Discussion: Templar - Part 1 - Aedric Spear

Khivas_Carrick

As has been done before and many times over with both Armor Types and Weapons, and of course, classes, I am going to be doing my own take on the Templar Class and possible ways to improve it or even nerf it. Yes, I said nerf. First up in this little series will be the ever lovely and enduring Aedric Spear Line!

First Proposed Change: Rename this. Spears aren't a weapon in the game, don't get our hopes up damn it. Just name it Aedric Warrior instead. Technically it fits the theme better.

Now then, with that mini rant out the way, let's get down to skills! Oh, before I continue, obvious implications apply here as do anywhere else: No flaming, No hyperbole, constructive criticism only please. Either help or get the *** out, no time for sad sacks and ***.

Puncturing Strikes - This move on it's own is nice and impressive, works well. Weird how your weapon suddenly disappears and it replaced by a giant glowing spear of light that your character somehow knows how to fight with despite never handling a spear before, but that's cool I guess. Might I suggest an animation change to this? One that's a little...cleaner to link with other skills and of course, make sense for the weapon you're holding?

Puncturing Sweeps - Ok, you added a self heal to this move. Now it went from being the top pick for Melee DPS for both single and AoE to also now healing you, which if you haven't guessed can be for quite a lot if it's 40% of a full group of AoE. Maaaay wanna tone this down a bit, say make it single target and not a channeled ability, but a singular melee strike. And then name is to Piercing Sweep, or something.

Biting Jabs - This is actually pretty good for people who love themselves some crit, but to be honest, 70% is STUPID high and this really only see's use in PvE as most things don't last very long once they get to low health in PvP. I'd uh, really rework this one slightly as well to have increased damage and then the crit, or something like that. I'm honestly at a bit of a loss as to how to tweak this one proper, just, 70% crit....wth man.

---

Piercing Javelin - Ok, cute, like the idea, had it going in an ok direction, then plomped it. It's a great idea, don't get me wrong, this is definitely a PvP only move here no matter which way you go with it, and it's handy as hell to have a knock back that can be thrown at an enemy. But may I suggest different animations to say something akin to a Force Push? Or perhaps, dare I say, change it's morphs....

Binding Javelin - To things like this. Make the morphs a choice, as choice is important and the harder the choice the better the toolset is, thus the better the game is. In this case, this is the PvP option. It would work exactly as Binding Javelin does now, only that it would become an AoE on where the target hits, thus the single target is knocked back and targets within 10 meters of the target suffer damage as well. Don't increase the damage, because then it'd be broken as hell, but throwing exploding spears at people would help cull the zerg trains a hell of a lot I'd like to think.

Aurora Javelin - And thus here lies the PvE option. Remember Binding Javelin up above there? How it explodes on contact but knocks a single enemy back and lights his buddies on fire for a split second? Imagine that, but in this case this happens: A single target, ranged or melee attack where you throw a spear that explodes on an enemy and ignites them for a DoT effect that lasts a very brief amount of time. Also increase the damage from Piercing Javelin significantly since it also won't knock back anymore. Literally you trade the CC/AoE for a strong, single target attack that burns things, of which that burn can proc Burning Light. This would help a looooot for upping Templar DPS in a multitude of ways.

---

Focused Charge - Interesting idea, I rather like it actually, but it's animation ruins it. Same for the morphs too. They'd be perfect if either the stuns/effects were made to last longer or the animations were made to be shorter as to use other moves and skills afterward much faster. That said, Focused Charge is fine aside from those issues. Bit odd how you want a Magic User in Melee Range, but I'll address that later on, or perhaps I inadvertently already did by noting that most Aedric Spear spells/skills can be used in melee and are even built for such purposes.

Toppling Charge - The move is amazing actually, like it honestly is not bad at all. It stuns whatever you charge to interrupting it, and then set's it off balance as to beat it severely about the head and face. Works well for PvE, PvP is kinda meh but that's where it's morph comes into play. If anything, I'd increase the damage this move and it's variant cousin and progenitor do.

