PTS Discussion: AP needed to get Alliance War skills to 10

Crown · February 2016

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

When you play in other alliance buff servers it's pretty common to fight that many and that's the point you don't even have to be a Templar in kags to get a quick revive now.

What platform and campaign is that? We tend to see 100+ only during dethrones.

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Do you know how annoying it is when people are reviving in your face when you're already severely outnumbered? You wipe one group then you turn around and see people reviving just to repeat the cycle.

Kill them again. And again. And again. If you are that severely outnumbered, it's the fight that matters, not who is standing at the end. When we have a group of 12 and are fighting 2-3 full raids of 24, we know we can't win, though we have fun trying to take out as many as we can!

CatchMeTrolling · February 2016

Crown wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

When you play in other alliance buff servers it's pretty common to fight that many and that's the point you don't even have to be a Templar in kags to get a quick revive now.

What platform and campaign is that? We tend to see 100+ only during dethrones.

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Do you know how annoying it is when people are reviving in your face when you're already severely outnumbered? You wipe one group then you turn around and see people reviving just to repeat the cycle.

Kill them again. And again. And again. If you are that severely outnumbered, it's the fight that matters, not who is standing at the end. When we have a group of 12 and are fighting 2-3 full raids of 24, we know we can't win, though we have fun trying to take out as many as we can!

I'm on Xbox NA and yeah well we wiped them again & again to the point we eventually ended the fight BUT it was our last imperial keep so we had to win. It's their buff server so we're usually fighting behind our gates.

Nightenhowl · February 2016

The drop might be too low, plus bwb will resemble vet pvp.

J2JMC · February 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

RIP servers when literally everyone is using caltrops and proxy det.

Yeah using these skills is only ok when the elite do it /s

I will laugh my face off when the hardcore guilds and players start calling for nerfs or removal of caltrops and prox det.

"It was OK when only a select few of my high rank AP-rich farming buddies use it but now that every pug can use it, its terrible for the game and the servers. Remove it nowwwwww!"

Basically this lol. No one cried about vigor nerfs until everyone could get it. Availability does not make something overpowered.

If more people having prox det all of a sudden makes people think it's broken I expect it to be promptly removed from the game to ensure a healthy game environment.

Ghostbane · February 2016

The majority of people I fight have Proxi/Caltrops/Alliance Curtains anyway.

There is also a grim satisfaction in knowing all of your lowbie alts have Combat Frenzy II come next patch.

But with this, I don't find it unreasonable to call for a reducement in the Undaunted skill line progression.

Millerman34n · February 2016

All of you haters are ***! What if you didnt have the game for a year plus, or if you olny want to pvp but want good skills like caltrops and vigor? Or if you have 8 characters? Just as you complain about undaunted others complain about getting adult 10? Shop being so *** narrow minded, some people like to play pvp but don't have 5 hours plus a *** day to play so *** you!

Pchela · February 2016

Millerman34n wrote: »

All of you haters are ***! What if you didnt have the game for a year plus, or if you olny want to pvp but want good skills like caltrops and vigor? Or if you have 8 characters? Just as you complain about undaunted others complain about getting adult 10? Shop being so *** narrow minded, some people like to play pvp but don't have 5 hours plus a *** day to play so *** you!

Adult 10... have you reached Adult 1 yet?

PhatGrimReaper · February 2016

Millerman34n wrote: »

All of you haters are ***! What if you didnt have the game for a year plus, or if you olny want to pvp but want good skills like caltrops and vigor? Or if you have 8 characters? Just as you complain about undaunted others complain about getting adult 10? Shop being so *** narrow minded, some people like to play pvp but don't have 5 hours plus a *** day to play so *** you!

What if I want to be a doctor, but don't have 6 years to spend at Medical school!! People are so narrow minded!!! I want to be a doctor.... I seen ER, I knows hows its dones!!!

Sanct16 · February 2016

Would you guys prefer if mages guild 10, fighters guild 10 and undaunted 9 would take over 200 hours each to obtain? 200 hours zombieslaying, 200 hours lorebook collecting? On every single char?

Well, think about it.

ZOS_RichLambert · February 2016

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:

The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.
Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:

Rank 2 – 700
Rank 3 – 8,000
Rank 4 – 38,000
Rank 5 – 98,000
Rank 6 – 188,000
Rank 7 – 308,000
Rank 8 – 488,000
Rank 9 – 758,000
Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Jura23 · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Thanks Rich. This might open eyes of some ppl about AP gains of the player base because some posts about this topic were quite ridiculous lately.

