A unbiased Nirnhoned/Reinforced poll

G0ku · June 2015

Keep Nirnhoned as-is, but change reinforced to apply globally to all armor pieces/trait used as Nirn does now

I just want to see the instagibbing of players dissappear. I feel they first have to fix their penetration values and other existing failures.

Saddest thing for me at the moment is that it still does not make any sense to wear heavy arnor at all. Every single patch I try to cover my DK in steel and return to light armor because I survive the same time with rolling out more damage...

Garwulf · June 2015

Go to bed Rylana

Nirnhoned is 'hard' to find and expensive to buy. Reinforced trait is as common as muck. If nirnhoned is to be nerfed then it will need to be easier to find and cheaper to buy. Nine trait armour for example is currently essentially pointless. In the end unless ZoS removes classes and allows us to do essentially as we wish with character development there is never going to be equality. Something will always be the darling of the month.

Nerf, Nerf go the seals......

Armitas · June 2015

Other Solution

I think both nirn and reinforced should apply flat values so that they are equally valuable no matter what weight of armor you are wearing. Beyond that distinction my vote is to make reinforced competitive with nirnhoned.

Emma_Overload · June 2015

Other Solution

BEST solution right here:

1) Keep Nirnhoned as it is.

2) Keep Reinforced as it is.

3) Introduce a NEW trait that buffs physical armor the same way Nirn buffs spell resistance.

BigTone · June 2015

Nerf Nirn, Buff Reinforced

The insta gib has to stop. There should be some kind of buff to wearing heavy armor. they tried to do that with 1.6 but it didn't work because of the ridiculous amount of penetration that can be achieved. Give us the physical equivalent to nirn and raise the hardcap on physical resistance. Make physical nirn scale based off of how much heavy armor you wear.

Tripwyr · June 2015

Keep Nirnhoned as-is, but change reinforced to apply globally to all armor pieces/trait used as Nirn does now

As I voted, I agree with Rylana that current TTK will be substantially worse if Nirn is nerfed to work the same way Reinforced does now. I believe Reinforced should instead be buffed to where Nirn is now, and all armor penetration effects should be significantly reworked. Armor penetration is ridiculous, it should never be a feature in any game.

Rook_Master · June 2015

Nerf Nirn, do not change reinforced

First of all Nirnhoned needs to be FIXED not nerfed.

TTK is a separate issue.

Jolinius · June 2015

I have mixed feelings about this. Ill be on my dk in full light apprentice stone with nirn weapon and an 8k crit flame lash and be hitting vamps in execute range for 800 crit but then turn around and get hit with a 19k crystal frag and im wearing 5 nirn.....and i wonder what could have been.

I do think it needs to be toned down but after they fix ALOT of things wrong right now.And only after that.

Septimus_Magna · June 2015

Nerf Nirn, Buff Reinforced

Cinbri wrote: »

Nirn 100% must be nerfed as wearing Light Armor with nirn allow you to be as tough vs magicka as Heavy Armor users.

Thats a bad comparison, I have a gear set with 5LA/1MA/1HA with S&B, 7 gold quality nirn gear pieces gives me 28k spell resist on my S&B bar.

Someone with 5HA/1MA/1LA with only 1 gold nirn piece will have the same amount of spell resist, 2 gold nirn pieces will put him over the cap of 32,5k spell resist.

That having said, my 28k spell resist isnt even that much spell resist. Most LA destro staff builds have 12k spell penetration, so my effective spell resist is only 16k with 7 gold nirn pieces!!! LA builds without at least 3 nirn pieces is just like wearing a bathrobe, it offers 0 protection against spells.

For armor penetration its even worse, DW maces ignore 33k armor for example. So even tanky builds are basically naked to their attacks.

I think the combat team needs to take a good look at the resist and penetration mechanics before changing the nirn and reinforced traits.

Tankqull · June 2015

Other Solution

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Nirn 100% must be nerfed as wearing Light Armor with nirn allow you to be as tough vs magicka as Heavy Armor users.

Thats a bad comparison, I have a gear set with 5LA/1MA/1HA with S&B, 7 gold quality nirn gear pieces gives me 28k spell resist on my S&B bar.

Someone with 5HA/1MA/1LA with only 1 gold nirn piece will have the same amount of spell resist, 2 gold nirn pieces will put him over the cap of 32,5k spell resist.

That having said, my 28k spell resist isnt even that much spell resist. Most LA destro staff builds have 12k spell penetration, so my effective spell resist is only 16k with 7 gold nirn pieces!!! LA builds without at least 3 nirn pieces is just like wearing a bathrobe, it offers 0 protection against spells.

For armor penetration its even worse, DW maces ignore 33k armor for example. So even tanky builds are basically naked to their attacks.

I think the combat team needs to take a good look at the resist and penetration mechanics before changing the nirn and reinforced traits.

i do agree - but they have to rethink defensive abilities, nirn gets exceptionally better the hihger your base defense is prime example are the again upcomming permablocking magica DKs where you are effectivly not doing any dmg anymore once they start slotting nirn. as blocker aren´t able to be critted the dmg against them should be calculated comparable to shield behaviour (pveérs may cry here but it doesent matter if you are hit by a boss attack for 200 or 400) .
how that can be balanced with the rollmop´s armada i actually have no idea especially with the upcomming reduction of attacks ignoring rolling.

Rune_Relic · June 2015

I think part of the problem is everyone trying to micro manage eachskill for better or worse and all of which have undesired consequences.

Would it not be better for all of us to just agree on what we expect in general ?
Let ZOS worry about the finer details of the overall way to do that.

eg. We want a;
DPS TTK of ?
We want a Tank TTK of ?
We want a healer TTK of ?
We want stuns to last this long.
We want purging to work in this way
We want snares to work I this way.
We want cooldowns on stuns or purge.
etc.

If we can thrash out the kind of combat everyone in general expects, perhaps we can all get behind it and let ZOS make it so in the way they want.
I don't think ZOS idea of combat is compatible with most peoples idea of combat....if there even is a concensus /shrugs
But if there isn't a consensus...all we do is jump from frying pan to fire.

Alcast · June 2015

Other Solution

They already stated nirn is broken, it will be fixed, working then the SAME as reinforced.

Basically 3 things because *** is broken right now.

Nirn applying to overall spellres instead of only the piece
Mace+Sharpened broken because penetrating more than it should
Nirn+Apprentice broken because penetration more than it should

if they fix those, balance will be restored, but then, ppl find some other stuff to QQ off

so it will go on and on

Tripwyr · June 2015

Keep Nirnhoned as-is, but change reinforced to apply globally to all armor pieces/trait used as Nirn does now

Guys, they never said Nirn is broken. They said they will readjust it because it is currently way too powerful, but it is still working the way they originally intended for it to work.

Soris · June 2015

Keep Nirnhoned as-is, but change reinforced to apply globally to all armor pieces/trait used as Nirn does now

I used to hate nirn. Now I love it.(aside from 7 piece and 70k resist) It's good for TTK no doubt. They probably should buff reinforced to nirn level. But make them so if someone has reached 40k armor/resist, the next nirn/reinforced armor piece will not add anything.
Or they should just bring it line with reinforced and add a general damage reduction in to that Battle Spirit passive.
Or nerf spell/armor igone skills and passives to make effective resistance actually be effective rather than having zero when certain skills/passives stacked on you.

There are probably more choices to go with but whatever they do, they have to be cautious because fights are either end with insta gibbing or they don't end at all. But it's not just armor/resists issue, they more likely tied to removal of softcaps, shield stacking and perma block/dodge which are off-topic here.