I summon thee, nightblades!

Tonturri

I actually just want someone to answer some questions on my baby nightblade :B

I'm planning on making her a full medium armor, 2h greatsword/resto staff fighter, and want to know if I'll be anywhere near viable at end-game for DPS purpose. I'd also like to dig into a little bit making a medium armor tank - or, if not, discover which armor type I should level along with medium (light or heavy? I keep getting mixed responses as to which is better for tanking right now). That said, on to the build!

2h sword, 1st bar.
The abilities I am considering - Cleave, Uppercut, Surprise Attack (Veiled Strike), Momentum. I might switch out Cleave or Uppercut with strife or cripple. I also intend on running Siphoning Attacks.

resto staff, 2nd bar
Anything from the 1st bar that didn't fit, if it'll work on a resto bar, along with: Healing Springs, Sap Essence, and an execute.

My questions are:
Shades. Useful, DPS wise? I know the debuff is nice, but running a full medium build, I'm more concerned about dps. I haven't tested it yet, but it'd make sense if it did damage depending on what weapon the caster was using (2h gives it strong attack, and so on) *crosses fingers*

What am I going to do for AoE?!

Siphoning Attacks - worth toggling off when resource-dumping, then toggling back on when I need to regen? Or just keep it up all the time? Iw as pondering just stacking weapon damage to the high heavens past cap, and that + Momentum would negate the damage debuff to a decent degree. Oh, and Sap Essence weapon damage increase.

Does Momentum flat out increase weapon damage, or just damage done with a 2h? Will it apply to Veiled Strike/Surprise Attack if I'm using it on the 2h bar?

If there's room, I also want to work in Haste -> Morph to Focused Attacks (Stam regen) if there's room. Actually, I am quite enthusiastic about this ability. Is it really as good as it looks?

Thanks!

Skullemainia

if you want a better dps i suggest you would also take light armor and if you want to be a tank you should take heavy armor definitely when the champion system will go live.

I'm not such a fan of siphoning attacks because I'm not really using a lot of normal attacks, only for animationblock.

you haven't that much AoE skill's as a NB. the only thing I would strongly suggest is using power extraction cause it can do a lot of AoE dmg plus it gives you more power afterwards.

I'm not a big fan of 2H weapons and personally I would go for dual wielding with a NB just for the critical with my two daggers

ever thought about being a vampire?? it would go verry well with your build

Suntzu1414

unfortunately. For AoE (NB) you're stuck with magica builds.

Additionally, as pointed before, if you don't run light.
Your SAP/VoB (magica) will fall short...

Final Note. If you are really interested in dps.
punt SA... Focus on maxing Weapon Dam.

as the prophets says "dead monsters can't attack".



Kill Well
ST

Tonturri

Final Note. If you are really interested in dps.
punt SA... Focus on maxing Weapon Dam.

Curious - wouldn't this kill my sustain though?

ever thought about being a vampire?? it would go verry well with your build

I haven't! I'm building the character to fit as close as possibly with the RP version of them, so I believe vampire is out. But, how would it go very well with the build?

Thanks for the information you two

Jacques Berge

Start watching at minute 9 for the best application of shades. Enjoy http://youtu.be/6j32My3rLF0

lolo_01b16_ESO

As you care about dps I assume that you want to do trials or other pve content. For pvp survivability or burst damage would be much more important.

On my stamina nb I have skilled dual wield, 2-handed and bow and switch between them depending on the fight i'm going to face. I usually use 2-handed just on my secound bar, but I saw quite a few people with 2-handed as main weapon during our latest trial timeruns. So damagewise you can be good enough even though you won't be able to beat a skilled dk with firestaff at the moment.

Cleave, Uppercut, Cripple and Momentum sounds fine to me. I also use Executioner in fights where I don't have enough Magicka to use Impale until the boss is dead.

Shades are just for damage reduction, stamina drain (in PvP) and mobility (morphed to shadow image). In my latest tests the shades did about 10 -15 dps.

Siphoning Attacks can be usefull, depending on the situation. In bossfights I prefer to have as much weapon damage as possible, but in longer fights with many adds, blocking and dodging (e.g. Praxin, some DSA stages) I like to have them on my bar.

Momentum increases your weapon damage as long as you have a 2-handed weapon equipped, even though the HoT stays when you switch to another weapon. But as the nb-skills scale with spell damage it only influences 2-handed skills, your ultimate and a few other skills that scale with weapon damage (e.g. caltrops).

I prefer the other morph of Haste as I usually have enough stamina regeneration, especially in trials when a templar keeps radiant aura up.

Depending on the fight Reapers Mark can be an alternative for surprise attack.

Additionally you should have Flawless Dawnbreaker on your primary bar and but your active ultimate on the secound bar.

For AoE your options are Carve + Sap Essence + Veil of Blades or switching to Dual wield / bow.

