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Harden ward got buffed last patch and now enables broken builds.

  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    pieratsos wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Aznox wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    My NB 4k weap dmg with 10k pen 56% crit chance and 80% crit dmg could not touch this guys health and he had no problem killing me.

    So ... you dueled an Impregnable MagSorc with a crit build ?
    Tehn to test I brought a damage dk tank with 30k resistance accross the board and still it took the guy under 10 seconds to kill me.

    So ... you died to a MagSorc first or second burst while having near maxed resists .... on a StamDK ? I have bad news for you ...
    You dont get the point. I was dueling the same guy but hes not the only one with this kind of build. Besides the all day top duelers I win 90% of all fights and if I lose I still get them low hp. On top of that I can 1vx up 5 decent gamers. Even if he had impreg on with 4k weap dmg (thats without enchant) and 80% crit dmg 1 to 2 surprise att. should take that shield off easy in a normal scenario.
    For the dk it has 3.9k weap dmg with 1.5k recovery. When you keep being snared and rooted forward momentum wont help you because by the tike you get close the guy will streak and start his crappy rotation over. But anywyas the point im making is that it is possible for mag sorc probably all shield users to be this tanky but still have a ton of dmage and moveability.
    There where other very good duelers on all kind of classes that got wasted by that dude with barly touching his hp.

    You dont see this too often yet but you see more and more ppl figuring this build out as you keep running into them. Just wait and see. You probs gotta leave your zerg for abit tho to really experience this...

    Besides the fact that its nearly impossible to die to a sorc as a DK tank, dont you think that is a little hypocritical to complain about other people being tanky and doing dmg when you literally admit in the same post that you are playing a freaking tank with hardcapped resistances while having 4k wpn dmg and 1.5 regen?

    Again this build was unfinished(missing trates and am on a mag class), not a dueling build and thus I didnt expect to win especially due to his root and snare spamming. I brought it to see how hard he can hit.
    Yes my build is strong in open world op but it can be done with any stam class as im running simple sets full medium, absolutely 0 cheese set up. On top of that since im running no chese this build can be countered if you attack it the right way and got your combos down (at that point it comes down to my skill lvl to stay alive to 1vx). That dudes build had no counter tho he shredded a ton of very good duelers without breaking a sweat.

    .
  • Feanor
    Feanor
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    I wondered when we’d see a nerf Sorc thread again. You guys just never stop so you?
    Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:
    Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard Stamplar
    All chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    Didn't Alcast post a build like that a while ago? Yet, you still not encounter many of these.

    A tutorial on how to beat pet sorc on duel, no matter how much resist, health and magicka he has.
    1. Die to a petsorc (based on your post, you've already mastered this point)
    2. Equip Shield Breaker
    3. Return to that pet sorc for vengeance.
    4. Some will quickly realise that you are wearing Shield Breaker and Streak to safety (they won't bother you anymore). The slower ones will die.

    No matter how much cheese proc sets are out there, I am more than good enough that I dont have to run garbage and still kick ass keeping my honor. I just get aggravated when people run broken cheese builds and then zerg you down. I dont care that this guy kicked my butt in a duel but I care when I fight multiple people and then dudes like this jump in and destroy you and there is nothing you can do about that.
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  • Ranger209
    Ranger209
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    @ezio45
    If you keep or revert changes all these really need is a dogroll treatment so you can cast it a lot but not spam it indefinitely

    There it is. I think you mean the streak treatment though, not roll dodge.
  • Minalan
    Minalan
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Mintaka5 wrote: »
    Any-***-thing else you'd like to add to the magsorc nerf list while we're at it? Bring it! You keep nerfing sorcs, and we keep getting better. LMFAO. No one gets better from having it easy, son <---- @Dr.NRG

    Actually you are wrong. Every time zos is trying to nerf sorcs they cry out and btch so much that they end up getting buffed in the end. The only real nerf sorcs got was the removal of the stun from frags and the long need dix to rune prison.

    Shields were made critable, so sorcs invest in Impen instead of stats and damage like before - like everyone else.

    Shields we're capped, so you no longer run into high shield sorcs, and sorcs have to invest in health and armor to stay alive - like everyone else.

    Sorc shields have armor, but are now vulnerable to armor pen, major breach, and major fracture, where they ignored that before. Now they're like every other class.

    Crystal frags was 'buffed' but the travel time was nerfed so badly it's really your own fault if you don't block or dodge it.

    Overall sorcs are more balanced with other classes, having to take more care on their builds and use actual skill. You have no facts to back up your claims, you got outplayed is all.
  • ZonasArch
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    I guess I was wrong... OP kept going! Even more stubborn than I could have ever anticipated! So funny how OP ignored me so hard. Way to go op, you're the joke of the day, I guess.

    Sucks to be you, I guess.
  • MashmalloMan
    MashmalloMan
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    Feanor wrote: »
    I wondered when we’d see a nerf Sorc thread again. You guys just never stop so you?

