Have they stopped banning people for stupid stuff yet?

Azurephoenix999 · April 11

Been away from the game for several years at this point, and I'm extremely hesitant to come back because after various incidents I've heard about I'm extremely paranoid about further investing my time and energy into this game only to get banned for something ridiculous.

Remember when an entire raid group got axed because they reported a bug they found by accident?

And then there's all the people who've gotten in trouble for mildly suggestive character names in a game that contains the Lusty Argonian Maid, heavily features Molag Bal (the daedric lord of you-know-what), and is rated M.

I've invested tons of time and money into this game in the past, but it's been ages. I'm considering returning, but my biggest fear regarding that is that once I get comfortable, some mod on a power trip will decide "screw you in particular" and my account will get banned. Countless hours and unknown quantities of money completely and fully down the drain.

So I have to know: Have they stopped banning people for stupid stuff or is it still happening?

randconfig · April 11

I wish I could say yes, but no. I've been punished for making a circumcision joke.

I'd rather allow a community tribunal system for voting in determining whether a player should be punished for what they say in zone chat, instead of an AI flagging words and the strict interpretation of the ToS being applied by customer support to double down on the punishment, despite the game clearly having adult themes throughout it, including the naughty bondage scene in the Ebony Flask Inn basement, violent assassination quest lines, Nord's calling you a "fancy man" and asking if you've "fallen on a sword lately fancy man?" derogatory towards LGBTQ+ community, dark elves treating khajiit and argonians as slaves, being able to drink, Nords being alcoholics, etc.

And that's just the surface, there are numerous examples in the game... Hypocrisy and censorship of non-hateful non-harassing speech are two of my biggest pet peeves, and for a private company to be able to take back products you literally paid for, it's beyond disgusting.

That said, I still love the game and the community, so for me the pros outweigh the cons. My best advice: just use Discord to communicate, and don't participate in zone chat.

Azurephoenix999 · April 11

randconfig wrote: »

That makes sense. Using Discord does seem like the best way to avoid that.

With regards to what character names are and are not appropriate, is there a properly defined code as to what you can't do, or is it just "don't be rude" with a mod deciding on their own interpretation as to whether or not it's okay?

Jolter · April 11

Character names seem to be very hit or miss. I've seen some bad ones, but then some non-offensive names get banned. For example, I had a friend who had to change his gamertag because somehow pooperscooper is offensive? The guy is retired and using to scoop up dog poop in a previous job.

randconfig · April 11

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

That makes sense. Using Discord does seem like the best way to avoid that.

With regards to what character names are and are not appropriate, is there a properly defined code as to what you can't do, or is it just "don't be rude" with a mod deciding on their own interpretation as to whether or not it's okay?

There are no clear examples, and a strict interpretation of the ToS would cause a lot of false positives punishing players who unintentionally make names that other players may interpret as a hateful slur. Meaning the system relies on you using intuition to know what is and is not offensive.

I think ZOS knows this, which is why it's seemingly not as common to see a thread about a player being punished for their IGN.

My best advice is compare your name to slur words and if it's one or two letters off from being the slur word, obviously don't use it. Also appeal the punishment if you genuinely did not intend for your name to be similar to a slur, explain what the name means if it's like an acronym you made up, or how you decided on your name. If you're genuine and not obviously trolling, I think you would get a favorable judgement, but it is possible to be genuine and for support to deny your appeal. Other than that, I would imagine they would make you change your name though, which is understandable to me.

Anyway, if you're unsure about a name, ask a friend what they think or even do a google search on the name and see if google auto-corrects it to something negative/a slur, as that would be an easy way to know you shouldn't use it haha.

This is just one of those things that we have to defer to intuition on, which is why a community tribunal system to vote on whether something is a violation or not would be a much better system, rather than allowing an AI and/or a single customer support representative to use soley their judgement/interpretation.

Azurephoenix999 · April 11

Jolter wrote: »

Character names seem to be very hit or miss. I've seen some bad ones, but then some non-offensive names get banned. For example, I had a friend who had to change his gamertag because somehow pooperscooper is offensive? The guy is retired and using to scoop up dog poop in a previous job.

That's very disappointing. I should really look up the ToS to see what the guidelines are in there, but if they're vague enough to allow mods to flag the mildest of stuff, I feel like I just don't have the freedom to be creative.

randconfig · April 11

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Jolter wrote: »

Character names seem to be very hit or miss. I've seen some bad ones, but then some non-offensive names get banned. For example, I had a friend who had to change his gamertag because somehow pooperscooper is offensive? The guy is retired and using to scoop up dog poop in a previous job.

That's very disappointing. I should really look up the ToS to see what the guidelines are in there, but if they're vague enough to allow mods to flag the mildest of stuff, I feel like I just don't have the freedom to be creative.

