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ARE U HAPPY NOW ZOS IS DOING SOMETHING***Interview With Miat*** Lets Talk Add Ons, Cheating and Q/A

JonnytheKing
JonnytheKing
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If you Have any Question for Miat leave them in the comments of the video.
https://youtu.be/fOVgRcfoes0
TWITCH jtk__gaming
GM of Elder-Skills DC PVP Guild NA
Main Toons
MagSorc
MagTemp
  • Shadzilla
    Shadzilla
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    How do you sleep at night? Lie on your side? Lie on your back? Lie on your stomach?
    Edited by Shadzilla on October 17, 2017 12:48AM
  • Aliyavana
    Aliyavana
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    how do you justify creating an addon to counter a playstyle that is part of the game mechanics because its "not fun to play against"
  • NyassaV
    NyassaV
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    Interesting... Still cheating... But interesting
    Flawless Conqueror ~ Grand Overlord
    She/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info
  • Malic
    Malic
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    The accent is perfect for this guy all things considered

    I love it.

  • SHADOW2KK
    SHADOW2KK
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    Hmmmm, did not watch it, did not remotely care too, I completely agree with @DDuke and many others in the essence in that PvP Alerts is basically a hack, and it is really pathetic that so many players, some of which I know, use it and think it is ok.

    And for all the wannabe hackers who think this crutch crap is ok and tries to flame me, good luck with that, right and wrong, this garbage is wrong, end of story.

    L2P properly with those of us who fight with honour in PvP or duelling or BG, or gtfo.
    Once I was a lamb, playing in a green field. Then the wolves came. Now I am an eagle and I fly in a different universe.

    Been taking heads since TeS 3 Morrowind..

    Been enjoying PvP tears since 2014

    LvL 50 - Dragon Knight EP [PC-EU] = Illuvutar = Ex The Wabbajack = (Stam DK)
    LvL 50 - Night Blade DC [PC-EU] = Legendary Blades = Evil Ninja/Dueller = (StamBlade)
    LvL 50 - Sorcerer DC [PC-EU] = Daemon Lord = (Mag Sorc)
    LvL 50 - Dragon Knight DC [PC-EU] = Khal-Bladez = (Mag DK)
    LvL 50 - Dragon Knight DC [PC-EU] = Tenakha Khan = (Stam DK)
    LvL 50 - Templar DC [PC-EU]] = Blades The Disgruntled = (Stamplar)
    LvL 50 - Night Blade DC [PC-EU] = Ghost Blades = (Assassin)
    LvL 50 - Night Blade DC [PC-EU] = Malekith The Shadow = (Mag NB)
    LvL 50 - Warden DC [PC-EU] = Crimson Blades = (Stamden)

    Guild Master of The Bringers Of The Storm.
    Harrods


    Member Of The Old Guard
    PC Closed Betas 2013

    PC Mastah Race

    Anook Page anook.com/shadow2kk

    Been playing since Beta and Early Access

  • D0PAMINE
    D0PAMINE
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    Cool thread. Still cheating.
  • Chronicburn
    Chronicburn
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    Cheaters honestly don't bother me ... I barely have enough time to play, let alone worry about them ... just my 2c

    Add Auction house
    STOP ALL NERFS
    Non-instanced housing
    Add jewelcrafting to sets

    These all are more important
  • wenchmore420b14_ESO
    wenchmore420b14_ESO
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    I watched it and listened to what he had to say.
    I have several friends and quite a few guild mates who write add ons.
    Bottom line to this, IMO, is:
    Just because you CAN make a add on like this doesn't mean you HAVE to make it.
    Scrupples and Morals should be considered. This is still cheating. It doesn't matter that ZoS left that area of code open, you don't have to, nor should you, monopolize on it at the expense of and to grief other players.
    Drakon Koryn~Oryndill, Rogue~Mage,- CP ~Doesn't matter any more
    NA / PC Beta Member since Nov 2013
    GM~Conclave-of-Shadows, EP Social Guild, ~Proud member of: The Wandering Merchants, Phoenix Rising, Imperial Trade Union & Celestials of Nirn
    Sister Guilds with: Coroner's Report, Children of Skyrim, Sunshine Daydream, Tamriel Fisheries, Knights Arcanum and more
    "Not All Who Wander are Lost"
    #MOREHOUSINGSLOTS
    “When the people that can make the company more successful are sales and marketing people, they end up running the companies. The product people get driven out of the decision making forums, and the companies forget what it means to make great products.”