Explosive Charge - As the name implies you charge to your enemy and explode the area around it, hurting it and it's nearby buddies. It's an AoE that closes gaps. Oh and it stuns casting targets for a few seconds. Not too terrible but I'd really like to see a 2 or 3 second increase on the stunning of the casting targets to make this compete with Toppling Charge better, and maybe do an AoE knockback to those targets adjacent to where you landed. Open to suggestions on this one. These might not even need tweaking to be honest.

---

Spear Shards - My what an interesting move. It's an AoE that's rather small BUT has a Melee/Tank Friendly Synergy that restores some of their Stamina. That's not bad, not bad at all. Frankly, I'd love to see the damage on this increased slightly, as would the stun time by literally just a second or two. Anything higher would make it just a wee bit OP for PvP. Also wouldn't mind seeing a Synergy that also increases ally's weapon damage by a small amount while their Stamina is being restored. That'd be interesting, and a great support ability.

Blazing Shards - Perfect, especially with the aforementioned weapon damage for allies' synergy. It's an AoE attack that leaves an AoE DoT, of which the DoT can proc Burning Spear. Say what? Say amazing son. Only gripe is that when someone picks up the spear the Dot/skill disappears, forcing you to recast it. This should've been addressed above, but I'll do so here instead: God damn it, if someone picks up the spear, let the DoT continue >_<

Luminous Shards - Same thing as Spear Shards but restores Magicka over time as well. Actually not that bad and again pretty supportive to DPS in need, or healers, or tanks, etc. Frankly, I'd have it do what I mentioned above for Stamina Restore = Damage increase, but in this case increase Spell Damage.

---

Sun Shield and It's morphs - This is the one skill that acts and works perfectly as intended. Do not touch it, if anything, fix the stacking exploit or whatever it is people *** and moan about on these here forums these days.

Actually one thing could change for the better: Radiant Shield, it's nice that you increase it's strength based on enemy hit, but it seems a little weak still, but only a tad. Perhaps increase the duration of said shield and activation damage by 1 Second per enemy hit?

---

Now it's time for the passive skills!

Piercing Spear - Crit Chance increase for using Aedric Spear abilities = Good. Increase Damage VS. Blocking Targets = Meeehhhhh. Instead of that for the second half of the skill, I'd make it so if anyone is blocking an Aedric Spear move, the block is 10% less effective. No this is not the same as 10% increase in damage, because if the enemy blocks your entire attack and brings you down to 100 points, 10% of that is just 110. But if you ignore 10% of their defenses, that 100 can evolve into a much grander but still earthly number. If that makes sense, good. If not, I apologize I'm a wee bit bad at explaining math at 3:30am.

Spear Wall - Good, great for tanks. Actually not much else to add to this, it's a tank thing anyway, and it works well as such, let it lie.

Burning Light - Ohh boy, this skill can either be horribly OP or terribly UP. As it stands now it isn't terrible, what with 25% chance to deal a rather sizable amount of Magic Damage to an enemy. That isn't bad, but it can be improved still. To that end, I suggest the following:

Burning Light - All Aedric Spear abilities have a 25% Chance to Deal X Magic Damage. All Melee Attacks have a 100% chance to Deal X Magic Damage.

Now, before you freak out, that second portion would scale with your magicka and spell damage, BUT would be a really miniscule amount, like 100 tops. This makes Melee users more capable of dealing higher DPS since their Light and Heavy attacks will mean more, as well as their skills. This also brings back the Crusader/Paladin style players in a glorious fashion. All hail the Glorious Paladin Race. No seriously though this would help both Melee DPS and Tanks quite a bit, DPS for the obvious DPS implications and Tanks for Threat Generation. For a supposedly gimp class I pull aggro a hell of a lot.

Balanced Warrior - All, the final point in the skill line, this one must be massive right, like it has to be huge and worth all the time and effort you put into this skill line! I mean-

4% Weapon Damage and 200 Spell Resistance.

......I'm sorry, did I just read that right? For leveling this damn thing to max, that's all I get? Really? Seems kinda weak for an end of tree skill, no? Not that it isn't terrible, it's just......Lacking. To that end, I propose this:

Balanced Warrior - Increase Weapon and Spell Damage by 5/10%, Increase Armor and Spell Resistance by 100/200.

