Which StamSorc changes are needed next?

Thraben · January 2019

As we all know, the Devs have been making really creative design choices since the last summer. The class defintely feels *different* than before.

Now it´s up to us to give them fresh ideas for further class improvements!

Would you pick...

Neloth · January 2019

All of the above

I can’t decide, honestly all those changes are decent

Latios · January 2019

Assassin´s Incap: Incapacitating Strike now does increased dam... oh, you mean the class with that blue-grey thing around it? Well it´s totally fine as it is. When it´s not breaking my stealth. Maybe decrease its range by 10m.

'AnYtHiNg BrEaKs ClOaK'

Feanor · January 2019

Critical Surge: Totally reworked: Now it´s Summon Real Stamina Class. You call upon the Powers of Oblivion to summon a Real Stamina Class. The Real Stamina Class follows you and uses SubAssault, Venomous Claw, and Biting Jabs on you to show you how it´s done. This can only happen every 10 seconds.

Replace Venomous Claw with PotL and it's decent.

hacker725x · January 2019

Other (explain)

Remove Dark Exchange/Dark Deal cast time 1.2 seconds
Improve sustain issue and rotation, make stamsorc DPS in PVE Group viable.
even zos can make whole resource restore all DOT.

Example:
Cast time: Instant
Cost: [2700 / 2610 / 2520 / 2430] Magicka.
Bargain with darkness to restore 8059 Health and 6000 Stamina over 20 seconds.

StamDK: Combustion/Helping Hands
Stamblade: Leeching Strikes
Stamden: Bull Netch
Stamplar: Restoring Focus
Stamsorc: Dark Deal

Valykc · January 2019

Other (explain)

Both mag and Stam need a serious sustain buff

Ladislao · January 2019

Other (explain)

I'd say that reverting Hurricane morph cost would be enough. Due to the change, it has become too cheap despite the fact that the ability does not imply frequent recast.

I don't think any more nerfs/buffs are needed.

Mettaricana · January 2019

Critical Surge: Totally reworked: Now it´s Summon Real Stamina Class. You call upon the Powers of Oblivion to summon a Real Stamina Class. The Real Stamina Class follows you and uses SubAssault, Venomous Claw, and Biting Jabs on you to show you how it´s done. This can only happen every 10 seconds.

Last option made me laugh

But seriously give us stam frags morph or let it trigger on all skills not just mag. My stam sorc has 5087 wep dmg and 3400 spell dmg even if it triggered on melee skill thatd be a nice in between shot fired.alao be a nice step towards hybrid options.

Make all pets scale on higher of the 2 pools stam or mag so we can have pet stam sorcs.

Give us a spamable attack maoe a wind fist morph of fury that does decent dmg maybe drops the execute for a quick dlg spam punch of wind and it wpuld give me reason to shout falcon punch.

Air atro ult that does physical damage and make it do the non stop spin attack the coa 2 ash titan adds do. Make it explode into stone fragments upon death and despawn.

iCaliban · January 2019

Other (explain)

Stam sorc needs more from class passives. Hell sorc in general needs to not be pigeonholed so much, for example requiring class abilities for the damage boost hurts stam sorc, requiring a daedric summoning ability for the 8% max mag and the increased stamina regen.

I think the idea of a stam sorc being a vehicle for weapon abilities is ok, if they get more meaningful contributions from passives. That way the feel of a battlemage is retained. Buff dark deal.

Nicalas · January 2019

Critical Surge: Totally reworked: Now it´s Summon Real Stamina Class. You call upon the Powers of Oblivion to summon a Real Stamina Class. The Real Stamina Class follows you and uses SubAssault, Venomous Claw, and Biting Jabs on you to show you how it´s done. This can only happen every 10 seconds.

Passive Synergy.

Access to Major/Minor buffs/debuffs on par with other classes.

Actively useable stamina based skills IE Sub Assault,Jabs,Surprise Attack.

Similar sustain options as Templar/Warden/Nightblade.

I care nothing about the concept of an air atro. I want real useable skills and passives. The simple fact my stamsorc doesn't have to stat into half my passives is pathetic.

troomar · January 2019

All of the above

-> Each slotted Clannfear increases your chance to get a free class change token by 1%, up to 3%

Does Shadowrend Set count?

kojou · January 2019

An Air Atronach. 2.5m radius, Does physical melee damage at last. Cannot move, but its damage increases with each slotted class skill

At least the poll is funny. Most polls I have seen lately are boring and pointless.

I would like to see my Stam sorc actually slot one more Sorc skill so Air Attro it is.

Thraben · January 2019

troomar wrote: »

-> Each slotted Clannfear increases your chance to get a free class change token by 1%, up to 3%

Does Shadowrend Set count?

Unfortunately, Shadowrend does not count, as it doesn´t use skill slots. The general general consensus is that such a powerful combat pet as the clannfear should require at least 3 skill slots, particularly now as pets have been heavily buffed with the latest patch. There is an ongoing discussion, though, if Nuzhimeh should also be able to be slotted on two bars, as she is rumored to match even some damage dealers' DPS in daily pledges.

MashmalloMan · January 2019

Other (explain)

While I'm a strong supporter of stam sorc, I'm looking for more unique playstyle and options NOT a buff, we're doing fine besides sustain issues.

The viewpoint that "so many sorc passives" are useless for us is simply untrue from a DD point of view. Whenever I look at warden's for example. I feel bad for them. So many of their passives are useless or require abilities to see use.

For tanks and healers, I'd argue our passives are worse as they're actually very DD central.

I'd say the passive game for us is pretty strong and it's why stam sorc is so good with weapon/wearwolf skill lines.

This seems like it was done by design.

Comparing stam sorc to stam warden

Conditional
8% max sta / 11% light attack dmg w/ bound armor slotted
20% sta reg for daedric ability slotted
2% wep dmg per sorc skill (4% front with hurricane and bound armor)

Universal
5% phys dmg
15% ult cost reduction
5% mag/sta skill cost reduction
1% extra dmg done every 10% hp target has (bye bye implossion)
10% mag reg

Utility
15% sta/mag cost reduction on skill after a block
8% max hp when a daedric summoning pet is active (Greater Storm Atro or future Air Atro

)

VS

Conditional
100% minor berserk with bird of prey slotted
12% sta rec with animal companion ability slotted
3% dmg done per animal companion ability slotted

Universal
4 ult 8 sec cd after animal companion ability
1260 heal on use of animal companion ability
10% minor toughness for 20 sec upon any heal (Can be activated by above passive)

Utility
15% snare reduction
500 resist per winters embrace skill slotted
250 sta/mag return per second when healing with green balance ability
Major mending when healing below 40% with Green balance ability

What I would change.
We need more access to what other classes have access to so we don't get too strong in group content, but we become less group dependant. As well as providing something for groups because we hella shelfish right now.

Rebate passive

SUCKS - rework it esp if we get below pet options.

Exploitation passive

If Dark Deal was instant cast, this would be easier to provide to group
I'd prefer something more passive like NB's and Wardens passive ability to provide their group buff easily
Maybe any time you cast a weapon ability

2 more stam morphs somewhere.

Spammable is not the only option, I'd take a tornado single target DOT
Clanfear to scale with Sta for ranged bow/bow builds to be more interesting instead of spamming snipe
Class Execute - 10m range lightning uppercut gap closer - lightning fists - combine mages fury morphs for mag

Rework to bolt escape

Cost stacking reduction or base cost reduced
Keeps momentum, sticks to terrain at target location instead of falling if above target location
Cast any direction

Instant cast dark deal

4k heal 2k magicka cost 5k sta over 20 seconds
OR at least reduce the duration so it can fit with a 1 second rotation - less clunky

Bound armor

Flip the effects, on cast 11% light attack and 8% sta for 30 seconds. 15% block mitigation while slotted.

Crit Surge

If we got air atro and stam scaling clanfear: crit surge and morphs now heal pets for half the hp on crit
OR Provides major savagery OR minor force for duration(this would be unique and mix up this rearming trap meta)

Air Atro

Cheaper cost/Shorter duration
Can provide major berserk for +1 more team mate
Spinning blades attack or passively has hurricane ability that grows in size
Can move
No ground slam stun

Overload

Could rework an Overload morph for sta return, but I'd rather take air atro if I need to choose

troomar · January 2019

All of the above

Thraben wrote: »

Unfortunately, Shadowrend does not count, as it doesn´t use skill slots. The general general consensus is that such a powerful combat pet as the clannfear should require at least 3 skill slots, particularly now as pets have been heavily buffed with the latest patch. There is an ongoing discussion, though, if Nuzhimeh should also be able to be slotted on two bars, as she is rumored to match even some damage dealers' DPS in daily pledges.

But with this monster set, you can actually have two clannfears at the same time! It should definitely double the chance (the double DPS provided is just a bonus). Nuzhimeh, on the other hand, could give you a chance to steal a class change token from another sorcerer teammate.

Thraben · January 2019

troomar wrote: »

Thraben wrote: »

Unfortunately, Shadowrend does not count, as it doesn´t use skill slots. The general general consensus is that such a powerful combat pet as the clannfear should require at least 3 skill slots, particularly now as pets have been heavily buffed with the latest patch. There is an ongoing discussion, though, if Nuzhimeh should also be able to be slotted on two bars, as she is rumored to match even some damage dealers' DPS in daily pledges.

But with this monster set, you can actually have two clannfears at the same time! It should definitely double the chance (the double DPS provided is just a bonus). Nuzhimeh, on the other hand, could give you a chance to steal a class change token from another sorcerer teammate.

Well, I have to admit, those are very thoughtful considerations. Given the approaching Necromancer class, another Sorc should not feel robbed by his Clannfear using colleague.

Would a change to the suggested Air Atronach help in this regard? I mean, having an immovable Atronach with an effective fighting range of 2.5 meters might encourage clever placement and might offer a unique combat experience in PvP, but it´s borderline OP when used in PvE, particularly since - with the Implosion change - the new Combat Team guys have rightfully demonstrated their firm belief that DPS parses on combat dummies are the gold standard of good class design.

RaptorRodeoGod · January 2019

Other (explain)

Cleanfear is already physical damage, but still scales with magicka tho .-.

Qbiken · January 2019

Stamsorc is in a good spot and doesn´t need any further changes. Air atronach would be a fun thing, but otherwise a really strong class in a good spot.

barshemm · January 2019

Qbiken wrote: »

Stamsorc is in a good spot and doesn´t need any further changes. Air atronach would be a fun thing, but otherwise a really strong class in a good spot.

Strong class for what?

Nicalas · January 2019

Critical Surge: Totally reworked: Now it´s Summon Real Stamina Class. You call upon the Powers of Oblivion to summon a Real Stamina Class. The Real Stamina Class follows you and uses SubAssault, Venomous Claw, and Biting Jabs on you to show you how it´s done. This can only happen every 10 seconds.

Qbiken wrote: »

Stamsorc is in a good spot and doesn´t need any further changes. Air atronach would be a fun thing, but otherwise a really strong class in a good spot.

Murkmire dark deal nerf.
Murkmire Overload 3rd bar removal
Implosion removal

Inferior burst(Sub Assault+DB,Take Flight both superior)
Inferior sustain.
No Major/Minor Buffs Debuffs compared to other stam classes.
No emergency group healing ultimate
No Utility
No stun/snares

LiquidPony · January 2019

An Air Atronach. 2.5m radius, Does physical melee damage at last. Cannot move, but its damage increases with each slotted class skill

The Air Atronach would be especially nice combined with the modified Deadly Strikes set, which unfortunately does not buff the Greater Storm Atro.

Brrrofski · January 2019

Qbiken wrote: »

Stamsorc is in a good spot and doesn´t need any further changes. Air atronach would be a fun thing, but otherwise a really strong class in a good spot.

Clearly you don't play one in pvp.

Only good thing they have is speed. Oh wait, I just got snared.

BaylorCorvette · January 2019

Other (explain)

StamSorc has been my main (and almost only) PvP class for the past 2+ years. I honestly think StamSorc is in an OK spot right now for OPEN world combat. Compared to other classes it can certainly use a little tweaking but it isn't in a super terrible place either. I adapted to the Overload change and losing the 3rd bar and I can honestly say I don't miss it too much now. The Dark Deal change IMO was a buff. We lose 1k burst stam return but get a net gain stam return total. I now buff up and cast a Dark Deal going into combat to get that stam return tic on me. So usually I always cast a preemptive Dark Deal, it has helped with PvP sustain.

In my opinion an Air Atro would only be worth while if it followed you or worked similarly to Eye of the Storm (OR Turned you into an Air Atro!?). StamSorc is a mobility class and an Ulti that was planted on the ground (like how Atro is now) is the exact opposite of that play style. So, Air Atro could be something cool IF implemented correctly.

Crit Surge in its current state is fantastic and shouldn't be touched.

My personal opinion is that StamSorc needs passives reworked since right now 50%+ of the passives aren't even applicable to a StamSorc. The change to Implosion is going to hurt the execute burst which is a shame, but at the same time it was kind of OP in PvP. The change ZoS is making to Implosion has some serious potential, although I think I might prefer it if it made your attacks stronger the lower health the target got, it would support the StamSorc aggressive play style and at the same time is an "execute passive" similarly to how Implosion is on Live right now.

Something else that StamSorc could use is more buffs/debuffs. I think something that would make Bound Armaments actually used is if when you activated Bound Armaments it made your light and heavy attacks apply major fracture.

tl;dr: StamSorc needs more applicable passives and buffs/debuffs.

Elwendryll · January 2019

As we don't have any class spammable. I'd like an overload stamina morph with different L/H attacks (effects and animation) depending on the weapon equipped. If we're bound to rely entirely on weapons, let's follow this direction all the way.

Xvorg · January 2019

Other (explain)

Stam based spammable

LiquidPony · January 2019

An Air Atronach. 2.5m radius, Does physical melee damage at last. Cannot move, but its damage increases with each slotted class skill

Brrrofski wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Stamsorc is in a good spot and doesn´t need any further changes. Air atronach would be a fun thing, but otherwise a really strong class in a good spot.

Clearly you don't play one in pvp.

Only good thing they have is speed. Oh wait, I just got snared.

Or PvE for that matter. What does a stamsorc bring to the table in PvE? No useful buffs/debuffs except for Major Berserk from Greater Storm Atro once in a blue moon, and very low DPS when compared to stamblades and stamdens.

Only thing stamsorc has going for it in PvE is that it's easy to play and survivable. Good for farming vMA is about it.

fred4 · January 2019

I don't get it. I've been playing other classes, but recently converted my Breton to stamsorc. I like it a lot. It beats the crap out of my stam DK in terms of viability and I like the playstyle much better than stamden. Hurricane is great. Crit Surge is great. Streak is great. Dark Deal is great. It kills NBs. It kills DKs. I had the most ridiculous OP duel with my DK friends using a high-crit setup and vMA weapons. That was with the wrong race, no Undaunted Mettle, and lacking Poison Injection. While that initial build felt too squishy in other matchups and had to be toned down, I'm very happy with my stamsorc. I frequently encounter ones that are unassailable in melee fights and fast enough to either escape or gap close in other fights. You guys don't know what you have.

