Necromancer class concept.

The_Sadist · May 2014

DISCLAIMER! THIS IS A WORK IN PROGRESS. (Also if this isn't in the right section, feel free to move it accordingly)
I'm currently busy with real life so while I want this concept up and posted I'll probably sit down and add stuff when time permits. Feedback and ideas are certainly welcome, but this is a concept thread, not a place to discuss how necromancy will ruin your in game experience.

On that note, let's start off with this little snippet for all of those individuals who are going to inevitably state that necromancy is banned and because of this lore breaking "Necromancy is not illegal in the Empire, though body and spirit are protected as property, and may not be used without the permission of the owner, and public display of the living dead is widely prohibited. Morrowind is the only province of Tamriel in which necromancy has been banned and is illegal" (http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Necromancy). While some people feel their immersion will be damaged by Necromancers hanging around town, with potential undead minions, or that because one of the main antagonists in ESO is a Necromancer and because of that should mean the class is out of the question.. I can only shrug. This is an MMO and not a single player game. Classes will be introduced with new concepts and zones will be discovered which were not evident in prior Elder Scrolls games.. such is the nature of an MMO.

Now for the rough idea about what each class skill line will entail.

A Necromancer will be broken down into three trees 'Reanimation', 'Death's Touch' and 'Pestilence' (these names are open for discussion)

Reanimation

It's pretty self explanatory, this tree will focus on exploiting nearby corpses* (and because of this will not be toggle based) to summon several types of undead creatures which in turn attack and defend the Necromancer. These creatures can only be summoned to a cap. Once the cap has been reached and a Necromancer tries to summon a new creature, the oldest summon will die in order for the newest summon to replace it. Summons cannot be healed by normal means and take damage over time. Due to the nature of necromancy these summons will take a % of the caster's health while they're animated, thus making a Necromancer more feeble as their army increases in strength. Furthermore, this tree will also have a few support spells in which a Necromancer can heal their undead minions or provide group support. All in all I think there should be 2-3 reanimation spells and 2-3 support spells (depending on which combination is selected). Because of this the tree itself will not feature any direct damage spells.
I feel a Reanimation class tree is justifiable being in the Necromancer skill set due to the nature of necromancy.

*I'm not entirely sure this is a good idea given the nature of corpses in ESO. There will be several instances where a summon base Necromancer would be useless as they can't exploit corpses for summons and in turn won't contribute to raids, dungeons or PvP

Death's Touch (Chill / Embrace?)

While the skill name needs work this tree will focus predominately on frost damage spells alongside snares and potential freezing. This skill line should feature 1-2 AoE spell(s) with CC effects and perhaps a 1-2 raw frost DPS damage spell(s) (depending on which combination is selected) alongside 2 support spells. Furthermore, I think one spell of these support spells should be a frost equivalent to Molten Weapons (Dragon Knight ability) only dealing frost damage over fire with different morphs.
I feel a frost class tree is agreeable for the Necromancer skill set due to how Necromancers in prior games functioned. They typically used frost spells in conjunction to their summons. Furthermore, the game itself is lacking frost spells and this will help remedy this problem.

Pestilence (Dark Alchemy?)

This tree will focus on disease DoTs, debuffs for enemies and buffs for allies with some potential poison aspects appearing in the spell morphs. This tree will be the 'Dark Alchemist' sort of skill set with spells lacking raw DPS but compensating for the DoTs and debuffs. Because of this I think this class should feature 2 AoE spells which buff / debuff allies / enemies, 1-2 DoT spells which also debuff when cast and 1-2 general support / CC spells (depending on which combination is selected).
I feel a DoT / disease class tree is appropriate for the Necromancer skill set due to how close necromancers work with the dead, it isn't a stretch to assume they know how to handle diseases accordingly. Furthermore, the game itself is lacking disease damage spells and this seems like a good solution.

Now that I've written what I feel the class should consist of in terms of the class spell skill set breakdown and which general spells I'd like to see I'll probably take a break for a bit and come back when I have the drive to sit down for a few hours and continue. Feel free to brain storm spells, ideas and your opinions, I'm pretty active so I'll try and address everyone.