Why the sudden boon? Well it says Balanced Warrior, not exactly getting a magic warrior vibe if it increases my weapon damage by an abysmal amount and then a small bit of Spell Resist that most people in Light Armor bypass anyway. In PvP, the only thing useful would be the damage bonus, and in PvE, well, mobs hit more than hard enough to negate the spell resist, so there's that. This is another thing that would go a long way to making Templar's viable DPS and Tanks for Trials. By the way note that this says Spell Damage, not Spell Power. Healing Spells would not be affected by this skill.

Well that's it for Part 1, Part 2 Comes later in the week!

EDIT* It totally occurred to me I forgot to mention the Ultimates for this Skill Line!

Radial Sweep - It's an AoE for tanks. It's useful for DPS as well, sure, but to be honest this is a little lack luster in it's beginning stages, but then again it's also very easy to level and use this skill as it's dirt freaking cheap.

Crescent Sweep - Well....It's still sort of ok? I mean it's increased damage to things in front of you but if you REALLY wanted to make this thing amazing, I'd do a full on 100% increase to enemies in front of you and make the skill passively increase it's damage and range. That'd really make it attractive for DPS in all walks of life. That, or make it so that after it hits all enemies' take increased damage from all sources by X amount for Y time. That'll make taking a Templar along for the ride in Trials a more appealing thing to do since you'll be able to do higher DPS but also improve the raid's DPS.

Empowering Sweep - You'll notice the above is mentioned for DPS only. That's because this one can knock your socks off for Tanking AoE groups or PvPing in that it increases your Damage Resistance to literally everything by making it so you take reduced damage per enemy hit. Sadly this is an AoE still and AoE's have caps, thus it is reigned in by that. However if you wanted this to be the Bee's Knees, make it so that it appeals to Tanks tanking a single boss or fighting a single player. Turn this move into an "Oh *** Button" so to speak from olden days of Tank Lingo. Keep the Reduced Damage Bit, bit also make it heals you for the damage you did using this skill, 50% upfront, 50% as a HoT to yourself or better yet, your nearby allies.

Khivas_Carrick

Not so shameless bump with a link to another discussion. Come at me bro!

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136047/discussion-templars-dawns-wrath-skill-line?new=1

Dagoth_Rac

The Skill Line is "Aedric Spear". Aedra means "Our Ancestors". Daedra means "Not Our Ancestors". So they are roughly opposites. So I think all Aedric Spear skills should do bonus damage to Daedra. And no lousy 2%. Make it a significant boost so that a group will be happy to have a Templar DPS come along in a Daedra-infested dungeon. This would not be an across the board DPS help, but it would be nice. And it is lore-friendly. And it would be specifically helpful in PvE where Templars really need DPS help. I don't PvP but hear that Templars are in better shape there than in PvE. There are no player Daedra in PvP so it would not affect balance in PvP. It would also not affect healing, an area where Templars could become OP if buffed.

timidobserver

Nice, he wants burning light to proc 100% of the time on melee attacks......

KenjiJU

I'd really like one of the passives to give us back magicka on melee hit. Light and heavy. Templars are a kind of in-between. If I want to use Puncturing Jabs, Sun Shield, and say Solar Barrage, I'd likely be using a melee weapon. But if I want to return Magicka, I have to use a ranged staff? It doesn't have to be a lot, but something to acknowledge this playstyle would be very exciting.

DKs have at least a passive and a skill morph that fills their 'in-the-fray' magicka role.

Khivas_Carrick

timidobserver wrote: »

Nice, he wants burning light to proc 100% of the time on melee attacks......

Yea, why not? A small, minuscule amount won't break the game or the class. Other games have done it, and with the damage added in ranging from 50-100 depending on level and spell damage, it'd be no more damaging than a DoT, probably less so in some instances.

If anything I feel you didn't catch my meaning, so I'll clarify it: By melee attacks I mean Light and Heavy only. If it was melee skills it'd be like having a really powerful DoT or status effect proc constantly, which is actually bad and even broken when you consider how powerful DW abilities are. But since every self respecting melee light attack weaves, a small addition to the light attack damage in the form of a 50 magic damage isn't much for PvP but will be a very welcome addition for PvE.


