wheem_ESO wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

+1 for 8 seconds is too much. We just needed Onslaught to 5 seconds which seems like an appropriate amount.

8 seconds might indeed be too much, but as I said in the post right above yours, we have to be careful when trying to compare the Colossus to Onslaught. Other than the buff/debuff duration, Onslaught is superior to the Colossus in every non-zerging scenario.
- It's significantly cheaper.
- It does far more damage, all of which lands in a single burst instead of over 3 seconds.
- It isn't nearly as telegraphed.
- The buff isn't subject to being cleansed.
- The buff can benefit the "caster" against targets that weren't near the original target of the Ultimate.

This is true about 12 seconds Onslaught. With 5 seconds half of that bonuses are irrelevant. As for the telegraph onslaught has very distinctive "slash" sound which means "ROLL-DODGE NOW".

Maulkin wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

wheem_ESO wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

+1 for 8 seconds is too much. We just needed Onslaught to 5 seconds which seems like an appropriate amount.

8 seconds might indeed be too much, but as I said in the post right above yours, we have to be careful when trying to compare the Colossus to Onslaught. Other than the buff/debuff duration, Onslaught is superior to the Colossus in every non-zerging scenario.
- It's significantly cheaper.
- It does far more damage, all of which lands in a single burst instead of over 3 seconds.
- It isn't nearly as telegraphed.
- The buff isn't subject to being cleansed.
- The buff can benefit the "caster" against targets that weren't near the original target of the Ultimate.

This is true about 12 seconds Onslaught. With 5 seconds half of that bonuses are irrelevant. As for the telegraph onslaught has very distinctive "slash" sound which means "ROLL-DODGE NOW".

So which part of the statement you quoted is not true about the 5-second Onslaught?

Feels like you’re arguing just for the sake of it now.

"The buff isn't subject to be cleansed" - 5 seconds is too short of a buff to think about ways of cancelling it. The same you can think about major berserk of nightblade's mark, which you will see like never.
"The buff can benefit the "caster" against targets that weren't near" - same. 5 seconds is very small time window. You can only use it against targets which were in reach on cast. It is zero chance you will use it against anybody else even with gap closer.

"It isn't nearly as telegraphed" - Onslaught is fully telegraphed. Basically any Onslaught used not on stunlock'd target will be dodged, because everybody knows that sound and knows what will happen if onslaught not dodged.

Of course on Live Onslaught is extremely deadly. But we are talking about PTS. 5 seconds duration just turns it to niche anti-tank short-burst tool. I guess original intent was to have 5 seconds which increase to 8 at level 4. But then somebody decided "let's gut it" and everybody's silent, because Dizzy-Onslaught-Executioner is used like by every stam player on Live and everybody tired of it. OK. But then we see 8 seconds of colossus and then onslaught gutting loses any sense.

Maulkin wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

"The buff isn't subject to be cleansed" - 5 seconds is too short of a buff to think about ways of cancelling it. The same you can think about major berserk of nightblade's mark, which you will see like never.
"The buff can benefit the "caster" against targets that weren't near" - same. 5 seconds is very small time window. You can only use it against targets which were in reach on cast. It is zero chance you will use it against anybody else even with gap closer.

"It isn't nearly as telegraphed" - Onslaught is fully telegraphed. Basically any Onslaught used not on stunlock'd target will be dodged, because everybody knows that sound and knows what will happen if onslaught not dodged.

Of course on Live Onslaught is extremely deadly. But we are talking about PTS. 5 seconds duration just turns it to niche anti-tank short-burst tool. I guess original intent was to have 5 seconds which increase to 8 at level 4. But then somebody decided "let's gut it" and everybody's silent, because Dizzy-Onslaught-Executioner is used like by every stam player on Live and everybody tired of it. OK. But then we see 8 seconds of colossus and then onslaught gutting loses any sense.

What are you even talking about?

- You can't "cancel" buffs, that's exactly the point. How would you even cancel major berserk if you knew the NB had it. Templars will purify the Major Vuln though.
- The players within reach of the cast, could well be more players than those Onslaught managed to land on. You could land onslaught on 1 player, kill him with it and get 5 secs on the next target. No such benefit for Colossus
- I don't have to explain how stupid it sounds to compare a 250ms audio warning to a 1s huge visual. It's 4 times longer warning and much more obvious. Hence it lands far far more often.

I think we better leave it here, cause it feels to me like preaching about gravity to the flat earth society. This discussion will get us nowhere.

If you read my first post on this, I stated that I don't think that 8 seconds of colossus is OP, I think that Onslaught is just mindlessly nerfed in wrong way. How many times you were killed after somebody onslaughted somebody else, and how many times when onslaught landed after dizzy stunlock with transition into "executioner spam"? For onslaught executioner combo absolutely nothing changed.... idk, soft up to 60% HP with something else then dizzy, then turn evil into onslaught into executioner, it will still be viable combo. So most dangerous part of onslaught is still there, they just nerfed secondary effect and nullified hybrids again.