The_Sadist · May 2014

'Reanimation'

I initially stated that this skill line would be used in conjunction with dead enemies, however I'm not entirely sure this is a good idea given the nature of corpses in ESO. There will be several instances where a summon based Necromancer would be useless as they can't exploit corpses for summons and in turn won't contribute to raids, dungeons or PvP. That being said, the corpses can alternatively be some sort of 'soul' system which the Necromancer themselves has. This will function the same as the suggested corpse exploitation, more souls can be gained via the passive and in turn more monsters can be summoned.

Ultimate:

Still needs a bit of work, I'm not sure if they should have a set duration or be similar to other summons.

Summoning of a Flesh Atronach: Requires 200 (or so) ultimate to summon with the Atronach itself gaining increased health / resistance / damage every 100 ultimate. Furthermore, it requires 3 nearby bodies (counts as 3 summons). Lastly a single Necromancer can only have one in play. Summons a mobile Flesh Atronach which deals moderate physical damage. Flesh Atronachs occasionally cast a large cone spell dealing high disease damage and generating a moderate amount of threat. Reduces max Health by 50%. Flesh Atronachs lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Morphs:

Summoning of a Dire Flesh Atronach: Requires 200 (or so) ultimate to summon with the Atronach itself gaining increased health / resistance / damage every 100 ultimate. Furthermore, it requires 3 nearby bodies (counts as 3 summons). Lastly a single Necromancer can only have one in play. Summons a mobile Dire Flesh Atronach which deals moderate physical damage. Dire Flesh Atronachs occasionally cast a large cone spell dealing high disease damage and generating a moderate amount of threat. Additionally Dire Flesh Atronachs are immune to CC effects and have extra physical / magical resistance. Reduces max Health by 50%. Dire Flesh Atronachs lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Summoning of a Diseased Flesh Atronach: Requires 200 ultimate (or so) to summon with the Atronach itself gaining increased health / resistance / damage every 100 ultimate. Furthermore, it requires 3 nearby bodies (counts as 3 summons). Lastly a single Necromancer can only have one in play. Summons a mobile Disease Flesh Atronach which deals moderate physical damage. Disease Flesh Atronachs occasionally cast a large cone spell dealing high disease damage and generating a moderate amount of threat. Additionally Disease Flesh Atronachs have a constant disease aura which damages nearby enemies for x disease damage every y seconds .Reduces max Health by 50%. Flesh Atronachs lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.
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Spells:

I'm just going to throw a few random spells out there for consideration, note, these aren't in a specific order. Furthermore, any OR(s) you see indicate I'm uncertain which element would be best. More over, you can only initially summon one minion but this will be increased via a passive. Lastly, minions cannot be healed by normal means.
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First concept, Bonewalkers. Bonewalkers are an undead monster from Morrowind with Greater Bonewalkers being their stronger form. Bonelords don't share much relation to a Bonewalker but the concept sort of made sense. http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Undead

Summoning of a Lesser Bonewalker: Summons a Lesser Bonewalker to attack enemies, requires a corpse. Bonewalkers deal disease damage. Basic attacks have a chance to apply the 'Grave Curse' debuff, which lowers the target's armour / spell resistance by x% for y seconds and snares the target for x seconds, cumulative. 'debuffing' summon. Reduces max Health by 10%. Bonewalkers lose x% total Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Morphs:

