It is finally here, and the opening post leads me to believe were talking about issues around large scale PvP instead of AOE caps - so Im going to jump right in on this.Healing abilities currently cap at 6 targets, where damage can hit up to 60 targets (100% to the first 6, 50% to the next 24, and 25% to the last 30).
Ive heard this idea dropped in one of our We Are ESO podcasts by you before Wrobel and Id like to strike at it in more detail. If healing and damage mechanics were the same (picking random targets) this issue with AOE caps wouldnt be as bad as they are. But because of smart healing (which I dont expect you to remove or change due to it being core to your game since its inception) is what makes the damage get the short end of the stick.
If youre hitting 16 people, and 6 for full at a time, youre picking 6 different targets each time. If youre hitting 24, or 30 players, the statistical chance you hit the target that you wanted to hit, who you previously put the most damage on, keeps getting worse and worse. Ultimately, its extremely unlikely to hit the target you want and burst that guy down. Instead, you have to throw out overwhelming amounts of damage and actually out damage their healing by a large margin in a short span of time (something not possible when significantly outnumbered. This becomes impossible when you factor in templar ult for reduction but more importantly: barrier.
Now you mentioned barrier, which is great. This ability absolutely and completely counters a burst from realistically happening. It also is compounded by the fact that you cant even crit shields (an issue shared with small scale magicka sorcs - but to stay on course here) the amount of uncrittable damage 1 barrier provides a full group is absolutely ridiculous.
All in all, AOE caps creates a situation that encourages you to bring numbers SIMPLY BECAUSE THE MORE YOU HAVE, THE MORE CHANCE YOULL TAKE 50% DAMAGE. It creates quantity over quality. Quantity already provides you the advantage of having more tools and bodies at your disposal.
I really wont be satisfied with anything short of full removal of AOE caps - because if you just raise the bar up, you have the same issue at a larger scale and youre not fixing the problem, youre promoting a worse one. To have more people stack more people.
Whoever takes the most damage, will get all of the heals, because smart healing targets whoever is lowest. Damage is randomly picking targets. Because of this design - you need to remove AOE caps.We want AoE abilities to be useful in PvP. That being said, we don’t want them to be the end all be all - single target abilities should also be useful.
Single target abilities will still be useful - 100%. In fact, I cant even AOE groups if theyre too big, the only viable option is to use single target to hope to burst through specific people. AOE is good, but its only as good as the numbers you have AOEing and the difference between what youre AOEing against. Again, the meta now because of the 50% damage nerf this patch is all about numbers. 50% less damage, then 50% from AOE caps if youre not the unlucky 6.
With that said - you should be discouraging people from balling up all of the time. THERE IS NO THREAT, NO RISK, NO REASON NOT TO. Fixing det is a good first step, but you shouldnt put 1 skill in the game that is the end all be all of countering these ball groups. The game design IS NOT GOOD to encourage this style of play. THERE MUST BE RISK INVOLVED, OR EVERYONE WILL DO IT. This is what Cyrodiil has become, because that is what has been promoted by all of these changes.
When players are forced to split and scatter to avoid the damage or ults of another group trying to strike at them while theyre all grouped, THAT is when you would switch to single target. That is how you bring single target combat back into this equation. But a lot of these groups, they dont even use single target at all. Because you dont give them a reason to. They have gap closers, survivals, buffs/utility, and AOE. They will literally gap closer and use steel tornado because it may be there best skill to damage with. If you created a reason for people that they HAD TO SCATTER they would switch to their single target, and back to AOE when they have the ability to counter in the same fashion.
This style of PvP existed more before, it exists less today.The intention of the caps and falloff is that AoE damage will be able to outpace healing in large group battles, but not dominate it.
This plays into the first part but I want to come back to it again. A large group may take 500k damage, but a barrier will eat up most of that (this is post mitigation damage too, so its being spread pretty slowly) - and technically none of those people could have dropped below 10k hp despite receiving an equal amount of healing, because the smart healing is going to prioritize those who need it, while the damage is being spread all over the place. This system is so screwed up - Im not even sure how it can be tolerated as a thing for mass PvP.
It sends a clear message to me. You want the game to be more casual friendly and youre giving people a cushion so they dont have to play as well, or try as much. You dont want them to die easily and become discouraged. The reality is, youve lost just as much playerbase creating a ball group meta that has smothered your servers performance, its backfired in a gruesome way.
