Death Stroke: Reduced the damage of this ability and its morphs by 4.5%.
Incapacitating Strike (Death Stroke morph): This morph now always stuns the target when it is used, regardless of the caster’s health. This morph now also deals Disease Damage instead of Magic Damage.
Teleport Strike: Reduced the damage of this ability and its morphs by 6.5%.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
ShadowStarKing wrote: »Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
You forgot to mention that Leap, and Sweeps are both AoE ultimates.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »ShadowStarKing wrote: »Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
You forgot to mention that Leap, and Sweeps are both AoE ultimates.
Yes, they are both aoe and both do less damage and DO NOT give any buffs OR debuffs to the enemy along with cost more than soul harvest/incap.Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
First, im sorry but there is NO WAY you are hitting 14k funnel healthy in pvp. Maybe PVE however PvP ur damage is reduced by 50% plus cp mitigation.
Second comparing death stroke to lethal arrow makes no sense. Yes lethal arrow gives defile but you must charge lethal and it has to hit. Plus I have not been hit for over 8k lethal arrow in PvP in some time.
Third, every class can pve dps competitively, and specifically magblade has one of the best pve dps rotations in game. Stamblade lacks a little but is still very good. Think we can all agree that these changes weren't made for pve.
As far as the aoe to single target debate in PvP single target burst wins, and THE BEST class ultimate in the game for single target burst is death stroke bar none. When you consider the cost versus the pitential damage output only ultate even close is overload, and itcan be dodged, reflected, blocked, silenced, and is probably the slowest animation in game aside from dark flare.
These are sorely needed changes.
The primary theme of this discussion is not about whether the reductions were necessary in pvp; rather, it is about where the offsets for that damage reduction are in pve. Are there any? Where will magblades turn to in order to make up for this difference? Lotus Fan is not largely used in a pve rotation (unless you're a tank, in which case the question still stands, because tanks in this update are supposed to be cranking out more damage,) but 4.5% damage reduction during execute phases does matter.Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Killa4hire89 wrote: »ShadowStarKing wrote: »Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
You forgot to mention that Leap, and Sweeps are both AoE ultimates.
Yes, they are both aoe and both do less damage and DO NOT give any buffs OR debuffs to the enemy along with cost more than soul harvest/incap.Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
First, im sorry but there is NO WAY you are hitting 14k funnel healthy in pvp. Maybe PVE however PvP ur damage is reduced by 50% plus cp mitigation.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »First, im sorry but there is NO WAY you are hitting 14k funnel healthy in pvp. Maybe PVE however PvP ur damage is reduced by 50% plus cp mitigation.
Hmmm, try this:
1 mundus shadow + full julianos + will power and something else (Kena + MS sharpened staff) 7 light
Now try, grim focus + entropy + shadowy disguise and Funnel Health.
How much did you hit?
And that's only one way to get those numbers
Killa4hire89 wrote: »First, im sorry but there is NO WAY you are hitting 14k funnel healthy in pvp. Maybe PVE however PvP ur damage is reduced by 50% plus cp mitigation.
Hmmm, try this:
1 mundus shadow + full julianos + will power and something else (Kena + MS sharpened staff) 7 light
Now try, grim focus + entropy + shadowy disguise and Funnel Health.
How much did you hit?
And that's only one way to get those numbers
That's actually very similar to my pvp setup. For my build, using the Shadow, Kena, and vMA destro are integral parts of the setup, and are accredited the majority of the power this build wields.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
Yes, but the mag Blade is a lot of fun in PVP too. On the whole I think you're making interesting points though. As an aside I always viewed Lotus Fan as a tank/crowdbuster/magblade skill so I think they're on the right track there. Magblade also gets Sap Essence, which is by far a better skill than power extraction in my view. There are pros and cons to both, but I really feel that on the whole Nightblade is probably the best done class in the game right now. Everything just feels 'right' with it, and I actually feel torn between using different skills and skill combos. When it comes to my Sorcerers and Templars though, I feel very on the rails, and I think this is a complaint of a lot of folks.