Summoning of a Greater Bonewalker: Summons a Greater Bonewalker to attack enemies, requires a corpse. Greater Bonewalkers deal disease damage. Basic attacks have a chance to apply the 'Dread Curse' debuff, which lowers the target's weapon damage and armour / spell resistance by x% (with x being reasonably higher) and snares the target for x seconds, cumulative. 'debuffing' summon. Reduced max Health by 10%. Greater Bonewalkers lose x% total Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Summoning of a Bonelord: Summon a Bonelord to attack enemies, requires a corpse. Bonelords deal disease OR frost damage, which snares for x% for y seconds. Bonelords occasionally cast the 'Second Barrier' (naming?) spell, applies a shield which reduces damage from all sources by x amount on the Bonelord plus nearby allies for y seconds OR occasionally casts a small AoE spell which deals disease OR frost damage which snares for a high x% for y seconds. 'DPS / Potential support' mage summon. Reduce max Health by 10% Bonelords lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.
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Summoning of a Skeleton: Summons a Skeleton to attack enemies, requires a corpse. Skeletons deal physical damage. Skeletons take reduced damage from all sources due to their skeletal form but have a chance to disintegrate when Health drops below x%. 'DPS' summon. Reduces Max Health by 5%. Skeletons lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Morphs:

Summoning of a Skeleton Champion: Summons a Skeleton Champion to attack enemies, requires a corpse. Skeleton Champions deal physical damage. Skeleton Champions take reduced damage from all sources due to their skeletal form but have a chance to disintegrate when Health drops below x%. Skeleton Champions will occasionally cast a point blank AoE growl / snarl around themselves generating threat from nearby enemies and increasing nearby allies damage by x% or y seconds. 'Tanky' summon. Reduce Max Health by 5%. Skeletons lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Summoning of a Skeleton Archer: Summons a Skeletal Archer to attack enemies, requires a corpse. Skeleton Archers deal poison OR physical damage. Skeleton Archers take reduced damage from all sources due to their skeletal form but have a chance to disintegrate when Health drops below x%. Skeletal Archers will occasionally cast a powerful ranged spell after an extended charge time dealing poison damage and interrupting the target. 'DPS' summon. Reduce Max Health by 5%. Skeletons lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.
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Zombies make sense as well.. so here is my zombie concept. I'm a bit iffy with it, while the idea of having a zombie spell makes sense, having a revenant spell where the zombies summoned have a relation to their bodies (casting the spell on a bandit cutthroat will yield a basic zombie with a sword, casting it on a goblin ranger will yield a zombie with a bow, casting it on a mage warlord will yield a zombie with a staff, if that makes sense), is also a good concept (seen here http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/94624/the-necromancer-s-guild#latest)

Summoning of a Zombie: Summons a Zombie to attack enemies, requires 2 corpses (counts as 2 summons). Zombies deal disease damage and basic attacks generate a moderate amount of threat / aggro. Zombies occasionally cast a cone AoE spell dealing disease damage. 'Tank' summon. Reduces Max Health by 15%. Zombies lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Morphs:

Summoning of a Dread Zombie: Summons a Dread Zombie to attack enemies, requires 2 corpses (counts as 2 summons). Dread Zombies deal disease damage and basic attacks generate a moderate amount of threat / aggro. Dread Zombies frequently cast a cone AoE spell dealing disease damage. Dread Zombie's basic attacks heal the Dread Zombie for x% OR When HP is below x% Dread Zombies deal additional damage and have increased attack speed. 'DPS/Tank' summon. Reduce Max Health by 15%. Dread Zombies lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.

Summoning of a Headless Zombie: Summons a Headless Zombie to attack enemies, requires 2 corpses (counts as 2 summons). Headless Zombies deal disease damage and basic attacks generate a moderate amount of threat / aggro. Headless Zombies frequently cast a cone AoE spell dealing disease damage. Headless Zombies have increased physical / magic resistance and more health compared to a Dread Zombie. 'Tank' summon. Reduce Max Health by 15%. Headless Zombies lose x% Health every y seconds. The more minions you have the higher health loss.
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So that's my three necromantic based summoning spells and I quite like the concepts, but I feel there are changes which need to be made and numbers are obviously up in the air. Onward to the 2 'support' based spells.
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Blood Sacrifice: A small AoE based spell which lasts for x seconds and heals minions moderately by y every z seconds. Any non-undead allies in the AoE receive a reduced heal per x seconds OR Allies can activate the 'Unholy Recovery' synergy which increases their Health / Stamina / Magicka regeneration by x for y seconds. The more targets in the AoE, the less effective the heals are. Caster's Health / Stamina / Magicaka regeneration is reduced by x% while the spell is up.