Additionally, this patch, more than any other, should allow players to take on AOE damage with the damage reduction, whereas in 1.6, it was easier to burst down with AOE. I get this game is for everyone, and I dont want to discourage people from playing it by making it too hard. But ultimately you have great players making great ball groups too that will crush these more casual players getting into larger groups if you actually did remove AOE caps just as well.
Removing AOE caps needs to be done because the game in its current state is 100% about quantity over quality. It has never before been as much about it as it is now, and if you dont take radical action to change this, you will lose what remains of players that want to create a great PvP environment. Theres a lot of alternatives around the corner - not to derail/threaten this offtopic, but its a reality. You need change quickly, and if you dont, a lot of the players who have stuck around through a lot of crap, are out once they find that magic we felt in earlier days of Cyro somewhere else.
Remember that a group of 5 players is not going to be able to kill a group of 20 players in most situations. It is possible if you catch the group completely off guard or funnel them into a tight space, but in a straight up 5 on 20, the larger numbers are going to win most times.
We use this on We are ESO podcasts, and its true - but I dont even know why you need to say this. Its like a reassurance to ball groups and zergs that you arent willing to make changes to bring things where they need to be. Which is GIVING EVERYONE A FAIR SHOT IN A FIGHT
Changes that should be made:
Immediate changes:
Step 1) Remove AOE caps [No discussion needed] (Wrobel Team)
Step 2) Change Barrier & Purge [Discussion needed: How do you do this? If you cast 1 barrier in a 24 man group and it hits 12, will a 2nd one hit the 12 who didnt get it? This will change things where groups simply run 2 barriers at a time. Will it randomly pick targets? This changes the design of it, and not necessarily in a bad way, but will alter how its functionally used by ball groups today. As far as purge is concerned, this will still be used to the effect it is today, even if you limited targets down to 4, they would assign 3-6 people that can purge. Consider how strong purge is and how it effects other things, like siege, otherwise changes here will be void.] (Wrobel Team)
Step 3) Make AP gains distributed equally across the board, no bonus for large groups. [No discussion needed] (Wheeler Team)
Step 4) Rework siege [Discussion needed - not testing] (Wheeler Team)
Post AOE caps:
Step 5) Evaluate Removal of AOE Caps; Discuss Dynamic Ult Gen [Discussion needed post AOE cap removal - NEW ult gen system, not like the old one, but not static] (Wrobel Team)
Going to stop there for now - because the list goes beyond mechanic changes at that point to design changes. The rest is design changes that can encourage people to be spread out, have other objectives and new things to do. Youve probably heard these ideas on the We Are ESO podcast if youve watched them. EI: City objectives and IC changes. These are mid/long term goals. The above is your short term IMMEDIATE goals that need to come in now.
usmcjdking wrote: »As for Magicka Detonation, I am going to reference my favorite Dota 2 play of all time.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=5K2CNiECTeo
That, my friends, is Echo Slam and what Magicka Detonation should be designed after. Echo isn't that much damage if it only hits one player. Echo is dumb powerful if it hits a lot of players, but unlike magicka detonation, Echo Slam is an all or nothing skill.
IMO, the best way to fix MD is to rework the skill. Make it very high risk with a very high reward.
- This skill should cost all of your remaining magicka (whether 100% or 5%). ALL OF IT.
- Base tool tip damage reduced by about 33%.
- 5m initial AOE.
- Anyone effected by the primary blast deals 1X% of their maximum magicka in a 5 meter radius around them.
- No AOE cap.
Last week, we had a really successful discussion on player abilities. It was super constructive and we got a ton of really great feedback. This week, we’d like to have that same constructive discussion with AoE caps and falloff. AoE caps are something that have been talked about on the forums for a while now and discussion has picked up recently, especially with regards to PvP. We’d like to discuss them in a bit more detail and provide some design goals for the system, as well as the overall vision for larger scale PvP in ESO.
We want AoE abilities to be useful in PvP. That being said, we don’t want them to be the end all be all - single target abilities should also be useful. The intention of the caps and falloff is that AoE damage will be able to outpace healing in large group battles, but not dominate it. Healing abilities currently cap at 6 targets, where damage can hit up to 60 targets (100% to the first 6, 50% to the next 24, and 25% to the last 30).
With that being said, there are a few situations where healing is able to out scale damage. The first step we are taking is to look at some of the abilities that heal far more than we would like in large group fights. We’re specifically looking at Purge and Barrier initially, and will be reducing the max targets these abilities can hit. While we are looking at specific abilities, we are also looking into Magicka Detonation. This ability was always intended to be more effective versus groups and less effective against individual targets, and it is not meeting those design goals currently.
