Why Duels and Arenas would be a mistake

Rylana

Hi there, for the last 17 years I have played several MMOs that had a strong PvP community in them.

One of my favorite modes of gameplay was Arena style battlefield/battleground (no I never played WoW, I come from SWG), as well as 1v1 Duels for IRL honor points.

This game is not properly balanced for 1v1 at this time. There are specs in most classes that make 1v1 battles not so much skill based as build based. An escapist sorc, a spike down NB, or a tank DK will pretty much own almost anything 1v1 (or simply be unkillable by anything).

So from that standpoint, at least at this stage of the games lifespan, dueling would be a mistake (it actually would also prevent a crapload of in game drama to just leave it out entirely). As nice as it would be to "test builds" it opens up a whole world of griefing and crybabying that you may not be prepared to deal with, Zenimax. Wait til you get threads made of "Humiliation via youtube" posted all over the forums driving your mods nuts.

For arenas the same is true (though in the future I would love to see them, since Vice Squad/Aldmeri Vice/Crossfleet, my guild, has a strong background of balanced even numbers PvP matches and playstyle in multiple games)

But right now there are too many I-win synergies to make this a viable system. Four of any class dominates. Four of any specific spec or cookie cutter, dominates. Skills are still broken, mechanics are still exploitable, and there is no check or balance between many classes versus another.

What you possibly face by making a 4on4 arena is not only pulling what little population remains out of AvA, you risk running into the perpetual nerf/buff/renerf/rebuff cycle so many other Arena-supporting MMOs have suffered through over the years.

Before you do either, you need to balance all four classes against each other, and fix a great multitude of abusable synergies first.

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO

Isn't AvA already build based anyways light armor and staves or gtfo

DeLindsay

Duels won't ruin anything as long as they are nothing more than duels. Why anyone place actual in game rewards for winning a duel is beyond me. They are nothing more than a way to spend time when you're bored and to test your builds against other players to better yourself for PvP and check your Healing/DPS for PvE.

Animus0724

Things may be a bit unbalanced at this time, but I for one welcome Duels and Arenas, even if classes are unbalanced, small scale pvp is an excellent way to iron out the kinks and help players refine their builds.

Another thing they could do is allow players to adjust damage percentage on each player at the start of a duel to make things more interesting, this way you can adjust the handicap if you are dueling a lower level player and have the duel be more skill based.

Limitless

I welcome duels for the sole fact that it could just be you 1v1ing your friend, or maybe someone from the opposite faction.

Being able to send challenges to other factions would be awesome, and dueling against your friends just sounds like a dream. You could test abilities and all that good stuff.

I don't believe that solely a Duel Function would kill the Cyrodiil population.

I think it's too early for an Arena Function though.

Islyn

Why Duels and Arenas would be a mistake Awesome! <- Fixed.

Nox_Aeterna

Duels could be just for fun , no score , no rewards. You just challenge and duel , that is acceptable.

Now , arenas would indeed require balance... So this should stay out of this game until zen can do it like GW2 , which divides arenas/BGs items/balance... from the rest of the game.

So there will be the current content(PvE+PvP) and its balance , which is still horrible now AND another balance for arenas/BGS.

Only when zen is ready to add arenas like this should they even think about this.

I will not think twice in unsubbing if zen adds arenas and mess up the balance even more.

demonlkojipub19_ESO

Everyone would go in with teams of all light armor with staff/1h/sh combo mixtures. I can see it now..

SBR_QuorTek

Thing is even at small scale zergs are viable is why it wont work in a game like this the other MMOs out there except for a few have a set class and that is it vs TESO that has 1000s ways of how to make your character able to kill stuff, it would be next to impossible to balance... even if they do fix alot of the problems with certain skills it would just be a devestating approach and also if people are crying nerf this or nerf that now then it would increase in 100 scale when people are put into a box seeing that people are still just walking over them.

Rylana

From experience I know the following three things regarding duels.

1. They are rarely ever done for actual testing, nearly all duels are caused by someone being butthurt over losing a fight and demanding to get their honor back by beating their killer. Its a revenge thing.

2. They lead to naming and shaming in both global chat and on forums/other media.

3. They lead to nerf calls and constant whining for skill X to be changed and skill Y to do something different so the loser of the duel can then "win"

Be careful what you wish for, because e-peen is a much stronger force than you give it credit for.