Morphs:

Empowering Sacrifice: A small AoE based spell which lasts for x seconds and greatly heals minions by y every z seconds. Any non-undead allies in the AoE receive a reduced heal of x every y seconds OR Allies can activate the 'Unholy Recovery' synergy which increases their Health / Stamina / Magicka regeneration by x for y seconds. The more targets in the AoE, the less effective the heals are. Caster's Health / Stamina / Magicaka regeneration is greatly reduced by x% while the spell is up. Additionally the caster loses -x% spell and weapon power while the spell is up and minions in the AoE gain an increase to damage output by y%. Any non-undead allies receive a reduced damage increase.

Dark Sacrifice: A small AoE based spell which lasts for x seconds and heals minions moderately by y every z seconds. Any non-undead allies in the AoE receive a reduced heal per x seconds OR Allies can activate the 'Unholy Recovery' synergy which increases their Health / Stamina / Magicka regeneration by x for y seconds. The more targets in the AoE, the less effective the heals are. Caster's Health / Stamina / Magicaka regeneration is reduced by less x% while the spell is up. Additionally the AoE size is increased by x and the spell's duration is increased by y.
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Ritual of the Damned: Channel spell, costs x magicka every second. While channeling nearby minions gain an increase to damage output by x%. The more minions there are the less powerful each individual boost is. Allies can activate the 'Unholy Empowerment' synergy which increases their damage output by a moderate % for x seconds.

Morphs:

Ritual of the Undying: Channel spell, costs x magicka every second. While channeling nearby minions gain an increase to damage output by x%. The more minions there are the less powerful each individual boost is. Allies can activate the 'Unholy Empowerment' synergy which increases their damage output by a moderate % for x seconds. Additionally, minions recover x health per second with x being reduced as the number of minions increase.

Ritual of the Worm Channel spell, costs x magicka every second. While channeling nearby minions gain an increase to damage output by x%. The more minions there are the less powerful each individual boost is. Allies can activate the 'Unholy Empowerment' synergy which increases their damage output by a moderate % for x seconds. Additionally, caster gains x magicka when an enemy dies while this spell is being channelled.
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While I'm not overly happy with the names, I like the concepts. Basically a support spell which is relatively useful for minions but less so for other allies, unless spammed and as a result the Necromancer is disadvantaged. Both morphs are different, one weakening the Necromancer but making minions more efficient whereas the other increases the practicality of minions at the cost of raw strength. Open to suggestion, perhaps spells shouldn't work on allies, I just wanted a bit of synergy.
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Passives:

Undead Mastery: Increases the amount of summons by 1 for every 'Reanimation' spell on the Necromancer's spell bar. Maximum of 3/6 (rank 1/2).

Basically base of 1, if you have 2 spells in your hot bar you now have a total of 3, which is the cap until you can update it again at later levels.. After which the cap is 6.

Necromantic Bomb: Minions explode upon death and deal disease damage in a moderate AoE based on x% of minion's max health. The % of health used and the AoE size increases as the rank increases.

Blood Pact: When a minion dies nearby minions are healed for x% of the deceased minion's maximum health. Nearby allies (caster included) are healed for a lowered % of previously mentioned %, The % of health increases as the rank increases.

OR

Dark Pact: When a minion kills an enemy caster gains x% Magicka, where x increases as the rank does.

Master Reanimator: Provides bonuses for summoned creatures. Bonewalker's attack speed increased by 10/20%. Skeleton's damage increased by 10/20%. Zombie's health increased by 10/20%. Flesh Atronach's health reduction is reduced to 40/30%.

I feel the passives may need to be changed as they all focus around the minions.. but I also think that this particular tree is selfish in that sense, little benefits for the caster in exchange for greater minion mastery.

The_Sadist · May 2014

Reserved for 'Death's Touch' skill set.

