Can we PLEASE get a fair amount of experience for PvPing???

Glory

Hi ZoS,
Some of us don't like grinding or PvEing and would prefer to PvP to develop our character. Please find a way to make it so that a player can earn champion points (and VR levels...) at a fair rate whether we are in a group or roaming solo.

Thanks.

deleted221205-002626

You DO get a very good amount pvp'n. I completly lvl'd from v1-14 in cyrodiil. You may need the other kind of experience tho to gain the experience yur seeking

IcyDeadPeople

I just resubbed and noticed it is a bit faster than it used to be, as I leveled from lowbie 10 up to VR5 around launch time, playing only in Cyrodiil, and this took 3-4 months playing almost every day.

This weekend it only took me about 2 days to earn ~1m XP (from VR13 to VR14) in Cyrodiil, faster than it used to be.

Still significantly slower than PVE, however, where you can take a new character from wailing prison up to VR14 in a few days through grinding.

cazlonb16_ESO

This has been brought up on the test server forums repeatedly. Basically ZOS' response was "zergball or f off".

Glory

michaelpatterson wrote: »

You DO get a very good amount pvp'n. I completly lvl'd from v1-14 in cyrodiil. You may need the other kind of experience tho to gain the experience yur seeking

It's not hard to level in PvP. The fact that I gained as much experience towards a champion point in a few minutes grinding as I did PvPing for a few hours is problematic and needs to be addressed.

cazlonb16_ESO wrote: »

This has been brought up on the test server forums repeatedly. Basically ZOS' response was "zergball or f off".

Yeah, I don't understand why they're continuing to encourage mindless hive activity. Sad...

cozmon3c_ESO

I don't like to zerg lag ball, its not fun and there is no skill involved. So the solo/small scale groups are going to suffer, thanks zos. There are ways to balance this, give more xp to solo/smaller groups per kill until it's on pay with what zerg get. Or make kill quests completion percentage based depending on how many people in your group. So if you have a zerg you have to kill 100 players and solo 20 and 12 man group 60. And so you can't game the system (percentage based or I guess it's a ratio base) say your in a 24 man group, you get 50 player kills out of 100. You then drop group, your quest drops down to needing 20 player kills but because it's ratio based your kills go from 50 to 10. So you go from 50/100 to 10/20 and vise versa if you join a group. This will even the playing field with pvp kill quests, though I'm not sure how difficult it would be to make a quest as dynamic as this as I have never seen one like this in any game before. It would be cool if you could do it imo.

Rojnaar

There are, and always have been certain NPC's in pvp that are brutal, and you have to focus them down as a priority, often over enemy players. The NPC's in pvp are buffed far beyond their noted level, why not buff the xp for killing them as well. It shouldn't be this difficult.

olsborg

Small scale pvp/solo roaming doesnt grant you nearly the same xp/cp progression as if you where grinding at some mobspot somewhere, this imo, is wrong.

Cody

michaelpatterson wrote: »

You DO get a very good amount pvp'n. I completly lvl'd from v1-14 in cyrodiil. You may need the other kind of experience tho to gain the experience yur seeking

no you don't:/

it took me a full month to get one VR rank.

if i were to lvl from 10-VR14, only PvPing, it would literally take me over a year to reach VR14. whereas in PvE it can be done in just a few days.

That is not fair nor is it balanced.

Obscure

PvP is not for levelling progression. It's very design runs counter to progression incentives that are not mode specific (I.E. Alliance points and skill lines) for good reason. The primary motivation for being in Cyrodiil has been, is, and should continue to be to fight other players. Not levelling. Just fighting. Secondary motivations should be limited to map completion for books, dungeons, points of interest, and/or shards, but at no point should it be about levelling. You want to level? There's a bunch of places to go for you to do that. Yes, levelling is boring. Yes, PvE is often not interesting to PvP focused players. But if they open the door to Cyrodiil being just as viable for levelling as anywhere else then we'll have zones packed with players who have no desire to fight, and just want to level. They'll ignore strategy, they'll ignore critical defence priorities, they'll ignore supporting major pushes on keeps, and the queue will be backed up with the people who actually would make a difference. Good luck succeeding at doing anything when everyone on your alliance is running around just trying to level, holding up slots that prevent your organised crew from getting in.

kash

Obscure wrote: »