Remember that a group of 5 players is not going to be able to kill a group of 20 players in most situations. It is possible if you catch the group completely off guard or funnel them into a tight space, but in a straight up 5 on 20, the larger numbers are going to win most times.
For feedback this week, we’d love to hear about situations in which you feel like you are having problems against large groups of players. Include the number of players you’re fighting against, abilities you believe they are using, and abilities you feel need tweaks to make them more effective against larger numbers.
Waffennacht wrote: »From what I understand it is not the fact that 5 players are facing 20, it's how the 20 ball up making a single target impossible and ontop of that reducing the amount of AoE damage.
In fact a 20 person vs 5 would maintain the 20 man advantage even with an AoE increased damage per player in area.
It would just force them to seperate allowing for single target, it's not like an AoE covers the whole freaking keep.
Also, historically speaking, a well defended position SHOULD be able to have 5 vs 20.
Remember WW2? The allies were looking at a 10 to 1 loss attacking the defended beeches! Yes a well positioned defense should have a mad ratio like that!
usmcjdking wrote: »As for Magicka Detonation, I am going to reference my favorite Dota 2 play of all time.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=5K2CNiECTeo
That, my friends, is Echo Slam and what Magicka Detonation should be designed after. Echo isn't that much damage if it only hits one player. Echo is dumb powerful if it hits a lot of players, but unlike magicka detonation, Echo Slam is an all or nothing skill.
IMO, the best way to fix MD is to rework the skill. Make it very high risk with a very high reward.
- This skill should cost all of your remaining magicka (whether 100% or 5%). ALL OF IT.
- Base tool tip damage reduced by about 33%.
- 5m initial AOE.
- Anyone effected by the primary blast deals 1X% of their maximum magicka in a 5 meter radius around them.
- No AOE cap.
You dont fix a meta by putting 1 skill in the game - that is used by only magicka users.
@MountainHound Makes a good point about the math. We all agree that the numbers don't seem right, though we also have to consider many scenarios that do not make the calculations so simple.
Back in the good old days, on campaign reset days we (I ran with Alacrity at the time) used to cap our groups at 12 people until we felt that we needed 4 more to win some fights. 16 was the most we would run with, as beyond that the AP gains were too diluted. Now, most of us who run larger groups agree that we prefer smaller ones. It takes more skill and finesse, and it's a lot easier to control smaller groups than 24 people at once - and is thus more fun for a good leader. The state of the game today makes it less feasible to win consistently against larger groups (which, regardless of what we all say here, will continue to exist), so those of us who can do so will probably continue to run full (24 person) groups when we feel it's necessary.
Should every player in a group share AP gains? Consider that a lot of roles might not participate as much, or if a target is squishy, two people can kill the target based on whoever has the lowest latency before anyone else's skills go off. I believe that the answer to this question has to be yes. The following questions are based on this answer being yes.
What about someone who casts a purge or a buff on the players who get the kill? Should they share in the AP? If a healer sees @Sypher about to die while trying to gank a player on the back line of an opposing group, and casts a heal saving @Sypher's life, how much of the upcoming AP that @Sypher makes killing his target - and his next target(s) should that person get? If it would have taken @Sypher 90 seconds to run back to the fight, and he kills 8 people before that time limit is up, how much of the AP he made is fair to be shared? 50% of the first kill is an obvious answer. Perhaps a percentage of all AP made until he goes out of combat? Everything that you want to suggest needs to have a simple mathematical formula that can be implemented in game.
What about someone who casts a debuff on the opponent? Should they share in the AP? They didn't do much (if any) damage, though their contribution reduced the opponents skills cast / uses their resources / prevents them from being effective for a time. How can that contribution be measured? To test this in current, I tried going solo (not a group member) and fear-spamming while two friends killed opponents. I made no AP doing so. Is this reasonable? My contribution being the stealther who feared a target while two other people killed said target before the fear was over seems like it should be of value (and thus worth AP on the kill).
What about someone who is in a tank build and absorbs a lot of damage so that the glass cannons who kill the opponent don't have to? Should they share in the AP? There are two people who run with me regularly who are masters of the body block. DKs who gap close to a target with their flappy flap up, shield, and stand in front of a glass cannon build who can finish the target off quickly. The DK protector saved the glass canon, the glass cannon knows that he/she couldn't have won the fight without the protector, so is that person entitled to sharing AP? Logically, there needs to be a game-intelligence-capable decision made about this, so the data that the game collects in real time has to feasibly be able to decide. I'm sure we all agree that the protector sharing AP is reasonable, though how can that be calculated? If it's based on to whom the opponent does damage, then a lot more people in the area will likely share in AP who should otherwise not.