    OP seems to have 0 intention of being constructive when all they say are things like:
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    That dudes build had no counter tho he shredded a ton of very good duelers without breaking a sweat.
    What build?

    I'm sorry, but what is the point of this thread? Without the build in question, claiming they're OP and everyone will use the build if you release the info is a weak argument.

    I guess this isn't the "Public TEST Server" and we should just let a broken build go live. My sneaking suspicion is OP just doesn't like Sorc's having nice things.
    PC Beta - 1900+ CP

    Stam Sorc Khajiit PvE/PVP Main || Stam Sorc Dark Elf PvP ||
    Stam Templar Dark Elf || Stam Warden Wood Elf || Stam DK Nord || Stam Necro Orc || Stam Blade Khajiit


    Mag Sorc High Elf || Mag Templar High Elf || Mag Warden Breton || Mag Necro Khajiit || Mag Blade Khajiit
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    Ranger209 wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    @ezio45
    If you keep or revert changes all these really need is a dogroll treatment so you can cast it a lot but not spam it indefinitely

    There it is. I think you mean the streak treatment though, not roll dodge.
    Tell me if Im wrong but I think the Streak inceases by 50% everytime and the Roll doge by 33%. If thats true then I did mean roll doge treatment as 50% would be too harsch
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  • Seenoevil
    Seenoevil
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    What I love about this entire thread and all the others about nerf this and nerf that...

    We all wanted a larger player base... now we have it and and people are using ""non meta"" sets and rotations people are complaining...
    People aren't just flocking to YouTube looking for the bis, now all these new theory crafters and set combos are coming in to play... people don't know how to deal with them..... new meta now is to go non-meta and theorycraft your own build and tell noone...

    Ever seen a stam warden running doylemish, sellistrix and leaching plate?? I have and he absolutely minced me lol not ashamed either,
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    ZonasArch wrote: »
    I guess I was wrong... OP kept going! Even more stubborn than I could have ever anticipated! So funny how OP ignored me so hard. Way to go op, you're the joke of the day, I guess.

    Sucks to be you, I guess.


    Lmao if you have nothing constructive to say why dont you stay out of this thread? Sucks to be me? No sucks to be you cause apparently you are very single minded and have nothing better to do then attacking people. I guess you only play mag sorc and dont know how to play without running cheese and are afraid your build gets nerfed... This is a real issue just wait and see till people pick this up and cyrodiil will be hell again as we had it with tremor viper builds. I dare you to try one of these set ups (especially pelinals fury) and see how broken it is then come back and btch again!
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  • ZonasArch
    ZonasArch
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    ZonasArch wrote: »
    I guess I was wrong... OP kept going! Even more stubborn than I could have ever anticipated! So funny how OP ignored me so hard. Way to go op, you're the joke of the day, I guess.

    Sucks to be you, I guess.


    Lmao if you have nothing constructive to say why dont you stay out of this thread? Sucks to be me? No sucks to be you cause apparently you are very single minded and have nothing better to do then attacking people. I guess you only play mag sorc and dont know how to play without running cheese and are afraid your build gets nerfed... This is a real issue just wait and see till people pick this up and cyrodiil will be hell again as we had it with tremor viper builds. I dare you to try one of these set ups (especially pelinals fury) and see how broken it is then come back and btch again!

    I said a bazillion constructive things and got ignored. All I'll say
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Aznox wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    My NB 4k weap dmg with 10k pen 56% crit chance and 80% crit dmg could not touch this guys health and he had no problem killing me.

    So ... you dueled an Impregnable MagSorc with a crit build ?
    Tehn to test I brought a damage dk tank with 30k resistance accross the board and still it took the guy under 10 seconds to kill me.

    So ... you died to a MagSorc first or second burst while having near maxed resists .... on a StamDK ? I have bad news for you ...
    You dont get the point. I was dueling the same guy but hes not the only one with this kind of build. Besides the all day top duelers I win 90% of all fights and if I lose I still get them low hp. On top of that I can 1vx up 5 decent gamers. Even if he had impreg on with 4k weap dmg (thats without enchant) and 80% crit dmg 1 to 2 surprise att. should take that shield off easy in a normal scenario.
    For the dk it has 3.9k weap dmg with 1.5k recovery. When you keep being snared and rooted forward momentum wont help you because by the tike you get close the guy will streak and start his crappy rotation over. But anywyas the point im making is that it is possible for mag sorc probably all shield users to be this tanky but still have a ton of dmage and moveability.
    There where other very good duelers on all kind of classes that got wasted by that dude with barly touching his hp.

    You dont see this too often yet but you see more and more ppl figuring this build out as you keep running into them. Just wait and see. You probs gotta leave your zerg for abit tho to really experience this...

    And with that stubborn, shortsighted behavior if yours, it'll get worse. Everyone will run this after live. When there's no more turning back.