CN_Daniel · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Let me translate:

CN AP Gains so crazy! At least 2, maybe 4 of those I'm betting are my team :-)

_Chaos · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

WHY DOES THIS GET YOUR ATTENTION BUT NOT THE AOE CAP THREAD @ZOS_RichLambert

Zyle · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Great post, I like the comparisons. I was wondering if that 32k AP/hour is averaged with the whole 8 weeks or is it averaged with online time in 8 weeks?

lolo_01b16_ESO · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

[*] Rank 7 – 308,000

I'll still get proxi before lvl 20. And I still think that this is a bad idea.

Skorol007 · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Great post, thanks; it does put things in perspective. I did think the gear was too cheap but looking at it your way it does explain why you the vendor is selling it at that price.

Jura23 · February 2016

bchulettub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Great post, I like the comparisons. I was wondering if that 32k AP/hour is averaged with the whole 8 weeks or is it averaged with online time in 8 weeks?

I think it's obvious he means online time because he says that "top 5" player will earn 200k AP in 6 hours.

Enodoc · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

@ZOS_RichLambert If these are the sort of numbers you want to go for, can't you at least line them up with Alliance Ranks?

Rank 2 – 700 (AR 1, Volunteer I)
Rank 3 – 8,000 (AR 3, Rrcruit I)
Rank 4 – 48,000 (AR 5, Tyro I)
Rank 5 – 88,000 (AR 6, Tyro II)
Rank 6 – 224,000 (AR 8, Legionary II)
Rank 7 – 326,400 (AR 9, Veteran I)
Rank 8 – 456,000 (AR 10, Veteran II)
Rank 9 – 809,600 (AR 12, Corporal II)
Rank 10 – 1,310,400 (AR 14, Sergeant II), or 1,040,000 (AR 13, Sergeant I)

Cuyler · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Great stuff @ZOS_RichLambert! This is going to bring a lot of people back to PvP. Maybe de sync the skill lines from AvA ranks though. That way hard core PvPrs like @Crown will still have their titles for achievement while the skills are more accessible to all.

Emma_Overload · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

This is the best post I've ever read from a ZOS employee. Thank you so much for explaining this issue and your reasoning behind the changes!!!

myrrrorb14_ESO · February 2016

Seems reasonable to me. Can't wait to try it out and see how it works for me!

Thank you for the info.

CatchMeTrolling · February 2016

I find it hard to believe the top 5 ap farmers are only getting 30k+ an hr when you very well can get 100k in an hr farming in a buff server. So where are these numbers coming from? You can get a 20k plus gate tick within a second and on top of that you'll already be fighting behind your gate getting double ap for each kill. So what type of players are you looking at?

Jura23 · February 2016

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

I find it hard to believe the top 5 ap farmers are only getting 30k+ an hr when you very well can get 100k in an hr farming in a buff server. So where are these numbers coming from? You can get a 20k plus gate tick within a second and on top of that you'll already be fighting behind your gate getting double ap for each kill. So what type of players are you looking at?

I think this Rich's post pretty much proves half of these number thrown around are jsut bragging and the other half is compensated by lots o time afk or TS chatting instead of playing etc.

Paulington · February 2016

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

I find it hard to believe the top 5 ap farmers are only getting 30k+ an hr when you very well can get 100k in an hr farming in a buff server. So where are these numbers coming from? You can get a 20k plus gate tick within a second and on top of that you'll already be fighting behind your gate getting double ap for each kill. So what type of players are you looking at?

Having a bit of experience here it's very likely ZOS have a data management platform where they can go, type in "Top AP earners (rate) in the past eight weeks" and it will query their user database and spit out the answer. These kind of metrics are invaluable and I am sure ZOS has them too since they know average CP/percentiles etc. No-one knows these numbers better than they do.

Let me say that 34k/hour average is really hard to sustain. Assuming 16 hours on, 8 hours off and only playing five days a week that's actually an average of 71,400 AP/hour. Sustaining those kind of numbers is really, really hard let alone for every single hour you are online all week.

Glad that these numbers are being decided based upon existing metrics and they have done a good job of it too. This means the average PvP player will need to do ~30 days of PvP to unlock Proxy for example, a far more achievable goal.

CatchMeTrolling · February 2016

Jura23 wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

I find it hard to believe the top 5 ap farmers are only getting 30k+ an hr when you very well can get 100k in an hr farming in a buff server. So where are these numbers coming from? You can get a 20k plus gate tick within a second and on top of that you'll already be fighting behind your gate getting double ap for each kill. So what type of players are you looking at?

I think this Rich's post pretty much proves half of these number thrown around are jsut bragging and the other half is compensated by lots o time afk or TS chatting instead of playing etc.