    _Steve Jobs (The Lost Interview)
  • Unstable.Pixel
    Unstable.Pixel
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    I swear to drunk i'm not god
  • Samadhi
    Samadhi
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    The video thumbnail said he explained why the addon is not cheating
    but the only real claim he provided was that it is not cheating because ZOS has not made it impossible to access yet
    which is basically the argument exploiters use with regards to exploits

    so when he goes on to insist that there are no cheaters in eso
    it is difficult to take his point seriously

    am ambivalent with regards to whether or not the addon is cheating
    but, ultimately, would like to see a structure where the interface is more in line with the artistic representations in the game
    if targeting, a player, it should be perfectly acceptable to be receiving notifications on when they start and finish casting
    since that is portrayed by the visuals in game
    having the notifications as a product of other players casting while unobserved is out of line with the game

    ESO has enormous visual telegraphs for skills in game,
    with the greater the danger of the skill having higher notification before contact
    but ESO also makes a point of hiding a number of those same telegraphs in particular situations
    at which point they 'should' be hidden from interface notifications as well

    providing greater visibility to visible telegraphs is a beneficial thing for the game,
    and has potentially made playing more manageable for individuals with disabilities
    providing them with a means to play at the level of those who do not face such difficulties

    providing visibility to non-visible telegraphs is exploiting the availability of code
    to perform functions over and above those that are available to gamers on unmodified platforms
    and exists to provide a means to play over and above the level available in the vanilla experience

    my concern is that the coding of the game does not sufficiently distinguish between hidden an visible states
    such that the only 'fix' for the depth of the addon
    will be to severely limit the availability of all such combat information
    rather than just what is distinguished by being performed in a hidden state
    "If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion." -- the 14th Dalai Lama
    Wisdom is doing Now that which benefits you later.
  • Sheezabeast
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    Ya I didn't buy his whole no cheaters in ESO rant.
    Grand Master Crafter, Beta baby who grew with the game. PC/NA. @Sheezabeast if you have crafting needs!
  • Ackwalan
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    Wow, the first sentence he speaks makes him sound like an egotistical jerk.
  • AzraelKrieg
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    Ackwalan wrote: »
    Wow, the first sentence he speaks makes him sound like an egotistical jerk.

    Anybody that creates an addon to counter a type of play they don't like is pretty much exactly that.
    Gold Dragons Guildmaster PC-NACR2000+
    Kalthar Wolf-Brother – EP Templar - 50 Maeli Valen - EP NB - 50Naps-During-Trials – EP Templar - 50Rulnakh - EP Sorc - 50Azrael Krieg - EP NB – 50Uvithasa Telvanni – EP DK – 50More-Tail - EP Warden - 50Narile Galen - EP Sorc - 50Bone Soldier - EP Necro - 50Naps-During-Trails - EP Necro - 50
  • Publius_Scipio
    Publius_Scipio
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    Miat's addon is NOT cheating. ZOS is the league here, ZOS are the refs, ZOS sets the rules. If Miat's addon is allowed with ZOS's blessing, then it can in no way be cheating. Those that are calling it cheating are misunderstanding.

    I don't like Miat's addon. Not because I think it's cheating but because I believe it gives the player using it an advantage over one that isn't using it. I don't believe 3rd party addons/programs should give players advantages (especially in PvP). I just don't see how using it can be considered not being given an advantage. First, all addons are created for some benefit, some advantage to using it. No one uses addons that hinder their play or take away from the game. Miat's (specifically for the purpose of PvP) gives the player a crystal clear cue of an incoming projectile even before the projectile (poison injection, crystal frag, etc) has been fired off. The addon really diminishes the need for awareness in certain (but not few) situations. A player not using the addon must rely on a greater amount of awareness. Also, there was a time when Miat's addon was alerting the player using it of enemies in stealth around him/her, without their knowledge that they were known to be in the area.