Prokonto

friendly no rewarding duels would be great:> both hands up for that!
but that game is not yet rdy for rated arenas bot 1:1 or group.
alot of balancing & reworking for that before it will be good for the game Zeni.

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO

demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote: »

Everyone would go in with teams of all light armor with staff/1h/sh combo mixtures. I can see it now..

Oh so AvA already is build based not skill based, K.

crowfl56

No dueling period, every game that has it seems like the griefers just hang out trying to sucker someone into a duel.
Now as far as Battle zone's I would be in favor of those. Making PvP for lvl's 10-20 , 21-30, 31-40, 41-50 then vet 2 to vet 11 and last but not least the vet12 MA zone.

Tannakaobi

crowfl56 wrote: »

No dueling period, every game that has it seems like the griefers just hang out trying to sucker someone into a duel.

You mean, they all hang out in a certain area where they know other duelers go and if you hang around they challenge you?

Wow! What grief... Such a hard life in the average day of an mmo player, I really feel your pain.

Gisgo

Duels are absolutely needed to test builds and to hunt for bugs, do not mistake them with arenas, its a completely different thing.

Lowbei

bad players will always naturally vote against anything that involves skill, to avoid a future of potential failure.

whats hilarious is that this cant affect anyone badly, it cant be exploited or used to grief... its simply a duel between two consenting players... yet bads vote against it anyway because they fear pvp.

Gisgo

Yes Lowbei we know you are a pro and everyone else here sucks, you keep saying it every ten minutes... i just wonder what are you doing on such a low-skill game.

Did you get your ass kicked on GW2?

WraithAzraiel

Games like this are all about timing - and right now all the kiddies are all like "I want an OompaLoompa now Daddy, now!" When in actuality, if the Devs - in their infinite wisdom, gave these knuckleheads everything they cried for when they cried for it. They'd hate it, cry about how poorly it was done, or find something else to moan about immediately.

You can't please the mob.

Tannakaobi

He has a point, how can dueling be used to grief any more than trade? Shall we ban trade?

Lowbei

Gisgo wrote: »

Yes Lowbei we know you are a pro and everyone else here sucks, you keep saying it every ten minutes... i just wonder what are you doing on such a low-skill game.

Did you get your ass kicked on GW2?

"bads take great offense to people making statements about bads"

SBR_QuorTek

Lowbei wrote: »

bad players will always naturally vote against anything that involves skill, to avoid a future of potential failure.

whats hilarious is that this cant affect anyone badly, it cant be exploited or used to grief... its simply a duel between two consenting players... yet bads vote against it anyway because they fear pvp.

You forget bad players will always vote yes as well thinking they would be better if not so many about... so you are contradicting yourself.

As funny as it may sound.

Gisgo

You didnt answer

Lowbei

never played gw2

"bads take great offense to people making statements about bads"

Gisgo

No no, that was just a joke.

My question is: if you cant find any competition on ESO, why arent you moving on a game with a more skilled playerbase?

I think i know the answer btw...

Lowbei

you mean like daoc? its dead sorry

gw2 for competition? lol

i like eso and am waiting for the inevitable arenas to provide competition.

less butthurt please

Gisgo

There are plenty of games with a more competitive playerbase, if you wanted competition, you would find it.
But then im afraid you would have to show your skill rather than bragging about it on the forum.

Lowbei

my general statement about bads seems to have caused you pain in the buttocks area

do we have a doctor here who can help this poor guy?

Gisgo

Not really, im half decent and i dont mind.

Lowbei

lol

Halrloprillalar

Rylana wrote: »

Be careful what you wish for, because e-peen is a much stronger force than you give it credit for.

prophetic words followed by:

Lowbei wrote: »

bad players will always naturally vote against anything that involves skill, to avoid a future of potential failure.

Not gonna lie, I facepalmed really hard.

Pissing contests aside, I do think duels would be beneficial - if nothing else for ironing out some bugged abilities and figuring out counters. But arenas are a very slimy can of worms that I don't think ZOS is ready to open yet.

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO

Tannakaobi wrote: »

crowfl56 wrote: »

No dueling period, every game that has it seems like the griefers just hang out trying to sucker someone into a duel.

You mean, they all hang out in a certain area where they know other duelers go and if you hang around they challenge you?

Wow! What grief... Such a hard life in the average day of an mmo player, I really feel your pain.

This made me lol so much.