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StamSorc Werewolf Theorycrafting - Sets & Questions

brandonv516
brandonv516
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This is my first real Stamina attempt in years and I don't want to do the "spin-to-win" style. I really want to play as a Werewolf and I've heard StamSorc is one of the better classes for it. So here is my initial thoughts for the sets:

5 Heavy/1 Medium/1 Light
Ulfnor's Favor
(2 items) Adds 1206 Max Health
(3 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery
(3 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
(4 items) Adds 4% Healing Taken
(5 items) Increases the Magicka or Stamina your Heavy Attacks restore by 30%.

I like this set because I always felt that Werewolf heavy attacks were lacking with resource return. Correct me if I am wrong, but there were some changes with Off-Balance returning more resources. Therefore, if you can get 1 heavy attack off on an "off-balanced" enemy with this set I do believe you are looking at more than half your bar returned.

For my other set, I'm thinking either:
Hunt Leader
(2 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
(3 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
(4 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
(5 items) When your pet attacks an enemy you have also attacked recently, you heal for 2433 Health and restore 1216 Stamina. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.
or
Salvation
(2 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
(3 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
(4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
(5 items) Reduces cost of Werewolf Transformation ability by 33%. While in Werewolf form Weapon Damage is increased by 150.
or even
Plague Slinger
(2 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
(3 items) Adds 1206 Max Health
(4 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
(5 items) When you take damage, you summon a Skeever corpse which will launch a poison ball that deals 5160 Poison Damage every 1.5 seconds at the nearest enemy for 6 seconds. This effect can occur once every 15 seconds.

Just going over these in my head:

The first set would be useless if your pack dies fast. Do they respawn right away? Is the heal cut in half in PvP?
The second set is bread and butter and clearly would be ideal for more time as a Werewolf. This brings the cost to much less than 200.
The third set is interesting to me because of the "cheese" element but it's also 9 seconds of nothing.


For the monster set, I can't help but want to go Troll King, Bloodspawn, Earthgore, or even Engine Guardian for more survivability/sustain. Should I instead go more offensive like Kena, Stormfist, or something else?

Lastly, what carries over to Werewolf? Is it just class passives, poisons, weapon enchants? No weapon skill passives correct?

Thanks!
Edited by brandonv516 on September 30, 2018 3:30PM
  • Stigant
    Stigant
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    I'd try going medium to be honest ...
    Impregnable for tankiness, well fitted small pieces, infused big ones, maybe heavy reinforced chest.
    Prisoners rags on jewelry and DW bar. 2xSwift rings, infused neck
    Monster set ... I'd try chudan, it gives extra health and armor buff you'd miss on ww if your huriccane expires.

    Fast sprinting beast with enough magicka to heal

    Edit: make it Orc and take Berserker morph, your pets won't be able to keep up with you very well
    Edited by Stigant on September 30, 2018 3:57PM
  • brandonv516
    brandonv516
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    Stigant wrote: »
    I'd try going medium to be honest ...
    Impregnable for tankiness, well fitted small pieces, infused big ones, maybe heavy reinforced chest.
    Prisoners rags on jewelry and DW bar. 2xSwift rings, infused neck
    Monster set ... I'd try chudan, it gives extra health and armor buff you'd miss on ww if your huriccane expires.

    Fast sprinting beast with enough magicka to heal

    Edit: make it Orc and take Berserker morph, your pets won't be able to keep up with you very well

    Forgot to add, I am an Argonian. This cannot change as I don't want to spend money on changing it again.

    You said go Chudan for "if your Hurricane expires" - isn't it going to expire very shortly after you turn into a WW?

    You don't feel heavy can be fast with Swift and immovable speed pots?

    Beserker morph is intriguing as bleeds are all the hype these days.
    Edited by brandonv516 on September 30, 2018 4:07PM
  • CatchMeTrolling
    CatchMeTrolling
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    Better off waiting till murkmire, ww resistance is bugged
    Ebonheart Pact: Templar - Overlord - Knight Paladin Tiberium Aka The Golden Saint

  • Stigant
    Stigant
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    Stigant wrote: »
    I'd try going medium to be honest ...
    Impregnable for tankiness, well fitted small pieces, infused big ones, maybe heavy reinforced chest.
    Prisoners rags on jewelry and DW bar. 2xSwift rings, infused neck
    Monster set ... I'd try chudan, it gives extra health and armor buff you'd miss on ww if your huriccane expires.

    Fast sprinting beast with enough magicka to heal

    Edit: make it Orc and take Berserker morph, your pets won't be able to keep up with you very well

    Forgot to add, I am an Argonian. This cannot change as I don't want to spend money on changing it again.

    You said go Chudan for "if your Hurricane expires" - isn't it going to expire very shortly after you turn into a WW?