Something is off about them to me lol wish I had the time to prove these numbers wrong

Ishammael · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

@ZOS_RichLambert -- this is a great post explaining the reasoning behind a change that made many players scratch their heads. Much appreciated. Another good example of this type of communication is Forward Camps. Their returning functionality almost exactly mirrors discussions from these very forums.

Would you be willing to make similar posts about other topics? For example:
1. AoE caps.
2. Dynamic Ultimate
3. Zerg vs Small scale play, i.e. intended playstyles for Cyrodiil
4. Balance Changes
5. etc.

In the TG patch there are a slew of balances changes made to each class that simply don't make sense at face value. I plan on doing a post about DragonKnights as soon as I have enough time (work is preventing me). I may enlist @Joy_Division for help doing a templar post.

Cheers!

Cinnamon_Spider · February 2016

Hopefully this change entices more people into Cyrodiil, or it will become more of a ghost town as PVErs get their skills unlocked and leave.

LearnThis · February 2016

@Cinnamon_Spider I agree with your comment.

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

Hopefully this change entices more people into Cyrodiil, or it will become more of a ghost town as PVErs get their skills unlocked and leave.

Although, I know there are others out there like me that will have more fun enjoying pvp without stressing about earning a skill or not having a skill that others are running around with. I like the direction of people being able to jump into this game and compete with each other sooner than a year or two later of grinding. I do not want anything taken away from those that have already earned and put in their time. In fact, keep away the titles but just do the skills. Someone else mentioned this and I agree that would be fair. Any CP change or PvP change should not ever hurt or take away from those that have already earned it. I am excited for the change because I am one of those players that loves to have alternative choices. So, I have six veteran characters and I want to play on them all at different times. This way each one can compete regularly without completely ignoring another because I want to unlock a skill.

Joy_Division · February 2016

@ZOS_RichLambert

Thank you very much for the detailed explanation regarding Zos's thinking in the matter and the accompanying data. As others have noted, this is exactly the type of communication that would go a long way to helping us players better understand the reasoning behind changes that stir up a lot of emotion. This shows ZoS cares what we think!

@Ishammael is right that there are enough changes, or more accurately, lack of changes with respect to class balance that is difficult to reconcile with so many people asking and agreeing that certain stuff is needed. For instance, who has argued on these forums (or anywhere) that the DK Dragon Blood wasn't lacking (especially in PvP)? This hints, incorrectly, that ZoS does not care what we think.

A similar post that would help explain why certain themes have persisted in ESO through multiple patches dedicated to balance, would help us understand the rationale as to why those gameplay elements have not changed.

Ish: I'm going to wait until the next incremental PTS patch. ZoS could have adopted a conservative approach to just test the waters. The next set of patch notes will indicate how much our feedback is being considered in this process.

Sanct16 · February 2016

@ZOS_RichLambert

THANKS! Awesome post and really great to see ZOS communicating with players.

CN_Daniel wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Some quick notes as to why we’re making the changes to the AP required for the Assault/Support skill lines:
The top 5 AP earners worldwide, over the past 8 weeks are averaging 32k AP/hour. This means it takes roughly 212 hours of PvP to reach rank 10 in the skill lines for them.

Over the past 8 weeks, the average PvP player earns ~10k AP/day. This means it takes roughly 692 days of PvP for them to reach rank 10 in the skill lines.

We want these skill lines to be a lot more accessible than what I noted above. We made some changes to how AP is awarded and that will help some, but it’s not enough - we need to reduce the amount of AP required as well. That being said, the numbers that are currently on PTS are too low and will be updated in next week’s PTS build. The new numbers will be:
Rank 2 – 700

Rank 3 – 8,000

Rank 4 – 38,000

Rank 5 – 98,000

Rank 6 – 188,000

Rank 7 – 308,000

Rank 8 – 488,000

Rank 9 – 758,000

Rank 10 – 1,158,000

(Note: this is the cumulative AP, so to reach rank 10 you need to earn 1,158,000 AP)

With these changes the “Top 5” group will be able to unlock all AvA skills in roughly 36 hours, while the average player will take roughly 116 days. It’s still a long haul effort for the average player, but it’s at least in the realm of possible for them now.

Also, while I’m on the topic of AP earning, we used this same data to help set the AP cost for the items that Adhazabi Aba-daro sells. (Cyrodiil rare item merchant) The “Top 5” group will be able to earn 200k AP in about 6 hours, while the average player will take about 20 days.

Let me translate:

CN AP Gains so crazy! At least 2, maybe 4 of those I'm betting are my team :-)

Well being Top 5 AP earner mostly comes down to who plays the most total hours as you can see on the low AP/hour average.