The_Sadist · May 2014

'Pestilence'

Most of the naming can be changed, I just selected random diseases from several of the games and made them spells, the branch itself has a unique feature where spells can 'spread' to nearby enemies / allies at x%, the chance for spells to spread procs every y seconds. The same spell can't spread to a single target twice, ally or enemy, this refreshes if the spell is re-cast.
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Ultimate:

Croatoan OR Thrassian Plague: Costs x ultimate, deals high disease damage every x seconds for y seconds in a large AoE. Enemies are also snared for a high % and have increased miss chance (by x%). Caster and Allies in the AoE take reduced damage from all sources (x%) and deal increase damage (y%) to targets who are in the AoE.

Morphs:

Dire Croatoan OR Thrassian Plague: Costs x ultimate, deals high disease damage every x seconds for y seconds in a large AoE. Enemies are also snared for a high % and have increased miss chance, b x%. Caster and Allies in the AoE take reduced damage from all sources (x%) and deal increase damage (y%) to targets who are in the AoE. Additionally, enemies have a low % chance of dying instantly which increases as their health decreases (bosses excluded). Furthermore, the ultimate cost is increased and the duration / size of AoE is decreased.

I feel this could potentially be extremely overpowered though.

Lingering Croatoan OR Thrassian Plague: Costs x ultimate, deals high disease damage every x seconds for y seconds in a large AoE. Enemies are also snared for a high % and have increased miss chance, b x%. Caster and Allies in the AoE take reduced damage from all sources (x%) and deal increase damage (y%) to targets who are in the AoE. Additionally, the size of the AoE is increased, the duration is increased and the ultimate cost is reduced by x.
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Spells:

Rot Worm: Deals x disease damage over y seconds, procs every z seconds. If the target is an ally, light / heavy attacks deal extra disease damage. May spread to nearby enemies / allies.

Morphs:

Flesh Worms: Deals increased x disease damage over y seconds, procs every z seconds. If the target is an ally, light / heavy attacks deal extra disease damage. May spread to nearby enemies / allies. Additionally, if the enemy target dies with Flesh Worms active on them they explode and deal poison damage in an AoE. Allies also take reduced damage (x%) from enemies who suffer from the Flesh Worms debuff.

Festering Worms: Deals x disease damage over y seconds, procs every z seconds. If the target is an ally, light / heavy attacks deal extra disease damage. May spread to nearby enemies / allies. Additionally, the enemy target is rooted for the duration of the spell, the snare can be broken if x damage is dealt before the spell ends. Allies also take reduced damage (x%) from enemies who suffer from the Festering Worms debuff.
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Swamp Fever: Deals x disease damage in a moderate AoE for y seconds, procs every z seconds, stacks. Allies gain a massive increase in health regeneration while standing in AoE, stacks.

Morphs:

Chilling Fever: Deals x disease damage in a moderate AoE for y seconds, procs every z seconds, stacks. Allies gain a massive increase in health regeneration while standing in AoE, stacks. Additionally, the enemy target is snared for a significant % while standing in the AoE. Allies deal additional magic damage (x) with light / heavy attack while standing in AoE, stacks.

Imbued Fever: Deals x disease damage in a large AoE for y seconds, procs every z seconds, stacks. Allies gain a massive increase in health regeneration while standing in AoE, stacks. Additionally, if an enemy target takes damage from the AoE spell they receive a DoT which deals magic x damage over y seconds. Allies deal additional magic damage (x) with light / heavy attack while standing in AoE, stacks.

When I say stacks I mean much the same as Grand Healing, you can cumulate damage and whatnot.
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Dampworm: Deals x magic damage to an enemy target over y seconds. If the target is an ally, increases Stamina / Magicka regeneration by a significant %. May spread to nearby enemies / allies.

Morphs:

Heightened Dampworm: Deals increased magic damage to an enemy target over y seconds. If the target is an ally, increases Stamina / Magicka regeneration by a significant %. May spread to nearby enemies / allies. Additionally, enemy targets are stunned for x seconds once the spell duration ends. Ally target's basic / heavy attacks deal x% more damage.