    You don't feel heavy can be fast with Swift and immovable speed pots?

    Beserker morph is intriguing as bleeds are all the hype these days.

    The reason behind medium is more crit for Berserker bleeds, weapon damage (+15% next patch/+12%to right now), sprint speed and reduced cost, paired with well fited and prisoners rags... your resource management will become no issue while zooming around battlefield hunting down players, always having enough Stam to break free, dodge and sprint, magicka for selfheals, using speeds and lingering pots.

    Argonian will do just fine imho. Orc would be better for the swift warrior passive tho.

    Edit: I play only NoCP PvP, so my view on the subject is very influenced by this POV.
    Edited by Stigant on September 30, 2018 5:20PM
  • Dashmatt
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    Lastly, what carries over to Werewolf? Is it just class passives, poisons, weapon enchants? No weapon skill passives correct?

    Thanks!

    Correct, everything except weapon passives, and any passives that require an ability to be slotted.

    For the sets, I’ve been tempted to try Ulfnors, I think it could be good. The only thing is if you want to rely on Off Balance, with the changes to WW fear you have to trade the Major Fracture morph for it. The set still works either way.

    I am not sure how good Hunt Leader is, but the heal would be reduced by battle spirit. The wolves are apparently better now, and I see a lot more of them in PvP, but I really like Berserker. If you use Ulfnors, another Stamina sustain set may not be necessary anyway.

    I do like Salvation a lot, and I think it has a place, but since sorcs have the reduced ultimate cost passive, I think it is less useful for them.

    I would probably try Shacklebreaker with it, or maybe a damage set like Automaton. It’s really about finding a good balance of offense and defense. In my experience it is better to start with more defense and see how much offense you can get away with, before you feel too squishy.
  • Qbiken
    Qbiken
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    Better off waiting till murkmire, ww resistance is bugged
    It´s fixed on PC, if you´re on console you´ll have to wait until next patch.

    My take on your post:

    * Ulfnor´s Favour:
    Better to utilize heavy attacks on off-balanced targets as you get around 12k stamina back with those if you´re in heavy armor. Easiest way to get off-balance is through Ferocious Roar or the Tactician CP-Passive.

    * Salvation:
    Garbage set in my opinion. The reduced cost might look nice, but once you´ve transformed, you´ve 0 usage for the set. And the extra weapon-damage you get from the 5 piece bonus is mediocre......One of those sets I would like to see reworked into something more useful. Some people will argue that it´s still good/decent set. And for certain builds it´s ok, but there´re better choices.

    * Hunt Leader
    If you can manage to get the set as jewelry and weapons it´s an ok set. You don´t really want to go medium armor in general on werewolf unless you´re using impregnable.

    * Plague Slinger:I´m personally not huge fan of damage proc-sets on a werewolf. I feel you´re better of boosting all your stats. But each to their own.

    Argonian is a nice race to go with. It carries no matter what class/setup you choose to play.


    Sets I think you should look towards:

    * Shacklebreaker
    * Hulking Draugr
    * Green Pact
    * Bone Pirate
    * Warrior´s Fury
    * Savage Werewolf
    * 7th Legion
    * Impregnable (both heavy and medium)
    * Clever Alchemist
    * Imperial Physique (situational)
    * Savage Werewolf
    * Desert Rose
    * Automaton
    * Prisoner´s Rags
    * Ravager

    In terms of monster helmets my choices would be:
    Mighty Chudan, Trollking, Kena, Pirate Skeleton
    Edited by Qbiken on September 30, 2018 5:46PM
    Retired werewolf player, currently getting carried by whatever the FOTM is

    Characters:
    EU
    DC - Octius Ciel - Magicka Sorcerer - Breton
    DC - Evelina Septim - Magicka Templar - Breton
    EP - Josephine Tharn - Magicka Templar - Breton
    DC - Zireael the White Flame - Stamina Sorcerer - Bosmer
    EP - Qbi-One-Kenobi -Stamina DK - Argonian
    AD - Anconeus - Magicka Nightblade - High Elf
    EP - Cirilla Élen Riannon - Magica Dragonknight - Dark Elf
    AD - The Cub of Cintra - Stamina Nightblade - Bosmer
    AD - Alinare Larentius - StaminaTemplar - Redguard
    DC - The Alt-Knight - Stamina Dragonknight - Nord
    DC - Féreldir - Magicka Warden - Argonian
    AD - Kuvirá - Stamina Sorcerer - Redguard
    EP - 1vX Material - Stamina Warden - Orc
    EP - Fenrir the Windwalker - Stamina Sorcerer - Redguard
    EP - Q_Q Mancer Stamina Necromancer - Dark Elf

