about armor

Roger that, it's easy to confuse these days all things considering.

I'd say I don't think armor should mitigate siege damage though as heavy armor is already extremely powerful and not only would allowing armor to reduce siege damage make heavy armor even more powerful compared to others, it would nerf siege damage across the board as even light armor users would receive some mitigation.

well people should just use the heavy PvP armor wich grants a 30% dmg reduction to siege weapons combine that with the 30% reduction of siege shield and you are facing loughable dmg...

Shiall

Tankqull wrote: »

well people should just use the heavy PvP armor wich grants a 30% dmg reduction to siege weapons combine that with the 30% reduction of siege shield and you are facing loughable dmg...

Incoming or Outcoming damage?

Sacadon

Vis wrote: »

You can ask for buffs to armor, but please do not spead any nonsense that magicka shields mitigate siege damage.

^^

Zsymon

woodsro wrote: »

Heavy Armor stays as is, give it a passive to reduce break free cost without slotting a skill, and add a melee weapon damage bonus to Juggernaut, and i think your gold.

Heavy armor used to reduce Break Free cost, and it used to add melee weapon damage, but they removed both bonuses for God knows what reason.

jelliedsoup

Ezareth wrote: »

xylena wrote: »

that makes this heavy armor user kinda sad QQ

Red Circles = bad. Don't stand in them ) =

Or just outside of them.

Draxys

Zsymon wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

Heavy Armor stays as is, give it a passive to reduce break free cost without slotting a skill, and add a melee weapon damage bonus to Juggernaut, and i think your gold.

Heavy armor used to reduce Break Free cost, and it used to add melee weapon damage, but they removed both bonuses for God knows what reason.

champion system

Draxys

Panda244 wrote: »

Heavy Armor, is, and always shall be, utterly. Useless. I honestly only wear my chest piece for the looks... The physical mitigation is so asinine I'd be better off using another piece of Light Armor for more cost reduction.

Only thing you want to wear a full set of Heavy Armor for is Tanking, after 3-4 pieces of Heavy you start to sacrifice way to much cost reduction and recovery rate for the mitigation that does absolutely nothing.


DK Tank Spec - 44.57% Mitigation - Wrecking Blow - 7k Damage

DK Light Armor Spec - 9% Mitigation - Wrecking Blow - 10k Damage
(Not legitimate test numbers, just the average damage that WB did to me while tanking or in my LA spec.)


It's not worth it. Never was, never will be. ZOS hates Heavy Armor.

If heavy armor is still worthless, why did nearly every magicka build add two heavy to their setup?

jelliedsoup

Draxys wrote: »

Panda244 wrote: »

Heavy Armor, is, and always shall be, utterly. Useless. I honestly only wear my chest piece for the looks... The physical mitigation is so asinine I'd be better off using another piece of Light Armor for more cost reduction.

Only thing you want to wear a full set of Heavy Armor for is Tanking, after 3-4 pieces of Heavy you start to sacrifice way to much cost reduction and recovery rate for the mitigation that does absolutely nothing.


DK Tank Spec - 44.57% Mitigation - Wrecking Blow - 7k Damage

DK Light Armor Spec - 9% Mitigation - Wrecking Blow - 10k Damage
(Not legitimate test numbers, just the average damage that WB did to me while tanking or in my LA spec.)


It's not worth it. Never was, never will be. ZOS hates Heavy Armor.

If heavy armor is still worthless, why did nearly every magicka build add two heavy to their setup?

So they could tank as you would expect.