PvP is not for levelling progression. It's very design runs counter to progression incentives that are not mode specific (I.E. Alliance points and skill lines) for good reason. The primary motivation for being in Cyrodiil has been, is, and should continue to be to fight other players. Not levelling. Just fighting. Secondary motivations should be limited to map completion for books, dungeons, points of interest, and/or shards, but at no point should it be about levelling. You want to level? There's a bunch of places to go for you to do that. Yes, levelling is boring. Yes, PvE is often not interesting to PvP focused players. But if they open the door to Cyrodiil being just as viable for levelling as anywhere else then we'll have zones packed with players who have no desire to fight, and just want to level. They'll ignore strategy, they'll ignore critical defence priorities, they'll ignore supporting major pushes on keeps, and the queue will be backed up with the people who actually would make a difference. Good luck succeeding at doing anything when everyone on your alliance is running around just trying to level, holding up slots that prevent your organised crew from getting in.

Then pvp should be a separate game like Guild Wars 2 arena matches. It would be a shame to separate people because it's great when everyone can play together, but punishing one part of the player base by designing their preferred area of game play to supplement the other part of the player bases progression is like mmo slavery.

Cody

Obscure wrote: »

PvP is not for levelling progression. It's very design runs counter to progression incentives that are not mode specific (I.E. Alliance points and skill lines) for good reason. The primary motivation for being in Cyrodiil has been, is, and should continue to be to fight other players. Not levelling. Just fighting. Secondary motivations should be limited to map completion for books, dungeons, points of interest, and/or shards, but at no point should it be about levelling. You want to level? There's a bunch of places to go for you to do that. Yes, levelling is boring. Yes, PvE is often not interesting to PvP focused players. But if they open the door to Cyrodiil being just as viable for levelling as anywhere else then we'll have zones packed with players who have no desire to fight, and just want to level. They'll ignore strategy, they'll ignore critical defence priorities, they'll ignore supporting major pushes on keeps, and the queue will be backed up with the people who actually would make a difference. Good luck succeeding at doing anything when everyone on your alliance is running around just trying to level, holding up slots that prevent your organised crew from getting in.

You just keep on with that mindset; and see what it will do to the game a year from now, when people that do nothing but PvE have all 3600CPs and come into PvP and completely crush the PvPers that literally do NOTHING BUT PVP, who will only have a fraction of the full 3600,all because of the garbage XP PvP gets in comparison to PvE.

Now, that hopefully will not happen, but anything is possible; and after seeing how OP people with 3600 CPs are... It is a cause for concern. Even the most skilled PvP player, who does nothing but PvP, won't stand a chance against the most-all PvE player with all 3600CPs; trust me, I am not lying to you. The gap is gigantic.

ZOS, PLEASE increase PvP XP gains. I won't make more of a fuss over it, as it will be quite some time before people start getting 3600 CPs, but it needs to be fixed before then, and people that just do PvP will be FAR behind PvErs if the current XP gain in PvP stays the same.

sicc

Seen this topic so many times the last couple weeks and not even a single response from ZOS.

Glory

Cody wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

PvP is not for levelling progression. It's very design runs counter to progression incentives that are not mode specific (I.E. Alliance points and skill lines) for good reason. The primary motivation for being in Cyrodiil has been, is, and should continue to be to fight other players. Not levelling. Just fighting. Secondary motivations should be limited to map completion for books, dungeons, points of interest, and/or shards, but at no point should it be about levelling. You want to level? There's a bunch of places to go for you to do that. Yes, levelling is boring. Yes, PvE is often not interesting to PvP focused players. But if they open the door to Cyrodiil being just as viable for levelling as anywhere else then we'll have zones packed with players who have no desire to fight, and just want to level. They'll ignore strategy, they'll ignore critical defence priorities, they'll ignore supporting major pushes on keeps, and the queue will be backed up with the people who actually would make a difference. Good luck succeeding at doing anything when everyone on your alliance is running around just trying to level, holding up slots that prevent your organised crew from getting in.

You just keep on with that mindset; and see what it will do to the game a year from now, when people that do nothing but PvE have all 3600CPs and come into PvP and completely crush the PvPers that literally do NOTHING BUT PVP, who will only have a fraction of the full 3600,all because of the garbage XP PvP gets in comparison to PvE.

