@olsborg Yet again this doesn't call for a nerf to helping hands mate. You cannot tell me that a 4.4k-4.5k igneous shield that gives 5% of your max stamina and at 40k that is 2k stamina is something so insane when you are using skills that are costing that amount if not more and further more yeah I play PvP and I'm not sure what you're rank is but I'm a Legate Grade 2 almost Gen so I've played a lot of PvP (might I add entirely solo unless I'm emperor). I'm a Redguard Stam DK so I do not understand or I cannot comprehend how you think this nerf is needed or in any shape or form fair.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
@olsborg
Yeah as a person who has played DragonKnight and only that class and who has it listed in his Sig I'll definitely disagree with this claim because I find it rather absurd and misplaced. I've been playing DK since craglorn came out on PC and only that class lol..
@Zarkeson
Patched lol Please buddy this wasn't even involving the DK in the first place rather the armor leeching. It's been patched the leeching plate B.S especially since the nerf to proc sets so yet again Try again with the "That one time at band camp"
The reason for the cost reduction is because they're destroying the Champion Point line the Magician, which reduces spell costs. It's gone. It's going to mess up my build badly.Lava whip: Doesn't need a reduction, it's fine where it is and I play both versions of this class and yet again you have yet to address the soft CC issue ...
Consider the Following:I honestly have to agree with the Zen Team's nerfs to DK. Good job team.
- Dragon Knights are more leaned as tanks. DPS should not be their go.
- The ARE "unkillable" DKs out there. Twenty people hitting a DK that never runs out of stamina or magicka; infinite block. Health never goes down until there are at least thirty people.
- A lot of DKs spam igneous shield infinitely, making them deathless.
- Helping hands give DKs extra blocking fuel + ultimate attribute refund = infinite block, health.
Princess_Asgari wrote: »Too much was changed at once for DK. No passive regen or reduced cost and now another battle roar nerf on top of healing nerfs.
RIP Ariana Kishi
@olsborg Yet again this doesn't call for a nerf to helping hands mate. You cannot tell me that a 4.4k-4.5k igneous shield that gives 5% of your max stamina and at 40k that is 2k stamina is something so insane when you are using skills that are costing that amount if not more and further more yeah I play PvP and I'm not sure what you're rank is but I'm a Legate Grade 2 almost Gen so I've played a lot of PvP (might I add entirely solo unless I'm emperor). I'm a Redguard Stam DK so I do not understand or I cannot comprehend how you think this nerf is needed or in any shape or form fair.
Agree to disagree, the helping hands and redguard nerfs are imo understandable, and I play a redguard.
Nothing to agree to disagree it's math...
OrphanHelgen wrote: »The sad part is, warden have major mending as a pure passive. But ye, ign shield and vigor too OP
FloppyTouch wrote: »When you have people like fengrush going to ZoS hq to help with balance this is want you get no nerf to Stam sorc but huge nerfs to any class they had issues fighting.
I'm very upset myself I'm just going to farm now. Already cancel my pre order like ZoS even cares but it's the best I can do.
This hurts Stam dk a lot but also mdk too is a huge nerf to dk in general.
D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »@olsborg
Yeah we have minor mending via dragon's blood then again you're missing it. You're stating the minor mending so you expect every DK to slot dragon's blood then combine that with igneous shield which would top around 8k magicka. Stam DKs aren't going to destroy their resource pool just like that especially in PvP and PvE.
How in the world is helping hands over performing even at 50k stamina which would come out to 2,500 stamina at the cost of 4.4k-4.5k magicka at that point you'd get back 5k when you spend nearly 10k magicka. Even with that you would need to sacrifice a lot and gear it to that hulking set that provides max stamina so yet again it's impossible that it's over performing as you stated.
I might agree that isolated on its own, helping hands is only strong, not overpeforming, but put into a minmax build with a heavy armor stamdk who's also a redguard you could play a noregen build but still end up with better sustain then a medium armor regen build with 2500 stamregen. This is why ZOS nerfs the resource returns from passives, sure they might have overdone it, as usual, but some kindof nerf was needed.
Yet a stamsorc who can build completely on damage remains untouched. Also, since when do we dedicate nerfs and buffs based on min/max builds?
So why not add in min/max sorc whose loaded up to 50k magicka; why are his shields not nerfed? Something needs to be done about that but clearly its over looked and changes are made on classes and skills that are perfectly balanced.
The problem wasn't the DK passives it was idiotic sets like Hulking Draugr and necropotence for magicka counterparts etc.
Quit nerfing classes when the real problem is broken gear addition.
IzakiBrotherSs wrote: »D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »@olsborg
Yeah we have minor mending via dragon's blood then again you're missing it. You're stating the minor mending so you expect every DK to slot dragon's blood then combine that with igneous shield which would top around 8k magicka. Stam DKs aren't going to destroy their resource pool just like that especially in PvP and PvE.
