Zenimax you are losing subscribers and currently have 2 game saving options for PvP

Evident

The servers every single night around prime time lag to ***, terrible lag unplayable lag. It is incredibly frustrating. If you cannot manage to fix whatever it is that is causing the lag with this many people within a week then there are only 2 options. Lower the cap on players to something your servers can handle, I for one would rather wait 5 minutes to pvp than deal with the unplayable lag/dcs/server down time/rollbacks its not a once in a while thing its every night. Or the other option if you have your hearts set on the population limit being what it is then buy better servers, your losing people.

Edit: I just wonder if you realize how game breaking the situation is in pvp, have someone from ur staff try to play prime time in wabbajack and see how much "fun" it is. (Oh yeah, I have a small network and from that small group of people ive met from the game at least 7 have quit due to lag in cyrodil and thats only out of the very few i know, just sayin)

GossiTheDog

Excessive lag was happening during beta testing phase. I had it last night on a PVP server where the population for all factions was low. It's a fundamental game problem that needs fixing. You can see players moving, but you can't (for example) activate objects, sneak, block etc.

Evident

All i know is when i play in the morning its fine. When i play at night its a disaster. Since beta =/ no good

Cogo

Maybe in Cyro. But on EU server not only me, but alot other has seen an increase in activity and "busy" cities".

In the patch they specificly point out that there is change to increase performance in Cyro.

What else do you want?!!?!

tilolyen_ESO

Cogo wrote: »

What else do you want?!!?!

How about a game that works as promised?? Just because "you" do not have issues, does not mean others are not, and judging by the amount of posts from pissed off players.....you are the minority. I do have to hand it to you @Cogo you are by far one of the top 5 defenders of this game and Zenimax. I wonder what Zeni would have to do to this game for you to actually be truly critical of them.

Cogo

Stop calling me a defender please. I like things like the truth.

I dont say I am right. I am speaking out of my ESO information, game experience and frankly a bit against how aggresive people are here.

I dont throw out a baseless statement. I always back it up with why I think X.

And I have plenty on my list that Zenimax need to fix/change/improve.

But making the game stable, sort of balanced and in a starting working order. That is not a new way to work these games you know.

Just like now, I stated that there IS a patch, with a time WHEN it applies to the servers and it specificly adress the problem we talking about. Lag in Cyro.

So I ask again, where is the problem?

And I am just guessing here, with comparing with other MMOs fixes. The less you change, the less you risk messing up, and vice versa.

I say what I think!

Avidus

If you are having trouble with Lag in cyrodiil, I would suggest not playing in a zerg party in Wabbajack.

I personally have never experienced significant lag that lasted more than a couple of seconds in cyrodiil, and I pvp a lot.

People complain about population capping? there are several borderline deserted campaigns. Why not just drag yourself to one with a lower population? At the very least guest in one until they fix any lag issues that exist.

Its like people are thinking "this doesn't work, so I'm going to keep trying it and get frustrated and rage about it when it doesn't work."

Be patient!

Koensol

@cogo the problem is that the game shouldn't have even launched in this state. But yea... investors want their money. And naow!

Teargrants

@Avidus‌
The thing is, everything you're saying is part of why so many of us are complaining.

To begin with, the game was specifically marketed for having "mass pvp" with up to "hundreds of players on screen" at once, and a lot of ppl bought into it because of that. Lately on Wabba you can't have more than about 20 ppl total skirmishing on screen without most of them suffering massive server-side lag. Sure, the "game's only been live for 2 months", but guess what - it was in beta for a year before that.

So while yes, some lag issues can be avoided by joining low populated campaigns, that's just not fun or appealing to many of the ppl who are in Cyrodiil. Especially when most of the low populated campaigns are dominated by 1 faction that sets it as their home campaign for bonuses while they guest in Wabba. And guess what happens when some ppl from other factions go in and start capping keeps? The players from the dominant faction come back from Wabba and zerg the hell out of the map until the few enemies give up and log. Then it's back to Wabba w/ their full pvp bonuses safe for another night. Flawed pvp bonus design FTW.