Think Ret Pallies in WoW.

Khivas_Carrick

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

The Skill Line is "Aedric Spear". Aedra means "Our Ancestors". Daedra means "Not Our Ancestors". So they are roughly opposites. So I think all Aedric Spear skills should do bonus damage to Daedra. And no lousy 2%. Make it a significant boost so that a group will be happy to have a Templar DPS come along in a Daedra-infested dungeon. This would not be an across the board DPS help, but it would be nice. And it is lore-friendly. And it would be specifically helpful in PvE where Templars really need DPS help. I don't PvP but hear that Templars are in better shape there than in PvE. There are no player Daedra in PvP so it would not affect balance in PvP. It would also not affect healing, an area where Templars could become OP if buffed.

Yea let's not touch Templar Healing. I'm a half-assed healer and I do better than some real healers out there simply because I'm a Templar, so let's not ruin a good thing by making it too good (although Healing Ritual could be faster imho).

As for the Lore Friendly bonus to fighting Daedra, I could see that happen tbh, but I wouldn't peg it as a necessity that the Combat Team would leap on right away. Also Templars in PvP are amazingly good, second only to a DK for obvious balance reasons.

KenjiJU wrote: »

I'd really like one of the passives to give us back magicka on melee hit. Light and heavy. Templars are a kind of in-between. If I want to use Puncturing Jabs, Sun Shield, and say Solar Barrage, I'd likely be using a melee weapon. But if I want to return Magicka, I have to use a ranged staff? It doesn't have to be a lot, but something to acknowledge this playstyle would be very exciting.

DKs have at least a passive and a skill morph that fills their 'in-the-fray' magicka role.

That would be interesting, but also possibly game breaking. That one is a tricky road you may not want to ever walk down if you can help it.

To that end though, with a bit of quick thought pumped into it, I could see Balanced Warrior making it so that it returns X% magicka if using a stamina weapon (melee/Bow) Heavy Attack, or X% stamina if using a magicka weapon (staffs) Heavy Attack, with the X = How many Aedric Spear abilities you have slotted.

booksmcread

All I really want from Aedric Spear is for the GCD removed from Focused Charge, the range extended slightly on Javelin to be on par with other ranged skills, and the radius of Radial Sweep to be 8m.

JLB

booksmcread wrote: »

All I really want from Aedric Spear is for the GCD removed from Focused Charge, the range extended slightly on Javelin to be on par with other ranged skills, and the radius of Radial Sweep to be 8m.

Would love those changes.

Pmarsico9

Here's my list:

Piercing Javelin is the only ability that is completely terrible in the entire tree. It serves no purpose and I feel bad for people that talent it. It hits like a wet noodle. Binding Javelin is bugged and Aurora Javelin still sucks bad.

Focused charge is bugged. It needs fixed. There's an ICD on this. This game isn't supposed to have them.

I think you are underplaying the value of Piercing Spear. The additional damage against blocking targets is actually pretty strong, all things considered.

Spear Wall doesn't just apply to tanks. It's highly valuable in PVP to every templar.

Burning Light needs to be useful for all weapon users. This is written from the perspective that Templar's should just be WoW ret pallies. Due to it's "Seal of Casino" nature (to equate it to that nightmare in WoW) as it stands now, it can cause massive fluctuations in damage. So rather than say it should be 100% on melee swings, it should simply apply to everything. I also think it should scale.

Burning Light: Provides a 25/50% chance to inflict 75% additional physical damage on all attacks on all Templar abilities and weapon attacks. Not just Aedric Spear. All of them. Radial Sweep, however, should guarantee a 100% proc chance. Same for its morphs. This also guarantees stronger scaling that isn't based solely off your level or whatever the current formula is. It should be 75% of the previous attack. Since it's physical, it's negated by armor. Which helps in PVP against clothy zerg trains.

Stick Diminishing chance per proc on abilities like Impulse and Solar Barrage. Certain things, such as Bat Swarm, shouldn't proc it at all. Just use some logic here. It's blatantly obvious what doesn't need help.

