Bolt Escape (Streak?) + Stampede is the new Burning Talons+Shield Bash

Bloodvax

Been seeing alot of sorcs using this combo in pvp since the bash nerf and i must say while it is effective its extremely annoying. They use streak to make you take a knee then crit charge you with the 2hander rinse repeat until your deadsville. Ultimate cheesmode style. It wouldn't be as bad as broken talons shield bash was except it seems that you cant always break out of the CC. Its not just on streak either it seems to happen on any CC that has the take a knee animation. My guild has been testing this out and we're not sure if its the lag causing it (we're on Celarus) or if its another factor but we've noticed that most of the time when forced down by streak or the templar spear (has the same effect i believe) we can only properly break out maybe 5% of the time. Any thoughts on the issue?
P.S. I know its been mentioned a 100 times but you have to admit that bolt escape is awful when no other class has an escape method that is that effective. You can effectively bolt across the map. surely out of range of anything else. Combined with magika flooding gear and pots you can just bolt forever.

ishilb14_ESO

It's either lag or a bugged game mechanic, please don't be so quick to name BE as the culprit in your title, this happened to me earlier when i got hit by talons and shield charge at the same, my character just refused to stun break even though I had full stamina. Overall this game still has so many bugs but the devs feel that buffing guards and nerfing stuff like talons is more important than bug-fixing. I'm probably not gonna sub next month and wait until ZOS devs get their heads out of their asses and focus on bug fixing. Wildstar may be a cartoon, but at least it doesn't have nearly as many bugs as ESO.

Armitas

Regarding it being unbreakable.
I was reading another forum and a guy was asking about an unbreakable fear chain he was getting. Check the thread below and see if anything sounds similar to your experience in being unable to break CC.

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/what-is-causing-unbreakable-unblockable-chainable-fear-in-pvp/

zenmogwai

Bloodvax wrote: »

My guild has been testing this out and we're not sure if its the lag causing it (we're on Celarus) or if its another factor but we've noticed that most of the time when forced down by streak or the templar spear (has the same effect i believe) we can only properly break out maybe 5% of the time. Any thoughts on the issue?

I also spent a few days trying to determine which CC it was I couldn't break out of. I've come to the conclusion that is has something to do with the combination of two CC's. So if you get knocked down for example and then immediately stunned while knocked down, I don't think it is possible to get up. I don't think it is any specific class because I've had it happen fighting everyone EXCEPT nightblade (although for me it seems most common against templars).

The stupid thing is, as soon as you mention it to people that haven't experienced this, they immediately tell you that you were out of stamina or don't know how to right+left click. This is definitely not the case. Something is now broken with CC and as soon as more people figure out how to do it, PvP will be ruined again.

Mykah

Counter is to block the stun then charge them before they can turn around and charge you.

I do think BE needs its magicka cost increased to 20% mana though. Its too spammable.

Bloodvax

Only time it happened to me vs a nightblade was when they used venom arrow to interrupt my focused aim so I'm pretty sure its related to "setting the target off balance"

NordJitsu

We should nerf all interesting combos in the game until everyone is equally bad and no one is having any fun.

Then you'd be happy.

limbaughb14_ESO

NordJitsu wrote: »

We should nerf all interesting combos in the game until everyone is equally bad and no one is having any fun.

Then you'd be happy.

If Bolt "Escape" is being used/abused as an offensive weapon, which it is, it needs to be addressed.

Mykah

Ergo increasing BEs magicka cost 20% so that its unwise to use offensively.

joshisanonymous

limbaughb14_ESO wrote: »

If Bolt "Escape" is being used/abused as an offensive weapon, which it is, it needs to be addressed.

That's the name of the initial skill, but the morphs both do damage. One is clearly more defensive and the other is clearly more offensive. Many skills are setup this way.

Hridh

huh, isn't Bolt Escape doing like no damage ?

joshisanonymous

Hridh wrote: »

huh, isn't Bolt Escape doing like no damage ?

Sorry, the offensive morph does damage, the defensive one doesn't. (I don't play a sorcerer.)

Glurin

Hridh wrote: »

huh, isn't Bolt Escape doing like no damage ?

Just about. You have to use the streak morph to do any damage with it, and that causes it to trade stun for disorient. Even so, it does pitiful damage and costs close to 400 magicka per cast at it's base value.

Mojomonkeyman

How about guys get some insight before complaining?

2h Sorcs use the BE morph called "Streak", which is clearly intended to be used offensively and does not have the projectile defense which makes you vulnerable to ranged cc and damage incoming.

I was leveling all the way up to VR10 with that build (and its variations) and then using it a lot in PvP.

While it certainly has advantages (which any viable smallscale build should have) in 1v1 up to 1v2 situations, there are extreme downsides as well - it is a squishy single target burst build and it forces melee combat while being very dependent on both resources, mana and stamina. In consequence the ae potential is very limited (mostly to streak) and offhand staff effectiveness is reduced by a lot compared to standard sorc builds (both in damage and frequency of spells, because the sorc wants to trade some magicka for stamina and wants to have softcapped weapon damage).

You can either go stamina heavy and combine it with the use of light attack - executioner - bash combo to bring you opponent down. Which will make you very vulnerable to enemy cc, since you need stamina for cc break, block, sprint and so on. You need medium armor pieces to up your weapon crit and stamina reg to proper values. This cuts immensely into your mana stat and reg, which will limit the use of streak by a lot.

Or you go magicka heavy and mix the bar with damage spells, which will force you to go light armor and makes you even squishyer, since not only armor value is decreased but the excessive use of stampede or critical charge will make you unable to block, cc break or dodge roll a lot. Just cc the sorc like a mad man (immobilize works wonders) and make him cry.