It's not all about ppl thinking "this doesn't work, so I'm going to keep trying it" as you put it. They keep trying Wabba and pray that it'll work because it's the only campaign widely known to be more or less balanced. They're desperate enough to brave 'MoLag Bal' and take their chances in Wabba, rather than gimp themselves in one of the single faction dominated low pop campaigns.

PS: Wabba-Lag isn't limited to being in a large group, or even being near other players. There's still lag spikes when I run w/ 1-2 other ppl stealthing between keeps.

Talcyndl

Right now Wabbajack has problems because of zerging. It may not be causing 100% of the issues, but it is the primary driver. I am able to play pretty smoothly when I move away from the zergs.

Hopefully, Monday's fix to Caltrops will result in less zerging play (zergs thrive with siege immunity). That plus the unspecified "memory fixes" should help.

joshisanonymous

For those unaware, and I think it's a lot of people, they posted a preview of a patch that's going through on Monday. It addresses some big PvP issues. A couple people have mentioned it in this thread but the link is probably worthwhile:

forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/105348/patch-v-1-1-3-preview/p1

Anyway, yeah, they're working on lag. It's absurd to suggest that they're just oblivious to the issue. This is, however, new territory for any MMO so you can't expect it to be perfect out of the gate, or even a little while out of the gate. Just keep sending in bug reports when you experience different types of latency.

And in case it's not clear, the new territory I'm talking about is the mostly action based combat system in an environment designed to hold 2000 players at once. GW2 had a pretty tab target-less system, but the zones were nowhere near as large. DAoC probably supported close to the same number of players in PvP, but a tab targetting system places significantly fewer demands on the network.

Edit: It might be worth pointing out that GW2 also had some pretty significant skill lag issues in PvP that popped up a year after launch, even. Perhaps that will also help put things in perspective. ESO is actually a pretty ambitious game in this regard.

bitaken

joshisanonymous wrote: »

This is, however, new territory for any MMO so you can't expect it to be perfect out of the gate, or even a little while out of the gate. Just keep sending in bug reports when you experience different types of latency.

Please, you did not really say this. I was in DAOC 12 years ago when we would siege relic keeps with 150 players - and 90 would be defending. If you see 240 on a screen at one time in Wabba - it IS a slide show.

Currently on PvP realms of WoW you will regularly see 90-120 people laying siege to a capital city - and almost no lag.

This is not new territory for the MMO world. It's new territory for TESO. They had no idea what was going to happen with PvP and they released it like this. Mosh Pit style PvP is always a huge draw for players. DAOC took some time to get it down to the point where you could play in massive battles and keep track of things, I will grant you that - but that was 13 years ago.

Cogo

bitaken wrote: »

joshisanonymous wrote: »

This is, however, new territory for any MMO so you can't expect it to be perfect out of the gate, or even a little while out of the gate. Just keep sending in bug reports when you experience different types of latency.

Please, you did not really say this. I was in DAOC 12 years ago when we would siege relic keeps with 150 players - and 90 would be defending. If you see 240 on a screen at one time in Wabba - it IS a slide show.

Currently on PvP realms of WoW you will regularly see 90-120 people laying siege to a capital city - and almost no lag.

This is not new territory for the MMO world. It's new territory for TESO. They had no idea what was going to happen with PvP and they released it like this. Mosh Pit style PvP is always a huge draw for players. DAOC took some time to get it down to the point where you could play in massive battles and keep track of things, I will grant you that - but that was 13 years ago.

Um, all software do not work the same way.
There are many reasons for lag or no lag.

2 things here, The new territory is the way Cyradiil works. Which is nothing like WoW or any other game. Simular to DaoC yes, but a new type.

Second....comparing the two on based of lag. Do I really have to explain how that is impossible to do?

And for the record, I played wow, hardcore, nailed garrosh 10 man ahead of the curve etc, for a year. EVERYONE always complained about lag at Ordos, which is normaly 40 people. I never lagged there. I do not lag in ESO cities.