    Thick skulled PvPers are the worst. Geez. Failing to see the obvious... We don't want to copy that, we want that fixed, assuming, again, you're not just a whiny loser. Which you probably are judging by how resistant you are to helping us help you.

    Here is one of your other constructive comments... people like you all they achieve is giving ZOS more work having to remove your comments and banning ppl.
    Edited by Dr.NRG on February 11, 2019 7:20PM
    .
  • ezio45
    ezio45
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    Minalan wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Mintaka5 wrote: »
    Any-***-thing else you'd like to add to the magsorc nerf list while we're at it? Bring it! You keep nerfing sorcs, and we keep getting better. LMFAO. No one gets better from having it easy, son <---- @Dr.NRG

    Actually you are wrong. Every time zos is trying to nerf sorcs they cry out and btch so much that they end up getting buffed in the end. The only real nerf sorcs got was the removal of the stun from frags and the long need dix to rune prison.

    Shields were made critable, so sorcs invest in Impen instead of stats and damage like before - like everyone else.

    Shields we're capped, so you no longer run into high shield sorcs, and sorcs have to invest in health and armor to stay alive - like everyone else.

    Sorc shields have armor, but are now vulnerable to armor pen, major breach, and major fracture, where they ignored that before. Now they're like every other class.

    Crystal frags was 'buffed' but the travel time was nerfed so badly it's really your own fault if you don't block or dodge it.

    Overall sorcs are more balanced with other classes, having to take more care on their builds and use actual skill. You have no facts to back up your claims, you got outplayed is all.

    1, no they brought mag more in line with Stam without giving them any of the benefits like higher spell damage and increased ability to rolldodging and cc break

    2 they made sorcs invested into health, mag and STAM. where as all Stam builds only have to invest in Stam and health. They also had sorc invest in armor while being limited to only light because of the lack of good heavy armor mag sets. While Stam has gear heavy dps sets.

    3 shields are vulnerable to pen. Again in light with 5k less weapon resistance than even medium

    So zos is trying to make light mag like Stam without and of the benefits or infrastructure to benefit them
  • ZonasArch
    ZonasArch
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Aznox wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    My NB 4k weap dmg with 10k pen 56% crit chance and 80% crit dmg could not touch this guys health and he had no problem killing me.

    So ... you dueled an Impregnable MagSorc with a crit build ?
    Tehn to test I brought a damage dk tank with 30k resistance accross the board and still it took the guy under 10 seconds to kill me.

    So ... you died to a MagSorc first or second burst while having near maxed resists .... on a StamDK ? I have bad news for you ...
    You dont get the point. I was dueling the same guy but hes not the only one with this kind of build. Besides the all day top duelers I win 90% of all fights and if I lose I still get them low hp. On top of that I can 1vx up 5 decent gamers. Even if he had impreg on with 4k weap dmg (thats without enchant) and 80% crit dmg 1 to 2 surprise att. should take that shield off easy in a normal scenario.
    For the dk it has 3.9k weap dmg with 1.5k recovery. When you keep being snared and rooted forward momentum wont help you because by the tike you get close the guy will streak and start his crappy rotation over. But anywyas the point im making is that it is possible for mag sorc probably all shield users to be this tanky but still have a ton of dmage and moveability.
    There where other very good duelers on all kind of classes that got wasted by that dude with barly touching his hp.

    You dont see this too often yet but you see more and more ppl figuring this build out as you keep running into them. Just wait and see. You probs gotta leave your zerg for abit tho to really experience this...

    And with that stubborn, shortsighted behavior if yours, it'll get worse. Everyone will run this after live. When there's no more turning back.

    Thick skulled PvPers are the worst. Geez. Failing to see the obvious... We don't want to copy that, we want that fixed, assuming, again, you're not just a whiny loser. Which you probably are judging by how resistant you are to helping us help you.

    Here is one of your other constructive comments... people like you all they achieve is giving ZOS more work having to remove your comments and banning ppl.

    You're just upset because we called you out on your lack of solid info. Just don't be shady when you want something fixed. No way anyone can fix what they don't know it's broken. I hope you can understand that very simple premise of this whoooole thing. I'm not the only one baffled with your stubbornness, and I'm not the only one willing to enforce your request, so long as you disclose what build that was.

    Or do you plan on using it yourself? Because if you do, and you think it's a broken build that's borderline exploitation...

    Again, for the millionth time, help us help you. Once we know what's the problem, we can all get out voices together. You just seem 100% afraid to be called on your B's or maybe on your lack of skills. This should not matter, if you actually believe your own words saying g this build is broken. Ethics suggest you tell us all what it is, here in a public forum, open to all eyes. That way, we can still have hopes of a fix.

    Keep that in mind... If you want it fixed, help us help you. If I didn't care about this, I wouldn't be saying this again and again and again to you a bazillion times today.

