Buffs and Spell/Weapon Power

rageofodin · December 2021

The in game description of abilities, buffs, and how CP applies to then is pretty awful, so Ill ask here

Do buffs like minor and major Berserk affect Weapon/Spell damage? If so, how much?

How much of a damage buff percentage-wise is 165 weapon damage?

Are sets like Relequen ONLY affected by Weapon/Spell damage increase, or are they affected by major and minor buffs as well?

Vevvev · December 2021

Minor and Major Berserk only effect the actual tooltip of the incoming damage. Spell and Weapon damage are just scaling stats for abilities.

Spell and Weapon damage like Max Magicka and Max Stamina are flat stats that don't operate as multiplicative boosts. CP stars that provide % based boosts and Berserk are multiplicative and take the value of the ability after it's normal scaling and then increase it by that %. So like an ability that scales with offensive stats on a 1:1 scale that deals 10k magic damage will probably have like 40k max Magicka and 6k spell damage. Apply Major Sorcery and now you have 7,200 spell damage so the ability does 11,200 magic damage.

With this 11,200 magic damage apply Major Berserk and it'll deal 12,320 magic damage. If my math is correct of course...

Everest_Lionheart · December 2021

To be honest I’m not entirely sure anyone knows how any of it works anymore, including the devs. Nerf this, tweak that, change this, add that, all in the name of reigning damage in and yet damage keeps pushing higher and higher.

That said the tool tips are murky at best. I would just like to know which skills are direct damage, AOE, dot and single target without having to do a google search. Can we start with that at least?

Ippokrates · December 2021

You can check all skills & their coef at UESP ESO SKILL BROWSER website.

In general, 1 point of weapon/spell dmg increase your overall dmg by 1 point (including LA/HA).

10 points (10,5 to be precise) of magicka/stamina also increase by 1 point bit only of your skills (if they are magicka/stamina or highest resource based).

As default you can assume that your char would have around 3k of weapon/spell dmg & 30k main resource as default, without any other bonuses from sets or CP.

With Brutality/Sorcery dmg should increase to 4k, so a typical skill will have dmg of 7k.

From these values you can try to evaluate, what will work better for you.

Stuff like Kinras will increase your dmg by 700.

A good dmg set can give you extra 1k.

And there is also crit chance. Depending on your crit dmg, 10% of crit chance could increase your dmg by 15-37% (ca. cause in eso crit rng results are usually +/- 5% - if you are lucky ^^ )

But once you will start to accumulate stats, things will start to look different. 1k of dmg increase by weapon/spell power will not be as good as 10% from major berserk if your hits will have 50k

So the real answer to your question is: IT DEPENDS

on your overal equipment, build and skills

And yeah, i am pretty sure all proc sets are working with berserk - without it ppl would not have such good parses

Plectro · December 2021

I can answer the first two questions. The last one I'm not 100% sure about

rageofodin wrote: »

Do buffs like minor and major Berserk affect Weapon/Spell damage? If so, how much?

Not the stats themselves, no. In damage calculations these are two separate values that are multiplied. The damage you do depends on several factors: How much your max mag/stam and weapon/spell damage stats boost the damage of the skill (Each skill is slightly different). And then damage modifiers like Dmg. Done boost and Dmg. Taken debuff of enemies. So the stats themselves will not increase, but the damage you deal will increase.

How much of a damage buff percentage-wise is 165 weapon damage?

I just did a quick calculation of this assuming penetration cap and that you would have all the weapon damage buffs (Minor & Major Brutality) which increase this 165 by another 30%, and things like medium armor passives / fighter's guild passives that you would be expected to run.
The math says roughly 2.4% DPS increase

rageofodin · December 2021

Thank you! This has been very helpful, and has cleared up a lot of confusion as to why Relequen/Kinras are the supposed meta for Stamina toons

For me, this solidifies its more about the rotation and CP points than flat damage increase

Again, thank you!

julez92 · January 2022

Vevvev wrote: »

Minor and Major Berserk only effect the actual tooltip of the incoming damage. Spell and Weapon damage are just scaling stats for abilities.

Spell and Weapon damage like Max Magicka and Max Stamina are flat stats that don't operate as multiplicative boosts. CP stars that provide % based boosts and Berserk are multiplicative and take the value of the ability after it's normal scaling and then increase it by that %. So like an ability that scales with offensive stats on a 1:1 scale that deals 10k magic damage will probably have like 40k max Magicka and 6k spell damage. Apply Major Sorcery and now you have 7,200 spell damage so the ability does 11,200 magic damage.

With this 11,200 magic damage apply Major Berserk and it'll deal 12,320 magic damage. If my math is correct of course...