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion. This is just mine.

    Edit: I definitely think ZOS seriously needs to revisit all the API and make some decisions. I always say this when in these threads but I will say it again. Way back when, back when Mr. Paul Sage (Tamriel still remembers you old friend!) called for all API to be closed off to players.... He understood, he knew what would/could happen down the road. I think that says a lot about the whole topic of addons and whatever else may be out there.
    Edited by Publius_Scipio on October 16, 2017 4:18AM
  • Shardan4968
    Shardan4968
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    I don't like Miat's addon. Not because I think it's cheating but because I believe it gives the player using it an advantage over one that isn't using it. I don't believe 3rd party addons/programs should give players advantages (especially in PvP).

    Isn't it definition of cheating? I believe that ZOS misundersdand something.
    PC/EU
  • ThePrinceOfBargains
    ThePrinceOfBargains
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    I don’t use this add-on because I don’t really do PVP, but if ZOS has not gone on the record and declared this to be cheating, then it’s not a cheating. Doesn’t matter how people personally feel about it.
  • Publius_Scipio
    Publius_Scipio
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    I don't like Miat's addon. Not because I think it's cheating but because I believe it gives the player using it an advantage over one that isn't using it. I don't believe 3rd party addons/programs should give players advantages (especially in PvP).

    Isn't it definition of cheating? I believe that ZOS misundersdand something.

    Can only be cheating if the purveyors (ZOS) of the game say it is. Whether they officially say it in the forums, or in the terms of service. Miat’s addon in particular was apparently reviewed by ZOS sometime last year I think. There is no infraction of the rules by using Miat’s addon as far as I know.

    I still believe (not sure how anyone can argue otherwise) that Miat’s addon gives the player using it an advantage over someone not using it. It’s like professional sports. There are a lot of rules in the books regarding PED and steroid use. You use it you are cheating and there are consequences. In ESO you can be on juice and TRT but not be breaking any rules.
  • FloppyTouch
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    Ofc it's not cheating ZoS allows it.

    But it's wrong gives an unfair advantage to anyone not using it. Creating an addOn that give away location and let's you know when a snipe is coming before it's shot is wrong. You should feel bad for making this and anyone that is using it is just as much in the wrong. Stuff like this makes me happy I switch to xb.
  • Sneaky-Snurr
    Sneaky-Snurr
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    TheMaster wrote: »
    I don’t use this add-on because I don’t really do PVP, but if ZOS has not gone on the record and declared this to be cheating, then it’s not a cheating. Doesn’t matter how people personally feel about it.
    @TheMaster
    You should PvP more often and you'll know how much of an advantage the addon offers the user.
    I've fought a lot of the addon users (friends and foe alike) and they said Miat's help a lot with the visual & graphical cues so sometimes it's too much and they're relatively vet players too.

    And no, I'm not complaining. Just saying that based on my experience, it does offer an edge over players who don't use it.
    The Order of the Shadows: Nightmare
      EP CP810 Nightblade
      AD CP810 Templar
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      AD Lvl 25 Sorceror
      DC Lvl 23 Nightblade
    {PC•NA•no-CP Ravenwatch}

    Shadow hide you. -Unknown
    There is no clean fight in a war. -Shun Izaki
  • NyassaV
    NyassaV
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    Miat's addon is NOT cheating. ZOS is the league here, ZOS are the refs, ZOS sets the rules. If Miat's addon is allowed with ZOS's blessing, then it can in no way be cheating. Those that are calling it cheating are misunderstanding.

    I don't like Miat's addon. Not because I think it's cheating but because I believe it gives the player using it an advantage over one that isn't using it. I don't believe 3rd party addons/programs should give players advantages (especially in PvP). I just don't see how using it can be considered not being given an advantage. First, all addons are created for some benefit, some advantage to using it. No one uses addons that hinder their play or take away from the game. Miat's (specifically for the purpose of PvP) gives the player a crystal clear cue of an incoming projectile even before the projectile (poison injection, crystal frag, etc) has been fired off. The addon really diminishes the need for awareness in certain (but not few) situations. A player not using the addon must rely on a greater amount of awareness. Also, there was a time when Miat's addon was alerting the player using it of enemies in stealth around him/her, without their knowledge that they were known to be in the area.