    Have a great day, I'm done with you unless you open your eyes.
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    ezio45 wrote: »
    Minalan wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Mintaka5 wrote: »
    Any-***-thing else you'd like to add to the magsorc nerf list while we're at it? Bring it! You keep nerfing sorcs, and we keep getting better. LMFAO. No one gets better from having it easy, son <---- @Dr.NRG

    Actually you are wrong. Every time zos is trying to nerf sorcs they cry out and btch so much that they end up getting buffed in the end. The only real nerf sorcs got was the removal of the stun from frags and the long need dix to rune prison.

    Shields were made critable, so sorcs invest in Impen instead of stats and damage like before - like everyone else.

    Shields we're capped, so you no longer run into high shield sorcs, and sorcs have to invest in health and armor to stay alive - like everyone else.

    Sorc shields have armor, but are now vulnerable to armor pen, major breach, and major fracture, where they ignored that before. Now they're like every other class.

    Crystal frags was 'buffed' but the travel time was nerfed so badly it's really your own fault if you don't block or dodge it.

    Overall sorcs are more balanced with other classes, having to take more care on their builds and use actual skill. You have no facts to back up your claims, you got outplayed is all.

    1, no they brought mag more in line with Stam without giving them any of the benefits like higher spell damage and increased ability to rolldodging and cc break

    2 they made sorcs invested into health, mag and STAM. where as all Stam builds only have to invest in Stam and health. They also had sorc invest in armor while being limited to only light because of the lack of good heavy armor mag sets. While Stam has gear heavy dps sets.

    3 shields are vulnerable to pen. Again in light with 5k less weapon resistance than even medium

    So zos is trying to make light mag like Stam without and of the benefits or infrastructure to benefit them

    I would argue tho that magicka has more access to better sets that stam does, especially when it comes to buffs and debuffs. Also, if you are good enough sustaining you can run stam dps sets to get really high spell dmg numbers by paring them with pelinals. Pelinals is a very underated and op set for mag classes if you can build your sustain around it they make some of the hardest hitting and tankiest builds in the game. Stam cannot do that. Also keep in mind weap dmg does not equal spell dmg you usually need a lot less spell dmg than weap dmg respectively. Thats why builds using pelinals are so op cause they allow you depending on how you build to get 4-7k spell dmg.
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  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Aznox wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    My NB 4k weap dmg with 10k pen 56% crit chance and 80% crit dmg could not touch this guys health and he had no problem killing me.

    So ... you dueled an Impregnable MagSorc with a crit build ?
    Tehn to test I brought a damage dk tank with 30k resistance accross the board and still it took the guy under 10 seconds to kill me.

    So ... you died to a MagSorc first or second burst while having near maxed resists .... on a StamDK ? I have bad news for you ...
    You dont get the point. I was dueling the same guy but hes not the only one with this kind of build. Besides the all day top duelers I win 90% of all fights and if I lose I still get them low hp. On top of that I can 1vx up 5 decent gamers. Even if he had impreg on with 4k weap dmg (thats without enchant) and 80% crit dmg 1 to 2 surprise att. should take that shield off easy in a normal scenario.
    For the dk it has 3.9k weap dmg with 1.5k recovery. When you keep being snared and rooted forward momentum wont help you because by the tike you get close the guy will streak and start his crappy rotation over. But anywyas the point im making is that it is possible for mag sorc probably all shield users to be this tanky but still have a ton of dmage and moveability.
    There where other very good duelers on all kind of classes that got wasted by that dude with barly touching his hp.

    You dont see this too often yet but you see more and more ppl figuring this build out as you keep running into them. Just wait and see. You probs gotta leave your zerg for abit tho to really experience this...

    And with that stubborn, shortsighted behavior if yours, it'll get worse. Everyone will run this after live. When there's no more turning back.

    Thick skulled PvPers are the worst. Geez. Failing to see the obvious... We don't want to copy that, we want that fixed, assuming, again, you're not just a whiny loser. Which you probably are judging by how resistant you are to helping us help you.

    Here is one of your other constructive comments... people like you all they achieve is giving ZOS more work having to remove your comments and banning ppl.

    You're just upset because we called you out on your lack of solid info. Just don't be shady when you want something fixed. No way anyone can fix what they don't know it's broken. I hope you can understand that very simple premise of this whoooole thing. I'm not the only one baffled with your stubbornness, and I'm not the only one willing to enforce your request, so long as you disclose what build that was.

    Or do you plan on using it yourself? Because if you do, and you think it's a broken build that's borderline exploitation...

    Again, for the millionth time, help us help you. Once we know what's the problem, we can all get out voices together. You just seem 100% afraid to be called on your B's or maybe on your lack of skills. This should not matter, if you actually believe your own words saying g this build is broken. Ethics suggest you tell us all what it is, here in a public forum, open to all eyes. That way, we can still have hopes of a fix.

    Keep that in mind... If you want it fixed, help us help you. If I didn't care about this, I wouldn't be saying this again and again and again to you a bazillion times today.

    Have a great day, I'm done with you unless you open your eyes.

