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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
Shall the groupfinder transfer quest progress for pledges?
SantaOrc
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From day to day you use the groupfinder tool and get into a group, which already killed one or more bosses in the dungeon. For random dungeons that may be okay, but undaunted pledges can't get completed that way.
In the first place you are now in a group which assumedly has been left from at least one frustrated player who couldn't bear the disability of the group anymore, secondly the run wouldn't have any value for you anyway.
If you choose not no bear with this burden, you are punished with a 15 min break.
My Suggestion: When you join a group using the group finder tool and relevant bosses have already been slain, at least adopt the quest progress for your pledge.
This way, there may be more motivation to help this struggling group.
Edited by SantaOrc on 14 October 2016 12:30 In the first place you are now in a group which assumedly has been left from at least one frustrated player who couldn't bear the disability of the group anymore, secondly the run wouldn't have any value for you anyway.
If you choose not no bear with this burden, you are punished with a 15 min break.
My Suggestion: When you join a group using the group finder tool and relevant bosses have already been slain, at least adopt the quest progress for your pledge.
This way, there may be more motivation to help this struggling group.
Shall the groupfinder transfer quest progress for pledges? 28 votes
yes!
57%
16 votes
no!
25%
7 votes
yes, but ...
10%
3 votes
no, but ...
7%
2 votes
0
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vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭no, but ...I like the idea but i am also worried about abuse. I know it would be harder to pull off, but still possible.
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SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!Again, you can't control which group you will join. Kicking people won't get you anywhere.
Edited by SantaOrc on 14 October 2016 13:310 -
Swomp23✭✭✭✭yes!Honestly, right now group finder is a mess. At least on XBox NA for a dps. I don't know if it's because it's still buggy or if not enough healer/tanks are in queue, but right now, as a dps, I often queue for more than 1 hour just to find a damn group for normal dungeons.
And I don't know what type of abuse you guys are afraid of. This is just to get quest completion for the pledge. You can't rly farm astronomic amounts of keys by abusing a system, since you're limited to a couple of keys a day (6 with 1T now I think?)
And if you think this is still too prone to abuse, you can make it so that you get completion if you join group by queue but not by friend invite...XBox One - NA0 -
SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!And if you think this is still too prone to abuse, you can make it so that you get completion if you join group by queue but not by friend invite...
I poll isn't about friend invites, it's only about the group finder tool. Good you mention it again, since people doesn't seem able to read before hitting "i didn't understand so better i press no".
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Swomp23✭✭✭✭yes!Is group finder working well for you guys?Edited by Swomp23 on 14 October 2016 13:36XBox One - NA0
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SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!
Excuse me? What are you refering to?Is group finder working well for you guys?
Edit: what is happening?
For me, as a healer, the group finder is really working well these days. Mostly from seconds to a minute or two and i have a group. Unfortunatelly, it doesn't help sometimes (therefore this thread)Edited by SantaOrc on 14 October 2016 13:420 -
Reverb✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭yes!Yes. This happens to me at least twice a week, where I queue for pledge and get a group right away, only to learn that they've already killed some of the bosses needed for pledge. Not only do I not get a key, but I also incur a 15-minute requeue penalty. It usually makes me just log off of that toon and not pledge that day.Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you. ~Friedrich Nietzsche1 -
Asardes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭no!I don't like the idea, since some people will profit from it and have an easy completion for many dungeon where the mid boss is actually harder than the last one. I have found myself in the situation of joining mid dungeon - most often was VWGT with a group left tankless at the Inhibitor - and finishing the end boss on hard mode, then returning with a new group and do the dungeon all over again. I never did mind that.
Before One Tamriel I used the group to PuG the silver pledge and a normal random dungeon each day - sometimes they were one and the same. But now it isn't worth it as normal mode doesn't give me any monster heads, and only the hard mode gives me a 2nd key for the pledge. So IMO it's simply not worth the time waiting in queue, then having only a slim chance of getting the maximum out of that pledge, or even anything at all since the group may turn out so weak it won't be able to even finish the pledge, thus wasting 30m or more without any result.
