WW Changes I would like to see Implemented

ASpaceTurkey

At the moment WW is very underpowered compared to Vampire, and is seen by many to not be very useful in PvE and/or PvP.
Here is an overview of both WW and Vamp.
This is what I propose is changed, and why.

Vampire:
Relies on High Magicka.
Constant form, no time limit.
Has 1 Ultimate ability, Bat Swarm.
Has 2 Abilities, Drain, and Bat Form.
Has lowered HP Recovery, and Susceptibility to Fire.

WW:
Relies on High Stamina.
Is an Ultimate, no constant form, lasts for 60 seconds?
Has no Ultimate, IS an Ultimate.
Has 2 Abilities, Pounce, and Roar.
Has no HP Recovery, and Susceptibility to Poison.

What I would change:
Make WW a constant form like Vamp, unlimited time in WW Form.
Give WW an Ultimate like Vamp, usable in Human Form, such as;
Feral Claws.
Cost 150 Ultimate, Let it overcharge like Overload.
Drains Ultimate per hit, does extra damage per hit like Overload,
use same effect/look as Searing Strike, turn it Blue, take away flames.

Use same Lowered HP Recovery as Vamp, change susceptibility to poison, to flame, like Faolchu.
Give WW a Self Heal Ability like Vamp, such as Bite or Devour.
Change susceptibility to CC Equal to Vamp.

What I would change the Transformation to:
Make the WW Change an Ability as opposed to an Ultimate.
Change the Transformation time to 2 Seconds in stead of 5.
Since changing into WW Form would take alot out of a person,
drain all or half of their stamina in stead of having it cost Ultimate.
Their Stamina would then have to charge back up, preventing WW Form from being OP, plus adding a small incentive to use it Tactically.

If you want to reply, please do so Constructively, as such:

What I have a problem with:
What I would change:
Why I would change it:
How it Improves on your Proposals:

All Non-constructive Negativity will be ignored.

ASpaceTurkey

My main is a WW now.

Not liking the time length at all, 30 seconds is way too low to be worth grinding for the 680 Ultimate it costs me.

I think a minimum of 5 minutes is needed for Wolf Form if devs want to stick to it being an Ultimate. With Devour adding an extra 30 seconds per use, and a timer pause while devouring.

Fenris_Silverfang

I do agree with this.
Both Vamp and Werewolf tree seem a bit unfinished , however the vampire skills seem a lot more useful than WW is.
It still ends up being more of a burden than anything and we cant even make proper use of it since the time is so very limited.
You cant even use it for rp because you'd run out of time before you can do anything with it, not even gonna mention pvp cause people use silver bolts and poison arrow as stamina dump skills which usually get you down in no time.

-I would love it to be a toggle and as suggested
-Dodging, cc ,and the like should be possible in ww form
-It would do well having a few more active skills, as well as for vamps maybe,
I feel pounce and roar alone just isn't nearly enough to make the combat fun.
-Id like proper running animation like the one on all 4's from skyrim

Cyrdemaceb17_ESO

It's 40 sec WW timer for me but you're right...it's simply too short for such a high cost ultimate.

lathbury

Warn you now a wall of text coming but bear with me.
As it stands vampires have great stealth aoe and are relatively survivable with mist form and bat swarm.
I would like to see werewolf be an absolute single target dps monster esp against those in light armour (hello big claws and being what looks like 18 stone of muscle) they should also be fast as there means of escape/ survivability and have high armour and spell resist. I will outline how I think this can be achieved without making them op.
1) make the form toggle off on except on a certain in game day where due to lunar blah blah randomly hits and with the new justice system is an offence.
2) while in form a max level ww properly specced with passives some thing like hircines hide stage 1 adds 500 armour and spell resist second stage another 500
3) the above maxed ww should hit a minimum of 900 dps with +10% against medium armour foes and + 20% against light armour with a shredding claws passive.
4) no standard sneak or cc break however pounce should cc break and knockdown
5) have roar do the opposite of what it does now have it paralyse targets either conal or 3 with fear ie a root
6) the ultimate should be a pack call that summon a wolf to attack any targets in its radius for a similar amount of damage to vob with the bonus that each death they cause heals the ww or the other morph rabid bites that cause additional disease damage.
7) sprint speed should be average horse speed with a couple of passives to get it to fast horse level
8. still keep poison sensitivity add a penalty ie less damage if you have not fed.
But fighters guild abilities only gain their bonus when in form.