    As I said I dont know what exactly he was running but he is not the only one and this is not just one build. Again one of the worst is Pelinals fury and that armor master build that was mentioned earlier.I am pretty sure thats what he was running cause he must have had 5-6k spell/weap dmg or how would he be able hit 10k plus frags on capped resistances?
    There are many ways to do it, it then depends on you how you do it given if you want more dmg, sustain or tankyness.
    The pelinals set up will give you most of that already then you can pare it with blood spawn, sustain or dmg moster sets. The guy I was fighting new how to sustain well so i guess he went full weapon dmg and resistances.

    .
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    @ZonasArch
    Just fyi, there are already yt videos of xing and builds runing this on mag dk. Its just barly moving to sorcs where it becomes even more broken as they have the range and movement

    Plus sorcs and dks dont have to equip 2h to make this work effectivly. As they have major brut in their tool kit
    Edited by Dr.NRG on February 11, 2019 7:50PM
    .
  • Murador178
    Murador178
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    If the sorc is using twillight its pretty normal to get rolled over. But if sorc isnt using a pet, its a tank hitting like a wet noodle.
  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    Murador178 wrote: »
    If the sorc is using twillight its pretty normal to get rolled over. But if sorc isnt using a pet, its a tank hitting like a wet noodle.

    Not if s/he has 4-7k spell dmg.
    For those who dont know what pelinals does, it makes your spell and weap dmg the same. Now that is easy to get a ton of weap dmg though jewelry enchants + traits or by running sets like fury, it is also easy to gain extremely high spell dmg numbers but giving up some magicka sustain. Thats not a bug deal though cause sustain is quite easy, especially when your shields have a ton of resistances so you dont have to spam them.
    .
  • ZonasArch
    ZonasArch
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    @ZonasArch
    Just fyi, there are already yt videos of xing and builds runing this on mag dk. Its just barly moving to sorcs where it becomes even more broken as they have the range and movement

    Plus sorcs and dks dont have to equip 2h to make this work effectivly. As they have major brut in their tool kit

    If you post these videos here, it will change the narrative from "l2p" to "oh yeah, this sucks, let's change it". Totally up to you.

    Btw, I don't play sorc at all.

    Edited, I missed an entire reply you gave to me.

    If you don't know what the build is, exactly, it's worth it to bring it up in a new thread, in a more theory craft approach, see what is breaking it and get the devs attention there. If you're that bother by it, could be worth a shot.
    Edited by ZonasArch on February 11, 2019 8:04PM
  • ezio45
    ezio45
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    ezio45 wrote: »
    Minalan wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Mintaka5 wrote: »
    Any-***-thing else you'd like to add to the magsorc nerf list while we're at it? Bring it! You keep nerfing sorcs, and we keep getting better. LMFAO. No one gets better from having it easy, son <---- @Dr.NRG

    Actually you are wrong. Every time zos is trying to nerf sorcs they cry out and btch so much that they end up getting buffed in the end. The only real nerf sorcs got was the removal of the stun from frags and the long need dix to rune prison.

    Shields were made critable, so sorcs invest in Impen instead of stats and damage like before - like everyone else.

    Shields we're capped, so you no longer run into high shield sorcs, and sorcs have to invest in health and armor to stay alive - like everyone else.

    Sorc shields have armor, but are now vulnerable to armor pen, major breach, and major fracture, where they ignored that before. Now they're like every other class.

    Crystal frags was 'buffed' but the travel time was nerfed so badly it's really your own fault if you don't block or dodge it.

    Overall sorcs are more balanced with other classes, having to take more care on their builds and use actual skill. You have no facts to back up your claims, you got outplayed is all.

    1, no they brought mag more in line with Stam without giving them any of the benefits like higher spell damage and increased ability to rolldodging and cc break

    2 they made sorcs invested into health, mag and STAM. where as all Stam builds only have to invest in Stam and health. They also had sorc invest in armor while being limited to only light because of the lack of good heavy armor mag sets. While Stam has gear heavy dps sets.

    3 shields are vulnerable to pen. Again in light with 5k less weapon resistance than even medium

    So zos is trying to make light mag like Stam without and of the benefits or infrastructure to benefit them

    I would argue tho that magicka has more access to better sets that stam does, especially when it comes to buffs and debuffs. Also, if you are good enough sustaining you can run stam dps sets to get really high spell dmg numbers by paring them with pelinals. Pelinals is a very underated and op set for mag classes if you can build your sustain around it they make some of the hardest hitting and tankiest builds in the game. Stam cannot do that. Also keep in mind weap dmg does not equal spell dmg you usually need a lot less spell dmg than weap dmg respectively. Thats why builds using pelinals are so op cause they allow you depending on how you build to get 4-7k spell dmg.

    I stopped reading at pelinals... Even if you could get high weapon dmg and transfer it with pelinals... pelinals would take up a set Making you loose that damage....