Instead I simply type in zone and guilds chats: "CP561+ DK Tank LFG vet hard mode pledges [achievement]" and I get a group straight away. Of course, that may fail as well, but from my experience the probability is smaller. There's no way I would PuG a DLC dungeon, those even fail with zone/guild made groups. The best runs is when friends invite me to tank dungeons with them, often I run the pledges multiple times a day just for the fun and the farming. As tank I'm never "unemployed", and I'm also leveling a healer. I suspect there were already too many DDs relative to the other two roles even before most dungeons were buffed in One Tamriel; now they all certainly require a tank and a healer to do the hard mode.Edited by Asardes on 14 October 2016 14:07Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
vMA (The Flawless Conqueror) | vVH (Spirit Slayer & of the Undying Song) | vDSA | vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL | vAS+1 | Emperor
PC-EU CP 3000+
41,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Pact Veteran Trade: Exemplary
Traders of the Covenant: God of Sales
Tamriels Emporium: God of Sales
Valinor Overflow: Trader
The Traveling Merchant: Silver
Characters:
Asardes | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 50 | Master Crafter: all traits & recipes, all styles released before High Isle
Alxaril Nelcarion | 50 High Elf Sorcerer | AD AR 20 |
Dro'Bear Three-paws | 50 Khajiit Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Veronique Nicole | 50 Breton Templar | DC AR 20 |
Sabina Flavia Cosades | 50 Imperial Warden | EP AR 20 |
Ervesa Neloren | 50 Dark Elf Dragonknight | EP AR 20 |
Fendar Khodwin | 50 Redguard Sorcerer | DC AR 20 |
Surilanwe of Lillandril | 50 High Elf Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Joleen the Swift | 50 Redguard Templar | DC AR 20 |
Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
Nazura-la the Bonedancer | 50 Necromancer | AD AR 20 |
Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
Ushruka gra-Lhurgash | 50 Orc Sorcerer | AD AR 4 |
Cienwen ferch Llywelyn | 50 Breton Nightblade | DC AR 4 |
Plays-with-Sunray | 50 Argonian Templar | EP AR 4 |
Milariel | 50 Wood Elf Warden | AD AR 4 |
Scheei-Jul | 50 Necromancer | EP AR 4 |
PC-NA CP 1800+
30,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Savage Blade: Majestic Machette
Characters:
Asardes the Exile | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 30 |0 -
SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!
You are jealous of someone who has to deal with a leaver-group and don't even grant him a solved pledge for his efforts? And some sentences after this statement you admit that this group may "even [getting] anything at all since the group may turn out so weak it won't be able to even finish the pledge"? For me, those two parts don't really fit together.I don't like the idea, since some people will profit from it and have an easy completion for many dungeon where the mid boss is actually harder than the last one.
I'm not sure what the following story should tell us, guess it's not directly related to the topic.
Edited by SantaOrc on 14 October 2016 14:251 -
Asardes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭no!It's not about being "jealous", simply being consistent. The quest clearly states that you should kill all 3 bosses. There should be now shortcut around that. Any other quest in the game that requires killing a boss requires that you damage him. As for receiving credit for his contribution, he already is receiving that. For example if you join a VWGT instance at Planar Inhibitor, and beat that and Kena, the objectives are completed, and you only need to kill the Adjudicator. I see nothing unfair in the current system.Beta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
vMA (The Flawless Conqueror) | vVH (Spirit Slayer & of the Undying Song) | vDSA | vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL | vAS+1 | Emperor
PC-EU CP 3000+
41,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Pact Veteran Trade: Exemplary
Traders of the Covenant: God of Sales
Tamriels Emporium: God of Sales
Valinor Overflow: Trader
The Traveling Merchant: Silver
Characters:
Asardes | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 50 | Master Crafter: all traits & recipes, all styles released before High Isle
Alxaril Nelcarion | 50 High Elf Sorcerer | AD AR 20 |
Dro'Bear Three-paws | 50 Khajiit Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Veronique Nicole | 50 Breton Templar | DC AR 20 |
Sabina Flavia Cosades | 50 Imperial Warden | EP AR 20 |
Ervesa Neloren | 50 Dark Elf Dragonknight | EP AR 20 |
Fendar Khodwin | 50 Redguard Sorcerer | DC AR 20 |
Surilanwe of Lillandril | 50 High Elf Nightblade | AD AR 20 |
Joleen the Swift | 50 Redguard Templar | DC AR 20 |
Draynor Telvanni | 50 Dark Elf Warden | EP AR 20 |
Claudius Tharn | 50 Necromancer | DC AR 20 |
Nazura-la the Bonedancer | 50 Necromancer | AD AR 20 |
Tharkul gro-Shug | 50 Orc Dragonknight | DC AR 4 |
Ushruka gra-Lhurgash | 50 Orc Sorcerer | AD AR 4 |
Cienwen ferch Llywelyn | 50 Breton Nightblade | DC AR 4 |
Plays-with-Sunray | 50 Argonian Templar | EP AR 4 |
Milariel | 50 Wood Elf Warden | AD AR 4 |
Scheei-Jul | 50 Necromancer | EP AR 4 |
PC-NA CP 1800+
30,000+ Achievement Points before High IsleMember of:
Savage Blade: Majestic Machette
Characters:
Asardes the Exile | 50 Nord Dragonknight | EP AR 30 |0 -
SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!Okay, thank you for explanation.
But do you agree that it would be good not to punish people for leaving a group they just joined but can't fulfill their pledge with? Because when you are short on time and have bad luck with the group you found, don't you feel like the person with the unfulfillable quest is beeing punished, especially with the 15 minute rule?0 -
vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭no, but ...And if you think this is still too prone to abuse, you can make it so that you get completion if you join group by queue but not by friend invite...
