Maintenance for the week of February 18:
• [COMPLETE] Xbox One: EU megaserver for maintenance – February 20, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EST (17:00 UTC)
The maintenance is complete, and the PTS is now back online and patch 4.3.4 is available. You can find the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/459684/
The Wrathstone DLC Game Pack and Update 21 base game patch are now available to test on the PTS! Read the full patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/454456/

Glad to see

  • validifyedneb18_ESO
    validifyedneb18_ESO
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    Browart wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    Khajiit will just pick up sorrow instead of strategist and propably they are become a much bigger monster dps than they were.

    People just dont know right now. For sure they can now do some mad stacking of crit damage, but its only 10% more than anyone could do before, and at the cost of 8% chance.

    Really got to wait on some testing on this one.

    Khajiit nb/templar can achiv with new passiv almost 70% crit dmg with horn etc. So its a bit broken on trials.

    Personally, I dont see it being 'broken', but I can see it potentially being a buff. In reality I dont think anyone has much of a clue. Both passives are quite strong, the only thing we can say for sure is the Shadow buff no longer dis-proportionally favors Furries, which I think its safe to say was the main reasoning for the change.
    ezio45 wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    Why did they dumpster khajiit

    They didn't, it's even better than before. It's now crit damage done which is way more helpful than the added crit chance. You can already get high spell it weapon crit, especially on NB which is were khajiit would have been focused. Now they basically get a free crit damage Mindy's stone...

    while highelf and woodelf are basically useless. With darkelf being much better than highelf and Breton and khajiit running laps around them both.. I don't think I need to get in to why woodelf is bad but I don't care what you to to stealth detection tied to rolldodging it's still useless and whoa hoo last patch they got 1500 physical and spell pen, one of which is never going to help anyone

    Totally wrong.

    Just stop.

    Crunch the numbers and do some tests before spamming the ignorant overreactions to patch notes.

    It is a *slight* buff to builds with high crit chance and a *slight* nerf to builds with low crit chance. In other words, in broad strokes, it buffs Khajiit stam DPS (particularly stamblades and stamplars) and it nerfs Khajiit magicka DPS.

    Oh whatever you win with khajiit, IDC

    Point is there's still 0 reason to pick a highelf or woodelf over anything else that's what I'm pissed about. Couldn't care less about khajiit

    Why is there no reason to pick Altmer, if you really care about getting every tiny bit of DPS? They're still the BIS magDD race...

    Not that much of a dps increase and dummer gets fire resistance which is everywhere in pve

    In PvP the 1.8k Stam is better than the Stam return especially with the recently changes to CP giving more to max pools. Mag doesn't need high Stam Regen in fights. You use alot of Stam quickly so the max Stam is better

    Now this is more of an argument I can agree with. Suggest something else by all means, but recognize the choice ZOS made by removing the mag regen (and why they did it) and dont ask for something that either equates to reverting the change or giving Altmer even more DPS than they already have. (Never suggest a buff to top the already DPS, people will just laugh at you).

    That said, I think you're under estimating the utility you get from that stamina. Try to understand that better and you will be able to make a better argument for a replacement or change.
  • ezio45
    ezio45
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    Browart wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    Khajiit will just pick up sorrow instead of strategist and propably they are become a much bigger monster dps than they were.

    People just dont know right now. For sure they can now do some mad stacking of crit damage, but its only 10% more than anyone could do before, and at the cost of 8% chance.

    Really got to wait on some testing on this one.

    Khajiit nb/templar can achiv with new passiv almost 70% crit dmg with horn etc. So its a bit broken on trials.

    Personally, I dont see it being 'broken', but I can see it potentially being a buff. In reality I dont think anyone has much of a clue. Both passives are quite strong, the only thing we can say for sure is the Shadow buff no longer dis-proportionally favors Furries, which I think its safe to say was the main reasoning for the change.
    ezio45 wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    Why did they dumpster khajiit

    They didn't, it's even better than before. It's now crit damage done which is way more helpful than the added crit chance. You can already get high spell it weapon crit, especially on NB which is were khajiit would have been focused. Now they basically get a free crit damage Mindy's stone...

    while highelf and woodelf are basically useless. With darkelf being much better than highelf and Breton and khajiit running laps around them both.. I don't think I need to get in to why woodelf is bad but I don't care what you to to stealth detection tied to rolldodging it's still useless and whoa hoo last patch they got 1500 physical and spell pen, one of which is never going to help anyone

    Totally wrong.

    Just stop.

    Crunch the numbers and do some tests before spamming the ignorant overreactions to patch notes.

    It is a *slight* buff to builds with high crit chance and a *slight* nerf to builds with low crit chance. In other words, in broad strokes, it buffs Khajiit stam DPS (particularly stamblades and stamplars) and it nerfs Khajiit magicka DPS.