    And mag has good buff sets? Like buff you can already get thru abilitys....

    The only debuff set I've ever used for mag is IA and that was in pve
  • ezio45
    ezio45
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Murador178 wrote: »
    If the sorc is using twillight its pretty normal to get rolled over. But if sorc isnt using a pet, its a tank hitting like a wet noodle.

    Not if s/he has 4-7k spell dmg.
    For those who dont know what pelinals does, it makes your spell and weap dmg the same. Now that is easy to get a ton of weap dmg though jewelry enchants + traits or by running sets like fury, it is also easy to gain extremely high spell dmg numbers but giving up some magicka sustain. Thats not a bug deal though cause sustain is quite easy, especially when your shields have a ton of resistances so you dont have to spam them.

    NOONE IS USING PELINALS...

  • Dr.NRG
    Dr.NRG
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    ezio45 wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Murador178 wrote: »
    If the sorc is using twillight its pretty normal to get rolled over. But if sorc isnt using a pet, its a tank hitting like a wet noodle.

    Not if s/he has 4-7k spell dmg.
    For those who dont know what pelinals does, it makes your spell and weap dmg the same. Now that is easy to get a ton of weap dmg though jewelry enchants + traits or by running sets like fury, it is also easy to gain extremely high spell dmg numbers but giving up some magicka sustain. Thats not a bug deal though cause sustain is quite easy, especially when your shields have a ton of resistances so you dont have to spam them.

    NOONE IS USING PELINALS...

    You couldnt be more wrong;) Is it meta yet? no not even close but ppl are using it and there are build and 1vx vidoes of it out there already too. When it comes to yt you will see it mostly on mag dk for now. In actually people use it on all sorts of mag builds.
    All you lose by equipping this is 1 5piece bonus that could give you any kind of buff. On the other hand reaching way over 4k spell dmg (in some cases over 6k) is totally worth it. The 1-4 piece on it aint bad either as it gives you a good base for what you need in pvp; health, mag recovery and stam recovery.
    Anyways I rather have you not believe me tbh so you wont start running this broken set up..
    .
  • Malamar1229
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    I had a hard time beliving this my self at first until it was shown to me. ZOS actually buffed harden ward to a point that you can make the tankiest dps builds ever on this. Yes you cannot really shield stack anymore but the shield you are getting now is extremely tough to break if your toon is build correctly. I duelled one of these build and couldn’t believe it; My NB 4k weap dmg with 10k pen 56% crit chance and 80% crit dmg could not touch this guys health and he had no problem killing me. Tehn to test I brought a damage dk tank with 30k resistance accross the board and still it took the guy under 10 seconds to kill me.
    I might be not the best pvp but I consider myself pretty good as I can effectively 1vx and win most duells. That guy however was a low rank casuall pvper just running a broken build. He coulnd even animation cancel correctly. So why is this possible? It shouldnt be....
    I really dont mind if shields are op but it should not be so easy to recast. After last patch you now have 3 types of mag sorcs, the ones that cant handle the last patch and who now die instantly, pets sorcs who are a whole other issue besides the facts named, and then these unkillable dps sorcs that hit like a truck. It is just a matter of time for them other sorcs to figure this build out. Also they will get even more buffs this coming patch due to race and cp changes.
    I would suggest to make them a lot more costly and/ or increase costs on recasts.

    Armor master + Necro + Chudan + willpower destro (or master destro), 2 protective + 1 arcane jewelry

    Gets you 30k resists in light armor and a really nice shield that you can stack with Harness Magicka.

    Very tough to kill and still lethal!
    Yeah thats 1 way to do it. Another way is with fortified, will power and wizards back back. Or running other major protection paired with sets like blood spawn. There are many ways to get this result both with light or heavy armor.
    @codestripper

    Anyone wearing that set up and still manages enough to kill you means you are terrible. I have made cockroach builds like that, and they hit for nothing against any competent opponent.
  • Dr.NRG
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    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    @ZonasArch
    Just fyi, there are already yt videos of xing and builds runing this on mag dk. Its just barly moving to sorcs where it becomes even more broken as they have the range and movement

    Plus sorcs and dks dont have to equip 2h to make this work effectivly. As they have major brut in their tool kit

    If you post these videos here, it will change the narrative from "l2p" to "oh yeah, this sucks, let's change it". Totally up to you.

    Btw, I don't play sorc at all.

    Edited, I missed an entire reply you gave to me.

    If you don't know what the build is, exactly, it's worth it to bring it up in a new thread, in a more theory craft approach, see what is breaking it and get the devs attention there. If you're that bother by it, could be worth a shot.