    NA
    EP - Sister Q - Stamina Sorcerer - Nord

    Trials
    vAA + HM: Completed
    vHRC + HM: Completed
    vSO + HM: Completed
    vMoL+ HM: Completed (Dro-m'Athra Destroyer x 2)
    vMA: Completed, and with 10 characters as Flawless Conquerors.
    vDSA: Completed
    vAS HM: Completed (Immortal Redeemer)
    vHoF + HM: Completed
    vCR +3 (Gryphon Heart)
    vBRP
    vSS HM: Completed
  • Chrlynsch
    Chrlynsch
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    The initial beginning strategy for most wolves is to go all offensive. They get lucky sometimes but usually are the ones that get melted first. This is why most wolves do not make it very long in their pvp careera and look to more mainstream and ironed out avenues of gameplay (dawnbreaker/spinning).

    To have a successful werewolf in pvp you will need several things. Not necessarily all of these are needed but a nice balance will help you as you hone your wolfplay. As you find your playstyle and feel like you can get away with less sustain, less mitigation, less health, you can start putting more damage into your wolf.

    Survival
    -Damage Mitigation
    -Sustained healing
    -Health Pool
    -Mobility

    Damage Mitigation
    Werewolf has a 10k armor and spell resistance passive buff, but dont think that will save you. Most non wolf toons have more survival through major evasion, Major resistance buffs, minor protection, purges, cleanses, cloak, all without the added damage from poison and fighters guild abilities.

    Your added mitigation comes from armor type, weapon type (S&B) and set bonuses
    Impen is just as important here as in human form always run 5-8 Impen unless you use Impregnable.

    Sustained Healing
    Werewolf's burst heal is amazing but unless you spec into it your magicka pool will run out before incoming pressure does.

    If you don't boost your magic return you will need a way to continually heal your self either with increase magicka returns or through sentimental healing via, health regen, lingering health, or set heal procs.

    Argonian and Heavy armor are a great way to increase your magicka return and will keep you in the fight longer.

    Health Pool
    The changes to the werewolf heal that came with Wolfhunter makes it important to keep your healthpool size up. The larger the healthpool the bigger the heal. I Recommend trying to hit the 30k mark while in CP Cyrodiil. The burst of coordinated DB is a real thing and unless you pad your health a bit you will find your

    Mobility
    Werewolves bonus speed is nice, but doesn't help with the fact that you will spend most of your fights sludging through snares. You will need Major Expedition, Swift or both in order to stay relevant in today's day and age.

    Here is an easy beginner no cp setup

    2 Pirate Skeleton
    5 Clever Alchemist
    5 Desert Rose

    Armor type: 5-1-1 Heavy
    Armor Enchants: Stam on all
    Armor Traits: 6 Impenetrable 1 Well-fitted
    Jewel Traits: 3 Swift
    Jewel Glyphs: Weapon Damage
    Dual wield: Nirnhoned main hand, infused offhand
    Weapon glyphs: stamina restore main, Weapon damage off hand
    Race: Argonian
    Food: Tri
    Mundus: Warrior
    Potion: Major Brutality, Stamina, Speed.

    This will give you extra mitigation through Heavy armor, pirate, Argoinan poison resistance and desert rose.

    Magicka regen through Argonian, desert rose, and heavy armor. Lots of wolf heals.

    Desert Rose, Clever Alchemist, Argonian, and 5 heavy, and undaunted 3, all will boost your health pool.

    You will have a massive amount of speed and even when snared you will be able to move around quite easily.

    With your speed pot up you wont need to sprint as you will be moving at 90% increased movement speed.

    Clever will help you break down targets, use it as your exicute.
    Caius
    Pack Leader of Scourge Alliance- First Fang of Hircine, The Beast of Bruma
    PC NA
  • brandonv516
    brandonv516
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    A lot of great advice, thank you everyone! Looks like I can make Argonian work.

    To touch on a few things:

    Very surprised to see multiple people saying Desert Rose as it's a light armor set. That's awesome. I would need to morph the jewelry for that to Swift so that would take some time.

    I've never been a fan of Clever Alchemist (even more with the changes that it has to be IN combat), so I'd look elsewhere for my weapon damage. Seems to be plenty of options.

    I don't see anyone suggesting poisons for Werewolves. Is it not optimal?
  • Chrlynsch
    Chrlynsch
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    The extra weapon damage from savage strength synergizes well with the weapon damage glyphs.

    Posions become trickier to proc in werewolf form as you only have a chance from your light attacks. In human form you get a lot of other chances to improve your poison uptime.
    Caius
    Pack Leader of Scourge Alliance- First Fang of Hircine, The Beast of Bruma
    PC NA
  • brandonv516
    brandonv516
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    So Plague Slinger is completely off the table as the tooltip in game actually reads:
    X poison damage every 1 second at the nearest enemy for 4 seconds. This effect can occur once every 15 seconds.