ShadowStarKing wrote: »@Killa4hire89
DB does more dmg than Incap plus it can passivly add WD, deals extra dmg to werewolfs/vamps and is a cone AoE so it can't be dodged.
Leap also deals more dmg and is an AoE(although it can be dodged) it can travel far(into keeps) the other morph can give a dmg shield.
Templars ult is also and AoE and guess what? It cost 75 ult only a different of 25 to cast and could give dmg mitigation the more enemies that are hit.
Death stroke didn't need a nerf.
Literally every comparison in this game is apples to oranges. It's been that way since day one. If it were always apples to apples, there would be only 1 class.Killa4hire89 wrote: »ShadowStarKing wrote: »@Killa4hire89
DB does more dmg than Incap plus it can passivly add WD, deals extra dmg to werewolfs/vamps and is a cone AoE so it can't be dodged.
Leap also deals more dmg and is an AoE(although it can be dodged) it can travel far(into keeps) the other morph can give a dmg shield.
Templars ult is also and AoE and guess what? It cost 75 ult only a different of 25 to cast and could give dmg mitigation the more enemies that are hit.
Death stroke didn't need a nerf.
You are are comparing apples and oranges. DB is a fighters guild ultimate and again costs DOUBLE what incap does and it doesn't give near the buff that incap does. Incap is I believe 6% damage increase on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds. Compared to DBs 6% (5% from DB and 1% from FG passive) weapon damage buff. Compared to other low cost CLASS ultimate from a PvP perspective it outclassed everything. You talk about leap being an aoe it costs a minimum of 110 ult (take flight) or 125 (unmorphed and ferocious leap). Not to mention you saying it hits harder than incapacitate is just not true. Max I have seen is 14k on a LA target who was running no impen. Average is about 7-8k. Which is same as incap w/o the 25% buff from CP.
This is highly subjective and I suspect a case of classism. I believe your first post was the one that demanded we be objective, so please do the same.Killa4hire89 wrote: »THIS WAS A GOOD CHANGE. NB is still the most OP class in game for both stam and magic in the current meta, and it doesn't look like it is going to change.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »ShadowStarKing wrote: »@Killa4hire89
DB does more dmg than Incap plus it can passivly add WD, deals extra dmg to werewolfs/vamps and is a cone AoE so it can't be dodged.
Leap also deals more dmg and is an AoE(although it can be dodged) it can travel far(into keeps) the other morph can give a dmg shield.
Templars ult is also and AoE and guess what? It cost 75 ult only a different of 25 to cast and could give dmg mitigation the more enemies that are hit.
Death stroke didn't need a nerf.
You are are comparing apples and oranges. DB is a fighters guild ultimate and again costs DOUBLE what incap does and it doesn't give near the buff that incap does. Incap is I believe 6% damage increase on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds. Compared to DBs 6% (5% from DB and 1% from FG passive) weapon damage buff. Compared to other low cost CLASS ultimate from a PvP perspective it outclassed everything. You talk about leap being an aoe it costs a minimum of 110 ult (take flight) or 125 (unmorphed and ferocious leap). Not to mention you saying it hits harder than incapacitate is just not true. Max I have seen is 14k on a LA target who was running no impen. Average is about 7-8k. Which is same as incap w/o the 25% buff from CP.
THIS WAS A GOOD CHANGE. NB is still the most OP class in game for both stam and magic in the current meta, and it doesn't look like it is going to change.
Proof please.Killa4hire89 wrote: »You only get the passive weapon damage on DB if you choose morph that doesnt stun.
And it is not true that magblade is outpaced by everything in pve. Magblade is very competitive and one of the best damage/utitlity classes in game.
Not useful to a magblade whatsoever.Killa4hire89 wrote: »If DB is better than use DB. it is in FG for a reason.
Please explain to me how this makes sense, or how this is objective. You came to this thread, which specifically asks for feedback pertaining to methods to supplement magblade pve dps to offset these changes, and have done little more than share your own classist bias thus far, which has been almost entirely focused around pvp. We have been analyzing your suggestions and they have been found wanting. Don't get salty towards others because we are still looking for an answer to the actual question that was asked.Killa4hire89 wrote: »This was a good change and if you can't see that then you are obviously biased.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »You said in your first post that only use was for passive ult gain. There are several ultimate available to you that are good. You can use meteor, soul tether, or even warhorn or barrier for support.