    If I were to do that I would definitely have to name Fury as one of the major issues, which will cause another outrage and drama as ppl love that set in the stam world. Who would have thought this could cause problems with magica..
    Anyhow in order to do that id have to replicate this build which I cant as I dont have the resources cause I am maintaining 7 characters and am broke af haha:)
    I am sure tho this will come up very soon as this has a strong chance if becoming the new meta. Mag dks are already miving that way. Next patch with bretons sustain will make this an easier build to run, too. The thing is these builds are very overpowered but only really broken on mag sorc (as far as I encountered it). Thats why I wanted to adress this with mag sorcs first before both sorcs and fury users start screaming out. Omg it would get so toxic haha
    There is only a small percentage of gamers in this forum who will really say something is broken all others wait untill they cant stand it themselves anymore and thus I fear we will have to wait untill that happends.
    .
  • Malamar1229
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Murador178 wrote: »
    If the sorc is using twillight its pretty normal to get rolled over. But if sorc isnt using a pet, its a tank hitting like a wet noodle.

    Not if s/he has 4-7k spell dmg.
    For those who dont know what pelinals does, it makes your spell and weap dmg the same. Now that is easy to get a ton of weap dmg though jewelry enchants + traits or by running sets like fury, it is also easy to gain extremely high spell dmg numbers but giving up some magicka sustain. Thats not a bug deal though cause sustain is quite easy, especially when your shields have a ton of resistances so you dont have to spam them.

    Sounds like more console conspiracies again. The theory crafting on console and their dueling scene is like watching an episode of Rugrats trying to put the square block into the circle slot.
  • jaws343
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    The OP would hate my build. I gave up on trying to go the resistance route and just specced purely into damage and sustain. My mag sorc is currently running Bright Throat, Spinners, and Slimecraw with Witch mothers and a restro back bar with mag recovery 2 piece (I also run barrier back bar for the passive recovery). I get 2.5K recovery front bar, 3K recovery back bar. 40K mag still, so it hits like a truck with only 2.3K spell damage buffed. And only 19K health.

    With the recovery, I can keep my shields up as quickly as they are taken down. And with 40K mag and 19K health in Cyro, I still get 9K shields. And it hits hard. Just got completely tired of running out of resources trying to work a high health high resistance build in. They work for survival, but killing other people on those builds isn't effective at all.
  • Beardimus
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    Wow a nerf sorc thread, goodness me, scraping the barrel now.

    2018 bar a small spell with runecage sorc took nerf after nerf. That's enough now.

    We warned everyone about wards critting. I sure as heck did, before i had no impen, wards down a pop dead. People wanted to make them bland and crit so they did. Now i run impen, now I'm more stable and harder to kill with wards down but i lose damage or sustain.

    The crys of nerfsorc have made things very bland for sorc and yet... Still they come crickey.

    I've not read the whole thread, mainly as at this point I'm taking nerfsorc thread to be a joke. Ut Whats your suggest OP? Revert wards? So we can move away from impen again and back how we were? Bring it on.
    Xbox One | EU | EP
    Beardimus : VR16 Dunmer MagSorc [RIP MagDW 2015-2018]
    Emperor of Sotha Sil 02-2018 & Sheogorath 05-2019
    1st Emperor of Ravenwatch
    Alts - - for the Lolz
    Archimus : Bosmer Thief / Archer / Werewolf
    Orcimus : Fat drunk Orc battlefield 1st aider
    Scalimus - Argonian Sorc Healer / Pet master

    Fighting small scale with : The SAXON Guild
    Fighting with [PvP] : The Undaunted Wolves
    Trading Guilds : TradersOfNirn | FourSquareTraders

    Xbox One | NA | EP
    Bëardimus : L43 Dunmer Magsorc / BG
    Heals-With-Pets : VR16 Argonian Sorc PvP / BG Healer
    Nordimus : VR16 Stamsorc
    Beardimus le 13iem : L30 Dunmer Magsorc Icereach
  • jaws343
    jaws343
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    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    ZonasArch wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    Aznox wrote: »
    Dr.NRG wrote: »
    My NB 4k weap dmg with 10k pen 56% crit chance and 80% crit dmg could not touch this guys health and he had no problem killing me.

    So ... you dueled an Impregnable MagSorc with a crit build ?
    Tehn to test I brought a damage dk tank with 30k resistance accross the board and still it took the guy under 10 seconds to kill me.

    So ... you died to a MagSorc first or second burst while having near maxed resists .... on a StamDK ? I have bad news for you ...
    You dont get the point. I was dueling the same guy but hes not the only one with this kind of build. Besides the all day top duelers I win 90% of all fights and if I lose I still get them low hp. On top of that I can 1vx up 5 decent gamers. Even if he had impreg on with 4k weap dmg (thats without enchant) and 80% crit dmg 1 to 2 surprise att. should take that shield off easy in a normal scenario.
    For the dk it has 3.9k weap dmg with 1.5k recovery. When you keep being snared and rooted forward momentum wont help you because by the tike you get close the guy will streak and start his crappy rotation over. But anywyas the point im making is that it is possible for mag sorc probably all shield users to be this tanky but still have a ton of dmage and moveability.
    There where other very good duelers on all kind of classes that got wasted by that dude with barly touching his hp.