Thank you, while I didn't check your math the point that "Spell/Weapon Damage" as well as other base line stats are not multiplicative. The only point I'd make on this is that Major/Minor Beserk only effect out going dmg while Major/Minor Vulnerability effect incoming damage but this is probably just a matter of semantics.

Vevvev · January 2022

julez92 wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Minor and Major Berserk only effect the actual tooltip of the incoming damage. Spell and Weapon damage are just scaling stats for abilities.

Spell and Weapon damage like Max Magicka and Max Stamina are flat stats that don't operate as multiplicative boosts. CP stars that provide % based boosts and Berserk are multiplicative and take the value of the ability after it's normal scaling and then increase it by that %. So like an ability that scales with offensive stats on a 1:1 scale that deals 10k magic damage will probably have like 40k max Magicka and 6k spell damage. Apply Major Sorcery and now you have 7,200 spell damage so the ability does 11,200 magic damage.

With this 11,200 magic damage apply Major Berserk and it'll deal 12,320 magic damage. If my math is correct of course...

Thank you, while I didn't check your math the point that "Spell/Weapon Damage" as well as other base line stats are not multiplicative. The only point I'd make on this is that Major/Minor Beserk only effect out going dmg while Major/Minor Vulnerability effect incoming damage but this is probably just a matter of semantics.

Right, difference between healing done and healing received. It does mean something, but their effect is generally felt the same on the receiving end when it comes to Berserk and Vulnerability. I did find in fringe cases when it comes to healing that Exhilarating Drain is unaffected by healing done but is effected by healing received. Not sure what other things in this game have that weird scaling issue but it is worth pointing out.

malistorr · January 2022

+1

"I would just like to know which skills are direct damage, AOE, dot and single target without having to do a google search. Can we start with that at least?"

Necrotech_Master · January 2022

malistorr wrote: »

+1

"I would just like to know which skills are direct damage, AOE, dot and single target without having to do a google search. Can we start with that at least?"

the key things to look for:

"dealing X dmg" is direct
"dealing X dmg over Y seconds" or "dealing X dmg every 1 second" are dot

aoe is listed in the stats usually under the range (it would show like "range 28 meters" and under that "area 3 meters", this gets a little weird though when an skill is a cone (like destruction staff wall of elements the "area" is listed as A x B meters (one of those being length and one being width))

skills can contain both direct and dot components (example: poison injection)

i do agree that there are a few skills which are not entirely clear (dark flare for templars, only deals direct single target dmg, but it also has an aoe component that applies major defile to the target and nearby targets, in this case the cp buffing single target dmg would be what you would use to buff the primary aspect of this skill since the aoe does not technically deal dmg)

malistorr · January 2022

What about a skill like wall of elements? It does damage over an area and over time. Does that mean it's buffed by anything that buffs AOE and DOT damage or just 1 or the other? And how can we tell without spending hours testing?

What about a heavy attack from a lightning staff? It does about 4-ticks for damage and I've heard the first few are at least 1 type of damage and the last tick is another. What types are each tick?

There are lots of skills/abilities where it's damn near impossible to tell without conducting science experiments that most players simply don't have time to do.

Vevvev · January 2022

malistorr wrote: »

What about a skill like wall of elements? It does damage over an area and over time. Does that mean it's buffed by anything that buffs AOE and DOT damage or just 1 or the other? And how can we tell without spending hours testing?

What about a heavy attack from a lightning staff? It does about 4-ticks for damage and I've heard the first few are at least 1 type of damage and the last tick is another. What types are each tick?

There are lots of skills/abilities where it's damn near impossible to tell without conducting science experiments that most players simply don't have time to do.

Area of Effect Damage over Time abilities scale off your offensive stats in the moment instead of on cast. Single Target Damage over Time abilities scale off your offensive stats when cast, however your critical, penetration, and weapon trait do effect the attack/heal dynamically.

And yes, an ability's attack/heal is either Single Target or Area of Effect and Direct or Damage over Time. And to add even more an ability can have all 4 things present.

Take for example DK's Engulfing Flames ability.
https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/engulfing-flames
As you can see it has a lot going on with an area of effect cone attack that hurts everyone in it and applies a damage over time effect.
The initial hit is an Area of Effect attack that deals Direct Damage.
The Damage over Time applied to the targets in the cone is Single Target.

Wait, how can a Damage over Time effect on an Area of Effect attack be single target?!? Simple, it's effecting only the target. If that Damage over Time effect was on the ground and able to hurt multiple people it'd be Area of Effect, but because it's applied to a single target despite being applied via an AoE direct damage attack it is single target.