Now, that hopefully will not happen, but anything is possible; and after seeing how OP people with 3600 CPs are... It is a cause for concern. Even the most skilled PvP player, who does nothing but PvP, won't stand a chance against the most-all PvE player with all 3600CPs; trust me, I am not lying to you. The gap is gigantic.

ZOS, PLEASE increase PvP XP gains. I won't make more of a fuss over it, as it will be quite some time before people start getting 3600 CPs, but it needs to be fixed before then, and people that just do PvP will be FAR behind PvErs if the current XP gain in PvP stays the same.

This entirely. People who are PvPing are visibly falling behind people who are PvEing ALREADY.

Panda244

Short Answer: No.

Long Answer: No you cannot get fair XP for PvPing.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO

so your worried pve'ers are going to grind the same route hours a day for a year an then all of a sudden take up pvp? its one thing to grind VR, and sure most competitive players will do a far bit of cp grinding during enlightenment, but if reaching 3600 is the reason you play then your crazy.

Obscure

@Cody

And yet those who have not spent their time grinding their balls off to get CP, and have pursued exclusively fighting in Cyrodiil will have dramatically more mode specific progression in Assault and Support skill lines, and dramatically more Alliance points with which to use in that game mode. Not saying these equally offset CP grinding, but the mode specific progression is in fact there.

Also worth noting kill bounties grant about 12k XP a pop so, while slower than the boring grind option, PvP exclusive players are still progressing in CP while also progressing in Alliance War skills and AP. What PvP lacks in XP rewards it makes up for in other mode specific rewards AND it doesn't turn the game into a mind numbing grind fest.

Cody

Obscure wrote: »

@Cody

And yet those who have not spent their time grinding their balls off to get CP, and have pursued exclusively fighting in Cyrodiil will have dramatically more mode specific progression in Assault and Support skill lines, and dramatically more Alliance points with which to use in that game mode. Not saying these equally offset CP grinding, but the mode specific progression is in fact there.

Also worth noting kill bounties grant about 12k XP a pop so, while slower than the boring grind option, PvP exclusive players are still progressing in CP while also progressing in Alliance War skills and AP. What PvP lacks in XP rewards it makes up for in other mode specific rewards AND it doesn't turn the game into a mind numbing grind fest.

All that PvP experience and all those alliance war skills won't do squat against someone who has over 1000-2000 more CPs than you. PvE offers MUCH FASTER CP acquisition, and CPs make a HUGE DIFFERENCE. Someone who purely PvPs will be at a huge disadvantage, and they will literally, not be able to even compete when the PvErs with 1000s more CPs than them shows up. This is exactly what happened at launch; groups of players found some grind spots and grinded to VR10 in a week, and all the PvP experience could not save all the pre VRs and low VRs that played the game without doing PvE and those huge grinds. The same thing will happen here if something is not done, only it will be with CPs instead of character level/rank, and it will take a bit more than a week to do it.

If that is the kind of game you support, then You and I have two entirely different viewpoints.

Obscure

Cody wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

@Cody

And yet those who have not spent their time grinding their balls off to get CP, and have pursued exclusively fighting in Cyrodiil will have dramatically more mode specific progression in Assault and Support skill lines, and dramatically more Alliance points with which to use in that game mode. Not saying these equally offset CP grinding, but the mode specific progression is in fact there.

Also worth noting kill bounties grant about 12k XP a pop so, while slower than the boring grind option, PvP exclusive players are still progressing in CP while also progressing in Alliance War skills and AP. What PvP lacks in XP rewards it makes up for in other mode specific rewards AND it doesn't turn the game into a mind numbing grind fest.

All that PvP experience and all those alliance war skills won't do squat against someone who has over 1000-2000 more CPs than you. PvE offers MUCH FASTER CP acquisition, and CPs make a HUGE DIFFERENCE. Someone who purely PvPs will be at a huge disadvantage, and they will literally, not be able to even compete when the PvErs with 1000s more CPs than them shows up. This is exactly what happened at launch; groups of players found some grind spots and grinded to VR10 in a week, and all the PvP experience could not save all the pre VRs and low VRs that played the game without doing PvE and those huge grinds. The same thing will happen here if something is not done, only it will be with CPs instead of character level/rank, and it will take a bit more than a week to do it.

If that is the kind of game you support, then You and I have two entirely different viewpoints.

