What really needs a nerf?

jpalm1995

So, i've been starting to pay attention to what the community thinks about certain skills being OP. From all of the forum posts and in game rants i've seen, it seems like sorcs, dodge rolling, and wrecking blow are the big topics. I now know exactly what should be nerfed...


NOTHING.

First of all, to all the people (mainly sorcs/templars) complaining about dodge roll spammers: Get over it. Do you expect someone to just sit there and let you kill them? Its not broken, its their form of survivability. That would be like taking away hardened ward/blazing shield.

To all of the people complaining about the sorcs: They aren't OP. Catch them w/o shields and you can 1-hit them. If they bolt away, follow them with your gap closer (if you aren't using a gap closer in pvp then you have an L2P issue). I've watched sorcs kill themselves with bolt escape cause someone chased them w/ crit charge. And don't complain about them running away from fights cause you NBs are just as guilty, if not worse.

Lastly, wrecking blow is a pain to land. Wrecking blow becomes deadly when you aren't paying attention to the player who lands it. I agree that there are some gameplay issues with it. However, I don't think its an issue with the skill itself.

The purpose behind this post is this: Stop whining about a skill/ability just cause you get countered by it. if sorcs really bother you that much, add some weapon damage. If WB spammers bother you, make your build a little more tanky. This game is the most balanced it has ever been. How about instead of crying for a nerf every time someone kills you, try to adapt your build/playstyle to whatever is killing you. Every build has a counter. If it didn't then PvP would be pointless. Everyone is obviously biased towards their own class/build which is understandable. But crying for a nerf is toxic.

Would love to hear some feedback.

Rune_Relic

Nerf this thread ! Its too OP.

iseko

If anything, I think temps need a buff. I'm playing a sorc. Templars are mainly just free AP in my eyes. They're allrounders. In 1.6 that means they seem to suck at everything... Healing got nerfed, magicka dps is terrible, DK's are better tanks,... Might be wrong, just my perception.

technohic

iseko wrote: »

If anything, I think temps need a buff. I'm playing a sorc. Templars are mainly just free AP in my eyes. They're allrounders. In 1.6 that means they seem to suck at everything... Healing got nerfed, magicka dps is terrible, DK's are better tanks,... Might be wrong, just my perception.

They could start by fixing a couple abilities and I would be happy. Speaking of gap closers; my Templars is maybe more dangerous for myself than my target with the odds of getting stuck in animation. Eclipse CCs myself. Blazing shield was getting a nerf by having a cost increase, and also having health scale for less than pre-1,6 and then ate a shield nerf of 15% while in Cyrodiil. Restoring aura was whacked beyond recognition and RIP blinding flashes. Healing was nerfed in passives both in our tree as well as resto staff bonus no longer applying.

All I got was a big "HIT ME HERE" spotlight extravaganza spell in RD.

Remember when everyone was whining that Templars were going to be the new FOTM? They may be best in stamina builds now; which no one wants to see in their group because they still expect us to be their healers.

jpalm1995

They could start by fixing a couple abilities and I would be happy. Speaking of gap closers; my Templars is maybe more dangerous for myself than my target with the odds of getting stuck in animation. Eclipse CCs myself. Blazing shield was getting a nerf by having a cost increase, and also having health scale for less than pre-1,6 and then ate a shield nerf of 15% while in Cyrodiil. Restoring aura was whacked beyond recognition and RIP blinding flashes.

All I got was a big "HIT ME HERE" spotlight extravaganza spell in RD.[/quote]

I agree w/ you. Toppling charge is beyond bugged. I play a templar as well so I know how you feel.

thelordoffelines

Nerf trap beast. When is this clearly op and game breaking skill going to be nerfed?

Shunravi

thelordoffelines wrote: »

Nerf trap beast. When is this clearly op and game breaking skill going to be nerfed?

Omg yes! I stepped on one the other day and it stopped me for a fraction of a second and made me waste a small bit of stamina! With the amount of damage I received I thought someone had sneak attacked me with a light attack! Massively OP!

Cody

i say sorcs need a buff. they lack any kind of reliable self-heal.

Ezareth

iseko wrote: »

If anything, I think temps need a buff. I'm playing a sorc. Templars are mainly just free AP in my eyes. They're allrounders. In 1.6 that means they seem to suck at everything... Healing got nerfed, magicka dps is terrible, DK's are better tanks,... Might be wrong, just my perception.

I could get on board the buff templar train...but that is probably because I haven't run into Ebonheart Templar or another good Templar in a long while.

Draxys

I would agree with you if someone could dodge roll 25 times to survive and not have much stamina left to fight... But they can, and quite easily if someone actually bothers to theorycraft a decent build. If I cast 25 heals as a magicka build to be able survive, I don't have any ability to turn around and fight back. Hardly seems balanced for stamina to be able to evade damage for a very long time and still be able to turn around and put up a decent fight (and put out twice as much damage as Magicka, if not more in some cases), when magicka cannot.