Blistering Dampworm Deals x magic damage to an enemy target over y seconds. If the target is an ally, increases Stamina / Magicka regeneration by a significant %. May spread to nearby enemies / allies. Additionally, enemies take x disease damage every time they perform a basic or heavy attack, can only proc once every x seconds per target. Ally target's basic / heavy attacks deal x% more damage.
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Wizard's Pox: Deals x disease damage to an enemy target, lowers spell resistance / armour by y for z seconds. If the target is an ally, increases spell /armour resistance by x for y seconds. May spread to nearby enemies / allies.

Morphs:

Witches' Pox: Deals x disease damage to an enemy target, lowers spell resistance / armour by y for z seconds. If the target is an ally, increases spell / armour resistance by x for y seconds. May spread to nearby enemies / allies. Additionally, enemies are interrupted when initial damage is dealt. Allies also gain increased light / heavy attack speed by x for y seconds.

Warrior's Pox: Deals x disease damage to an enemy target, lowers spell resistance / armour by y for z seconds. If the target is an ally, increases spell / armour resistance by x for y seconds. May spread to nearby enemies / allies. Additionally, enemies are dazed when initial damage is done and when the debuff ends OR reduces enemies damage by x% for y seconds. Allies also gain increased light / heavy attack speed by x for y seconds.
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Crimson Plague: Caster and nearby allies surround themselves with an airborne pathogenic aura which deals x disease damage every y seconds over the course of z seconds to enemies within q yards

Morphs:

Evolving Crimson Plague: Caster and nearby allies surround themselves with an airborne pathogenic aura which deals x disease damage every y seconds over the course of z seconds to enemies within q yards. Additionally, the amount of disease damage dealt is increased as the spell progresses by x every y seconds.

Swarming Crimson Plague: Caster and nearby allies surround themselves with an airborne pathogenic aura which deals x disease damage every y seconds over the course of z seconds to enemies within q yards. Additionally, the duration of the spell is increased and the size of the aura is increased.
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Passives:

Pandemic: Increases the chance of Pestilence spells spreading by x%, with x increasing as the rank does. Furthermore, also increase the range at which spells can spread by y yards, with y increasing as the rank does.

Potency: Increases the duration of Pestilence spells by x%, with x increasing as the rank does.

Dark Alchemist: Whenever an enemy dies while under the effects of a Pestilence spell, restores x Magicka. The amount of Magicka restored increases as the rank does.

Parasite: Whenever a Pestilence spell spreads to a nearby enemy / ally, gain x ultimate.

Still_Mind · May 2014

I'd rather have Necromancy as a World\Guild skill line. Tharn himself said that he'll "make a Necromancer out of you (Vestige) yet".

The_Sadist · May 2014

Still_Mind wrote: »

I'd rather have Necromancy as a World\Guild skill line. Tharn himself said that he'll "make a Necromancer out of you (Vestige) yet".

That's where we disagree, I'd prefer a Necromancer class purely because I'm selfish and have always played Necromancers when they are an option. Tharn was being humorous, with the obvious implication that necromancy is 'bad' and we're good at it. I understand that mages can go down the 'dark' path and study Necromancy, but if that's the case there shouldn't be any more classes implemented as everyone can learn anything, technically speaking. Why shouldn't a Dragonknight be able to summon Daedra? Why can't the Sorcerer class heal like a Tempar? The fact everyone is so magically gifted in this game irks me, but hey. Furthermore, I'm also hoping there would be a Lich world skill line (http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/95491/lich-concept/p1). I was under the impression world skill lines were 'be x and not y' like vampirism, lycanthropy and hopefully lichdom. Lastly a guild skill line could work, the issue for me is, as mentioned, I'm selfish and a guild skill line isn't big enough to encompass all a Necromancer can potentially be.

I think a class would be ideal and I know people are going to disagree, but that's simply my opinion and those of a select few. I personally want to see a few more classes being developed and appearing in-game and I think a Necromancer should be one!

Back to my uni essay.. zz.

Still_Mind · May 2014

I see where you're coming from, but, in the greater picture, I don't think that adding new classes is a feasible solution. First, there's the game setting. Necromancy is largely frowned upon in all player factions, and the main storyline clearly states that the Vestige is *not* familiar with Necromantic arts.

