Is this a joke?

ArRashid

After all those nerfs to Burning Talons, the spell is now completely, totally useless.

Not only the damage is really nerfed, but it's also bugged beyond measure now.

- damage applies instantly, duration starts ticking (4 sec "root")
- ROOT IS APPLIED over 2.5-3 seconds later (mobs run wild till then.. so archers finally get "rooted" when they walk 10m away from me)
- root is applied for the remaining duration only (aka about 1 sec - talon emerge and almost immediately disappears again)

Is this some form of joke on the remaining DK population? Haven't there been enough nerfs to keep us from playing?

I'd really like to finally get my main to max level since I have free time in summer at last, but I'm really running out of options for a sensible build and will soon be forced to use THE build like everyone else (aka resto staff and class abilities only)

Jarnhand

Well all I can say is that DKs spam it alot, that and Standard, and combined they are very powerful.

ArRashid

You'll cry a river on forums to get it nerfed to the ground? I wouldn't care that much for the pitiful damage it deals (even though volcanic rune now deals more and stuns more reliably), but if it even fails to root NPCs before they scatter over whole area..


You know what? INSTEAD OF NERFING IT EVERY PATCH, THEY SHOULD RATHER FIX IT SO IT BECOMES CC-BREAKABLE LIKE IT'S INTENDED

Can't even be lag, because (that pitiful) damage IS applied when you push the button. It just takes forever till the root is actually applied. Playing most of the day now and it applies root anywhere between 1 and 3 seconds. Mostly if used against single target, it has ALMOST no delay, but if used in the middle of a pack of 3 mobs, they usually manage to scatter, then it BRIEFLY roots them, and then they are free again. Especially annoying with those pesky archers that can literally 1-shot you with Arrow Spray (or just by spamming light attacks for 250 through block and armor cap) from their retreat position.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments

Armitas

There is an NPC archer skill that causes the archer to back up and fire even with the root in place. There is something that is bugged out with that archer skill, I have seen it myself. Backing up is part of that skill animation so that it seems the game doesn't know what to do. Other than that I have not seen it fail to root.

Also I think the Impale group synergy consumes the talon root even though it's duration is not finished.

yelloweyedemon

ArRashid wrote: »

Especially annoying with those pesky archers that can literally 1-shot you with Arrow Spray

LearnToPlay.

Troponin

yelloweyedemon wrote: »

ArRashid wrote: »

Especially annoying with those pesky archers that can literally 1-shot you with Arrow Spray

LearnToPlay.

I think that also applies under "Rude and insulting comments".

How about, you add something constructive to the thread?

Playing with a really buggy class and skills will naturally cause you to mess up. When you expect a CC to go off but it doesn't because its' bugged, that can cause a chain reaction in making other mistakes.

yelloweyedemon

Troponin wrote: »

yelloweyedemon wrote: »

ArRashid wrote: »

Especially annoying with those pesky archers that can literally 1-shot you with Arrow Spray

LearnToPlay.

I think that also applies under "Rude and insulting comments".

How about, you add something constructive to the thread?

Playing with a really buggy class and skills will naturally cause you to mess up. When you expect a CC to go off but it doesn't because its' bugged, that can cause a chain reaction in making other mistakes.

OP is overreacting, and raged like a little kid when someone replied (telling the truth), that Talons is FAR from useless.

Nothing constructive can be added to the thread. Not to mention there are 5000 other threads about the issue.

Talons were overpowered at launch, and after the various "nerfs" (more like fixes), they are still very powerfull. Just because you can't braindead block and spam 1 skill to kill mobs, it doesn't mean that a skill is broken. If you wanna see real bugs and a mess of skills, you should try another class.

Troponin

The only issue I am having is that the distance it will work seems really buggy. One time I use it, it goes off without a hitch, the next it seems to think an enemy is out of range when in reality, it's well within the 6 meter range. It doesn't seem to be lag or latency, but it gets applied to the enemy standing almost directly beside the one it missed.

ArRashid

That was actually the first time a moderator cleaned threat of hateful troll posts (even though about two raging sentences were removed from mine as well).

I KNOW arrow spray can be dodged. But you have to prepare for that by NOT BLOCKING (so you have stamina for roll dodge.. as a caster, possibility to roll dodge is gone after 2-3 blocks), which kills you anyway. Great trade-off.

Talons have been nerfed so many times JUST FOR PVP whiners that it's insane... if they so don't like it's damage, then REMOVE THE SYNERGY, and don't destroy the spell for PvE (aka single person use).

Anyway, that's not the point.
The point is that unlike other roots (Bombard (4s root, 2s snare) and Encase (5.5 sec root), which hit more or less instantly and HOLD for the duration, Talons deal damage first, then THINK HARD for a couple seconds, then decide it's root time but the duration since the damage is almost over, so the root is very brief (often not more than 1.5 sec when used in a pack of 3 mobs)

Jarnhand wrote: »

Well all I can say is that DKs spam it alot, that and Standard, and combined they are very powerful.

So as I though this is the "argument" you guys have to counter this? Ofc it holds you in PvP if the other guy (or an army of them) is spamming it. Just like any other ability. It even functions well enough in 1vs1 environment (because of WAY less calculations it has to make) where it roots almost instantly after the damage is dealt. I'm talking about AoE use in PvE situations, where it proves to be really unreliable, and I'm really considering replacing it once and for all. Since mobs scatter anyway, what's the point of even having a root? I'll rather take reflect or dragon blood instead to survive those scattered mobs better.