Stannum

1st thing you need to deside wheather you'have stamina or magika build. If you use 2H and medium you need stamina build. So the question is how are you going to use resto? As it scales of magika pool it will be not very effective (and if in 1.6 they make staff scale of spell dmg it will be even less effective).

skills for 2H bar
1. Rally is great
2. AoE: cleave morph should be with power extraction (you may ask why not sap essense it's because of stamina build you will have no enought spell dmg and magika pool to spam sap essense for efficient healing, but power extraction will give you in dangeons great weapon dmg buff - 11% for each target hit up to 99%, and you need not to spam it, one use and kill quick).
3. Veiled strike - scales with magika and uses magika, and is good only from stealth\invis (and cloak also uses lots of magika), as you will use medium you will also have low magika regen.
4. For one target 2h has good loop wrecking blow + full heavy attack (and stamina never ends) but may be you'll need to have unstoppable active while using it.
You can say that you'll have magika resourse managed with leaching strikes and resto, but I think that in this case overall DPS will be much lower.
So pure 2H NB PvE stamina build should looks like this:
carve|execution (or reverse slice)|rally|critical rush|power extraction || flawless dawnbreaker (for large groups)
wrecking blow|execution (or reverse slice)|focussed attacks|critical rush|unstoppable || veil of blades (for bosses)

and last - armour you can use full medium it gets you somewhat bigger crit and stamina regen or use 5 med+heavy torso+light belt it gets you more armour, more spell resist and more magika regen.

Tonturri

execution (or reverse slice)

Slightly confused here - am I going to be working in an execute skill into my normal DPS rotation, no matter what health percentage the boss is at?

Depending on the fight Reapers Mark can be an alternative for surprise attack.

I did not consider this one. Do bosses have enough armor that it is worth using, even with the Surprise attack morph (-40% armor debuff)? I know it has a morph that decreases magicka cost, so will definitely look at it now.

So the question is how are you going to use resto?

For the off-healing while leveling, primarily. I don't expect to use it much later, but I also always try to keep resto staff + bubble on all characters who run vet dungeons/want to run trials. No way I intent to use it for magicka restoration, though. I had some survivability problems on my first nightblade (duel/bow) and since I'm going to be grinding on this new NB, I'm going a little bit more for heals than I normally would due to needing to pull large mobs consistently. Would going double 2h sword for end-game stuff work? I'm just concerned about how well I can survive, as while Rally is nice, I don't think I have room for the Siphoning tree heal or the AoE heal from the other ability.

4. For one target 2h has good loop wrecking blow + full heavy attack (and stamina never ends) but may be you'll need to have unstoppable active while using it.

Would the medium armor Evasion work in place of unstoppable? Also, how much does your wrecking blow hit for - will I ever be able to reach a 2k crit? :O

I'm intending on going stamina, then split the rest between health and magicka for stats.

Stannum

Tonturri wrote: »

execution (or reverse slice)

Slightly confused here - am I going to be working in an execute skill into my normal DPS rotation, no matter what health percentage the boss is at?

No it's for finishing.
If you use execution it gives you passive bonus for low health it is good for one target and gives dmg bonus when you use carve on large groups of mobs as they have low health. If you use reverse slice it has good AoE for low health mobs.

4. For one target 2h has good loop wrecking blow + full heavy attack (and stamina never ends) but may be you'll need to have unstoppable active while using it.

Would the medium armor Evasion work in place of unstoppable? Also, how much does your wrecking blow hit for - will I ever be able to reach a 2k crit? :O

unstoppable is used mostly not for armour buff but for knocking/stun immunity as while you do full heavy you cannot block and when you are bloking you burn your stamina. So Evasion is not equal replace.
2k crit - may be from stealth. on VR2 I have ~1k non-stealth crit dmg.

As for resto, you'll have some healing with rally and you also can use potions when it's hot.

Tonturri

Ah, okay. Trying to figure out what my filler ability is. Am I pretty much stuck with uppercut?

OrphanHelgen

I am tanking vet14 dungeons with medium armor. I have 5 medium and two heavy. Legs, feet, belt and gloves are medium with damage type crafted set items. So when I equip a 2H or bow, I get the full benefit of that set item. Dont remember the name but maybe hundings rage or something?

Then my chest and helm are heavy, with reinforced trait especially on chest because of the high base armor. These two heavy armors including the 5th medium armor shoulder, are tank set items. I think it is called whitestrakes or something.

So now, when I swap from bow/2H to sword and shield (witch is a part of the tank crafted set items) , I get full benefit og that, and can tank. With right skills and end game enchants and food, you will softcap the stats with builds like this anyway. But !!!!! : I think update 6 will remove softcap, Im not sure about this.

