Lowbie PvP Mechanics

Sil

Crisscross wrote: »

Censorious wrote: »

Crisscross wrote: »

Censorious wrote: »

...boosted to something near equality...

Is this really true...?

You get boosted to Lvl 49 equivalent, less passives. VR1 (Lvl50) will still have an advantage but it's not so much that a bad VR can beat a good lvl 10.

When I say 'good' I don't mean some sort of PvP god that can solo a dozen players with one hand. I mean good at hiding behind a rock and clubbing the poor SoB with a brick when he ain't looking.

I will have an easier time believing you if you told me that the sky was green.

Last week I was in the mid 40s, and got the jump on a HALF HEALTH veteran ranked straggler. I immobilized him, then stunned him, then wailed on him. His HP bar barely moved, and when the stun wore off, he got some distance, healed himself, then one shotted me with soul strike.

Now I'm VR1 and I've taken part and won 2 1v1s (where I got the jump on them and knocked them off their horse, but still, at least I can actually do DAMAGE now), and can regularly survive charging into the melee of a zerg. If I tried meleeing in a zerg fight before I got veteran rank, I'd get toasted by random AOEs within the first five seconds of charging in. I'd get toasted by random AOEs alot of the times even if I stayed at range.

So until someone convinces me that my experiences are just completely anecdotal, I call BS on any claim that says pre-VRs are in any way competitive. If this is the intended system, then it needs to be changed, plain and simple, because lowbies are just being turned off by the dozen. If not, then something is clearly broken under the hood with how the bolster buff works.

Exactly what I and some comrades and clan mates experienced.
What is said/intended, and what is really happening are 2 pairs of shoes.

I was now with a lvl 33 mage with 2 daedric companions in cyro and met 1 ! vet5 guard near a village. I could hardly scratch him until I was dead, and my mage isn't bad. Something doesn't fit here....

Thunderchief

I think there are hidden stats involved such as "Power" that aren't increased at all in PvP.

Censorious

I see where the problem is. You seem to regard 'competitive' as being ' able to beat the living snot out of'.

Below VR rank there is no way I would ever have considered going 1v1 with any VR player. I wouldn't dream of going 3v1 with only two other lowbies to help.

Competitive to me means staying in stealth with half-a-dozen VR ranked players and helping to pull down reinforcements heading to a fight. It means taking zero damage if at all possible and the moment I see someone even look in my direction I hit a rejuvenation potion and run like ****.
You may not think that's very heroic but that's the way I play it. Now I'm VR2 and a bit more dangerous, I'll take on a half dozen players at once. It's not that I'm so much more powerful, it's the fact that I've learned to be so damn slippery they're lucky to land a shot on me.

Oh, and the guards? They will one-shot a VR12 player - so don't even think about getting their attention.

McDoogs

Gisgo wrote: »

I dont know numbers but non veterans are really, really soft, no matter the armor they are wearing..

That is usually because they don't know how to play yet. No matter the level active damage mitigation (blocking, dodge roll, cc break) >>>> passive damage mitigation (spell resist, armor rating)

Also, the level scaling does not boost damage skills. By mid vet levels all your damage/buff skills should be morphed and maxed which will not be the case in the 30s and 40s.

Thalmar

People complaining about campaigns being empty, merging campaigns like developers doing right now is not near the solution. The biggest problem is the huge difference between VR12s and players who are leveling. If they add 1-2 level 10-49 campaign people will be amused how many people will return to PvP. I still believe or want to believe there are more players who do PvP to enjoy, to have fun instead being strongest and kill anyone on side. I will not set my feet again into PvP till i am V5 or higher or till they add a leveling campaign as i mentioned if they ever do that at all.

Thunderchief

The impression I had was that pvp in this game would have a greater emphasis on skill rather than gear and levels. This is not the case.

If I bought Battlefield 4 today and started playing i'm sure that I could get a starting pistol and headshot and experienced player I would do a lot of damage and very likely kill him. In this game I can unleash on a high level player and he could stand there and watch me until I run out of stamina/magicka and then 1 shot me.