The other option would be to make it a DoT instead of a flat damage proc. Then allow it to stack with itself and have it linger for a solid 3-4 seconds if you didn't want to have to deal with going through what abilities should proc it.

You have an issue again with Balanced Warrior.

Abilities need to scale. Fixed values suck. Armor and Spell resistance need to scale if that's the route here. But this is a great place to address a bigger issue.

Templars are the only class with an entire tree dedicated to a single role. Restoring Light ONLY heals. You can say that Draconic Power is similar for DK's and tanking, but ultimately, a lot of those abilities are used by all DK's for self-sustenance while playing and Inhale is a valuable DPS ability.

As such, Balanced Warrior is where you address the sustainability of Templar DPS builds. I think the game is at the point where it's OK to require things, and I don't know a Templar that would view not talenting this as a viable choice as it stands now.

Balanced Warrior:

Increases Spell and Weapon Damage by 5/10%. Also increases magicka regeneration by 2.5/5% for each non-restoring light ability that is slotted.

Why not Stamina, too? Simple: Because Restoring Aura and its morphs need a buff on the passive side and that's an underrated ability for Stamina builds to begin with. You would rather have a single ability slotted than 5 to bolster your stamina-based attacks, no?

You could even argue that this change to Balanced Warrior is what should be done to make Templars the support they were allegedly designed to be in the first place. A little magicka regen would support a DPS-geared Templar not reliant on the Warlock set to be able to support the healer as needed.

Khivas_Carrick

I'm glad these are finally taking off and people are talking on these threads.

@Pmarsico9, when I wrote this I was a little......off on a few things, but most of them still stand. You're right about Piercing Spear, I'm all for that staying as is.

The Javelins we both seem to agree on needing a rework because lolthey'rebad. The charges also need fixing via bugs and glitches, something I was not entirely aware of at the time of writing this since I had used both only a few times before deciding that I liked Stampede and Critical Rush more.

As for the Javelins though, I would really appreciate them acting as both a ranged or melee casting alternative, or preferably, melee to short range attacks. Leave the ranged caster portion to Dawn's Wrath and let Aedric Spear be the melee builds and tanks modis-operandi.

That said I stick by my ideas behind my suggestions, although I've considered them greatly since making them. Ideas in a rough sketch looks something like this:

Piercing Javelin - Throw a spear that strikes an enemy and wounds them, dealing X Magic Damage and Y magic Damage over time and knocking them back 4 meters. 28 Meter Range.

Aurora Strike - Attack at close range, knocking the enemy down for 4 seconds and dealing X Magic Damage and Y Magic Damage over time. 8 Meter Range, Instant Cast. Difference in this morph is the change to melee range but with a grossly increased damage amount on both ends of the attack.

Binding Javelin - Retain the entire base skill's effect, but now make this ability for an enemy to be pinned down for 3 seconds before being taunted by the player for 15 seconds.

Kinda what I have in my head, something that helps two player types a bit.

As for Burning Light, Seal Of Casino made me laugh way more than it should have. That said, I'm not sure if I like the chance for it to proc off of everything a Templar can do with a few caveats. That seems semi-messy and a hell of a lot of work to go through, not to mention if luck serves you well, and it should if it's a 50/50 chance that every little thing procs it, I would rather see the 50% on all skills and 100% on all L/H melee attacks but at a much lesser amount of damage, or keep it the same amount of damage with only 25% chance.

I said it that way because Templars were meant to fill the role of a Knight Of The Divines, a holy warrior of some sort, be them a cleric or a paladin or a priestly healer. Best way to fill that in my mind is to let them use melee weapons to the best of their ability and let the DoTs and ranged stuff fulfill the dmg for casters and bow users and the healing is rather self explanatory.

And as for Balanced Warrior, frankly it isn't terrible as is, but holy hell guys you can do better, and frankly my two suggestions, Pmarsico9's, whichever would work wonders for everybody.

Pmarsico9

I can get on board with Javelin. But wouldn't it better serve to work as a ranged ability to utilize when a melee character is out of range? Not to be use rotationally, but to help support MDPS that is essentially despised by this game and has no damage advantage over ranged?