What about someone who casts a caltrops in order to tag all opponents that other people kill? Should they share in the AP? They've tagged all opponents, but the amount of damage to each target as compared to using DPS skills is minimal. Right now, someone who does minimal damage to a target that dies will get very little AP compared to the player(s) who did most of the damage. I'm not certain what the ratios / math details are, though it is noticeable.
What about someone who spams mutagen or healing springs to tag all the allies with heals? Should they share in the AP that the people they tag kill? What about the AP that the group members of the people they tag make and is thus shared with the people they tagged with heals? A complex scenario is if non-grouped-person heals a healer who is part of a group and prevents said healer from dying, then that healer heals a glass cannon group member thus preventing him/her from dying, and the glass cannon kills a target. The original person is indirectly responsible for saving the life of the person who made the kill. Should this solo healer get any portion of the AP gain? There are people who like to play solo and prefer healing rather than DPS. How are these people supposed to make AP?
Another interesting scenario is if two people are each part of different 24-person groups. Those two people participate equally in killing an opponent. Right now, both those people along with everyone in range in their groups (who is in range) will get about 100 AP.
usmcjdking wrote: »usmcjdking wrote: »As for Magicka Detonation, I am going to reference my favorite Dota 2 play of all time.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=5K2CNiECTeo
That, my friends, is Echo Slam and what Magicka Detonation should be designed after. Echo isn't that much damage if it only hits one player. Echo is dumb powerful if it hits a lot of players, but unlike magicka detonation, Echo Slam is an all or nothing skill.
IMO, the best way to fix MD is to rework the skill. Make it very high risk with a very high reward.
- This skill should cost all of your remaining magicka (whether 100% or 5%). ALL OF IT.
- Base tool tip damage reduced by about 33%.
- 5m initial AOE.
- Anyone effected by the primary blast deals 1X% of their maximum magicka in a 5 meter radius around them.
- No AOE cap.
You dont fix a meta by putting 1 skill in the game - that is used by only magicka users.
Which, if you actually bothered to do anything other than kneejerk-stam/magicka-paradigm respond you would realize that a vast majority of the damage is NOT coming from the initial damage, but the echo'd magicka explosion from other enemy characters standing in proximity. This forces magicka users to stay away from the zergball or get their entire team gibbed.
Let's put this in the context of your stam sorc.
You see a nice zerg ball of 15 players just standing on itself derping and spamming purges/healing springs. You buff yourself with surge/lightning form then prime proximity det.
You hit critical charge when the timer hits 1 second and prox det goes off hitting all players, it does about 2.5k damage on the initial explosion, pretty crappy cuz stam right? Right.
However, due to these new mechanics, say there was 7 Magicka (Averaging 30k magicka amongst them) and 7 stamina (averaging 14k amongst them) and 1 hybrid tank sitting at 22k magicka. The average for all of their magicka pools is 22k, which means that each target you hit will resonate for another 2.2k (before reduction) damage. That's 35.5k damage as a stam sorc, before reductions.
So, balling up gets you punished by Magicka Det which is what @Wrobel stated was his purpose for the skill.
hammayolettuce wrote: »usmcjdking wrote: »usmcjdking wrote: »As for Magicka Detonation, I am going to reference my favorite Dota 2 play of all time.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=5K2CNiECTeo
That, my friends, is Echo Slam and what Magicka Detonation should be designed after. Echo isn't that much damage if it only hits one player. Echo is dumb powerful if it hits a lot of players, but unlike magicka detonation, Echo Slam is an all or nothing skill.
IMO, the best way to fix MD is to rework the skill. Make it very high risk with a very high reward.
- This skill should cost all of your remaining magicka (whether 100% or 5%). ALL OF IT.
- Base tool tip damage reduced by about 33%.
- 5m initial AOE.
- Anyone effected by the primary blast deals 1X% of their maximum magicka in a 5 meter radius around them.
- No AOE cap.
You dont fix a meta by putting 1 skill in the game - that is used by only magicka users.
Which, if you actually bothered to do anything other than kneejerk-stam/magicka-paradigm respond you would realize that a vast majority of the damage is NOT coming from the initial damage, but the echo'd magicka explosion from other enemy characters standing in proximity. This forces magicka users to stay away from the zergball or get their entire team gibbed.
Let's put this in the context of your stam sorc.