As for competitive pve dps builds for Magblade in not going to explain to you how to do it as I don't have the time. Look up deltia he gives great builds and has said that Magblade is one of best pve dps builds
I'm not salty, I am stating the facts. This was changed specifically for PvP where it was overperforming in relation to other ultimates.
Sorry if your offended or aggravated by what u say but it is the fact.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »You only get the passive weapon damage on DB if you choose morph that doesnt stun.
And it is not true that magblade is outpaced by everything in pve. Magblade is very competitive and one of the best damage/utitlity classes in game.
This was a good change and if you can't see that then you are obviously biased. If DB is better than use DB. it is in FG for a reason.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
Killa4hire89 wrote: »I have to disagree with both of you, and here is why. This ultimate give major defile (reduced healing) increases your damage on EVERYTHING for 6 seconds, costs only 50 ultimate AND either A: passively boosts ultimate gain or B: Stuns on activation. That's not to mention that the skill on it's own hits like a Mac truck.
I have been hit in PVP by a magblade with this for 13k. Now at the time of this I had approximately 20k phys resist, 23k spell resist, and 2550 critical resistance. No other ultimate can compare to this kind of damage output and low cost. Closest is overload which is easily the easiest ultimate in the game to counter.
Lets compare low cost class ultimate. Sorc overload is great damage and lower cost but really easy to dodge. DK Dragon leap is strong but DOUBLE the cost of death stroke and is still the only ultimate in game that is literally negated by root spam. Templar crescent sweep costs more, has no cc, and does WAY less damage (if you can even get it to hit with it's buggy range).
I am sure if you look at it objectively you will see that this adjustment was needed from a PvP point of view, where Nightblades already reign supreme.
I believe that I have been very objective thus far, for the record. The OP could have easily been a rage post, but the intent here was to gain insight from the community, not cause a ruckus.
To summarize your point as it pertains specifically to a magblade, Soul Harvest hits too hard in pvp, and that merits a reduction. I do find this interesting and I won't outright disagree. I have hit many people with Soul Harvest in pvp and used it to win a fight.
However, you claim a 13k hit on Soul Harvest... when I can crit for 14k with my Swallow Soul. That's a spammable, extremely low-cost skill that also heals me, generates ultimate, and passively boosts my healing received. Why does it hit harder than Soul Harvest, if this ultimate is so overpowered? Like I mentioned in the OP, most people I know use it for the passive ult regen and little else. It finds its way into my pvp build, but not because of its superior damage.
Also, compared to something like Lethal Arrow, the Major Defile component of Soul Harvest is of a very short duration. It has all of the benefits of Soul Harvest (minus the ult gen), except does them way better, especially considering with lethal arrow you can be 30m away and still reap the same benefits, without any of the risk of being melee. I know many archers in pvp who will snipe (not even from stealth) and crit other players for 15-17k. All of this together makes the argument against Soul Harvest look fairly dull.
Until DB, many NBs were shifting over to Incap Strike specifically because of the stun component for pvp. Now magblades can't really do that (at least it isn't supported by the soundest of logic), which just makes me question it more. If the aim was to balance it out in pvp, then why is the pve-favored morph seeing reductions with no offsets? It's not like magblades were pulling highest dps relative to every other class and build, and the sole reason was Soul Harvest.
I don't consider myself an ignorant individual. I recognize that there are many who share in your opinion of magblades. Let's assume that the reductions to both skills were sorely needed for pvp, and we all accept that. Where is the pve offset?
Last I checked, magblade dps in pve falls behind stam DKs, magicka DKs, magicka Templars, stam NBs, magicka Sorc, and even many stam sorcs (especially in this update). This is the primary reason for my inquiry. I win more fights in Cyrodiil with Prolonged Suffering and light attacks than I ever have with Soul Harvest.
How are you hitting 14k swallow souls!? You're soul harvest must be hitting for over 20k