Destro buff, really?

Stannum

patch 1.4.4. and magika/stamina regain with heavy attacks.
Do they really think that heavy melee attack with stamina regain equals heavy ranged attack with magika regain?
Destro now is definitely OP.
It can CC with fire clunch, has AoE DoT, has great AoE attack, has great spam attack, regain magika on kill, has buff on heavy attack speed.
Don't you think it's too much?

sarttsarttsarttub17_ESO

Coming from someone who uses a bow on a vr12 NB? L O L

We all know bows can't immobile spam am i rite? Have no dots oh and i'm sure those 2k lethal arrows and cloak spam heavy shots are fine too. I bet you are a cheese build playe, i can already see your DK's hold down block forever spamming lava whip.

Khivas_Carrick

It definitely has the potential to be broken, just as bows can be as well. Essentially, as @sarttsarttsarttub17_ESO‌ pointed out, bows are pretty much the stamina version of Destro Staffs now, and for some reason I'm actually not that worried about bows simply because those super crits come from stealth and are often earned (despite what others may think, sniping properly is not an easy thing to do) whereas the Staff actually has to be in the open.

But it also hits harder.

And in some cases fights better.

And has better synergy with it's related armor type.

Basically, it's moves worry me because it's like handing a nuke to a caveman. Maybe not quite so severe of an example but I hope my meaning gets across. The moves themselves aren't so bad in how they act, they just need their numbers grossly toned down, especially Fire Clench (since it's instant) and Impulse (for obvious scary reasons).

But alas, these are just the two cents of a man who prefers medium/light/heavy armor and a 2H sword with a Templar. I will never touch a destro staff again XD

Unless we can Gandalf them ***. If we can Gandalf up in here, I'll Destro Staff it all day err'day.

Kego

How does someone really think this will buff Desruction anyhow? If you Heavy Attack you can't Impulse, if you Heavy Attack your DPS goes down, cause Light Attack/Crushing Shock weaving does better DPS than Heavy Attack + Crushing Shock.

Stannum

The problem is that wearing staff in positionall mass PvP when you've run out magika you can get it from the distance easilly. When you run out of stamina you can get it only with bow, cause nobody will let you to use heavy attacks in melee PvP. So regain resorces with heavy attack buffs destro/bow in PvP and gives nothing to melee weapons.

Zsymon

Exactly, I would have expected two handed heavy attacks to gain massive stamina back, but it's no different than from the bow. I don't see the reasoning behind that, since like you said, in pvp it's almost impossible to get off two handed heavy attacks, while with bows it is very easy.

timidobserver

Most magicka users are going to using other methods to replenish their magicka anyway.

grim1234

The whole regain stamina/magicka with heavy attack is stupid, stupid, stupid. There should be an efficient way for stamina users to regain stamina. Or there should be a revamp of light armor skill line. Four skills are just DPS buffs and one is an overpowered in my opinion Spell Resist. Imo they should get nerfed or one of them should be changed completely. Magicka regen? I'd say that one should go. Magicka spells are just too unique with many different situational purposes to be spammable to no end. Yes, let spells deal massive damage, but with some limit. Replace it with, I don't know, a flat bonus to magicka pool? Free cast every 60/30 seconds? Something completely different?

Cody

heavy attacks from 2H weapons should break thru blocks, and melee heavies need to restore a lot more stamina than they currently do.

Stannum

Cody wrote: »

heavy attacks from 2H weapons should break thru blocks, and melee heavies need to restore a lot more stamina than they currently do.

Even if it were so it were still senceless as in PvP you can do melee heavy attack on enemy only if he is away from computer.

Davadin

What's with the negativity with melee?

I'm FAR from being a great player, but I melee a lot of times and I strike Heavy alot of time. The trick is to have the ball to jump into the fray and following your enemies. And if you can do animation cancelling, it's pretty great.


*NOW* that being said, I would LOVE a heavy 2H breaks through block, (or even give out a 0.5 stun!) and I agree Destroy (and bow, yes BOW!) are leaps and bound much safer and produce higher DPS compared to it. And to buff them further is mindblowing to me too (even though i have a destro myself for those keep sieging)(yes, melee for keep defending).