I had that very thing happen to me a couple nights ago, I witnessed a person dodge roll about 15-20 times out into a field so that we were alone, then they turned around and crit charge/wrecking blow for a large chunk of my health (I do wear some heavy but it can still crit me for 10-12k). I ended up winning the duel, but the fact still remains that it's a little ridiculous that it's possible to do that in one type of build but not the other.

Edit: by the way, I don't disagree with your opposition to nerfing everything. I think sometimes instead of nerfs, other things need buffs. Balance can be a tricky thing.

iseko

Ezareth wrote: »

iseko wrote: »

If anything, I think temps need a buff. I'm playing a sorc. Templars are mainly just free AP in my eyes. They're allrounders. In 1.6 that means they seem to suck at everything... Healing got nerfed, magicka dps is terrible, DK's are better tanks,... Might be wrong, just my perception.

I could get on board the buff templar train...but that is probably because I haven't run into Ebonheart Templar or another good Templar in a long while.

It's because the class is *** ATM, no defense, no offense, sub par heals. Pure ***

technohic

Templars are broken: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/161959/templar-skills-bugged-made-useless-ignored/p1

TBois

Draxys wrote: »

I would agree with you if someone could dodge roll 25 times to survive and not have much stamina left to fight... But they can, and quite easily if someone actually bothers to theorycraft a decent build. If I cast 25 heals as a magicka build to be able survive, I don't have any ability to turn around and fight back. Hardly seems balanced for stamina to be able to evade damage for a very long time and still be able to turn around and put up a decent fight (and put out twice as much damage as Magicka, if not more in some cases), when magicka cannot.

I had that very thing happen to me a couple nights ago, I witnessed a person dodge roll about 15-20 times out into a field so that we were alone, then they turned around and crit charge/wrecking blow for a large chunk of my health (I do wear some heavy but it can still crit me for 10-12k). I ended up winning the duel, but the fact still remains that it's a little ridiculous that it's possible to do that in one type of build but not the other.

Edit: by the way, I don't disagree with your opposition to nerfing everything. I think sometimes instead of nerfs, other things need buffs. Balance can be a tricky thing.

idk Drax shields are pretty spammable with the right build, and you won. Once he went to dps he was probably pretty ok to manage. Its the same with sorcs who spam shields and bolt. Just don't chase them. I think both are pretty ok as they are.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Ezareth wrote: »

iseko wrote: »

If anything, I think temps need a buff. I'm playing a sorc. Templars are mainly just free AP in my eyes. They're allrounders. In 1.6 that means they seem to suck at everything... Healing got nerfed, magicka dps is terrible, DK's are better tanks,... Might be wrong, just my perception.

I could get on board the buff templar train...but that is probably because I haven't run into Ebonheart Templar or another good Templar in a long while.

Another sorc here for buffing templars. But I agree, what templars really need are long overdue fixes, not buffs per se.

If ZOS finally fixes the damn toppling charge then templars could chase sorcs all day. That charge has a cheap cost and is a great magicka dump. But it's worthless with a self stun.

Remove the CDs on templar abilities, ALL OF THEM!!! That means solar barrage too, jabs, etc.

Blazing shield could use a bit of tweaking too. Maybe since its costs more now it could shield for 35-40% of health instead of just 30%. This suggestion may come back to bite me though when people get more champion points and running 30-35K health becomes the new meta.

skarvika

Anything that can 1/2-shot a player needs a nerf. Radiant Destruction (and I say this with RD on my bar), Lethal Arrow, Wrecking Blow, etc... That or buff up everything else to be just as viable.

davedesigns

Nerf the lag and low FPS...

Draehl

Things about every class need to be tweaked. Things about game systems need to be tweaked. People who insist everything is fine (in nearly any MMO) are delusional and/or trying to be tough guys. These games are damn difficult to balance correctly. Something will always be OP or too weak to be viable. Devs need to constantly be improving and we as player need to whine and cry to make the imbalanced known. Do we often overstate the imbalances? Yes, but they still exist.

TheElementalPlatypus

Fix Cloak - NB's would be the happiest they've ever been, we would love it, so very much, but you know, it breaks off of just about everything

Yeh templars need things fixed, their skills are really buggy. TOPPLING CHARGE GLOBAL COOLDOWN LOL

bg22

lololol

1 shot kill if you get past their shields. XD

Yeah, no biggy. Just get past the shields.

lolol

Roechacca

Game runs perfect . People need to stop complaining about problems that don't exist

technohic

Roechacca wrote: »

Game runs perfect . People need to stop complaining about problems that don't exist

I'm glad I am used to seeing you, or I would be really pissed and linking my vids.

iseko

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

iseko wrote: »

If anything, I think temps need a buff. I'm playing a sorc. Templars are mainly just free AP in my eyes. They're allrounders. In 1.6 that means they seem to suck at everything... Healing got nerfed, magicka dps is terrible, DK's are better tanks,... Might be wrong, just my perception.

I could get on board the buff templar train...but that is probably because I haven't run into Ebonheart Templar or another good Templar in a long while.

Another sorc here for buffing templars. But I agree, what templars really need are long overdue fixes, not buffs per se.

If ZOS finally fixes the damn toppling charge then templars could chase sorcs all day. That charge has a cheap cost and is a great magicka dump. But it's worthless with a self stun.