We don't disagree on the disparity, we disagree on the solution. Make PvP just as XP viable as grinding PvE, and we get a volume of other problems. There are many ways to level the playing field, making PvP a top spot for progression is a poor one. Fighting players is the focus there, that needs to remain the case.

Yes, the game needs to narrow progression gaps between PvP and PvE. No, it doesn't need to do so by inflating PvP XP rewards.

Joy_Division

Obscure wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

@Cody

And yet those who have not spent their time grinding their balls off to get CP, and have pursued exclusively fighting in Cyrodiil will have dramatically more mode specific progression in Assault and Support skill lines, and dramatically more Alliance points with which to use in that game mode. Not saying these equally offset CP grinding, but the mode specific progression is in fact there.

Also worth noting kill bounties grant about 12k XP a pop so, while slower than the boring grind option, PvP exclusive players are still progressing in CP while also progressing in Alliance War skills and AP. What PvP lacks in XP rewards it makes up for in other mode specific rewards AND it doesn't turn the game into a mind numbing grind fest.

All that PvP experience and all those alliance war skills won't do squat against someone who has over 1000-2000 more CPs than you. PvE offers MUCH FASTER CP acquisition, and CPs make a HUGE DIFFERENCE. Someone who purely PvPs will be at a huge disadvantage, and they will literally, not be able to even compete when the PvErs with 1000s more CPs than them shows up. This is exactly what happened at launch; groups of players found some grind spots and grinded to VR10 in a week, and all the PvP experience could not save all the pre VRs and low VRs that played the game without doing PvE and those huge grinds. The same thing will happen here if something is not done, only it will be with CPs instead of character level/rank, and it will take a bit more than a week to do it.

If that is the kind of game you support, then You and I have two entirely different viewpoints.

We don't disagree on the disparity, we disagree on the solution. Make PvP just as XP viable as grinding PvE, and we get a volume of other problems. There are many ways to level the playing field, making PvP a top spot for progression is a poor one. Fighting players is the focus there, that needs to remain the case.

Yes, the game needs to narrow progression gaps between PvP and PvE. No, it doesn't need to do so by inflating PvP XP rewards.

You are crazy thinking. There are people out there with over 120 Champion Points as of last night. I have 78. Up the PvP XP already!

ScruffyWhiskers

I think they might have hotfixed something for PvP. I seem to get enlightenment while I am in Cyrodiil but lose it as soon as I port out. Anybody else seeing this. I've repeated it a bunch of times. Get enlightenment while in Cyrodiil, leave to go grind and then lose it as soon as I port. Really weird.

Vizier

Rojnaar wrote: »

There are, and always have been certain NPC's in pvp that are brutal, and you have to focus them down as a priority, often over enemy players. The NPC's in pvp are buffed far beyond their noted level, why not buff the xp for killing them as well. It shouldn't be this difficult.

that is an excellent point.

olsborg

ebethke_ESO wrote: »

Hi ZoS,
Some of us don't like grinding or PvEing and would prefer to PvP to develop our character. Please find a way to make it so that a player can earn champion points (and VR levels...) at a fair rate whether we are in a group or roaming solo.

Thanks.

Agreed. They should give xp with ap, and cap that system so if youre in a group pvping you cant earn lots more then someone soloing pvp. So if you want to be efficient in gaining xp in pvp you can do so by staying up to the ap-xp cap, and people grouping wont have a huge xp gain compared to you.

Tankqull

Obscure wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

@Cody

And yet those who have not spent their time grinding their balls off to get CP, and have pursued exclusively fighting in Cyrodiil will have dramatically more mode specific progression in Assault and Support skill lines, and dramatically more Alliance points with which to use in that game mode. Not saying these equally offset CP grinding, but the mode specific progression is in fact there.

Also worth noting kill bounties grant about 12k XP a pop so, while slower than the boring grind option, PvP exclusive players are still progressing in CP while also progressing in Alliance War skills and AP. What PvP lacks in XP rewards it makes up for in other mode specific rewards AND it doesn't turn the game into a mind numbing grind fest.

All that PvP experience and all those alliance war skills won't do squat against someone who has over 1000-2000 more CPs than you. PvE offers MUCH FASTER CP acquisition, and CPs make a HUGE DIFFERENCE. Someone who purely PvPs will be at a huge disadvantage, and they will literally, not be able to even compete when the PvErs with 1000s more CPs than them shows up. This is exactly what happened at launch; groups of players found some grind spots and grinded to VR10 in a week, and all the PvP experience could not save all the pre VRs and low VRs that played the game without doing PvE and those huge grinds. The same thing will happen here if something is not done, only it will be with CPs instead of character level/rank, and it will take a bit more than a week to do it.