Before everybody says woah that's to op 900 dps at endgame isn't a lot so really only viable on light armour bosses. Balance it further by giving shards a chance to do 2500 irresistible damage when it procs and the other morph a tranquillising effect that reduces our run ie escape. Also one of the fighters guild passives should make them immune to the root effect of roar.
These changes would make ww absolute melee range single target monsters. But with significant drawbacks the need to feed regularly or become weak and when transformed the chance to get 1 or 2 shotted which could happen at just the wrong time if the moons are in the right place.
Just some ideas cause at the moment they are poodles.
Plus imagine being in a bank and half the ppl transforming cause it's that time of the month lol. Then proceeding to get chased of by guard and fighters guild Members.

Enesse

Interesting suggestions. Personally, I'd keep the weakness to poison the same. Faolchu was weak to fire because he was also undead.
I'd say: the transformation would last the same amount of time, but the person transforming could be immune to knockbacks and have increased defense during that time. Or just all the time when in wolf form, except maybe being stunned by a fighter's guild skill.
Spell resist and defense especially should be a big deal for werewolves, after reading the lorebook, "The Werewolf's Hide." It described a werewolf's coat as it's greatest gift, deflecting weapons and keeping it safe from harm so long as they groom it.

Werewolves do differ from vampires in that we have 2 forms, not like vampire lords in Skyrim. Vamps at the moment can use any 5 skills of their own choosing in their 1 form, but werewolves when transformed are limited to 2. It might be more fair to add more skills in the werewolf line.

The time that we have in wolf form is definitely gimped. Some people suggest that it be toggle-able, others a skill, etc. Either way, it needs to be something more. Most other werewolves agree with me that we want to experience running as a pack (in Cyrodiil, mostly). 30-60 seconds, and having a cooldown between corpses you devour isn't gonna cut it.
The whole "feeding" thing is kind of weird to me in this game. It was pretty specific in Skyrim that werewolves couldn't eat undead corpses, but we could eat those of humanoids and animals. I think that same system could work well in ESO, maybe also limiting vampires from being able to feed on werewolves.

Passives and appearances. Few things for this: Some increased speed while in humanoid form, yeah? We are a bit more than human now, after all. (And vamps get speed bonus while sneaking)
Some werewolf form passives, or even possible skills could include a tracking ability-one that lets you either see or track down stealthed enemies.
For the appearances, maybe have yellowish eyes or claw-like fingernails in humanoid form. As for wolf form, I think our fur should match our hair color, or be customizable.
The running animation should really be running on all fours, too.

Hmm..one last thing. The moons. Werewolves are hugely based around moonlight. Vampires get passive buffs during nighttime, why shouldn't we? Or at least a passive buff when the moons are full. I liked one of the above ideas about a random transformation during a certain time of the lunar cycle that could get you in trouble with the justice system, sounds fun.

ASpaceTurkey

Thanks for the replies, people. Much appreciated.

I definitely agree with the appearance issue, Vamps get pale skin and cool-looking eyes. WW get.... nothing. Why not give WW yellow eyes and claws like Enesse suggested. Why not let us colour our fur?

I definitely agree with more abilities, at the moment we have 2, what about our claws? Is it not possible to add some form of claw attack?

The biggest gripe for me is the time limit. I would love to see WW Form become toggle-able, having infinite time would not be OP considering we can't use magicka.

