Normal, version I, veteran, version II... I'm confused...

NewbieKenobi · October 2016

So the patch notes declares

All Dungeons now have both a Normal and Veteran modes.
Previous Dungeons which had a unique Veteran mode have been converted to Version I and II; each version now has a Normal and Veteran mode.
Fungal Grotto will now be known as Fungal Grotto I and Fungal Grotto II.

But they don't really go inte to detail what exactly what this really mean...

Why didn't Zeni just add a Normal mode to say Fungal Grotto and call it Fungal Grotto Normal, keeping the original version and calling it Fungal Grotto Veteran, and then taking the original Selene's Web calling it Selene's Web Normal and then cranking up a version of it calling it Selene's Web Veteran?!?!

It's pretty confusing haveing a Fungal Grotto I and Fungal Grotto II but just a Selene's Web or a Blackheart Haven... I mean like, why didn't Selene's Web get a Selene's Web I and a Selenes's Web II??? There is just no consistency to the dungeon naming and versions now...

They could at least have called the (e.g.) Fungal versions Normal, Veteran, Pretige and Elite or something... Fungal I Normal, Fungal I Veteran and Fungal II Normal and Fungal II Veteran is both confusing and a bit... (sorry) cheap...

Could someone pls explain this to me as if I were a five year old?

I really don't get the whole version I and II thing...

Thx guys!

ZOS_RichLambert · October 2016

Story is separated from difficulty now. Some dungeons have multiple stories, which is why you will see Fungal Grotto I and Fungal Grotto II. (In your example, Selene's Web doesn't have a story 2)

Normal and Veteran are the difficulty mode of the dungeon.

So, short version is if you see a I or a II next to the name of the dungeon, that is the story you are choosing. You can do it in either normal or veteran difficulty.

DeadlyRecluse · October 2016

NewbieKenobi wrote: »

Why didn't Zeni just add a Normal mode to say Fungal Grotto and call it Fungal Grotto Normal, keeping the original version and calling it Fungal Grotto Veteran, and then taking the original Selene's Web calling it Selene's Web Normal and then cranking up a version of it calling it Selene's Web Veteran?!?!

It's pretty confusing haveing a Fungal Grotto I and Fungal Grotto II but just a Selene's Web or a Blackheart Haven... I mean like, why didn't Selene's Web get a Selene's Web I and a Selenes's Web II??? There is just no consistency to the dungeon naming and versions now...

Prior to 1 Tamriel, MOST dungeons had a normal mode and a vet mode--but not all! Selenes, Arx, Blackheart, Direfrost, etc. did not have a vet mode--and the DLC dungeons from the IC patch and the SotH patch had a vet mode, but no second storyline (normal and vet were different difficulties of the same dungeon). Most of the base game dungeons, though, had normal and vet modes that had different storylines: Banished Cells normal and Banished Cells Vet, for instance, had different mobs, bosses and story.

Essentially, some dungeons were actually two different dungeons in the same physical location.

So now the dungeons that had a normal and vet story are called "1" and "2," and normal/vet is just a difficulty toggle. Hence Fungal 1 and Fungal 2, but only just Selene's--and all three of those examples come in normal and veteran difficulty.

Rune_Relic · October 2016

..

...bah inb4.....oh....too late

Enodoc · October 2016

Story and Difficulty is now separate. Maybe this will help:

