Zanen wrote: »

If you have 12 characters you can get 72 keys a day. Even on one character you're going to get something usable pretty quick if you keep at it, it's way better than it used to be.

Let's assume the average vet hardmode dungeon takes 20 minutes to complete in addition to waiting 10 minutes in dungeon finder, so 30 minutes total per dungeon (and I'm being generous with these estimates).

That means you'd need to dedicate 18 hours a day to farming dungeons. It also means you can't have a job or a family or ANY other responsibility in life (such as eating and sleeping). That is insane justification for the RNG in this game.

Tannus15 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

The odds of getting the shoulder you need are 1/288.

Korean MMOs have better odds on gear than this

Your math is wrong.

it's 1 in 12. He just wants Iceheart anything.

That's in Gilirion the Redbeard's chest (god i hope that @Fly666monkey is opening the correct chest)
There are 12 different shoulders on offer from that chest. Trait is irrelevant as is armour weight.
The OP has had seriously back luck.

Trait and weight are absolutrly relevant for endgame content.

Fly666monkey wrote: »

50 keys in and I have not seen hide or hair of the Iceheart shoulders, let alone any with the weight and trait I want. The past few weeks has been nothing but doing pledges over and over again. And I'm hearing stories of people going through upwards of 120 keys with no luck?

Who in their right mind thought this was a good design decision?! I know a skinner box when I see one. Implement a token system already.

160 keys and I only got 5 illambris from opening the same box, all of them with chappy traits. Safe to say I got ZOSed.

Zanen wrote: »

If you have 12 characters you can get 72 keys a day. Even on one character you're going to get something usable pretty quick if you keep at it, it's way better than it used to be.

RNG sometimes really blows though, the dungeon/arena weapons are way worse than shoulders.

Really? You're advising to just suck it up and do 36 dungeons a day?

"Oh c'mon guys it's not that bad, just quit your job and run pledges."

I finally got my divines grothdarr shoulder yesterday which took months to get. Every time I get Iceheart it's prosperous. Now I can hoard keys until I need something else.

It's not that big a deal, first you grind for the set pieces and then just plug a way here a little there a little until you get the traits you want.

Fly666monkey wrote: »

EldritchPenguin wrote: »

jpeter88 wrote: »

way to many people complain about RNG, its part of MMO's, people expect everything fast and free with zero grind. could you imagine how boring this game would be if you got everything you wanted the first go? it is frustrating and i do agree they need a token system of sorts but there needs to be a grind or the game is just dead. dont play the game if its that frustrating, simple as that.

If the OP had burned 3 keys and then made this thread, I would agree with you. But we're talking about 50 keys here. That is 25 hard mode runs minimum. That's 8 days worth of dailies for one character, and that's if every single one of them was a hard mode dungeon, which is only feasible if you are either an extremely strong player already and can carry groups through hard mode DLC dungeons, or you have a really good guild full of players that doesn't need to be carried in the first place. So it could be 8 days worth of dailies for one character, or it could be 16.

Now, I don't know about you, but I think it's more than reasonable to say that 8-16 days worth of farming should be more than enough to get a single Iceheart piece to complete the set. It doesn't have to be enough farming to get the BiS trait and armor weight, but it's not reasonable to spend that much time looking for a usable item and never get it.

I don't think there's anything wrong with giving adequate items to players left and right. Let people run around with 2 medium Grothdarr pieces in Prosperous and Training after their first few Undaunted dailies. The grind for BiS items is and should be hard, but it should be relatively easy to get baseline equipment that will be adequate until you have the means to grind out a better version of it.

Thank you for being reasonable.

It's not the grind itself that's the problem, it's that I, and many other players, have nothing to show for it.

But thats not entirely true is it?

Every pledge gets you a monster piece.

maybe each key turned in did not give you the one piece you wanted... glirion has 11 sets to drop so turning in 50 keys has a 92% chance of giving you a given set and thus an 8% chance of not *if* the RNG is spread evenly and there is zero guarantee or warranty saying thats the case. The odds of a given set and weight and trait out of 50 keys is much lower - on the order of 5% or less if my math holds.

So, one could argue that betting say 50 hours of time against an 8% chance of what one considers "nothing to show for it", an 87% chance of what was called "baseline gear" and even then only about 5% chance of getting exemplary (exactly what you wanted" gear to be a poor choice.

As a poster described above, similar to what i do, is a more productive approach might be to look at what you have and build accordingly.. For me, i have ended up using maybe 1 in 3 of my pledge key pieces on one character or another at various times in various builds. if one is willing to accept "not in right trait or weight" and "baseline" and "adequate" equipment then there are a lot of builds that meet that criteria coming out of many of the drops.

The RNG is only as frustrating as the person coming at it believes in coming at an RNG for getting a single specific result is reasonable.

Same problem here with engine guardian. The grind in this game puts most korean MMOs to shame.

Still haven't gotten my grothdarr shoulders in divine. I've spent 100s of keys on that same chest. I've gotten so many divine iceheart shoulders though...

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

Fly666monkey wrote: »

50 keys in and I have not seen hide or hair of the Iceheart shoulders, let alone any with the weight and trait I want. The past few weeks has been nothing but doing pledges over and over again. And I'm hearing stories of people going through upwards of 120 keys with no luck?

Who in their right mind thought this was a good design decision?! I know a skinner box when I see one. Implement a token system already.

I think we just grouped for PvP.

My advice to all MMO people who say "I'm sick of X"?

Don't do "X". Seriously. It isn't needed. No single piece of gear is so important that you're locked out of content without it. If the key grind kills you, just do other stuff for a few weeks.

Yeah, I think heading out for PvP and avoiding dungeons did me some good. I think at this rate I'll just wait for the gold vendor to pop up.

This is the only enjoyment in this game. Grouping, kicking, 15 min waiting, loot begging, not understanding of Planar Inhibitor mechanics, ragequiting, tank searching, kicking fake tank, wiping, low dps whining, getting Skoria helmet with training. All this fun stuff.