Also, in regards to burning light, 25/50% off everything raises the proc rate a lot. It makes sense to not have the flat scaling that the other three classes have in their passives. It creates variety to have a class where most of the scaling is off a proc.

Also, DoTs work well with the Templar idea because it's such a defensive-oriented type of outlast class.

Maybe Burning Light should be a DoT that you want to keep rolling. A ranged alternative for Piercing Javelin would support that for Melee builds..........but frankly, I think no matter what, Templars, even melee Templars, are going to be trying to keep Vamp's Bane up as much as possible.

As such, make it so focus/uptime = Burning Light proc rate per target. A target loaded up with Spear Shards, Vamp's Bane, weapon attacks, and (God Willing) a replacement for Backlash should have Burning Light ticking away essentially continuously for a Percentage of the attack that procced its Damage.

However, if you are multi-targetting or AoEing, Burning light should be comprised of a lesser proc rate.

Khivas_Carrick

Burning Light should not be a DoT imho, that kind of nerfs it in my mind. And you got a point with DoTs matching Templars, but it's more than that to me, and to many others.

I like the idea of trying to give melee Templar's a ranged option, but we have back up weapon kits and another skill like for that, which is why I really think they could do with more melee options outside of Puncturing Sweeps.

But back to Burning Light. This seems to be the biggest point of contention regarding Templar DPS. It's amazing as is truth be told, since any Aedric Spear based ability can proc it, including Blazing Spear's DoT, but I'd still rather see it become more regular and steady than let anything proc it, especially since letting anything proc it makes it the strongest class based passive around to the best of my knowledge, since as far as I know no other skill passive minus the final skill of a tree allows for it to affect skills outside their respective skill line.

Many affect weapons or armors or manuevers, but none directly to skills, and that would seem like going too far to me, which is why I want to keep it to 50% full damage for AS skills, and 100% for basic melee attacks.

Khivas_Carrick

Don't let this die btw guys =P Keep the convo going.

Khivas_Carrick

I feel I should bump this as to:

1) Not let the convo die out in light of so many recent threads coming back up to showcase how unhappy people are with Templars, and now also Sorcerers.

and

2) Tag the wonderful and amazing @ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ so she can forward this to the design team!

ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Thanks for all the very detailed feedback and suggestions everyone provided in this thread and the Dawn's Wrath one linked at the beginning of the discussion. We have forwarded links to both along to the combat and gameplay team.

ThatHappyCat

Only weak skill here is Piercing Javelin. Binding Javelin is nice in theory but with CC breaking the magicka cost you pay for its 3.5s stun (often broken immediately) isn't worth it, Spear Shards is cheaper and does more. Aurora Javelin is too weak, it should have a range increase (to 28m) and a higher maximum damage (say 60%). The base skill could probably use a slight cost decrease as well.

Puncturing Sweep's self-healing is too strong, especially against more than one opponent. "Sweep" also doesn't make much sense now that it doesn't increase AoE. Needs to be toned down and get a name change.

I feel Luminous Shards is lacking compared to Blazing Spear but many Templar Healers use Luminous. Really though, the main recipient of your Spear will be the tank, who's going to want stamina most of all; and Luminous doesn't give that much more stamina than Blazing... while Blazing is a far stronger AoE ability (and CC).

Radiant Ward needs something to make it worth picking compared to Blazing Shield. Say if the Ward grants stamina every time it takes damage.

Focused Charge's GCD is getting fixed so yay.

Khivas_Carrick

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Thanks for all the very detailed feedback and suggestions everyone provided in this thread and the Dawn's Wrath one linked at the beginning of the discussion. We have forwarded links to both along to the combat and gameplay team.

Thank you kindly Ms. Folsom.

manny254

There are only two changes I would make.

When blazing spear's synergy is activated the spear should remain, but the synergy can't be activated again.

Binding javelin does it job well, but I would recreated the aurora javelin morph. It cost to much to be useful as a dps skill. Remove the cc, but greatly reduce the cost. Then add something that increases the damage. In a perfect world I would want it to become a proper execute, but I doubt that would happen. I would settle for reduced cost, and increased damage with the removal of the cc.

Soris

manny254 wrote: »

When blazing spear's synergy is activated the spear should remain, but the synergy can't be activated again.