    They upped the damage a bit but the cooldown is much longer now. Too long for my taste.
    Edited by brandonv516 on October 1, 2018 4:42AM
  • Thraben
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    A lot of great advice, thank you everyone! Looks like I can make Argonian work.

    I don't see anyone suggesting poisons for Werewolves. Is it not optimal?

    Rootpoison could work. You definitely don´t need a damage poison, in that case a weapon enchantment is better.
    Hauptmann der Dolche des Königs

    DDK ist die letzte Verteidigungslinie des Dolchsturz- Bündnisses auf der 30-Tage-No-CP- Kampagne(EU) mit dem Anspruch, in kleinen, anfängerfreundlichen Raid-Gruppen möglichst epische Schlachten auszufechten.

    DDK is the Daggerfall Covenant´s last line of defense on the 30 days no-cp campaign (EU). We intend to fight epic battles in small, casual player friendly raid groups.
  • Feannag
    Feannag
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    Now that ZOS has changed (maybe) the speed meta...would you reconsider the Swift rings...speed always good, but WW start out faster already. Would it be more worthwhile to invest in something else?
    Feannag
  • Amdar_Godkiller
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    What I've been running of late and really enjoy on my Orcplar WW:

    Darkstride

    Prisoner's Rags

    Molag Kena

    High damage, high speed, great sustain, no run cost.
  • brandonv516
    brandonv516
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    Feannag wrote: »
    Now that ZOS has changed (maybe) the speed meta...would you reconsider the Swift rings...speed always good, but WW start out faster already. Would it be more worthwhile to invest in something else?

    Yeah actually I don't want to be restricted to Chudan so I'm thinking Protective would be a good trait. 2 should be good.
    What I've been running of late and really enjoy on my Orcplar WW:

    Darkstride

    Prisoner's Rags

    Molag Kena

    High damage, high speed, great sustain, no run cost.

    That looks really cool. Can you heal enough with this build in WW form?
    Edited by brandonv516 on October 2, 2018 4:19PM
  • Amdar_Godkiller
    Amdar_Godkiller
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    Feannag wrote: »
    Now that ZOS has changed (maybe) the speed meta...would you reconsider the Swift rings...speed always good, but WW start out faster already. Would it be more worthwhile to invest in something else?

    Yeah actually I don't want to be restricted to Chudan so I'm thinking Protective would be a good trait. 2 should be good.
    What I've been running of late and really enjoy on my Orcplar WW:

    Darkstride

    Prisoner's Rags

    Molag Kena

    High damage, high speed, great sustain, no run cost.

    That looks really cool. Can you heal enough with this build in WW form?

    Yes definitely, as long as you become accustomed to sprinting in circles/kiting around your opponent to build up magicka. While sprinting you have the equivalent of roughly 2500 mag recovery. With one swift as an orc in 5 medium armor you are at the movement speed cap while sprinting.
  • crashen17b14_ESO
    crashen17b14_ESO
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    I know Breton is super off-meta, but that just happens to be what my werewolf stamsorc is. Just how screwed is he, being a breton and not an orc or redguard? Is there any way to bend the magicka bonuses to his advantage?
  • brtomkin
    brtomkin
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    I know Breton is super off-meta, but that just happens to be what my werewolf stamsorc is. Just how screwed is he, being a breton and not an orc or redguard? Is there any way to bend the magicka bonuses to his advantage?

    The heal now scales off of health, but it still costs magicka, so you could say the Breton will get more heals due to reduced cost and bigger pool.

    PS4 NA: Pickmans__Model, CP 1300+
  • Amdar_Godkiller
    Amdar_Godkiller
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    Breton's like Argonians are actually not only fine as stam builds in PVP, but honestly OP.

    4K spell resistance
    Bonus AP
    Reduced cost on your heal
    And a larger magicka pool are awesome

    FWIW, Redguard isn't the even the best race for WW, especially in pvp, because sustain isn't an issue for WWs since half our damage comes directly from Light attacks.

    I would say that all of the following are better than Redguard for WW in PVP (and one of my two WWs is actually Redguard):

    1. Argonian (best WW class because god-like resource management and better than 20% stronger WW heals (9% max health, 5% healing received and done; these factor into each other multiplicative rather than additive. My 7K WW heals would be over 8K if I played Argonian.

    2. Orc - Better damage than Redguard, more health, and better healing, plus bonus sprinting speed

    3. Imperial - 166% max stam modifiers are possible in WW form with 158% max health if you use an imperial warden. This is the literal resource cow of the game.


    In PVE, Orc is still going to better, and Imperial and Khajit will be just as good.

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