"Spindleclutch I" is what used to be "Normal Spindleclutch". There is now a "Normal Spindleclutch I" and a "Veteran Spindlecluch I", both of which follow the same story "Deadly Whispers", just with different difficulty. That's the one where Praxin Douare is the story questgiver, and The Whisperer is the final boss.
"Spindleclutch II" is what used to be "Veteran Spindleclutch". There is now a "Normal Spindleclutch II" and a "Veteran Spindlecluch II", both of which follow the same story "Blood Relations", the sequel to "Deadly Whispers", just with different difficulty. That's the one where Guardian Sud-Hareem is the story questgiver, and Vorenor Winterbourne is the final boss.
This setup, where "Normal" became "I" and "Veteran" became "II", exists for every dungeon that had a different story in its Veteran mode: Spindleclutch, Fungal Grotto, Banished Cells, Wayrest Sewers, Elden Hollow, Darkshade Caverns, Crypt of Hearts, and City of Ash. Each of these now has two stories (I and II), and two difficulties for each (Normal and Veteran).
The other base-game dungeons, which were only Normal and did not have a second story or a Veteran mode, now have a Veteran mode which is just a more difficult version of the existing Normal dungeon: Arx Corinium, Volenfell, Tempest Island, Direfrost Keep, Blackheart Haven, Selene's Web, Blessed Crucible, and Vaults of Madness.
The DLC dungeons, which already had a Normal and Veteran version of the same story, are essentially unchanged: White-Gold Tower, Imperial City Prison, Cradle of Shadows, and Ruins of Mazzatun.

Edit: Wow, ninja'd by @ZOS_RichLambert himself

anitajoneb17_ESO · October 2016

Enodoc wrote: »

Edit: Wow, ninja'd by @ZOS_RichLambert himself

Speaking of which... @ZOS_RichLambert ...

Please give of story II for all dungeons...
Why would you give up on this ? You sure had some work done in the drawers already...
I know you said you prefer to work on new stuff rather than old stuff, but sorry, I don't buy this "explanation". Is it some copyright/legal issue with Sage's team ?

I know I'll never get that question answered - you couldn't even if you wanted to.

But... just be aware... we would really, REALLY welcome "story II" of every old dungeon. Vet City of Ash was just GREAT. We want them all.

Enodoc · October 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Edit: Wow, ninja'd by ZOS_RichLambert himself

Speaking of which... ZOS_RichLambert ...

Please give of story II for all dungeons...
Why would you give up on this ? You sure had some work done in the drawers already...
I know you said you prefer to work on new stuff rather than old stuff, but sorry, I don't buy this "explanation". Is it some copyright/legal issue with Sage's team ?

I know I'll never get that question answered - you couldn't even if you wanted to.

But... just be aware... we would really, REALLY welcome "story II" of every old dungeon. Vet City of Ash was just GREAT. We want them all.

Simplest answer, that I can guess, is that it's due to the Tamriel Unlimited change in business model. All the new content they create now needs to bring in revenue through DLC sales, meaning that anything that focused on adding more content to the base game (Story II for dungeons, expanded delves in Tier 2/3 zones, spellcrafting, horse racing, etc) was shafted to the bottom of the list, as it can't be sold as DLC.

Waffennacht · October 2016

It would have made sense just to completely rename the II version dungeon.

Essentially the I and II are completely different dungeons and are considered as such (just deal with the same story)

So Banished Cells I is a dungeon, has both vet and normal mode
Banished Cells II (the re-banishing) is a completely different dungeon with vet and normal

Enodoc · October 2016

Waffennacht wrote: »

It would have made sense just to completely rename the II version dungeon.

Essentially the I and II are completely different dungeons and are considered as such (just deal with the same story)

So Banished Cells I is a dungeon, has both vet and normal mode
Banished Cells II (the re-banishing) is a completely different dungeon with vet and normal

Technically they did. Their full titles, when you enter the dungeon through the door, are
"The Banished Cells I: Banishing the Banished" and "The Banished Cells II: The Plan". So they essentially attached the name of the quest to the dungeon's title. But for ease of grouping, it's easier to say "LFG vBC2" than "LFG vet The Plan".

Elsonso · October 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Story is separated from difficulty now. Some dungeons have multiple stories, which is why you will see Fungal Grotto I and Fungal Grotto II. (In your example, Selene's Web doesn't have a story 2)

Normal and Veteran are the difficulty mode of the dungeon.

So, short version is if you see a I or a II next to the name of the dungeon, that is the story you are choosing. You can do it in either normal or veteran difficulty.

Thanks.

@ZOS_RichLambert It seems rather generic to use the I and II numbering scheme. Did you consider more specific names?

delclay23 · October 2016

Different drops in different dungeons