WoW had a lot of time to work out their code to support more numbers of players in in the same area. ESO is doing the same, with a complete different "software".

They already made a fix that goes live on monday where 1 point is to reduce lag in Cyra.

Evident

The reason I dont switch campaigns is because i chose this campaign and have put a lot of time into it, why be forced to switch because of lag? Im not sure how some people claim to not lag perhaps you dont play during prime time everyone i know talks about the lag, and yes im hearing that theres a patch to fix it thumbs up, i hope it does enough cause the lags bad, and no its not my connection. Its just not fun at all when it lags as hard as it does, 1 second lag hey no biggie but when *** is just freezing for everyone it gets rough... when you cap a scroll and dc rollback 20 mins or emperor etcetc its rough, my biggest issue is that people are leaving the game because of it. personally i do not want this game to lose too many people and go f2p

joshisanonymous

bitaken wrote: »

Please, you did not really say this. I was in DAOC 12 years ago when we would siege relic keeps with 150 players - and 90 would be defending. If you see 240 on a screen at one time in Wabba - it IS a slide show.

I talked about DAoC and explicitly explained why they were able to do large battles with little lag. There's no reason you should be responding like this unless you simply did not read my post. Instead, it seems you got so excited about an opportunity to flex your e-peen that you jumped down my throat the second you read the phrase "new territory."

Harakh

Cogo wrote: »

Maybe in Cyro. But on EU server not only me, but alot other has seen an increase in activity and "busy" cities".

In the patch they specificly point out that there is change to increase performance in Cyro.

What else do you want?!!?!

- Fix all NB Bugs
- Fix Balance
- Fix caltrop abuse
- Fix buggy Quest
- move EU Server to EU!
- more communication in forums
- and many more

rhoekieb16_ESO

-give everyone still playing this game a medal

Teargrants

Does the medal have a reduce lag enchant?

bitaken

joshisanonymous wrote: »

bitaken wrote: »

Please, you did not really say this. I was in DAOC 12 years ago when we would siege relic keeps with 150 players - and 90 would be defending. If you see 240 on a screen at one time in Wabba - it IS a slide show.

I talked about DAoC and explicitly explained why they were able to do large battles with little lag. There's no reason you should be responding like this unless you simply did not read my post. Instead, it seems you got so excited about an opportunity to flex your e-peen that you jumped down my throat the second you read the phrase "new territory."

I read your post. The reality is you are too much a fanboy to put criticism where it is due. How many times in the past week has Wabbajack been rolled back? 5 that I was a part of - 4 more that I have been told about.

We had an epic fight at Ash last night with about 90 AD singeing and 50 DC defending. They almost took the first flag - we pushed them out and killed the stair runners. They almost pushed us off the back flag - we pushed them back a second time. Then they started a third rush...server roll back. We could not make it back to Ash before they did - and the doors were down and all NPC's were gone so they took the keep with ease.

How is this not game breaking to you? Why must you be a fan boy?

Here is reality: The bugs and lag are destroying the game. You can come at me with anything you want - but this is 2014 not 2000. Releasing the Craglorn patch effectively ruined an already laggy campaign in Wabbajack.

I don't care about your PvE zones - or your pretty mobs to kill and puzzles to solve. All I want to do is PvP - and when the zone I PvP in feels like a slide show in slow motion with 4-8 second ability lag and continual server roll backs - the thing is damn well broken.

We did not design the game - but are paying to play it. If they can't get it to a reasonable performance level - VERY SOON - there will be only the story geeks and PvE nerds playing it - which means I will be looking for another title to PvP in because I will have no one to fight.

Is that clear enough for you?

Alomar

There's worse server lag, skill delays, roll-backs, memory-leaks, etc. in Low-Medium pop Wabba than there ever was in Full AB. Gotta love progress.

ishilb14_ESO

You can't not zerg because a 4 man group can't cap a keep because Zenimax believes NPCs should do all the work defending unmanned keeps. Like why shouldn't keeps be easy to cap if there are no players to defend it. This is one of the things GW2 did right.