    Oh whatever you win with khajiit, IDC

    Point is there's still 0 reason to pick a highelf or woodelf over anything else that's what I'm pissed about. Couldn't care less about khajiit

    Why is there no reason to pick Altmer, if you really care about getting every tiny bit of DPS? They're still the BIS magDD race...

    Not that much of a dps increase and dummer gets fire resistance which is everywhere in pve

    In PvP the 1.8k Stam is better than the Stam return especially with the recently changes to CP giving more to max pools. Mag doesn't need high Stam Regen in fights. You use alot of Stam quickly so the max Stam is better

    Now this is more of an argument I can agree with. Suggest something else by all means, but recognize the choice ZOS made by removing the mag regen (and why they did it) and dont ask for something that either equates to reverting the change or giving Altmer even more DPS than they already have. (Never suggest a buff to top the already DPS, people will just laugh at you).

    That said, I think you're under estimating the utility you get from that stamina. Try to understand that better and you will be able to make a better argument for a replacement or change.

    Idk the fire resistance + the 1.8k+ Stam just makes dark elf seem alot better than getting 600 Stam back ever rotation with a reduction to damage while your casting or channeling, especially with how few casting and channeling abilitys are used in rotations. I see that maybe helping out Templar but not much else and even then it still doesn't seem on par with 2k fire damage resistance
  • Olupajmibanan
    Olupajmibanan
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    Browart wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    What a beautiful game, Khajiits, Bretons and Orcs become a new BiS race because in Elsweyr need to be promoted.

    You are spreading wrong information,

    Altmer, Dunmer, Bosmer, Argonian, Red Guard in very good position.

    You need to do math before posting or check DPS parses threads.

    I dont think so, If u saw tests parses, Bretons with Khajiits dominates as Magicka races on parses on each pts patch. Orcs with Redguard had the same dps before buff changes for Orcs. Dont tell me I spread wrong information when you doing this at each post with "dont nerf orcs".

    Breton is NOT top DD by a long shot. 258 wep damage is a HUGE loss if you're trying to max out damage. The sustain is nice, but in a propper PVE environment you only need it if you want to heal or maybe tank.

    Khajiits have just "received" a major nerf to Magic damage in the CP change.

    Calm down buddy.

    According the latest huge full-raid parses, didn't Breton actually have the highest average dps?
  • validifyedneb18_ESO
    validifyedneb18_ESO
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    ezio45 wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    Khajiit will just pick up sorrow instead of strategist and propably they are become a much bigger monster dps than they were.

    People just dont know right now. For sure they can now do some mad stacking of crit damage, but its only 10% more than anyone could do before, and at the cost of 8% chance.

    Really got to wait on some testing on this one.

    Khajiit nb/templar can achiv with new passiv almost 70% crit dmg with horn etc. So its a bit broken on trials.

    Personally, I dont see it being 'broken', but I can see it potentially being a buff. In reality I dont think anyone has much of a clue. Both passives are quite strong, the only thing we can say for sure is the Shadow buff no longer dis-proportionally favors Furries, which I think its safe to say was the main reasoning for the change.
    ezio45 wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    Why did they dumpster khajiit

    They didn't, it's even better than before. It's now crit damage done which is way more helpful than the added crit chance. You can already get high spell it weapon crit, especially on NB which is were khajiit would have been focused. Now they basically get a free crit damage Mindy's stone...

    while highelf and woodelf are basically useless. With darkelf being much better than highelf and Breton and khajiit running laps around them both.. I don't think I need to get in to why woodelf is bad but I don't care what you to to stealth detection tied to rolldodging it's still useless and whoa hoo last patch they got 1500 physical and spell pen, one of which is never going to help anyone

    Totally wrong.

    Just stop.

    Crunch the numbers and do some tests before spamming the ignorant overreactions to patch notes.

    It is a *slight* buff to builds with high crit chance and a *slight* nerf to builds with low crit chance. In other words, in broad strokes, it buffs Khajiit stam DPS (particularly stamblades and stamplars) and it nerfs Khajiit magicka DPS.

    Oh whatever you win with khajiit, IDC

    Point is there's still 0 reason to pick a highelf or woodelf over anything else that's what I'm pissed about. Couldn't care less about khajiit

    Why is there no reason to pick Altmer, if you really care about getting every tiny bit of DPS? They're still the BIS magDD race...

    Not that much of a dps increase and dummer gets fire resistance which is everywhere in pve

    In PvP the 1.8k Stam is better than the Stam return especially with the recently changes to CP giving more to max pools. Mag doesn't need high Stam Regen in fights. You use alot of Stam quickly so the max Stam is better

    Now this is more of an argument I can agree with. Suggest something else by all means, but recognize the choice ZOS made by removing the mag regen (and why they did it) and dont ask for something that either equates to reverting the change or giving Altmer even more DPS than they already have. (Never suggest a buff to top the already DPS, people will just laugh at you).