Stannum

Tonturri wrote: »

Ah, okay. Trying to figure out what my filler ability is. Am I pretty much stuck with uppercut?

will I ever be able to reach a 2k crit?

btw, checked wreaking blow from stealth with my vr2 redguard NB - 2.6k HP crit

Jacques Berge

dancing.in.the.webeb17_ESO wrote: »

Tonturri wrote: »

Ah, okay. Trying to figure out what my filler ability is. Am I pretty much stuck with uppercut?

will I ever be able to reach a 2k crit?

btw, checked wreaking blow from stealth with my vr2 redguard NB - 2.6k HP crit

Is that in PVE or PVP? Because the modifiers are different. In PVE, Melee sneak attacks enjoy a x4.5 modifier where in pvp it's a x2 modifer. Just thought for food

Stannum

PvE. non-stealt crit ~1k HP, stealth crit ~2.6k HP

TheBull

OP I suggest 2h Bow for DPS. Cleave does damn good AoE dps now a days. Poison injection Focused aim for single target. Get as much stam as you can get.

Running retro as a stam build is just not viable, and NO, shades do next to no dmg. It's an extremely over hyped skill with extremely low functionality, highly situational almost to the point of uselessness in anything other than a duel.

Jacques Berge

Yeah, as much as Iove my shades, they're simply not useful in PVE ... I'm no help if you're wanting to run a Stam dps build. I run a hybrid for pvp and a magic based in PVE. Magic based NB is insanely good, super high ult gen... I've had 3 VoBs running at the same time... It's almost sickening... Almost

Vizier

Insightful thread. Alot of hidden gems here for NB enthusiasts.

Artis

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Yeah, as much as Iove my shades, they're simply not useful in PVE ... I'm no help if you're wanting to run a Stam dps build. I run a hybrid for pvp and a magic based in PVE. Magic based NB is insanely good, super high ult gen... I've had 3 VoBs running at the same time... It's almost sickening... Almost

They are very useful. PvE is not about how much dps you can deal. Well, not only about it. It's also about how much you can help your group - and it's really good for everyone if one NB is running shades. Besides, you don't need ALL your slots for ST dps. You simply won't use that many skills In aoe fights.. yeah, pretty hard to use shades efficiently, but if you can target the most dangerous enemy - send shades there.

Jacques Berge

Artemis wrote: »

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Yeah, as much as Iove my shades, they're simply not useful in PVE ... I'm no help if you're wanting to run a Stam dps build. I run a hybrid for pvp and a magic based in PVE. Magic based NB is insanely good, super high ult gen... I've had 3 VoBs running at the same time... It's almost sickening... Almost

They are very useful. PvE is not about how much dps you can deal. Well, not only about it. It's also about how much you can help your group - and it's really good for everyone if one NB is running shades. Besides, you don't need ALL your slots for ST dps. You simply won't use that many skills In aoe fights.. yeah, pretty hard to use shades efficiently, but if you can target the most dangerous enemy - send shades there.

Haha... Oh sorry, my tank always uses deep slash or whatever... The damage debifs don't stack... That is why I don't really use em in PVE.

Tonturri

I definitely intend on running Shades in my tank loadout. That teleport *drools*. Thanks all for your help!

Artis

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Artemis wrote: »

Jacques Berge wrote: »

Yeah, as much as Iove my shades, they're simply not useful in PVE ... I'm no help if you're wanting to run a Stam dps build. I run a hybrid for pvp and a magic based in PVE. Magic based NB is insanely good, super high ult gen... I've had 3 VoBs running at the same time... It's almost sickening... Almost

They are very useful. PvE is not about how much dps you can deal. Well, not only about it. It's also about how much you can help your group - and it's really good for everyone if one NB is running shades. Besides, you don't need ALL your slots for ST dps. You simply won't use that many skills In aoe fights.. yeah, pretty hard to use shades efficiently, but if you can target the most dangerous enemy - send shades there.

Haha... Oh sorry, my tank always uses deep slash or whatever... The damage debifs don't stack... That is why I don't really use em in PVE.

Sure, but not all the tanks are stamina-based and would rather use shades or, even better, use that slot for something more useful than deep slash or shades if another NB in a group is running shades. In some fights (last fight in vet Fungal Grotto) Shades are really nice to have as you can not keep Deep slash up because you're never in melee range.

Also, can your deep slash teleport you from AoE? :P Shades are a pretty cool tool, I think It's fine not to use it, but I disagree that they are not useful at all

Tonturri

Also, can your deep slash teleport you from AoE? :P Shades are a pretty cool tool, I think It's fine not to use it, but I disagree that they are not useful at all

I've seen a bow NB spawn a Shade that had a bow, which started plinking away at an enemy at range. Would that work for resto staff as well - the ranged bit?

Stannum

Tonturri wrote: »

Also, can your deep slash teleport you from AoE? :P Shades are a pretty cool tool, I think It's fine not to use it, but I disagree that they are not useful at all

I've seen a bow NB spawn a Shade that had a bow, which started plinking away at an enemy at range. Would that work for resto staff as well - the ranged bit?

archer shade is a shadow image morph it doesn't depend on the weapon caster uses.