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion. This is just mine.

    Edit: I definitely think ZOS seriously needs to revisit all the API and make some decisions. I always say this when in these threads but I will say it again. Way back when, back when Mr. Paul Sage (Tamriel still remembers you old friend!) called for all API to be closed off to players.... He understood, he knew what would/could happen down the road. I think that says a lot about the whole topic of addons and whatever else may be out there.

    Oh you're the guy always raging in Cyro zone chat who no one repsects and is always flaming or whatever. No it's cheating. The lawyer side in me sees your point but the good person in me says it's cheating
    Flawless Conqueror ~ Grand Overlord
    She/Her ~ PC/NA | I record things for fun and for info
  • Ackwalan
    Ackwalan
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    I don't like Miat's addon. Not because I think it's cheating but because I believe it gives the player using it an advantage over one that isn't using it. I don't believe 3rd party addons/programs should give players advantages (especially in PvP).

    Isn't it definition of cheating? I believe that ZOS misundersdand something.

    Can only be cheating if the purveyors (ZOS) of the game say it is. Whether they officially say it in the forums, or in the terms of service. Miat’s addon in particular was apparently reviewed by ZOS sometime last year I think. There is no infraction of the rules by using Miat’s addon as far as I know.

    I still believe (not sure how anyone can argue otherwise) that Miat’s addon gives the player using it an advantage over someone not using it. It’s like professional sports. There are a lot of rules in the books regarding PED and steroid use. You use it you are cheating and there are consequences. In ESO you can be on juice and TRT but not be breaking any rules.

    ZOS never came out and said if miats add-on was cheating or not. They said they were looking into it, then never mentioned it again. ZOS did change the API that affected the add-on, but never gave it an official pass.

    The problem here, is that ZOS is terrible at communicating what is acceptable and what isn't. They really don't want to talk about cheating, especially when there is no easy fix. ZOS could change the API to completely nullify this add-on, but that would affect lots if not most all other add-ons, creating even more disruption.

    So it really looks like ZOS is just going to take half steps, and hope for the best. Leaving people with an attitude of "if I can get away with it, then it's not cheating".

  • Skitttles
    Skitttles
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    Hollery wrote: »
    Oh you're the guy always raging in Cyro zone chat who no one repsects and is always flaming or whatever. No it's cheating. The lawyer side in me sees your point but the good person in me says it's cheating

    Respect the Scipio.

    Skittles | DC Stem Sok and sumtimes Nertbled
  • rustic_potato
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    I like how people bring up honor when they fight against people using addons. Some people fight for fun and some fight to win and some fight just to fight.

    If there is something that gives you an advantage in the fight there is no reason to use it as long as it is withing the rules of engagement. The rules here involves the API that allows such addons.

    Say player 1 goes to a keep looking for a fight with player 2. 10 players of player 2's group gang up and kill player 1. Player 1 cries dishonorlable combat but it is just valid battle tactics. Why take a fight that you don't know that you won't win. The addon is the same way if I get an advantage that allows me an advantage withing the rules of engagement there is no reason to not use it. It is a video game, there is no honor or pride. Just objectives that need to be taken and the most efficient way of doing it.

    That is my thoughts on this matter.
    I play how I want to.


  • Qbiken
    Qbiken
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    This thread won´t end well........ O.O
  • Jaimeh
    Jaimeh
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    Regardless of whether this addon is exploitative or cheating, I’ve always been against using it because I think it diminishes a big part of PvP: having a reactive playstyle, and being able to quickly recover from unexpected attacks. Knowing when invisible players are around, and more importantly, knowing when an attack is incoming, even when you’re not actually seeing the player charging the attack, eradicates the need to learn to be able to recover from unanticipated assaults, not to mention rendering certain playstyles obsolete. If a ganker can burst me down in two seconds, then so be it. I will either make a build to counteract that playstyle, if it bothers me so much, or make a NB myself, and join in. Last night people in chat were discussing about having an addon that automatically activates synergies, and although it’s a hyperbole, all these things make me wonder what’s next - having an addon that plays the game for us? :sweat_smile:
  • zaria
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    Cheaters honestly don't bother me ... I barely have enough time to play, let alone worry about them ... just my 2c