Xsorus

ishilpatelb14_ESO wrote: »

You can't not zerg because a 4 man group can't cap a keep because Zenimax believes NPCs should do all the work defending unmanned keeps. Like why shouldn't keeps be easy to cap if there are no players to defend it. This is one of the things GW2 did right.

GW2 didn't do anything right...Don't kid yourself

Having a Keep that could have its door knocked down in 30 seconds and taken was moronic.

ishilb14_ESO

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

ishilpatelb14_ESO wrote: »

You can't not zerg because a 4 man group can't cap a keep because Zenimax believes NPCs should do all the work defending unmanned keeps. Like why shouldn't keeps be easy to cap if there are no players to defend it. This is one of the things GW2 did right.

GW2 didn't do anything right...Don't kid yourself

Having a Keep that could have its door knocked down in 30 seconds and taken was moronic.

It took 4 people 10 minutes to cap an unmanned keep, you don't think that's a long time considering no players are there to defend it? I guess you're one of those that can't match up to those 4 players so you want NPCs to defend it for you, is that it?

Elidas

I have terrible lag in Cyrodil even when I am soloing PvE. Being near a zerg is not the problem. And neither is my PC because when I am outside Cyrodil everything runs perfect

Mendoze

Is the new patch applied yet, because last night it was still horrible server side lag at least in EU AB? Skills/spells won't work or have 20 second lag, doors still bug and won't open, and every now and then can't mount/dismount horse. Don't forget the always so funny stuck in combat "feature" for healers, random client crashes and the list goes on and on. If the patch was already applied, I did not see any difference. Ever since Craglorn patch Cyrodiil has been a total mess, and fixing this mess really should be on top their priority list by now. For Pete's sakes, this game was sold on advertising large scale PVP, and still 2 months after launch we have fundamental game breaking problems.

alexj4596b14_ESO

Mendoze wrote: »

Is the new patch applied yet, because last night it was still horrible server side lag at least in EU AB? Skills/spells won't work or have 20 second lag, doors still bug and won't open, and every now and then can't mount/dismount horse. Don't forget the always so funny stuck in combat "feature" for healers, random client crashes and the list goes on and on. If the patch was already applied, I did not see any difference. Ever since Craglorn patch Cyrodiil has been a total mess, and fixing this mess really should be on top their priority list by now. For Pete's sakes, this game was sold on advertising large scale PVP, and still 2 months after launch we have fundamental game breaking problems.

I didn't have any issues yesterday

maczcoobb16_ESO

Auriel's Bow EU still lags like crazy when you go to a place where action is going on. It's sad really...

Pancake-Tragedy

ishilpatelb14_ESO wrote: »

-GW2 rant-

It took 4 people 10 minutes to cap an unmanned keep, you don't think that's a long time considering no players are there to defend it? I guess you're one of those that can't match up to those 4 players so you want NPCs to defend it for you, is that it?

I don't think that 4 people should be able to take a keep, and that was one of the problems with GW2, among many others.

I do think that a 4 man group should be able to take resource nodes though (not solo like you could with supply camps in GW2). That would open up more things to do for smaller groups, increase the amount of small scale pvp, and detract from the zerg mentality. Currently, small man groups can't do anything useful except cut off reinforcements.

jespertorpb16_ESO

PVP is basically unplayable. The expectations was so great - and now after a while, i must say - after being a huge fan - im so disappointet. PVP is about trying yourself against other players, putting together a plan, working together trying to outsmart the others. Brain vs brain. Its totally ruined, when lag (or whatever issues) causes you to not be able to activate abilities, shift weapons or stear your character correct. Even ½ sec of lag is too much. A PvP fight lasts max 8 seconds, and the difference between being victorius or dead, can easily be determined by the ½ sec where your actions has no effect. Not to mention the endless amount of of dc's.

Its not my internet, i have 100 MBit
Its not my PC i have an ASUS G750J

Its the game, the server, the code - or whatever the excuses are.

Its a failure...