Which catgory does this game fall in?

david271749

This is kind of an old question from beta surveys, but I'd like to see opinions.

Nox_Aeterna

It's a good mix of both.

This game is a bad MMO , this game is a bad ES game.

But the game itself is good , it could be great , but they still have a long walk before that.

Turelus

It's an MMO.

First of all what do you deem as an MMO?

Mass Multiplayer Online doesn't mean it has to be like World of Warcraft.
There was a really interesting post by Paul Sage on these forums during beta that I wish they had kept which explained how yes this is an MMO but don't run into it expecting it to be like every other MMO.

I managed to find a copy/paste I had of it on Skype, give it a read and open your mind!

Paul Sage wrote:

First, I would like to start off with a large ‘thank you’ to those of you who are beta testing the game. It is hard to describe the amount of effort that goes into creating a project like The Elder Scrolls Online, and I know the team appreciates your willingness to get into the game at this stage and give us feedback. As beta testers you may be wondering what this game is, what the direction is, and what you should be testing. That’s a fair enough question, and one I would generally answer with, “Let the game speak for itself.” But I also know that many of our testers come from already established communities of other games, and are curious how that experience maps over to ESO.

To understand the direction and vision of ESO, I think it is important to understand the term “MMO” and how it is viewed. “MMO” used to mean one thing: massively multiplayer online. Back in the 90s, this was a big deal. The internet wasn’t what it is now, and getting thousands of players into the same graphical “world” was a huge feat. Anything could be an MMO provided it had thousands of players in the same world. You could have MMORTS, MMORPG, MMOFPS, etc.
However, with the successes of a couple of games, “MMO” has become almost synonymous with a certain type of MMORPG, one that derived a lot of its spirit from MUDs. As you probably know, MUDs were solely text-based; MUD admins developed fun systems relying solely on information being passed to players through lots of words and numbers. It was natural for the first MMOs, or graphic MUDs, to base their systems on tried and true MUD systems such as chat, combat, itemization, etc.

Without calling any title by name, I think it is safe to say that two titles really contributed to this repurposing of the moniker “MMO”, and informed what many people have come to think of when the term “MMO” is mentioned. So much so, that people expect any game released as an “MMO” to emulate the systems in those titles. And companies have delivered that emulation. Title after title has been released that many people refer to as ‘clones.’ Even large name ‘titles’ based a lot of their gameplay around these successful titles. And the results were, I’m sorry to say, less than spectacular. I’ve watched quality titles fall by the wayside because of one simple truth: “People are tired of this clone thing.” Therefore, the point is, when the general public refers to something as an “MMO”, they generally mean, it is like X game, but the myriad of games that are like X game have been largely unsuccessful. People were generally happy with X game. They didn’t need us making it again.

That was a long way to go to say that our path to success is to embrace what it is that makes us special, what makes us Elder Scrolls. So with that, I’ll try to lay out the abbreviated vision for the game you are testing: The Elder Scrolls Online is a modern RPG that immerses thousands of players in the beautiful world of Tamriel during a time of great conflict, actively engaging them and encouraging them to explore together.

“Modern” and “immersive” are two key words I’ll concentrate on for this letter. To many people, they mean many different things. To us, it means removing a lot of the UI elements. Concentrating less on long narrative text and fine number-crunching math, and more on things like a visceral, active combat system, voice-over with believable writing and acting, player choice, etc. Players should be playing in the world-space, and not watching the UI.
What you see and experience in the game versus the UI is key, much more so than math and text appearing everywhere. That’s not to say there won’t be elements in the game for people who like to min-max and get the most out of a certain build, hey that’s fun too, but we are going to lean far more on world immersion and active decision making. This is part of an Elder Scrolls title.
Part of immersion is also interactivity. We’ve added many things to the world to make it as interactive as possible. This has been no small effort. In an MMO, keeping track of what gets introduced into the economy is important, but we feel that interactivity is also important in the Elder Scrolls. Players want to be able to take things from barrels, crates, etc.