How in the world is helping hands over performing even at 50k stamina which would come out to 2,500 stamina at the cost of 4.4k-4.5k magicka at that point you'd get back 5k when you spend nearly 10k magicka. Even with that you would need to sacrifice a lot and gear it to that hulking set that provides max stamina so yet again it's impossible that it's over performing as you stated.
I might agree that isolated on its own, helping hands is only strong, not overpeforming, but put into a minmax build with a heavy armor stamdk who's also a redguard you could play a noregen build but still end up with better sustain then a medium armor regen build with 2500 stamregen. This is why ZOS nerfs the resource returns from passives, sure they might have overdone it, as usual, but some kindof nerf was needed.
Yet a stamsorc who can build completely on damage remains untouched. Also, since when do we dedicate nerfs and buffs based on min/max builds?
So why not add in min/max sorc whose loaded up to 50k magicka; why are his shields not nerfed? Something needs to be done about that but clearly its over looked and changes are made on classes and skills that are perfectly balanced.
The problem wasn't the DK passives it was idiotic sets like Hulking Draugr and necropotence for magicka counterparts etc.
Quit nerfing classes when the real problem is broken gear addition.
You think? Heavy Armor stam sorc relied heaviliy on Warlord. Now, that's gone. Unless you wanna Crit Rush > Dark Deal > Dizzy Swing > Dark Deal > etc. you ain't gonna be untouched as a Stam sorc.
Yeah... Those sorcs are gonna run out of magicka pretty quickly because shields now cost 16% more than they used to. That's huge. you aren't going to spam shields for days at all.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
WillhelmBlack wrote: »At least mag DK got a small boost to Stam return. That should compensate for some of the block nerf.
I must say I'm not particularly disappointed with any of the nerfs to each of the classes but I can say that Stamina Templar has taken the biggest nerf, not Stam DK.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
OrphanHelgen wrote: »The sad part is, warden have major mending as a pure passive. But ye, ign shield and vigor too OP
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
@WillhelmBlackWillhelmBlack wrote: »At least mag DK got a small boost to Stam return. That should compensate for some of the block nerf.
I must say I'm not particularly disappointed with any of the nerfs to each of the classes but I can say that Stamina Templar has taken the biggest nerf, not Stam DK.
Yeah see that's a perspective of not playing Stamina DK and shouldn't justify these changes as being 'fair'. What is being done is no sustain for Stamina DK whatsoever, sure Mag DK gets some sustain boost but remember now you lose major mending overall and with that goes your survivability. Heck if these changes go through I cannot play my Mag DK as a healer in trials or dungeons anymore since I won't get that 6 second boost reliably since igneous shield's shield is so bloody lackluster it'll drop when a chicken hits it.
You're also wrong Stam DK has taken the biggest hit as we've been consistently nerf'd while Stamplar got some improvements last patch. If you feel otherwise feel free to come cite me some quotes because I just checked and didn't see a damn improvement for my Stamina DK.
WillhelmBlack wrote: »Honestly, you're kicking off too early. We have a few weeks of PTS ahead. Stam DK was a massive problem in PvP in regards to their infinite sustain. They'll now have to think of a way of sustaining instead of just stacking 40-50k stamina and let the class do all of its sustaining for them. For PvE, I think you need to catch up on a few Youtube videos, there are many unkillable Stam DK builds out there.
It might be that the nerfs are completely overkill. We'll find out very soon.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
WillhelmBlack wrote: »@WillhelmBlackWillhelmBlack wrote: »At least mag DK got a small boost to Stam return. That should compensate for some of the block nerf.
I must say I'm not particularly disappointed with any of the nerfs to each of the classes but I can say that Stamina Templar has taken the biggest nerf, not Stam DK.
Yeah see that's a perspective of not playing Stamina DK and shouldn't justify these changes as being 'fair'. What is being done is no sustain for Stamina DK whatsoever, sure Mag DK gets some sustain boost but remember now you lose major mending overall and with that goes your survivability. Heck if these changes go through I cannot play my Mag DK as a healer in trials or dungeons anymore since I won't get that 6 second boost reliably since igneous shield's shield is so bloody lackluster it'll drop when a chicken hits it.
You're also wrong Stam DK has taken the biggest hit as we've been consistently nerf'd while Stamplar got some improvements last patch. If you feel otherwise feel free to come cite me some quotes because I just checked and didn't see a damn improvement for my Stamina DK.
Honestly, you're kicking off too early. We have a few weeks of PTS ahead. Stam DK was a massive problem in PvP in regards to their infinite sustain. They'll now have to think of a way of sustaining instead of just stacking 40-50k stamina and let the class do all of its sustaining for them. For PvE, I think you need to catch up on a few Youtube videos, there are many unkillable Stam DK builds out there.
It might be that the nerfs are completely overkill. We'll find out very soon.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell