Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

I guess that's the one funny thing right? This patch we are the best class at escaping. Most people can't catch a double streak + Boundless sprinting sorc.

Exactly! Mag sorc sucks at everything except stealing kills and escaping.

Fortunately those are the two most important aspects of PvP in the high MMR BGs, so I built around that.

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

I guess that's the one funny thing right? This patch we are the best class at escaping. Most people can't catch a double streak + Boundless sprinting sorc.

Exactly! Mag sorc sucks at everything except stealing kills and escaping.

Fortunately those are the two most important aspects of PvP in the high MMR BGs, so I built around that.

Does ICE Destro Ultimate "Eye of the Storm" snare / root the way the locational cast does?

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

I guess that's the one funny thing right? This patch we are the best class at escaping. Most people can't catch a double streak + Boundless sprinting sorc.

Exactly! Mag sorc sucks at everything except stealing kills and escaping.

Fortunately those are the two most important aspects of PvP in the high MMR BGs, so I built around that.

There is no doubt that a MagSorc adds ridiculous killing power to any group. It's just that its solo capabilities have been destroyed by the shield nerf.

Like, honestly your build is playing really selfish in BG's for solo que's.

If I was running Sorc in a BG premade it would be Necro + Shacklebreaker + Balorgh. Twilight Heals are clutch, the max mag makes tool tip so ridiculous that you will 1 shot someone at 40% hp and you need the stam + regen in conjunction with other group buffs for survivability.

Streak + Boundless + Mines is an absolute requirement to kite when groups realize they need to focus you. Take off Healing Ward for Annulment in a group setting if you have a good healer & slot anything else you'll need to get off the Meteor combo. Done.

Too vulnerable to burst though. Maybe if it had some protective traits. Necro shackle was the first thing I tried since that’s what my sorc was using last time I played it.

It’s a selfish playstyle to a degree, but I often times get more healing than anyone else on my team. Bloodspawn means I can hit those resto ults pretty often and mutagen really racks up the healing #s and gives transmutation.

I’m big on proper positioning. If you’ve seen my currently unavailable (back in a week) stream you’ll know that I often ask my team to follow me. Thankfully many of the high MMR BG players are watching my stream and so odds are that if I’m in a high MMR match then at least half the team will recognize me.

Eye of the storm would require me to be too close to opponents for my liking. I prefer to prekite to around 15-20m away at least.

I mean, is that because of your team though that you're being bursted down? If you're being focus fired consistently then instead of running Shackle shouldn't you run Wizard's to group debuff entire teams?

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

I guess that's the one funny thing right? This patch we are the best class at escaping. Most people can't catch a double streak + Boundless sprinting sorc.

Exactly! Mag sorc sucks at everything except stealing kills and escaping.

Fortunately those are the two most important aspects of PvP in the high MMR BGs, so I built around that.

There is no doubt that a MagSorc adds ridiculous killing power to any group. It's just that its solo capabilities have been destroyed by the shield nerf.

Like, honestly your build is playing really selfish in BG's for solo que's.

If I was running Sorc in a BG premade it would be Necro + Shacklebreaker + Balorgh. Twilight Heals are clutch, the max mag makes tool tip so ridiculous that you will 1 shot someone at 40% hp and you need the stam + regen in conjunction with other group buffs for survivability.

Streak + Boundless + Mines is an absolute requirement to kite when groups realize they need to focus you. Take off Healing Ward for Annulment in a group setting if you have a good healer & slot anything else you'll need to get off the Meteor combo. Done.

Too vulnerable to burst though. Maybe if it had some protective traits. Necro shackle was the first thing I tried since that’s what my sorc was using last time I played it.

It’s a selfish playstyle to a degree, but I often times get more healing than anyone else on my team. Bloodspawn means I can hit those resto ults pretty often and mutagen really racks up the healing #s and gives transmutation.

I’m big on proper positioning. If you’ve seen my currently unavailable (back in a week) stream you’ll know that I often ask my team to follow me. Thankfully many of the high MMR BG players are watching my stream and so odds are that if I’m in a high MMR match then at least half the team will recognize me.

Eye of the storm would require me to be too close to opponents for my liking. I prefer to prekite to around 15-20m away at least.

I mean, is that because of your team though that you're being bursted down? If you're being focus fired consistently then instead of running Shackle shouldn't you run Wizard's to group debuff entire teams?

Naw, the hold your ground playstyle doesn’t work if it’s pug v premade and you’re the pug.

Kite or die, baby.

That's what I meant when I said I'd be running Necro + Shackle + Balorgh - I'd only run that if I had a premade. If I wasn't premade I'd run a selfish kill stealing build such as the one you listed haha

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

I guess that's the one funny thing right? This patch we are the best class at escaping. Most people can't catch a double streak + Boundless sprinting sorc.

Exactly! Mag sorc sucks at everything except stealing kills and escaping.

Fortunately those are the two most important aspects of PvP in the high MMR BGs, so I built around that.

There is no doubt that a MagSorc adds ridiculous killing power to any group. It's just that its solo capabilities have been destroyed by the shield nerf.

Like, honestly your build is playing really selfish in BG's for solo que's.

If I was running Sorc in a BG premade it would be Necro + Shacklebreaker + Balorgh. Twilight Heals are clutch, the max mag makes tool tip so ridiculous that you will 1 shot someone at 40% hp and you need the stam + regen in conjunction with other group buffs for survivability.

Streak + Boundless + Mines is an absolute requirement to kite when groups realize they need to focus you. Take off Healing Ward for Annulment in a group setting if you have a good healer & slot anything else you'll need to get off the Meteor combo. Done.

Too vulnerable to burst though. Maybe if it had some protective traits. Necro shackle was the first thing I tried since that’s what my sorc was using last time I played it.

It’s a selfish playstyle to a degree, but I often times get more healing than anyone else on my team. Bloodspawn means I can hit those resto ults pretty often and mutagen really racks up the healing #s and gives transmutation.

I’m big on proper positioning. If you’ve seen my currently unavailable (back in a week) stream you’ll know that I often ask my team to follow me. Thankfully many of the high MMR BG players are watching my stream and so odds are that if I’m in a high MMR match then at least half the team will recognize me.

Eye of the storm would require me to be too close to opponents for my liking. I prefer to prekite to around 15-20m away at least.

I mean, is that because of your team though that you're being bursted down? If you're being focus fired consistently then instead of running Shackle shouldn't you run Wizard's to group debuff entire teams?

Naw, the hold your ground playstyle doesn’t work if it’s pug v premade and you’re the pug.

Kite or die, baby.

That's what I meant when I said I'd be running Necro + Shackle + Balorgh - I'd only run that if I had a premade. If I wasn't premade I'd run a selfish kill stealing build such as the one you listed haha

Ah gotcha! Makes sense.

To be honest, maybe this is to much cheese for you, but I find proc sets to be overwhelmingly OP in BG's. I ran overwhelming + sloads the other night and I don't think I had a single BG in which I didn't get #1.

jaws343 wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

You can't land a rune cage and meteor combo anymore unless lag assists you.

And welcome to Sorcs 2018, where telegraphed burst rotations are shut down by everyone except brain dead zerglings.

Yeah, I mean, no other class has a signal like curse. Curse being put on you is like a heads up in 3 seconds you need to dodge or block.

That coupled with the shield nerf makes it almost impossible to land the combination, so when you do, because it's so easily telegraphed, they absorb it.

I either fight to a draw or have to run away due to limitless sustain for stamina classes.

I don't get how they could make this change to shields.... it was so stupid....

I've been trying to use the telegraphed nature of Curse as an advantage, to varying success. I have been applying it, and then rather than going into a combo immediately, I heavy attack>shield> heavy attack> shield>repeat.

Usually, in that time, Curse goes off after 3 seconds, I land 3 or 4 heavy attacks (or they dodge them all and burn some stamina), and with the shield weave, you get your frag proc. And then, right before the second Curse explosion, I drop my burst. Not many are expecting it, and if you can play defensive enough for 12 seconds, you can work away at their resources as they are expecting the burst earlier.

It doesn't work against everyone, and it doesn't work outnumbered and purge is not your friend with it.

And the delayed burst actually pairs well with a Torugs/Knightslayer setup. Letting the Knightslayer proc and a oblivion enchant proc chip away at their health before the second Curse explosion (and these two sources of oblivion damage together are pretty strong since everyone had to boost their health). Forces them to heal and waste resources that they could be using when you drop your combo.

Yeah I've been considering Knightslayer + Sloads for this exact reason!!!! I also do the same thing, I usually throw a Frag on the 3 second curse to get them to work for it, then spam shield so I have another frag for the 6 second set up, which they usually aren't expecting because most of the time we are refreshing the 3 second curse.

This patch feels very situational and I swap around skills a lot more than I used to. I mainly play BGs and some open world PvP, but that also in no CP.

Meteor I slot for open world or in BGs where I want the passives since I know I will have to use light's champion a lot more due to missing offhealing of my group.

If I want to use an offensive ult nowadays I go DBOS and sometimes negate if there are clumped up groups with a healbot, but saving up that much ulti usually feels like a waste.

I swap between master and asylum staff depending on how many reflects there are.

For combos I change it up depending on the target. I don't really bother engaging someone with 25k+ health unless others are also attacking that person. I definitely use endless fury a lot earlier than I used to since trying to put it on someone who just panic rolldodges is a total waste. Can use streak or DBOS to pop these targets if I manage to get it on them at the start of my combo (often right after curse).

Rune cage is still incredibly strong if you find the barspace for it as you can basically guarantee DBOS to hit them unblocked. I think meteor still works too, but the timing needs to be incredibly precise and the ult is useless outside of the combo for it's cost.

HA -> Curse -> LA -> Execute -> LA Cage -> LA DBOS will kill a lot of people with sub 22k HP. The only problem is to get used to DBOS being melee.

However ult is not always up so you end up in a situation where you are either defensive or spam reach/FP more often than not. HAs are also not to be underestimated in no CP btw.

Lord-Otto wrote: »

^(o_o)
Iii... disagree.

Curse and Dawnbreaker aren't dealing 9k damage. Dawnbreaker IS your stun in a combo, unless you're dealing with permablockers, and you're not gonna kill them, anyway. The necessary combo is Curse-Fury-Dawnbreaker-Frags.

Meteor doesn't combo with Rune Cage anymore. Tested it, let it confirm by others, Rune Cage activates too late. It's useless.

Okay I wrote this a bit misleading. It will set you up to kill people, not outright kill them. No combo does that in no CP atm unless you are fighting potatoes, hit someone who isn't paying attention or have some super glass build.

I disagree with using DBOS as only stun as it won't ever be enough to deplete the stamina of someone you are fighting. If a sorc runs at you using curse -> execute and still runs into your face it's your own fault for not blocking that incredibly telegraphed DBOS. People will block it and if not the first time they will do it the next time since it's BGs and they will remember that you run DBOS. However since it's BGs you will also remember which people are the easy targets and can specifically focus them.

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Simply don't use Dawnbreaker when your opponent is blocking. He can't block forever. Use Reach as your CC when Dawnbreaker is unavailable. And simply keep close to your opponent at all times when running Dawnbreaker, to mask it.

It's funny but the melee ultimate really is the best ultimate for solo open world right now.

The best solo magsorc combo is:
Find ESO install folder > right click > send to recycle bin

Feanor wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

MalagenR wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Thogard

Yeah I saw what your build is meant to do. Still, I’m asking myself if you couldn’t be much more effective on anything else than a Sorc. Yes, Streak is better in a slow world now, and Daedric Tomb adds an element of surprise, but your damage potential and group support would be way better on anything else I guess.

Believe me when I say I’ve tried. I can’t do on Stam what I can do on mag because on Stam I have to make myself vulnerable to try to steal kills. On sorc I can do it from a distance.

If I was fighting bad players then sure, Stam would be fine. Probably better.

But against good players in BGs I need to 1. Be able to kite premade groups and 2. Steal their kills on the third team.

Mag sorc or Stam sorc are the only two viable options for that this patch without having to rely on getting saved by the bg solo queue teammate RNG. Stam sorc seems not as useful for the rest of my own team though, and not as great for the cyro playstyle I’m going for.

I have no problems solo queueing into good premades or running up and bugging whole Zergs while small scaling. It opens up a lot of playtime that would otherwise be spent wasted or looking for easier fights.

I didn’t want to play mag sorc this patch. I wanted my stamden or stamplar to stay viable for my playstyle. But I can’t abide being run down by Zergs or premades and I don’t want to run the spin2win ball group style in cyro that can’t leave home base until the magplar logs in.

I guess that's the one funny thing right? This patch we are the best class at escaping. Most people can't catch a double streak + Boundless sprinting sorc.

Exactly! Mag sorc sucks at everything except stealing kills and escaping.

Fortunately those are the two most important aspects of PvP in the high MMR BGs, so I built around that.

Glad you see it that way. For a moment I thought your stance was Sorc is actually good in Murkmire.

Eh well the thing is that stealing kills and escaping are the two most important things in BG PvP so I’d say sorcs are good in BGs in murkmire.