By far the largest downside is that fights vs multiple opponents (not even at once but one after another) will be very, very difficult due to the limited ressources of a hybrid build. The use of dark exchange becomes obsolete since you need your stamina to actually fight. Same goes for immovable which cannot be kept up, the cost is just too high to not make you miss the precious stamina for offensive and defensive purposes.

Play a sorc, go into pvp and test it yourselve. Unbelievably thats another L2P issue. If your Kungfu sucks, dont complain, train more.

Regards

Reevster

NordJitsu wrote: »

We should nerf all interesting combos in the game until everyone is equally bad and no one is having any fun.

Then you'd be happy.

Ya some people wont be happy till everything is nerfed into the ground and and no one wanting to play any class at all , good work , keep nerfing and destroying the game.

Dudis

Try breaking CC and blocking...

Hell, after not being CCd (since you blocked) you could even charge them yourself.

NordJitsu

limbaughb14_ESO wrote: »

NordJitsu wrote: »

We should nerf all interesting combos in the game until everyone is equally bad and no one is having any fun.

Then you'd be happy.

If Bolt "Escape" is being used/abused as an offensive weapon, which it is, it needs to be addressed.

@limbaughb14_ESO‌

This is pretty hilarious. 99.99999% of the complaints about BE are with people using it to run away.

I can't even tell you how funny it is to see some one claiming its OP when used offensively.

Honestly, Streak could use a substantial damage buff and the removal of the Magicka Regen penalty (keep it for Ball of Lightning so people can't spam escape.)

smercgames_ESO

It is pretty annoying when spammed. I've seen alot of VR 12's doing this with shields on so they streak in, blow someone up and by then their shield is gone since they have taken some hits then streak again. Regen. Do it again and there is practically nothing you can do about it since they use all their Stamina to CC break and become immune and are free to do whatever they want for a few seconds while dropping the entire group down to a knee. I'm not sure the CC immunity is even working correctly vs Streak because I've been dropped to a knee multiple times within a few seconds before. Rather frustrating people always look for the broken skills to abuse all the time.

wpitterlb14a_ESO

zenmogwai wrote: »

Bloodvax wrote: »

My guild has been testing this out and we're not sure if its the lag causing it (we're on Celarus) or if its another factor but we've noticed that most of the time when forced down by streak or the templar spear (has the same effect i believe) we can only properly break out maybe 5% of the time. Any thoughts on the issue?

I also spent a few days trying to determine which CC it was I couldn't break out of. I've come to the conclusion that is has something to do with the combination of two CC's. So if you get knocked down for example and then immediately stunned while knocked down, I don't think it is possible to get up. I don't think it is any specific class because I've had it happen fighting everyone EXCEPT nightblade (although for me it seems most common against templars).

The stupid thing is, as soon as you mention it to people that haven't experienced this, they immediately tell you that you were out of stamina or don't know how to right+left click. This is definitely not the case. Something is now broken with CC and as soon as more people figure out how to do it, PvP will be ruined again.

I've been seeing a lot of this as well, and its incredibly frustrating. The Templar spear throw knockdown ability definitely does seem to be the biggest offender (though I've been able to break out of even that a couple times). As far as I can tell it does not seem to be linked to any single ability, and no one ability causes it 100% of the time, so it does seem like its being caused by some combination of CC's. I've also noticed that it happens much more frequently when being attacked by multiple opponents, who are likely spamming multiple types of CC, again supporting the same theory.

The simplest theory is that a hard cc followed by a soft cc is causing the game to not recognize that you are still hard cc'd. So you get hit with a stun, then immediately hit with a root/immobilize, the CC break mechanic only recognizes that you are rooted and so it won't trigger, even though you are also stunned. I know for sure that I've been caught in this unbreakable stun more than a few times while also caught in talons, but I have no idea how the Templar spear fits in to this theory.

Huckdabuck

I know quiet frequently in PvE I get locked up where my character won't even move (even after I have killed something and am no longer in combat) so I have to Alt+F4 and relog. Might just be something along the lines of broken fight mechanics.

Baphomet

There is a real issue with CC breaking in game right now. I experienced it on Celarus yesterday, too.

NPC eclipses would be almost impossible to break with a full stamina bar and knockdowns would be impossible to recover from.

Other guildies were experiencing the same thing.

We had this CC break bug big time on the PTS a while ago, and I have my suspecions that it might be back - this doesn't seem to be a lag issue this time around.

NordJitsu

@Baphomet‌

I had the same problem on Wabba.


I think its a latency thing.

There's be times when I'd get knocked down and be unable to do anything with a full Stam bar.

Its got nothing to do with BE though.

c0rp

Maybe if you blocked you wouldnt be CCd all the time.

dahl.lucas_ESO

It sounds like lag issues on the server. Happens to me all the time. Just hope they fix this soon it's not worth pvping when you start fighting then get Perma cc or in instantly killed when your all alone after an engagement.

NordJitsu

@c0rp‌

So you Block 100% of the time? Like when traveling between keeps and such?

You must be a ton of fun to run with in PvP since your groups are always waiting for you to catch up.

No one said they get stunned all the time. But it happens sometimes and if CC break isn't working, its frustrating.

wpitterlb14a_ESO

It is not lag. I've had this happen dozens of times. It is incredibly obvious that your character is simply enduring the full length of the stun/knockdown, and the second the animation is over you are instantly able to return to normal action.

I don't play on Wabba or whatever other servers that apparently are suffering from constant lag issues. I play on Auriels Bow (US), and mostly during off hours when there is no more than 10-20 players fighting each other at any given location. I have very little lag, but when it does lag its noticeably different from the cc break issue.