    That said, I think you're under estimating the utility you get from that stamina. Try to understand that better and you will be able to make a better argument for a replacement or change.

    Idk the fire resistance + the 1.8k+ Stam just makes dark elf seem alot better than getting 600 Stam back ever rotation with a reduction to damage while your casting or channeling, especially with how few casting and channeling abilitys are used in rotations. I see that maybe helping out Templar but not much else and even then it still doesn't seem on par with 2k fire damage resistance

    I am fairly unsure myself, but I do know that the low stamina on my current Altmer (barely enough for 2 rolls) has gotten me killed many times when situations demand rolling. 1.8k might be big if it gets you an extra roll without regen though, not even sure if it will.

    For fire, I think in a lot of vet content, if stuff is going to kill you (Because you failed a mechanic) its probably going to kill you regardless of 3k extra resistance. In PVP I can really see its use, fire and burning especially are huge in BGs and cyro. But then in PVP is where the stamina regen would also really shine.
    Edited by validifyedneb18_ESO on February 11, 2019 8:57PM
  • ezio45
    ezio45
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    ✭✭
    ezio45 wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    Browart wrote: »
    Khajiit will just pick up sorrow instead of strategist and propably they are become a much bigger monster dps than they were.

    People just dont know right now. For sure they can now do some mad stacking of crit damage, but its only 10% more than anyone could do before, and at the cost of 8% chance.

    Really got to wait on some testing on this one.

    Khajiit nb/templar can achiv with new passiv almost 70% crit dmg with horn etc. So its a bit broken on trials.

    Personally, I dont see it being 'broken', but I can see it potentially being a buff. In reality I dont think anyone has much of a clue. Both passives are quite strong, the only thing we can say for sure is the Shadow buff no longer dis-proportionally favors Furries, which I think its safe to say was the main reasoning for the change.
    ezio45 wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    Why did they dumpster khajiit

    They didn't, it's even better than before. It's now crit damage done which is way more helpful than the added crit chance. You can already get high spell it weapon crit, especially on NB which is were khajiit would have been focused. Now they basically get a free crit damage Mindy's stone...

    while highelf and woodelf are basically useless. With darkelf being much better than highelf and Breton and khajiit running laps around them both.. I don't think I need to get in to why woodelf is bad but I don't care what you to to stealth detection tied to rolldodging it's still useless and whoa hoo last patch they got 1500 physical and spell pen, one of which is never going to help anyone

    Totally wrong.

    Just stop.

    Crunch the numbers and do some tests before spamming the ignorant overreactions to patch notes.

    It is a *slight* buff to builds with high crit chance and a *slight* nerf to builds with low crit chance. In other words, in broad strokes, it buffs Khajiit stam DPS (particularly stamblades and stamplars) and it nerfs Khajiit magicka DPS.

    Oh whatever you win with khajiit, IDC

    Point is there's still 0 reason to pick a highelf or woodelf over anything else that's what I'm pissed about. Couldn't care less about khajiit

    Why is there no reason to pick Altmer, if you really care about getting every tiny bit of DPS? They're still the BIS magDD race...

    Not that much of a dps increase and dummer gets fire resistance which is everywhere in pve

    In PvP the 1.8k Stam is better than the Stam return especially with the recently changes to CP giving more to max pools. Mag doesn't need high Stam Regen in fights. You use alot of Stam quickly so the max Stam is better

    Now this is more of an argument I can agree with. Suggest something else by all means, but recognize the choice ZOS made by removing the mag regen (and why they did it) and dont ask for something that either equates to reverting the change or giving Altmer even more DPS than they already have. (Never suggest a buff to top the already DPS, people will just laugh at you).

    That said, I think you're under estimating the utility you get from that stamina. Try to understand that better and you will be able to make a better argument for a replacement or change.

    Idk the fire resistance + the 1.8k+ Stam just makes dark elf seem alot better than getting 600 Stam back ever rotation with a reduction to damage while your casting or channeling, especially with how few casting and channeling abilitys are used in rotations. I see that maybe helping out Templar but not much else and even then it still doesn't seem on par with 2k fire damage resistance

    I am fairly unsure myself, but I do know that the low stamina on my current Altmer (barely enough for 2 rolls) has gotten me killed many times when situations demand rolling. 1.8k might be big if it gets you an extra roll without regen though, not even sure if it will.

    For fire, I think in a lot of vet content, if stuff is going to kill you (Because you failed a mechanic) its probably going to kill you regardless of 3k extra resistance. In PVP I can really see its use, fire and burning especially are huge in BGs and cyro. But then in PVP is where the stamina regen would also really shine.