Well to be fair, if you choose a name that most people interpret as offensive, wouldn't you want to be made aware/to change your name?

Azurephoenix999 · April 11

randconfig wrote: »

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Jolter wrote: »

Character names seem to be very hit or miss. I've seen some bad ones, but then some non-offensive names get banned. For example, I had a friend who had to change his gamertag because somehow pooperscooper is offensive? The guy is retired and using to scoop up dog poop in a previous job.

That's very disappointing. I should really look up the ToS to see what the guidelines are in there, but if they're vague enough to allow mods to flag the mildest of stuff, I feel like I just don't have the freedom to be creative.

Well to be fair, if you choose a name that most people interpret as offensive, wouldn't you want to be made aware/to change your name?

If it was something actually offensive then sure, but what if it was something along the lines of "Lifts-Her-Tail"? Names like that are already in the game (granted they're few and far between, but still), so if someone reported me for a name like that, shouldn't it be on them to not be so sensitive?

Wuduwasa13 · April 11

Ohhh no

reazea · April 11

No, they haven't. And if you think it's bad in game......

randconfig · April 11

reazea wrote: »

No, they haven't. And if you think it's bad in game......

@ZOS_GinaBruno I genuinely feel it's not good that the community is this terrified about talking about their concerns regarding automation and strict interpretation of the ToS in customer support appeals. I worry that this may be the reason for the decline in social interactions in the game over the last decade I've played (PS4, PS5, & on PC), and a potential barrier to returning players. The ToS are vital to allowing our wonderful community to exist and keeping the game alive, so I hope I don't sound as though I'm anti-ToS.

I genuinely think the transparency of having a community enforced tribunal system for judging reports would restore trust in the playerbase, I genuinely feel what I have said here is constructive criticism, rather than just negativity/criticism, and I genuinely believe that it's not good for the community if a large % of the players are fearful to community their thoughts on these matters.

That is why I chose to engage with this thread. I too am afraid I will be punished, but I care too much about this game to not speak on this. If there is something specific I have said or mentioned, that was too much, I will hear any feedback from mods, take accountability, and not repeat it going forward, I just hope that the whole of what I am saying here, the bigger point I'm trying to make, is not something I would be punished for, and I hope that this could be an opportunity for the ZOS team to reassure the community/ease fears of having civil constructive discussions with the ZOS team for fear of retaliation.

Azurephoenix999 · April 11

randconfig wrote: »

reazea wrote: »

No, they haven't. And if you think it's bad in game......

Agree with this wholeheartedly.

I'd love to get back to playing, but I feel like what is and is not acceptable should be more clearly defined and less restrictive. At the very least, language used in the game itself should be able to serve as a baseline. Character names should be able to get at least to "Lifts-Her-Tail" levels of raunchy without getting in trouble. Otherwise it seems kind of hypocritical, like saying "we can put it in the game, but you can't put it on your character".

As for things like exploits, it would be healthier for the game if players weren't punished for mild infractions, and instead encouraged to record footage of it happening and send it in. If people aren't afraid of getting banned, then they won't be afraid to record themselves doing it, and the more recordings there are, the more data there'll be for the problem to be identified and fixed.

Dragonnord · April 11

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Been away from the game for several years at this point, and I'm extremely hesitant to come back because after various incidents I've heard about I'm extremely paranoid about further investing my time and energy into this game only to get banned for something ridiculous.

Remember when an entire raid group got axed because they reported a bug they found by accident?

And then there's all the people who've gotten in trouble for mildly suggestive character names in a game that contains the Lusty Argonian Maid, heavily features Molag Bal (the daedric lord of you-know-what), and is rated M.

I've invested tons of time and money into this game in the past, but it's been ages. I'm considering returning, but my biggest fear regarding that is that once I get comfortable, some mod on a power trip will decide "screw you in particular" and my account will get banned. Countless hours and unknown quantities of money completely and fully down the drain.

So I have to know: Have they stopped banning people for stupid stuff or is it still happening?

How about you not doing stuff or making names that are against ToS? Is it that difficult?

Also, ZOS doesn't ban you because of a name, you just get a message to change your name when you log in to the game.

Its_MySniff · April 11

I got a three day ban over a name. They gave me a token to change it and I changed one letter. My fault, but that's still a ban over a name. Wasn't a nasty name either, must have offended someone.

kah · April 11

One of my trade guilds stopped sending mail because one of the officers got banned for "spamming" aka sending out weekly guild updates. So I understand your concern.

ZOS_Icy · April 11

Greetings,

After review of this thread, we have decided it is best to close it down for being non-constructive. When creating threads on our forums, we ask that they be civil, constructive, and kept within the Community Rules. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

The Elder Scrolls Online Team