We also want aspirational items, attributes, abilities, etc. that don’t take a four-page chart to understand. These should be things most people can readily identify and know if it is useful for them. When you can wear any weapon or armor, you should be able to understand its core functionality and usefulness to you.

There are also those things which just work better in social environments: grouping, guilds, chat, and other social features. Our vision for social is that you are able to play with your friends. We’ve tried to remove as many hurdles as possible, while some must remain to preserve other features. For instance, alliances are necessary to support our Alliance War effort. So it is true that you must be in the same alliance as someone to play with them, but we felt the benefits to the Alliance War outweighed the negatives in keeping players separated. We’re also a very account-based game. Benefits of having things like a bank shared amongst all characters, easily finding people, out-of-game access to friends, etc. outweighed other things that are benefits of a more character-based social system.

There are many other parts of our vision I could break down: Why are there levels? Why are there classes? Why is there an Alliance War? etc. But we’ve got a game to make and you’ve got a game to play. These are the things which I feel help us the most in beta tests:

(1) Remember, not everything can be added as optional. Even if you have seen certain things appear in the game, some features may be removed, maybe for a short time, maybe for a long time, maybe permanently or indefinitely. Every feature has to be supported by us and we need to feel that every feature is representative of the vision and our quality bar.

(2) Keep an open mind and remember to take the game on its own merits. If you’re like us, you don’t believe MMO is a genre. It is an acronym that tells you that a lot of players are going to be playing in the same play-space as you. It is an awesome and special thing to play alone or with friends in a world populated by other players. The term “MMO” doesn’t define what a game should or should not be or should or should not have, beyond having other players. So when we make decisions about what makes the cut or doesn’t make the cut for the final product, we are looking at what hits the vision for The Elder Scrolls Online, and not what makes an MMO.

(3) Keep giving us great feedback and playing. Believe it or not, just playing still really helps. We track lots of data, including all the behind-the-scenes numbers to see if things are adding up as they should. Positive feedback helps just as much as pointing out issues. I like feature X helps us know what you would like more of. And this wasn’t meant to dissuade any particular feedback, it was just meant as a clarification of what we are doing.

Once again, thank you for participating in our beta. Believe me when I tell you that this game is being made by people who truly want to bring you something unique, fun, and special. I hope you can see that in our efforts and in our product.

Sleepydan

It's an MMO.

This is an mmo with a coat of elder scrolls paint.

I wish this was an elder scrolls game with multiplayer.

Uviryth

its an action-mmopg

Dita

There is no "Fail" category - so I didn't vote.

rawne1980b16_ESO

It's a bad mix of both.

It's missing a hell of a lot of features that people have come to expect from an MMO so it falls a bit short there.

It's missing features people come to expect from Elder Scrolls games so it's falling short there.

It's kinda in the middle and can't really decide where it wants to go.

Sure it has the same "feel" as an Elder Scrolls game but it's missing things. Looting, crime, DB, Thieves etc etc.... It's half an Elder Scrolls game.

I think the game falls into it's own niche category rather than MMO/ES.

Deepfry

It's a good mix of both.

How can anyone vote for option a) or b) ?

It is obviously "massively multiplayer" by definition, with loads of player characters running around, player guilds, grouping, and the option to interact if you so wish.

It is obviously "an Elder Scrolls game", as it is set in the Elder Scrolls universe, with Elder Scrolls geography, Elder Scrolls lore, etc.

It is therefore clearly a mix.

In my humble opinion, the only valid options are c) and d). Is it a good or a bad mix ?

Rocksteady

You should do this poll again in 1 year and compare the results. Right now I honestly don't know what I think of it. I'm having fun when I play but I won't really know how good it is as a whole until I see where they go with it(at least 1 expansion in)

aufischb16_ESO

It's a bad mix of both.

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

This game is a bad MMO , this game is a bad ES game.

But the game itself is good , it could be great , but they still have a long walk before that.

That about sums it up. Although I decided that the game is currently rather a bad mix than a good one. But there is potential........

theyancey

It's a good mix of both.