This, and also it would benefit both parties, the caster and the guy who picks it up or the whole group.

I also want to thank Khivas and everyone in here and the other topic for their smart suggestions. %100 agree with every suggestion. Hope they will be considered by the developers in future patches.

Khivas_Carrick

faernaa wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

When blazing spear's synergy is activated the spear should remain, but the synergy can't be activated again.

This, and also it would benefit both parties, the caster and the guy who picks it up or the whole group.

I also want to thank Khivas and everyone in here and the other topic for their smart suggestions. %100 agree with every suggestion. Hope they will be considered by the developers in future patches.

SENPAI NOTICED ME

BRogueNZ

manny254 wrote: »

There are only two changes I would make.

When blazing spear's synergy is activated the spear should remain, but the synergy can't be activated again.

Are you suggesting only one person could use it?

Khivas_Carrick

Until another/the same templar throws another spear, yes, since that's how it works now. That suggestion is saying throw the spear, somebody uses it, but the spear remains to continue dealing damage until it expires, in which another spear is thrown and another person can reuse it.

BRogueNZ

Funny. I've always assumed in was available to everyone within in the area like most synergies. Can't say I've ever seen the spear itself or DoT prematurely disappear.

Khivas_Carrick

.....The spear has a timer dude, only stays around for six seconds before disappearing. That's how it works, throw a spear out, if it's blazing it'll dot the area for six seconds OR until somebody picks up the spear, ending the attack early but restoring their attribute.

The way I proposed is that the spear and it's effect doesn't end until the timer ends or is refreshed, even if someone picks it up.

BRogueNZ

Realise it's on a timer.

Wasn't aware that's how it worked to be honest, can't say I've even read the tool tip properly until yesterday. Your proposal is what I have been assuming all along. It works which is all I cared about really.

Id would like a morph that stunned multiple targets, even if it didn't dot or offer a resource refund.

ThatHappyCat

A ranged AoE CC is a bit too much IMO. Really, I'm fine with how Spear Shards work ATM, down to it disappearing when synergised. Just cast another one, you can't use the same synergy more than once every 15 seconds so no one's going to consume all your Shards immediately.

Khivas_Carrick

HappyCat got it right, ranged AoE stuns is entirely too broken. And what's this about 15 second cooldown on Synergies? Are you sure that's a thing because I have yet to see it work properly, for every time I throw down a shard, it disappears mighty fast.

I'm serious btw, if that's how it's supposed to be, I might have to fill out a bug report here.

Also, neither of you play DPS do you?

Baphomet

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

People have been spitting out these threads for many months now, and there even was/is an official thread where people were asked to type their opinions, suggestions and concerns about the templar class so that the devs could make the appropriate changes.

Still, some 6 months after launch, none of the suggestions (even the ones with wide player concensus) have made it in game yet - what's up with that?

dodgehopper_ESO

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

The Skill Line is "Aedric Spear". Aedra means "Our Ancestors". Daedra means "Not Our Ancestors". So they are roughly opposites. So I think all Aedric Spear skills should do bonus damage to Daedra. And no lousy 2%. Make it a significant boost so that a group will be happy to have a Templar DPS come along in a Daedra-infested dungeon. This would not be an across the board DPS help, but it would be nice. And it is lore-friendly. And it would be specifically helpful in PvE where Templars really need DPS help. I don't PvP but hear that Templars are in better shape there than in PvE. There are no player Daedra in PvP so it would not affect balance in PvP. It would also not affect healing, an area where Templars could become OP if buffed.

Werewolves and Vampires are daedric in origin, so I would expect a buff to damage vs. Daedra to also mean damage vs. Vampires and Werewolves as well. Where do you think Werewolves and Vampires go when they are dead? I can tell you: Hircines Hunting Grounds and Coldharbor respectively. At least from a thematic point of view I think it makes sense as well, given that the very purpose of the class is intended to hunt down and defend against Daedric influence in Nirn.

dodgehopper_ESO

Honestly, I just hope we can spellcraft our class skills in the future, to make unique spins on abilities we already have. I've for instance heard many people who wish that Blazing Spear were a targeted aoe.