Enesse

I'd like to add to my "Appearance" suggestions. Subtle differences in male/female features. I find it very..weird, when I transform and my feminine body suddenly gains a 6 pack and ripped muscles. I'm a werewolf, not a weregorilla, right? Even real female wolves have slightly more feminine features, like softer facial features and sleeker bodies. Just my two septims.

ASpaceTurkey

That would be possible, Enesse. I can see how that would be cool to add.
On top of that, I'd love for our fur to be colourable.

nightwalkerrobin_ESO

I am liking what I am hearing here. Have it a Toggle, but consequences in the Justice System. Love the idea of a possible forced transform during the full moon. But I also think Vamps should get noticed at stage 3 and 4, 4 making the Vamp KOS by city guards/NPC fighter's guild.

But I would really love to hear that the Devs are reading and taking all the outstanding ideas that have been given to them for consideration. They almost don't need to come up with their own ideas, use what has been suggested. And it would be nice if they would submit to us, the WW community, their plans so we can give some input/feedback before they spend the time/money coding. Lets work as a team on this.

And Devs, please give us some idea of when we will see something. Soon has passed.

mixyesspitlickub17_ESO

Sounds like you just want to be a Sorcerer Vampire, to be honest. Like Vamp, like Vamp, as Vamp, like Vamp, equal to Vamp.

Changes I'd make to Werewolf:

Able to break CC
Transformation, Pounce, and Roar complete faster.
Change the "Get hit for ultimate gain" to "Gain X ultimate every second."

Being an Ultimate is fine due to getting more armor, faster movement, and massive boosts to Stamina/Melee damage.

ASpaceTurkey

@‌Mixy
I was a Sorc Vamp, I changed to WW because I wanted to try something new, and so far, I am liking WW better.

I typed my post as you've emulated "Like Vamp", because it is a viable way of comparing the two. At the current time, Vamp is more powerful than WW in the respects I cited, I would like to see both of them levelled to be as equal as possible; no, they don't have to be exactly equal, but at present, there are more incentives to be a Vamp over WW.

@‌Night
Being able to break CC would be a boon to a transformed WW, I fail to see why it wasn't implemented already; come one, ZoS. You don't think a massive WW can break a stun?

I agree, I would like to see WW changed to a toggle, due to the following reasons:

1. I see Vamp's constant form as being an advantage over WW's timed form.
I see this advantage as being unfair, due to WW's inability to Heal and use Magicka while transformed, compared to Vamps being able to use both.

Toggle-able WW Form may not be Lore-Friendly, but ZoS could implement a forced change at night and Full Moon to counteract that, keeping the Lore-Hounds happy-ish.
Plus, those who wish to keep WW Lore-Friendly could choose not to change at any time; the current consensus with Lore-Hounds and bad-losers being "they shouldn't be allowed to change at any time.", I believe "Play your own way" may apply here.

2. It could create PvE and/or PvP Wolf Packs, people who enjoy playing together, with the added joy of being able to Role Play. Who could disagree with that, considering ESO is an MMO-RPG, emphasis on the RPG.

3. PvP would be unaffected, due to the effectiveness of Poison Abilities and Weapons, Fighters guild abilities, and WW not being able to Heal or use Magicka while Transformed; making all PvP-OP Complaints Moot. (Seriously, people. You would rather complain than find a way to counteract another player's play style? Sounds childish and lazy to me.)


Thank you for your replies, they were well-received.

ZOS_TristanK

Thank you for all of the feedback and suggestions, all! We encourage you to also head over to our official thread about upcoming changes to werewolves here to see what's coming and give your input.

ASpaceTurkey

Thank you very much for that reply, Tristan. I do believe most WW players will be quite happy to hear that they are not being ignored, plus, knowing what is coming up next for WW is going to put a smile on all our furry maws.

ASpaceTurkey

@ZOS_TristanK‌
If you are able to see this message, one problem I can see is that when changing back to Human Form, our Ultimate resets. Being able to keep that gained Ultimate would greatly counteract the time limitation.