    Add Auction house
    STOP ALL NERFS
    Non-instanced housing
    Add jewelcrafting to sets

    These all are more important
    How should non instanced housing work in any remotely plausible way? remember its one megaserver with more than 100.000 active players on.
    Grinding just make you go in circles.
    Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.
  • Riejael
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    As I've said it before. Its not cheating unless you can be banned for it. Lets do a bit of a test.

    I have installed and utilized the Miat PVP addon.

    http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1545-MiatsPVPAlerts.html

    The above statement is either true or not. But that is irrelevant as a statement such as that can be damning evidence for a report. In addition I have posted a link to the download of the addon. I will post a reply in about 3 days time. I'll let it go for at least about 60-72hrs.

    If I am not banned. It is not cheating. If I am, then well then you won't hear from me and you'll have your answer.

    This will settle the debate once and for all. So make sure to report this post for cheating to test that theory. We'll let a moderator decide if this addon is legit or not.

    Also if you do NOT report this post. Then you concede that the addon is legit.

    This puts everyone in an interesting position. If I am wrong. I will be banned or suspended (or at least have my posted edited by a mod). If I am right, those reporting could face action against them for a false report.

    Choose wisely. I am willing to put the forum account on line, is everyone else willing to do the same? My only other request is that everyone refrains from trolling, ad hominem attacks, and other forms of simple bickering. No matter which side of the argument you are on, accept the results of the test. Everyone in agreement? Then let's proceed.

    Any Mod reading this should consider that this post is not in violation of any forum rule other than possibly posting a link to an addon that is not allowed. You will have to determine if said addon is actually in offense to the rules. I personally believe that the addon is in total compliance with the EULA, Code of Conduct , and all policies governing both in game and forum conduct. If you find that it is not, then I will fully accept the decision of that authority.

    Let us put this issue to rest.
  • zaria
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    Ofc it's not cheating ZoS allows it.

    But it's wrong gives an unfair advantage to anyone not using it. Creating an addOn that give away location and let's you know when a snipe is coming before it's shot is wrong. You should feel bad for making this and anyone that is using it is just as much in the wrong. Stuff like this makes me happy I switch to xb.
    This ZoS could simply say that it was not allowed to use that function in PvP.
    Rather I would disable that API call in Cyrodil. Or then target is sneaking.
    The call of an wind up to attack is very nice for boss mechanisms and I think its the same here.
    Grinding just make you go in circles.
    Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.
  • agegarton
    agegarton
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    This thread defines the term “first world problems”. I’m sick and tired of these “cheater” posts.

    I have been playing this game since the beta. I have logged more online hours than I’m prepared to post (you know..... in case my wife sees it), but I’m pretty clear that I have logged more hours than the vast majority of players. I have completed every single quest several times across about 16 alts and four accounts, spent huge amounts of time in PVP in Cyrodiil and in the Imperial City and Sewers, and I farm mats and resources for some pretty major trade.

    I can safely say that not once - not one single time - have I been bothered by a bot, a Zerg, an add on user, a gold seller, or any so-called “cheat”. That’s not to say I haven’t seen all of the above, but as a grown-up I know when to say “it’s a game” and just move on. Experience not ruined.

    Perhaps if you all spent more time just playing the game than whining like spoilt schoolgirls on these forums, you’d have a better time in Tamriel.
  • elijafire
    elijafire
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    If you Have any Question for Miat leave them in the comments of the video.
    https://youtu.be/fOVgRcfoes0

    Doesn't matter if it is cheating or not. If you play PvP it is absolutely necessary to use macros and addons in order to have an even playing field.

    One of my favorites is charge--> light attack --> Upercut ---> (ani cancel) Reverse Slice x 2 (using macro slice) BOOM dead in 3 seconds or less ;)
This discussion has been closed.