If that is the kind of game you support, then You and I have two entirely different viewpoints.

We don't disagree on the disparity, we disagree on the solution. Make PvP just as XP viable as grinding PvE, and we get a volume of other problems. There are many ways to level the playing field, making PvP a top spot for progression is a poor one. Fighting players is the focus there, that needs to remain the case.

Yes, the game needs to narrow progression gaps between PvP and PvE. No, it doesn't need to do so by inflating PvP XP rewards.

i doubt anyone wants pvp to be top notch but the gap beeing reduced from 8-10x the cp gained in pve in a given timeframe being reduced to a 25% advantage of pve.

Francescolg

If "median" PvE'ers are only able to do just about 1-2 CP per evening a MASSIVE crying on the forums would start.

There is no alternative to push general PvP-Xp.

Kupoking

Gaining an alliance rank should give a bunch of bonus exp

DisgracefulMind

houimetub17_ESO wrote: »

Gaining an alliance rank should give a bunch of bonus exp

AGREED.

However, I was able to get 4 CPs in Cyrodiil yesterday. Was shocked, but I got them, and had a blast while doing it.

Obscure

houimetub17_ESO wrote: »

Gaining an alliance rank should give a bunch of bonus exp

This is a fair point. However, it must be kept in line with other rewards in the mode granted by Alliance Rank (skill line progression).

If CP from gaining an Alliance Rank = the same time investment for PvE grinding CP, then it'll be an objectively better option as it also progresses Alliance War skill lines. It must be kept in line as a lesser XP reward specifically due to mode specific progression.

On the flip side, they could make the Alliance War skill lines more robust, by simply adding more lines like Infiltration and Siege.

Cody

Obscure wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

@Cody

And yet those who have not spent their time grinding their balls off to get CP, and have pursued exclusively fighting in Cyrodiil will have dramatically more mode specific progression in Assault and Support skill lines, and dramatically more Alliance points with which to use in that game mode. Not saying these equally offset CP grinding, but the mode specific progression is in fact there.

Also worth noting kill bounties grant about 12k XP a pop so, while slower than the boring grind option, PvP exclusive players are still progressing in CP while also progressing in Alliance War skills and AP. What PvP lacks in XP rewards it makes up for in other mode specific rewards AND it doesn't turn the game into a mind numbing grind fest.

All that PvP experience and all those alliance war skills won't do squat against someone who has over 1000-2000 more CPs than you. PvE offers MUCH FASTER CP acquisition, and CPs make a HUGE DIFFERENCE. Someone who purely PvPs will be at a huge disadvantage, and they will literally, not be able to even compete when the PvErs with 1000s more CPs than them shows up. This is exactly what happened at launch; groups of players found some grind spots and grinded to VR10 in a week, and all the PvP experience could not save all the pre VRs and low VRs that played the game without doing PvE and those huge grinds. The same thing will happen here if something is not done, only it will be with CPs instead of character level/rank, and it will take a bit more than a week to do it.

If that is the kind of game you support, then You and I have two entirely different viewpoints.

We don't disagree on the disparity, we disagree on the solution. Make PvP just as XP viable as grinding PvE, and we get a volume of other problems. There are many ways to level the playing field, making PvP a top spot for progression is a poor one. Fighting players is the focus there, that needs to remain the case.

Yes, the game needs to narrow progression gaps between PvP and PvE. No, it doesn't need to do so by inflating PvP XP rewards.

i don't want it top notch, i want it equal with PvE.

Roechacca

PvE players hate PvPers . If there was a stronger word for hate they would have it . They hate the balancing pvp causes . They hate the time it takes away from their game style development and they really hate when people make fun of them for not participating . They don't care if players leave because the pvp is bad and they most certainly would rather see a game go free to play or die off before becoming pvp focused . Don't ask for PvE players to understand your PvP frustration . Don't even bother ! Just ignore every post they make in a pvp thread . Respond to other pvpers and Devs , not them .

Snit

Don't worry, they still plan to increase EXP for vet dungeons and trials.


(I mean... worry)