You see a nice zerg ball of 15 players just standing on itself derping and spamming purges/healing springs. You buff yourself with surge/lightning form then prime proximity det.
You hit critical charge when the timer hits 1 second and prox det goes off hitting all players, it does about 2.5k damage on the initial explosion, pretty crappy cuz stam right? Right.
However, due to these new mechanics, say there was 7 Magicka (Averaging 30k magicka amongst them) and 7 stamina (averaging 14k amongst them) and 1 hybrid tank sitting at 22k magicka. The average for all of their magicka pools is 22k, which means that each target you hit will resonate for another 2.2k (before reduction) damage. That's 35.5k damage as a stam sorc, before reductions.
So, balling up gets you punished by Magicka Det which is what @Wrobel stated was his purpose for the skill.
Stam user using prox det and magicka user using prox det I two totally different dmg numbers.
Prox det isn't the answer
Removing AOE caps is the answer.
It is finally here, and the opening post leads me to believe were talking about issues around large scale PvP instead of AOE caps - so Im going to jump right in on this.Healing abilities currently cap at 6 targets, where damage can hit up to 60 targets (100% to the first 6, 50% to the next 24, and 25% to the last 30).
Ive heard this idea dropped in one of our We Are ESO podcasts by you before Wrobel and Id like to strike at it in more detail. If healing and damage mechanics were the same (picking random targets) this issue with AOE caps wouldnt be as bad as they are. But because of smart healing (which I dont expect you to remove or change due to it being core to your game since its inception) is what makes the damage get the short end of the stick.
If youre hitting 16 people, and 6 for full at a time, youre picking 6 different targets each time. If youre hitting 24, or 30 players, the statistical chance you hit the target that you wanted to hit, who you previously put the most damage on, keeps getting worse and worse. Ultimately, its extremely unlikely to hit the target you want and burst that guy down. Instead, you have to throw out overwhelming amounts of damage and actually out damage their healing by a large margin in a short span of time (something not possible when significantly outnumbered. This becomes impossible when you factor in templar ult for reduction but more importantly: barrier.
Now you mentioned barrier, which is great. This ability absolutely and completely counters a burst from realistically happening. It also is compounded by the fact that you cant even crit shields (an issue shared with small scale magicka sorcs - but to stay on course here) the amount of uncrittable damage 1 barrier provides a full group is absolutely ridiculous.
All in all, AOE caps creates a situation that encourages you to bring numbers SIMPLY BECAUSE THE MORE YOU HAVE, THE MORE CHANCE YOULL TAKE 50% DAMAGE. It creates quantity over quality. Quantity already provides you the advantage of having more tools and bodies at your disposal.
I really wont be satisfied with anything short of full removal of AOE caps - because if you just raise the bar up, you have the same issue at a larger scale and youre not fixing the problem, youre promoting a worse one. To have more people stack more people.
Whoever takes the most damage, will get all of the heals, because smart healing targets whoever is lowest. Damage is randomly picking targets. Because of this design - you need to remove AOE caps.We want AoE abilities to be useful in PvP. That being said, we don’t want them to be the end all be all - single target abilities should also be useful.
Single target abilities will still be useful - 100%. In fact, I cant even AOE groups if theyre too big, the only viable option is to use single target to hope to burst through specific people. AOE is good, but its only as good as the numbers you have AOEing and the difference between what youre AOEing against. Again, the meta now because of the 50% damage nerf this patch is all about numbers. 50% less damage, then 50% from AOE caps if youre not the unlucky 6.
With that said - you should be discouraging people from balling up all of the time. THERE IS NO THREAT, NO RISK, NO REASON NOT TO. Fixing det is a good first step, but you shouldnt put 1 skill in the game that is the end all be all of countering these ball groups. The game design IS NOT GOOD to encourage this style of play. THERE MUST BE RISK INVOLVED, OR EVERYONE WILL DO IT. This is what Cyrodiil has become, because that is what has been promoted by all of these changes.
When players are forced to split and scatter to avoid the damage or ults of another group trying to strike at them while theyre all grouped, THAT is when you would switch to single target. That is how you bring single target combat back into this equation. But a lot of these groups, they dont even use single target at all. Because you dont give them a reason to. They have gap closers, survivals, buffs/utility, and AOE. They will literally gap closer and use steel tornado because it may be there best skill to damage with. If you created a reason for people that they HAD TO SCATTER they would switch to their single target, and back to AOE when they have the ability to counter in the same fashion.
This style of PvP existed more before, it exists less today.The intention of the caps and falloff is that AoE damage will be able to outpace healing in large group battles, but not dominate it.