From the beginning some people wanted co-op Skyrim. That is NOT what this game was ever designed to do and it never will be. I remember from the beta forums some people throwing fits saying that just because this isn't the game they wanted that they were going to buy it just so they could trash the game on the forums and make it fail in hopes that in the future they might get their co--op play instead. From the looks of things that is exactly what some of them are trying to do.

Witblitz

It's a bad mix of both.

Game is broken. They won't be able to fix it either. I also suggest they never attempt this genre ever again either.

htoncic

It's a good mix of both.

Witblitz wrote: »

Game is broken. They won't be able to fix it either. I also suggest they never attempt this genre ever again either.

Why shouldn't they? Once you go MMO, you never go back.

isengrimb16_ESO

It's a good mix of both.

I'm glad they didn't feel they had to make another WoW clone, and saw the truth that one WoW is enough. I'm not missing having my face blared at by the UI and addons. I don't miss the grindy, shooting-gallery feel of a world artificially littered with hostile patrolling robots everywhere. I'll take the bugs over constant class tweaks/nerfs/buffs over something I don't even participate in (PvP). I'll trade flying for effective sneaking (can't stand the way rogues and druids work in WoW), and enemies that go away or turn docile once I'm done with an area objective.

I might even like the big pvp battles here, if I can get arsed enough to check out Cyrodiil, and pick a campaign (NA).

Audigy

It's a good mix of both.

I played a lot of MMO´s since the 90´s and also played a bit of Skyrim, Oblivion and Morrowind. Therefore I would think I know my fair share about both franchises.

MMO´s offer you an interaction with other players in a huge world. Besides that MMORPG´s let you design your Char based on your decisions and you don't have an end to reach but a never ending journey.

While I know that the second Generation MMO´s followed a different philosophy, this is still how MMO´s were developed during the first Generation and old does not necessarily mean bad but different.

If you watch the MMO market closely then there is a huge revival coming slowly, back from static "EndGame" to a more evolving "journey", where a Char has not reached the end at max level and has a lot more to do than just visiting a single raid dungeon for months in the hope to get a new item.


In conclusion you can say that ESO is a MMO at every important point, not free from minor issue´s, but the basic idea represents the MMO franchise quite well.


As for Elder Scrolls, I think that not having a housing and companion system hurts, both things should come ASAP, but also the crime system is currently missing. Besides that, I think that the lore is quite nice and you really have the feeling that you play an Elder Scrolls game, which just needs a bit more social content in future. But also some more professions and sandbox elements could come in handy.

One important aspect which combines the MMO with the ES so nicely is the Char progression, as both never had a real end and supported the idea of "learning by doing". You can pretty much always improve your char, by using specific abilities, even your horse can level.

So yes, I think its a good mix of both.

david271749

It's an MMO.

I voted MMO for a lot of reasons. The main reason is I always feel rushed to catch up with other players. I don't have time to slow down and immerse myself in small aspects of the game. Trying to talk to NPCs during dungeons is a joke. It seems like most of the people who play just want to level. I'm not saying I don't enjoy the game though. I do hope that some things get added to make this game feel more like it belongs in the Elder Scrolls series.

Bhakura

Didnt vote, you forgot "its a bot game"

Innocente

In my experience, ESO has been a Single Player Game with some Multi Player options founded on a Lobby Based player distribution system that one has little control over.

In short, ESO is not really an MMO as I like to define MMOs: That of persistent populations that can group for content in a stable server environment.

Just my thinking on it. I will point out that in the pre-beta days of ESO, the developers/marketers were very fond of stating that ESO was NOT an MMO. However, they never really did describe what it actually, in fact, was.

david271749

It's an MMO.

Bhakura wrote: »

Didnt vote, you forgot "its a bot game"

Nope. That option is here. Enjoy!

PBpsy

It's an Elder Scrolls game.

Snowboarding simulator.

isengrimb16_ESO

It's a good mix of both.

I actually like puzzle-jumping down cliffs, and I'm crappy at jumping in computer games.

david271749

It's an MMO.

Still trying to get used to the mix of this game. I've played MMOs and Elder Scrolls titles. I'm a much bigger fan of Elder Scrolls games, but I have enjoyed some MMOs in the past. Something about this one just doesn't feel right.