    I wanna say of the top of my head rolldodging is around 3k Stam -/+ depending on CP set up. So that plus the bonus to max pools from CP is probably enough to get 1-2 more rolldodges depending on how you Stam falls.its like wearing another shackle breaker set. Just seems more helpful to me in PvP and pve than the current highelf 600 every rotation essentially

    I think the fire is alot more useful in pve than your giving it credit for. Especially if you have a group that isn't super great. Saint olms in AS has pretty much unavoidable fire damage. Cr has you share the fire debuff. Hof has the fire damage on 1 of the triplets that is cleansable but I don't think avoidable and last boss has it on the dps sides arm. Might be avoidable if your ranged mag dps. Vma has the spider and fire stage and crem guard and some of that isn't avoidable without taking at least a hit or to from it. Think vdsa last stage is like all fire damage.

    In PvP it's a life saver. Fire is pretty much the only used staff there. Then you got infernal guardian, zaan, asylum inferno burning dot. The darkelf fire resistance pretty nulifies masters inferno staff, destro bombs.
  • qbit
    qbit
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    I'm happy to eveeyone is enjoying the new combat design lead.
    PC-NA: @q.bit
  • ezio45
    ezio45
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    qbit wrote: »
    I'm happy to eveeyone is enjoying the new combat design lead.

    I don't think this is wheeler. He has a boss too... That oversees both this and I think ui and PvP. So wheeler might not have as much freedom as we/he would like. It's also possible that these changes are wrapping up wrobels work. We probably won't see wheelers work until next patch. Ik Garrett posted the racial changes when wrobel was still at the company so this has been planned/worked on since murkimire.

    At least so far I have liked wheelers work and I don't think any problems will result from him directly rather Garrett and rich (tho idk if rich has much influence on that side of things, feel he is more in charge of story/ lvl and work design. He's the creative director so I imagine he works more with the artistic points of the game then inner workings of it. Think that's all Garrett). I would imagine that any big tweaks to the combat come from higher up with say ideas for what needs to be changed. For example, were looking at racial balance, each of the races must subscribe to these rule sets regarding there overall balance. Say like we don't want this and this type of passive to be combined in the same race. Then it is up to the combat team to decide what exactly is passive fitting that criteria are.
  • CurvedSwords123
    CurvedSwords123
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    Browart wrote: »
    What a beautiful game, Khajiits, Bretons and Orcs become a new BiS race because in Elsweyr need to be promoted.

    You are spreading wrong information,

    Altmer, Dunmer, Bosmer, Argonian, Red Guard in very good position.

    You need to do math before posting or check DPS parses threads.

    Math? Here you go. Redguards are now at the bottom.

  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
    ✭✭✭✭

    Breton is NOT top DD by a long shot. 258 wep damage is a HUGE loss if you're trying to max out damage. The sustain is nice, but in a propper PVE environment you only need it if you want to heal or maybe tank.

    Khajiits have just "received" a major nerf to Magic damage in the CP change.

    Calm down buddy.

    Thing is, Bretons can sustain a berserker enchant, which gives them 459 spell damage, which is more than Altmer get, and Altmer have to use absorb magicka enchants already on live unless they're a magblade DD (and even then sometimes you need it) now they're going to lose their magicka recovery but gain 258 spell damage, which is still less than Breton and they'll have worse sustain.

    So actually, Bretons will be better than Altmer for DPS. That's how broken their sustain is.

    Hes right also due to those passives Bretons may run more unique sets as you don’t rely on building into sustain as much. I have always preferred Breton over other races for mag and I tryed change between races a lot. The way I play it’s always been the best class for me and I’m sure once more ppl play it they will understand why that is
    .
  • validifyedneb18_ESO
    validifyedneb18_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Dr.NRG wrote: »

    Breton is NOT top DD by a long shot. 258 wep damage is a HUGE loss if you're trying to max out damage. The sustain is nice, but in a propper PVE environment you only need it if you want to heal or maybe tank.

    Khajiits have just "received" a major nerf to Magic damage in the CP change.

    Calm down buddy.

    Thing is, Bretons can sustain a berserker enchant, which gives them 459 spell damage, which is more than Altmer get, and Altmer have to use absorb magicka enchants already on live unless they're a magblade DD (and even then sometimes you need it) now they're going to lose their magicka recovery but gain 258 spell damage, which is still less than Breton and they'll have worse sustain.

    So actually, Bretons will be better than Altmer for DPS. That's how broken their sustain is.

    Hes right also due to those passives Bretons may run more unique sets as you don’t rely on building into sustain as much. I have always preferred Breton over other races for mag and I tryed change between races a lot. The way I play it’s always been the best class for me and I’m sure once more ppl play it they will understand why that is

    You where correct, then I realized you where talking about PVE not PVP and now you're just flat out wrong. "Bretons may run more unique sets". Aha.

    No. You run a meta set or you simply do less damage. And no, you dont need sustain in the current meta, you get more than enough from food and tank/healer feeding.
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