I poll isn't about friend invites, it's only about the group finder tool. Good you mention it again, since people doesn't seem able to read before hitting "i didn't understand so better i press no".
Still have to point out. 3 friends join up. Go through the dungeon, just getting to the boss. 4th friend logs on. Hey lets kick this guy and get a replacement. Now you will argue, there is no way to guarentee the person who comes in as a replacement will be their friend. But there are certainly ways to make it more likely. And there is no way to stop them from kicking people over and over again until the 4th friend makes it in. Or they get bored and stop trying.
i would like to say this would be unlikely since i wouldnt do it. But Ive played enough online games to know people would do it.0 -
SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »i would like to say this would be unlikely since i wouldnt do it. But Ive played enough online games to know people would do it.
What do you think is more time consuming, in terms of frequency and effort:
a) running a dungeon and beeing kicked at some point (because people are trying the tactic you just explained)
b) getting in a group with progressed dungeon (what this thread is about)
Since your plan "already works" with random dungeons and i never heard of anyone trying it (since when this guy gets into the wrong group, they all have to wait 15 mins. Remember, the waiting queue is for the whole europe server.) but encounter the "progressed dungeon"-problem every week, i still stick to b).
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vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭no, but ...vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »i would like to say this would be unlikely since i wouldnt do it. But Ive played enough online games to know people would do it.
What do you think is more time consuming, in terms of frequency and effort:
a) running a dungeon and beeing kicked at some point (because people are trying the tactic you just explained)
b) getting in a group with progressed dungeon (what this thread is about)
Since your plan "already works" with random dungeons and i never heard of anyone trying it (since when this guy gets into the wrong group, they all have to wait 15 mins. Remember, the waiting queue is for the whole europe server.) but encounter the "progressed dungeon"-problem every week, i still stick to b).
Why would anyone do it now? They quest wont complete. In your plan it will. So even if the fourth ends up in a different group, the original 3 just find a replacement and finish up. All it took was a couple minutes of them booting people over and over. Hardly a slow down at all. Sure the 4th still has to do the whole dungeon but he was going to anyway if he didnt get in their group. So the only people who end up with a 15 minute timer are the people that got booted.
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SolarCat02✭✭✭✭✭And if you think this is still too prone to abuse, you can make it so that you get completion if you join group by queue but not by friend invite...
I poll isn't about friend invites, it's only about the group finder tool. Good you mention it again, since people doesn't seem able to read before hitting "i didn't understand so better i press no".
On Xbox, even if you used group finder to start your group, you can invite a friend to fill up that last spot. You do have to wait five minutes or so do for the dungeon to recognize that you have less than four people, of course.
Has this been changed in the One Tamriel update on PC?
@SantaOrc Random dungeons just require you to beat the last boss, yes. The undaunted pledges, however, require bosses from a list and if you are missing even one you can't turn it in.
Personally, I think a toggle when queuing that eliminates already-formed groups from your search would be the easiest way to resolve this issue. Then random dungeon people can get a random dungeon with a random progress through it, but pledge people can guarantee they get to start at the beginning.Why be normal when you can be better?
Elissandra Ravenwing, Magicka Dragonknight Healer
Lady Kalila, Stamina Templar DPS
Stands-in-Danger, Nightblade Saptank
Zalarah, Stamina Dragonknight DPS1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭yes!@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom
Pledges should advance to the groups progress when joining a group in progress. Especially so when using GF.
It helps groups get replacements when someone has to drop.
Additionally, we should have a toggle for joining a group in progress or not. This should be part of the default.1 -
SantaOrc✭✭✭yes!
Of course it will happen. But it will fail and won't be a anything near to a frequent problem. Contrary to the actual freqent problem this topic is about. That's my opinion.vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »
I don't understand the problem. The game can differ between automatic assignments to groups and manual invites. If you have a dungeon running with defeated bosses and invite someone manually, he should not get any gifted progress. If you get someone assigned through the tool, he should. Not sure if i understood your issue, though.SolarCat02 wrote: »
On Xbox, even if you used group finder to start your group, you can invite a friend to fill up that last spot. You do have to wait five minutes or so do for the dungeon to recognize that you have less than four people, of course.
I poll isn't about friend invites, it's only about the group finder tool. Good you mention it again, since people doesn't seem able to read before hitting "i didn't understand so better i press no".And if you think this is still too prone to abuse, you can make it so that you get completion if you join group by queue but not by friend invite...
If this will be implemented without the progress adopting feature, you won't ever get a replacement for leavers.SolarCat02 wrote: »Personally, I think a toggle when queuing that eliminates already-formed groups from your search would be the easiest way to resolve this issue.
Even when it is done additionally, most people would choose not to search for broken groups.
Edited by SantaOrc on 14 October 2016 15:520