    You dont see this too often yet but you see more and more ppl figuring this build out as you keep running into them. Just wait and see. You probs gotta leave your zerg for abit tho to really experience this...

    And with that stubborn, shortsighted behavior if yours, it'll get worse. Everyone will run this after live. When there's no more turning back.

    Thick skulled PvPers are the worst. Geez. Failing to see the obvious... We don't want to copy that, we want that fixed, assuming, again, you're not just a whiny loser. Which you probably are judging by how resistant you are to helping us help you.

    Here is one of your other constructive comments... people like you all they achieve is giving ZOS more work having to remove your comments and banning ppl.

    You're just upset because we called you out on your lack of solid info. Just don't be shady when you want something fixed. No way anyone can fix what they don't know it's broken. I hope you can understand that very simple premise of this whoooole thing. I'm not the only one baffled with your stubbornness, and I'm not the only one willing to enforce your request, so long as you disclose what build that was.

    Or do you plan on using it yourself? Because if you do, and you think it's a broken build that's borderline exploitation...

    Again, for the millionth time, help us help you. Once we know what's the problem, we can all get out voices together. You just seem 100% afraid to be called on your B's or maybe on your lack of skills. This should not matter, if you actually believe your own words saying g this build is broken. Ethics suggest you tell us all what it is, here in a public forum, open to all eyes. That way, we can still have hopes of a fix.

    Keep that in mind... If you want it fixed, help us help you. If I didn't care about this, I wouldn't be saying this again and again and again to you a bazillion times today.

    Have a great day, I'm done with you unless you open your eyes.

    As I said I dont know what exactly he was running but he is not the only one and this is not just one build. Again one of the worst is Pelinals fury and that armor master build that was mentioned earlier.I am pretty sure thats what he was running cause he must have had 5-6k spell/weap dmg or how would he be able hit 10k plus frags on capped resistances?
    There are many ways to do it, it then depends on you how you do it given if you want more dmg, sustain or tankyness.
    The pelinals set up will give you most of that already then you can pare it with blood spawn, sustain or dmg moster sets. The guy I was fighting new how to sustain well so i guess he went full weapon dmg and resistances.

    I highly doubt a competent mag sorc build is running Pelinals. There is zero purpose to doing so. If you are running Ravager or Seventh Legion on a mag sorc, you don't have enough magicka or sustain. If you are running Pelinals with Armor Master, Pelinals is literally doing nothing. There are no added weapon damage buffs to increase. And spell and weapon damage enchants provide the same exact increase to your stats. And all of the Spell or Weapon damage buffs for a Sorc are the exact same in the Passives. So there is literally no point in speccing for weapon damage just to run Pelinals on a mag sorc. You could just run BSW or Spell Strat and get nearly the exact same spell damage buff but still running Armor Master and getting 2-4 piece that actually boost your damage.

    What is more likely happening is you are running up against Armor Master and Lich builds with players using Balorgh to boost their damage. I use Balorgh on my Magden and it hits like a truck after popping northern storm.
  • Dr.NRG
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    Beardimus wrote: »
    Wow a nerf sorc thread, goodness me, scraping the barrel now.

    2018 bar a small spell with runecage sorc took nerf after nerf. That's enough now.

    We warned everyone about wards critting. I sure as heck did, before i had no impen, wards down a pop dead. People wanted to make them bland and crit so they did. Now i run impen, now I'm more stable and harder to kill with wards down but i lose damage or sustain.

    The crys of nerfsorc have made things very bland for sorc and yet... Still they come crickey.

    I've not read the whole thread, mainly as at this point I'm taking nerfsorc thread to be a joke. Ut Whats your suggest OP? Revert wards? So we can move away from impen again and back how we were? Bring it on.

    Hey since you just joined ill recap for you. Wards are not the issue themselves, the problem is that they now allow for very broken builds since they take on all your resistances and since you can make builds that are almost capping crit phys and spell resist while maintaining high dmg. There are different ways this can be done. For example some will equip sets like armor master or fortified brass, others will get protective traits on jewelry and run bloodspawn, some will run a mix. Where this becomes a very serious problem is if a skill player equips stam sets like warriors fury and pairs that with pelinals(hp, mag rec, stam rec, spell and weap dmg become the same). By doing so s/he can cap resistances and still have 4-7k spell damage depending on how much they build into sustain for making up not running 5 light.
    Either way some of these builds are so well theory crafted that they become absolutely unkillable (in a 1v1 scenario) while they maintain very high damage (9k plus frags on a dk with 30k spel phys resist and 3k crit resist).

    So the point Im making is we should consider reworking shield (not just sorcs but sorcs especially) make them as they were but rather increase cost on recast same as streak or dogroll works just not as extreme.
    Any other approaches would call for a hard nerf to many sets people love that are not broken on stam but become broken on mag. So that woukd really work without hitting all stam classes hard.
    .
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