Epona222

I do think it's a huge mistake to raise the level of NPCs in Cyrodil. More people need to take part, not fewer. At the rate I am going, it could be months before I hit VR5. Before the levels were upped, at least when I went in I felt I was halfway there, it was an attainable goal that I might at some point be able to hold my own - now never mind the enemy players, a flippin' croc can take me out no problem.
Now I just sag under the weight of the thought of those extra 5 VR levels as if it's another barrier to me really getting involved. I just wish the goalposts would stop moving.

Thunderchief

Epona222 wrote: »

I just wish the goalposts would stop moving.

They just added 2 levels to the game so maybe soon they will increase the goalposts to VR7?

Crisscross

Censorious wrote: »

Competitive to me means staying in stealth with half-a-dozen VR ranked players and helping to pull down reinforcements heading to a fight. It means taking zero damage if at all possible and the moment I see someone even look in my direction I hit a rejuvenation potion and run like ****.

Seriously no offense dude, but I think you need a dictionary.

Cheatingdeath23

Jochamo wrote: »

IMO, the recent pvp changes were ill-advised. This seems to be borne out by the low population on the pvp servers.

I am a low level that has been in pve and pvp since lvl 10. I am in no hurry to get to VR, but the recent changes have made the pvp unplayable for me.

I agree completely.

I started playing PvP around level 15, and played consistently through level 26 and had a lot of fun. But with all the VR players, they had to do something to make guards and NPC's more challenging, so they bumped them up to VR5... now I don't play PvP and am taking my time through PvE before I go back.

If they bumped new players to VR5, that might make a difference... if they decreased the giant difference between VR12 and VR1, that would make a difference. Heck, if they didn't lower my armor when I went into PvP, that might make a difference.

Censorious

Crisscross wrote: »

Censorious wrote: »

Competitive to me means staying in stealth with half-a-dozen VR ranked players and helping to pull down reinforcements heading to a fight. It means taking zero damage if at all possible and the moment I see someone even look in my direction I hit a rejuvenation potion and run like ****.

Seriously no offense dude, but I think you need a dictionary.

WTF ? You think there's a spelling mistake in that? You can't even spell offence.

Crisscross

O.o Really?

Well in case you aren't trolling, offense is the American spelling and offence is the British spelling. And,

com·pet·i·tive
kəmˈpetətiv/Submit
adjective: competitive
1.
of, relating to, or characterized by competition.
"a competitive sport"
2.
as good as or better than others of a comparable nature.

Hiding in the middle of six other veteran players is not competitive at all. You aren't really even helping. What you described kind of sounds like the equivalent of a one legged ten year old waving his arms around in the middle of a soccer game.

Censorious

Crisscross wrote: »

O.o Really?

Well in case you aren't trolling, offense is the American spelling and offence is the British spelling. And,

com·pet·i·tive
kəmˈpetətiv/Submit
adjective: competitive
1.
of, relating to, or characterized by competition.
"a competitive sport"
2.
as good as or better than others of a comparable nature.

Hiding in the middle of six other veteran players is not competitive at all. You aren't really even helping. What you described kind of sounds like the equivalent of a one legged ten year old waving his arms around in the middle of a soccer game.

I see - you take exception to my USE of the word.
I can't really argue with you. If you want to define competition in such narrow terms that's up to you.
But there's no point in your insisting that the game should be changed. It won't be, for many very good reasons.

Crisscross

So list them.

I'm also defining the word by its definition. Arguing that its competitive or even fun to be unable to do any damage and having to run away if something threatens to breath on you is just delusional, which it really sounds like you are at this point tbh.

Shutting out lowbies like this is not only bad game design in general, but also completely contradictory to the supposed theme of ESO. "Play how you want" yet there are baffling limitations present everywhere, with the broken bolster system just being one of them. The irony is that a number of other MMOs, who never gave the slightest hint of promising freeform gameplay, openly welcomes low level players to PVP via a working bolster system, level brackets, or specific roles that low levels can fill that are both meaningful and enjoyable. ESO does none of these, unless you're lucky enough to enjoy manning a siege weapon I suppose. Instead PVP players are forced to grind PVE before they can get to the content they enjoy. Bad design. Unneeded design. I'm just not seeing these "many very good reasons" that are supposedly out there.

Thunderchief

I really want to pvp but I don't think I'll go back until I have leveled up a lot more. Might do guild zergs occasionally though because that bit was fun.