Aedrion · January 2019

All of the above

Personally, I would also make Hurricane apply major fracture, breach and defile to self and minor of these to an enemy.

fred4 · January 2019

BaylorCorvette wrote: »

StamSorc has been my main (and almost only) PvP class for the past 2+ years. I honestly think StamSorc is in an OK spot right now for OPEN world combat. Compared to other classes it can certainly use a little tweaking but it isn't in a super terrible place either. I adapted to the Overload change and losing the 3rd bar and I can honestly say I don't miss it too much now. The Dark Deal change IMO was a buff. We lose 1k burst stam return but get a net gain stam return total. I now buff up and cast a Dark Deal going into combat to get that stam return tic on me. So usually I always cast a preemptive Dark Deal, it has helped with PvP sustain.

In my opinion an Air Atro would only be worth while if it followed you or worked similarly to Eye of the Storm (OR Turned you into an Air Atro!?). StamSorc is a mobility class and an Ulti that was planted on the ground (like how Atro is now) is the exact opposite of that play style. So, Air Atro could be something cool IF implemented correctly.

Crit Surge in its current state is fantastic and shouldn't be touched.

My personal opinion is that StamSorc needs passives reworked since right now 50%+ of the passives aren't even applicable to a StamSorc. The change to Implosion is going to hurt the execute burst which is a shame, but at the same time it was kind of OP in PvP. The change ZoS is making to Implosion has some serious potential, although I think I might prefer it if it made your attacks stronger the lower health the target got, it would support the StamSorc aggressive play style and at the same time is an "execute passive" similarly to how Implosion is on Live right now.

Something else that StamSorc could use is more buffs/debuffs. I think something that would make Bound Armaments actually used is if when you activated Bound Armaments it made your light and heavy attacks apply major fracture.

tl;dr: StamSorc needs more applicable passives and buffs/debuffs.

Aha! I can only agree stamsorc is decent. As I am happy with DB as my main ult, I am actually quite happy to backbar the Atro for the regen passive and use it when taking or defending a flag. It has a use, despite being stationary.

I haven't settled on my weapons, but I would say who cares about the lack of a spammable and CC, when the skills you get are as good as they are. Besides, Streak is a CC. Want to be tanky? Play 1H+S and use Reverb Bash for CC and Defile. I completely don't get the other post that bemoans the absence of debuffs in the sorc class. We're talking about stam. We got 4 weapon skill lines.

Bound Armaments is not something I have actively used, but I assume it would help against Soul Assault and, maybe, Ballista? I assume it would stack with 1H+S?

Thraben · January 2019

fred4 wrote: »

I don't get it. I've been playing other classes, but recently converted my Breton to stamsorc. I like it a lot. It beats the crap out of my stam DK in terms of viability and I like the playstyle much better than stamden. Hurricane is great. Crit Surge is great. Streak is great. Dark Deal is great. It kills NBs. It kills DKs. I had the most ridiculous OP duel with my DK friends using a high-crit setup and vMA weapons. That was with the wrong race, no Undaunted Mettle, and lacking Poison Injection. While that initial build felt too squishy in other matchups and had to be toned down, I'm very happy with my stamsorc. I frequently encounter ones that are unassailable in melee fights and fast enough to either escape or gap close in other fights. You guys don't know what you have.

Ok, one serious note, as the thread has been derailed anyway:

Every Stam class is "unassailable" with the right setup, maybe even a stamplar. Just a matter or TrollKing, and certain other sets. That doesn´t make it more interesting to play, though, compared to what we had 12 months ago.

fred4 · January 2019

I find it particularly noticeable that some stamsorc's health never really moves from 100% until pressured by more than one player. That's not Troll King, nor are they blocking. These are not outright tanks, but typically 1vXers. I can only assume that Crit Surge plays a large part in that, but I haven't figured out all the ingredients. It might include Orc + gold food + Steed mundus, perhaps Lingering Health pots, and of course Vigor. In my own case, I play medium (I just prefer it), and my health bounces around quite a lot. Perhaps that isn't always visible when attacking a stamsorc.

So I guess you're looking for variety. As someone who plays several classes, stamsorc feels pretty unique to me. I can only recommend switching to another class.

The Elder Scrolls Online

Which StamSorc changes are needed next?

Which StamSorc changes are needed next? 83 votes