Remove the CDs on templar abilities, ALL OF THEM!!! That means solar barrage too, jabs, etc.

Blazing shield could use a bit of tweaking too. Maybe since its costs more now it could shield for 35-40% of health instead of just 30%. This suggestion may come back to bite me though when people get more champion points and running 30-35K health becomes the new meta.

Blazing shield got nerfed to ***. Increased cost and reduced effectiveness. Now it is only 27% of your health. And no it does not increase as it levels. Healing skills overal got nerfed. Templar has the highest skills cost, the lowest dps and the worst sustain in the magicka department. Any half decent templar Ive seen in pvp is glass cannon stam build. With some survivability in 1v1. AvA they are just insta killed.

It's like the devs took out the old nerf bat when making 1.6 and randomly started swinging it. The first blow landed on templars and then they just kept whacking away. Untill there was nothing left but a little red pile that used to be a decent class.

Templar used to be hard to play with but very effective when you knew how. They were always up close. They wre not unkillable tanks like DK's but they could be right in your face, taking a beating while pushing out a constant DPS barrage. Now... Free AP anyone?

pronkg

Draxys wrote: »

I would agree with you if someone could dodge roll 25 times to survive and not have much stamina left to fight... But they can, and quite easily if someone actually bothers to theorycraft a decent build. If I cast 25 heals as a magicka build to be able survive, I don't have any ability to turn around and fight back. Hardly seems balanced for stamina to be able to evade damage for a very long time and still be able to turn around and put up a decent fight (and put out twice as much damage as Magicka, if not more in some cases), when magicka cannot.

I had that very thing happen to me a couple nights ago, I witnessed a person dodge roll about 15-20 times out into a field so that we were alone, then they turned around and crit charge/wrecking blow for a large chunk of my health (I do wear some heavy but it can still crit me for 10-12k). I ended up winning the duel, but the fact still remains that it's a little ridiculous that it's possible to do that in one type of build but not the other.

Edit: by the way, I don't disagree with your opposition to nerfing everything. I think sometimes instead of nerfs, other things need buffs. Balance can be a tricky thing.

NB being as weak as they are without decent heals or shields need to be able to do this. I'm speaking as a sorc cause really, if they couldn't do this then they would be no match for me, at all.

And you really need to use block

pronkg

Speaking as a sorc

I pvp allot, and I really can't find anything to be nerfed significantly,

(maybe the cost of bolt escape should be a percentage of max mana instead of flat amounts)

Besides that, overall it's a learning process. I remember dieing allot at first with my "OP" sorceror. Now I've learned how to play, learned how to counter, learned when to block, heck I even got 1 bar reserved for dodge rollers/reflective scales spammers.

All in all it seems to me the balance is good, I've had loads of 1 v 1 fights where I sometimes feel like I'm a god, and other times I get wrecked.

Oh yeh and for me 1 v 1 is a fight to the death, I don't use bolt escape. (Only in 1 vs 50 )

You really never know what you are fighting against. I have 2800 spell damage, if you don't block, counter or dodge then yeah, not matter what class your a goner. But if you CC me once, ill drop like nothing.

Maybe Templars need a little buff, maybe sorcs need a little nerf, in the end it would be minor changes, cause Massively OP doesn't exist anymore.

jpalm1995

I can get on board with the templar buff train. However, the main reason I posted this thread was to call everyone out who is complaining for a nerf to an ability that often kills them. I think the difference between whining for a nerf to sorcerers and asking for a buff to an obviously underpowered class is a huge difference.

I have also noticed how easy templars are to kill, I think they have a lot of skills that are broken and that need fixing.

Vanzen

wrong thread

SafiyerAmitora

jpalm1995 wrote: »

If they bolt away, follow them with your gap closer (if you aren't using a gap closer in pvp then you have an L2P issue).

I no longer use a gap closer on my DK...

But I find having absorb magic (what I replaced invasion with) much more useful/helpful, being a tank and all, so I don't really stress about the loss. I can still play well without it, just it'll be more difficult to kill anyone, especially with my new setup (only actual attacks are talons, whip, and caltrops; everything else is self-heals and buffs). :b

Armitas

Shouldn't we buff nothing? If we nerf nothing we might turn it into something, requiring us to then ask them to nerf something so that we can unbuff something and turn it back into nothing.

Kuro1n

Detection potions needs a nerf, a BIG one.

SafiyerAmitora

Armitas wrote: »

Shouldn't we buff nothing? If we nerf nothing we might turn it into something, requiring us to then ask them to nerf something so that we can unbuff something and turn it back into nothing.

You lost me after the second nothing. >.<'

And good to see you, Armitas. :b Hope to meet you on the battlefield once again. Still as op as I remember you were?

Armitas

SafiyerAmitora wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Shouldn't we buff nothing? If we nerf nothing we might turn it into something, requiring us to then ask them to nerf something so that we can unbuff something and turn it back into nothing.

You lost me after the second nothing. >.<'

And good to see you, Armitas. :b Hope to meet you on the battlefield once again. Still as op as I remember you were?

You too.

Nope, I got 1.6ed.