@yelloweyedemon I do play other classes too, and I am actively doing something about them too (especially NB.. I don't have templar yet but otherwise I'm playing the 3 remaining classes). DO YOU? Or you're just picking fights on forums?

yelloweyedemon

ArRashid wrote: »

That was actually the first time a moderator cleaned threat of hateful troll posts (even though about two raging sentences were removed from mine as well).

I KNOW arrow spray can be dodged. But you have to prepare for that by NOT BLOCKING (so you have stamina for roll dodge.. as a caster, possibility to roll dodge is gone after 2-3 blocks), which kills you anyway. Great trade-off.

Talons have been nerfed so many times JUST FOR PVP whiners that it's insane... if they so don't like it's damage, then REMOVE THE SYNERGY, and don't destroy the spell for PvE (aka single person use).

Anyway, that's not the point.
The point is that unlike other roots (Bombard (4s root, 2s snare) and Encase (5.5 sec root), which hit more or less instantly and HOLD for the duration, Talons deal damage first, then THINK HARD for a couple seconds, then decide it's root time but the duration since the damage is almost over, so the root is very brief (often not more than 1.5 sec when used in a pack of 3 mobs)

Jarnhand wrote: »

Well all I can say is that DKs spam it alot, that and Standard, and combined they are very powerful.

So as I though this is the "argument" you guys have to counter this? Ofc it holds you in PvP if the other guy (or an army of them) is spamming it. Just like any other ability. It even functions well enough in 1vs1 environment (because of WAY less calculations it has to make) where it roots almost instantly after the damage is dealt. I'm talking about AoE use in PvE situations, where it proves to be really unreliable, and I'm really considering replacing it once and for all. Since mobs scatter anyway, what's the point of even having a root? I'll rather take reflect or dragon blood instead to survive those scattered mobs better.

@yelloweyedemon I do play other classes too, and I am actively doing something about them too (especially NB.. I don't have templar yet but otherwise I'm playing the 3 remaining classes). DO YOU? Or you're just picking fights on forums?

Burning Talons was not nerfed just for PvP, and PvE is not focusing on single player use of skills. Burning Talons was ridiculously OP for a tanking DK (and it's still really powerfull).

About the arrow spray, you can also just walk out of it. Plus, yeah, if you are a caster with 100% magicka and no point/enchantent on stamina you are going to pay the price. It is going to be far worse in the future since they are trying to ballance stamina with magicka builds, so get used to it.

Troponin

yelloweyedemon wrote: »

Burning Talons was not nerfed just for PvP, and PvE is not focusing on single player use of skills. Burning Talons was ridiculously OP for a tanking DK (and it's still really powerfull).

About the arrow spray, you can also just walk out of it. Plus, yeah, if you are a caster with 100% magicka and no point/enchantent on stamina you are going to pay the price. It is going to be far worse in the future since they are trying to ballance stamina with magicka builds, so get used to it.

I am really worried about that too. Stamina based builds need a change, but I am REALLY hoping it doesn't make the pendulum swing in the opposite direction and make the magicka builds suddenly really hard to use.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO

Troponin wrote: »

yelloweyedemon wrote: »

ArRashid wrote: »

Especially annoying with those pesky archers that can literally 1-shot you with Arrow Spray

LearnToPlay.

I think that also applies under "Rude and insulting comments".

How about, you add something constructive to the thread?

Playing with a really buggy class and skills will naturally cause you to mess up. When you expect a CC to go off but it doesn't because its' bugged, that can cause a chain reaction in making other mistakes.

What he meant to say was learn to watch the cue/ listen for him announce he is doing the one shot move and the proceed to use the many tools at your disposal to disrupt the slow wind up attack. Aka activated abilities that interrupt or the interrupt mechanic. I have been frustrated by dying from archers but after " learning to play" I very rarely am one shotted by an NPC, when it happens I feel its my fault there are so many cues and chances to deal with it.

Its irrelevant if they take a step because of animation when rooted because they can still use projectiles anyway.

ArRashid

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO wrote: »

Troponin wrote: »

yelloweyedemon wrote: »

ArRashid wrote: »

Especially annoying with those pesky archers that can literally 1-shot you with Arrow Spray

LearnToPlay.

I think that also applies under "Rude and insulting comments".

How about, you add something constructive to the thread?

Playing with a really buggy class and skills will naturally cause you to mess up. When you expect a CC to go off but it doesn't because its' bugged, that can cause a chain reaction in making other mistakes.

What he meant to say was learn to watch the cue/ listen for him announce he is doing the one shot move and the proceed to use the many tools at your disposal to disrupt the slow wind up attack. Aka activated abilities that interrupt or the interrupt mechanic. I have been frustrated by dying from archers but after " learning to play" I very rarely am one shotted by an NPC, when it happens I feel its my fault there are so many cues and chances to deal with it.

Its irrelevant if they take a step because of animation when rooted because they can still use projectiles anyway.

1) Arrow spray is about 1m wider on both sides than shown on the ground
2) Archer NPC manages to run 10m from you till the root from Talons finally hits him (which is totally useless by then)
3) (NPC version of) Arrow Spray is so wide, that from those 10 metres you have no chance to dodge in time, UNLESS you have stamina for BASH (to cancel your lengthly animation) AND ROLL DODGE (in the right moment to dodge the actual skill, the dodge window is really small)
(which means you have to be above 50% stamina by that time = that means you cannot block till then, or you get lower than that as a caster, even with stamina food)

IF Talons were working as intended, the archer would never be able to get away in the first place, allowing you to just take two steps to the side to completely avoid Arrow Spray (and Barrage can't even be used that close, since it has minimum range of about 6-8m)