BUT it's not impossible to have heavy strikes in PvP, even in the middle of a zerg fest. You might not live to tell the tale, but without heavies, I wouldn't be able to score most of my kills in Cyro...

Davadin

Cody wrote: »

heavy attacks from 2H weapons should break thru blocks, and melee heavies need to restore a lot more stamina than they currently do.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler‌ make it happen, bro. Come on. I don't care if this is PvP bonus only or you need to reel in the combat team, but COME ON... the stam/magick returns between a melee and ranged can't be the same.

That's just... well.... not very smart.

Khivas_Carrick

As I agree with the above poster here, I will take the time to tell you why it isn't very smart in a short list. Feel free to rebuke me at any time.

1) Ranged DPS often has it easier in your game for the simple fact that you can move and shoot at the same time. Granted you can't move as fast, but you can still move.

2) This is compounded by the fact that melee skills simply do not do as much damage as ranged skills. I say this with an air of reason because it's literally as plain as day, all one has to do to see this is open their skill bars, unequip their weapon, and look at their skills. In this case, as a Stamina Build, Lethal Arrow at Rank 2 deals 505 Poison Damage, while Uppercut deals 465. The cast time between the two of them is so little that it fails beyond reason to make up for the damage difference, which with my 2h equipped, Rank 4 Wrecking Blow deals 720 on the tooltip, whereas Lethal Arrow, still Rank 2 mind you, deals 833. What the hell man, what the hell?

3) Also as I've mentioned before, being melee in this game is hard. A ranged character can easily have a dumb amount of defense from various shields, barriers, or simply being far the hell away that damage is a foreign concept to them, whereas all melee, even the ones in light armor using melee magicka builds (yes they exist) and/or medium armor with a set of swords or a giant ax are basically tanks, because they have to be able to soak up a stupid amount of damage. Now that comes from a PvE standpoint, from PvP Melee is garbage regardless of whatever you do mainly because Staffs and Spells are just so damn powerful. Also because they come with an instant cast knock back, but we're not keeping score here, why would we do that anyway, that's something only professionals do, right?

Seriously though, think about it. As the game sits now, melee is an extremely hard to do thing because every boss has so many "Eff Off!" options available that being close to them is not possible 90% of the time, not even for the tank thanks to the way you built Heavy Armor (good job shitting on that too by the way) not being as viable for tanking as Light Armor with skills can be at times, but that's another issue for another time. Point is, Melee = crapload of risk with little to no reward where Ranged = very little risk with crapload of reward.

4) Not to be that guy, but Ima be that guy; Look at other games, look at how they are. Even freaking SWTOR knows that Melee needs higher dmg for their numbers simply because their time to fight a boss is much shorter and can often wipe the raid. In this game melee is an even larger hindrance and damn is it hard to pull off. Take a hint from your competitors, on this point they got it right where you guys need a lot of work.

Still_Mind

Khivas_Carrick wrote: »

As I agree with the above poster here, I will take the time to tell you why it isn't very smart in a short list. Feel free to rebuke me at any time.


4) Not to be that guy, but Ima be that guy; Look at other games, look at how they are. Even freaking SWTOR knows that Melee needs higher dmg for their numbers simply because their time to fight a boss is much shorter and can often wipe the raid. In this game melee is an even larger hindrance and damn is it hard to pull off. Take a hint from your competitors, on this point they got it right where you guys need a lot of work.

Well, while I was playing SWToR, melee actually were dominant. Jedi Knights and Sith Warriors had accessible of gap-closing and controlling mechanics, as well as heavy burst damage for when they get up close and personal, while melee bounty hunters and shock troopers didn't need quite as much face to face time with the target, just to burst it down, usually.

Point is - it's a very delicate balance. Overbuff melee damage, while there's so many gap-closers, and ranged becomes helpless, go the other way around, and melee feels useless because it gets outmached by ranged for all intents and purposes.

Zsymon

You're forgetting though that Wrecking Blow also knocks back and stuns for a significant value.

But that aside, I do agree that Wrecking Blow should have a higher damage value, not only is it almost impossible to pull off in pvp without being blocked, it has the obvious disadvantage of not having any range. Ranged attacks are far harder to see coming, especially a tiny arrow flying through the air.