This plays into the first part but I want to come back to it again. A large group may take 500k damage, but a barrier will eat up most of that (this is post mitigation damage too, so its being spread pretty slowly) - and technically none of those people could have dropped below 10k hp despite receiving an equal amount of healing, because the smart healing is going to prioritize those who need it, while the damage is being spread all over the place. This system is so screwed up - Im not even sure how it can be tolerated as a thing for mass PvP.
It sends a clear message to me. You want the game to be more casual friendly and youre giving people a cushion so they dont have to play as well, or try as much. You dont want them to die easily and become discouraged. The reality is, youve lost just as much playerbase creating a ball group meta that has smothered your servers performance, its backfired in a gruesome way.
Additionally, this patch, more than any other, should allow players to take on AOE damage with the damage reduction, whereas in 1.6, it was easier to burst down with AOE. I get this game is for everyone, and I dont want to discourage people from playing it by making it too hard. But ultimately you have great players making great ball groups too that will crush these more casual players getting into larger groups if you actually did remove AOE caps just as well.
Removing AOE caps needs to be done because the game in its current state is 100% about quantity over quality. It has never before been as much about it as it is now, and if you dont take radical action to change this, you will lose what remains of players that want to create a great PvP environment. Theres a lot of alternatives around the corner - not to derail/threaten this offtopic, but its a reality. You need change quickly, and if you dont, a lot of the players who have stuck around through a lot of crap, are out once they find that magic we felt in earlier days of Cyro somewhere else.
Remember that a group of 5 players is not going to be able to kill a group of 20 players in most situations. It is possible if you catch the group completely off guard or funnel them into a tight space, but in a straight up 5 on 20, the larger numbers are going to win most times.
We use this on We are ESO podcasts, and its true - but I dont even know why you need to say this. Its like a reassurance to ball groups and zergs that you arent willing to make changes to bring things where they need to be. Which is GIVING EVERYONE A FAIR SHOT IN A FIGHT
Changes that should be made:
Immediate changes:
Step 1) Remove AOE caps [No discussion needed] (Wrobel Team)
Step 2) Change Barrier & Purge [Discussion needed: How do you do this? If you cast 1 barrier in a 24 man group and it hits 12, will a 2nd one hit the 12 who didnt get it? This will change things where groups simply run 2 barriers at a time. Will it randomly pick targets? This changes the design of it, and not necessarily in a bad way, but will alter how its functionally used by ball groups today. As far as purge is concerned, this will still be used to the effect it is today, even if you limited targets down to 4, they would assign 3-6 people that can purge. Consider how strong purge is and how it effects other things, like siege, otherwise changes here will be void.] (Wrobel Team)
Step 3) Make AP gains distributed equally across the board, no bonus for large groups. [No discussion needed] (Wheeler Team)
Step 4) Rework siege [Discussion needed - not testing] (Wheeler Team)
Post AOE caps:
Step 5) Evaluate Removal of AOE Caps; Discuss Dynamic Ult Gen [Discussion needed post AOE cap removal - NEW ult gen system, not like the old one, but not static] (Wrobel Team)
Going to stop there for now - because the list goes beyond mechanic changes at that point to design changes. The rest is design changes that can encourage people to be spread out, have other objectives and new things to do. Youve probably heard these ideas on the We Are ESO podcast if youve watched them. EI: City objectives and IC changes. These are mid/long term goals. The above is your short term IMMEDIATE goals that need to come in now.
For feedback this week, we’d love to hear about situations in which you feel like you are having problems.
-Usually against any group of player's who know how to stack on-top of each other, explanation below. (Ball Group's)The number of players you’re fighting against.
Abilities you believe they are using, and abilities you feel need tweaks to make them more effective against larger numbers.
timidobserver wrote: »Remember that a group of 5 players is not going to be able to kill a group of 20 players in most situations. It is possible if you catch the group completely off guard or funnel them into a tight space, but in a straight up 5 on 20, the larger numbers are going to win most times.
In that case, why does the 20 player group need the added advantage of free damage reduction given that you are admitting that they have the advantage and will most likely defeat 5 players anyway? Currently in a 5 v 20, the 20 player group gets reduced damage just for standing next to each other on top of their natural numbers advantage.
I'm curious how difficult it would be to remove the AoE caps on the coding side.
Why not make a 7-day campaign to test PvP changes like this?
MisterBigglesworth wrote: »
Maneuver should just break on casted heals too (not hot ticks) - that would solve all of it´s issues