Second, the skills that you distil into class skill lines, are already present, in some form or the other. Undaunted, Siphoning, Shadow skill lines do represent the whole lifedrain\dark alchemy\black magic aspect to them.

Third, existing classes need balancing and fixing. I do realize that ESO classes aren't as playstyle-defining as in class-based MMOs, but class skill lines, to a rare exception, are still more powerful than most others.

Fourth, I believe that Necromancy as an in-game discipline, doesn't need to be spread so thinly over 3 skill lines. One skill line+Ultimate should be more than enough. The first thing that comes to mind when you hear "necromancy" is walking dead. Thus, the closest thing to it should be the concept of your "reanimation" skill line, with 1-2 skills from the adjacent concepts. Other Necromancy-themed powers may easily be pulled thread by thread from other sources.

As for all Frost-based skill line, I'm really ambivalent here. Personally, I didn't think that singling out Stormcalling was justified with the Sorcerer class - I believe that tree should have been the true Destruction tree, but meh, it works, I suppose.

The_Sadist · May 2014

@Still_Mind‌

1. I never said adding new classes was a feasible solution to anything, I simply mentioned that I feel classes will eventually be added and a Necromancer could potentially be one. Vampirism is frowned upon, so is Lycanthropy and I'm going to assume come the Thieve's guild and the Dark Brotherhood, both aspects of the guilds will be frowned upon as well. Yes, but the storyline also calls a vampire 'mortal'

and the groundskeeper, who is a daedric prince that hates undead, willingly works with a vampire vestiage

. Lastly, the story also says we're all soulless and special, but that's obviously not the case. A simple matter of changing some dialogue I suppose (not simple, but you get the picture)

2. I don't see how the Undaunted (which was released without being completed) and the Shadow skill lines come into play.. But I can see the similarities with the Siphoning line and ONE aspect of the proposed idea. However, the skills haven't been written up so it's a bit premature to say anything regarding spell similarities. Furthermore, the whole point of this thread is to brainstorm ideas and concepts, what I'm writing isn't set in stone. Class spells have similarities but are also made unique through mechanics, added side effects and general concept.

3. I'm all for balancing and fixing other classes before implementing new classes, that's sort of a given. So I don't understand what you're trying to say. Brainstorming won't hurt and if ideas are taken.. well ideas are taken.

4. You and I believe two different things, that's the issue. I agree reanimation is probably the pivotal focus of a Necromancer and if they make a guild skill line with just the reanimation aspect, plus a Lich world skill line I probably won't complain.. but as it stands I don't see why I can't simply create a concept in the hopes that it might be implemented. The frost skill line makes sense in relation to prior Elder Scrolls games where Necromancers used mostly frost spells in conjunction to reanimation spells / undead allies. The disease line is purely fabricated and has a lot plausibility due to how Necromancy is associated with the dead and the dead typically have all manner of diseases.

5. I'm inclined to agree with this, the Sorcerer probably should have had a more well rounded tree, but what's done is done. Having a Necromancer utilise a frost only tree with some general magic damage thrown in is simply an idea. It ultimately mightn't work.

And back to this 2000 word essay

.

Stx · May 2014

Necromancer wouldn't work as a class imo. It would be great however, in the form of a world skill line. Nightblades and Sorcerers already have some really Necroish spells, and a world skill line would compliment them nicely, and give players the freedom to build their necro how they want.

The_Sadist · May 2014

Stx wrote: »

Necromancer wouldn't work as a class imo. It would be great however, in the form of a world skill line. Nightblades and Sorcerers already have some really Necroish spells, and a world skill line would compliment them nicely, and give players the freedom to build their necro how they want.

That's you're opinion and you're entitled to it. Like I mentioned in prior comments a world skill line probably wouldn't be my cup of tea (due to the 2 spell limit) but a guild skill line? Perhaps. However I don't think it will hurt to come up with a concept, if only for lols and potentially to have spells snagged for a hypothetical guild / world skill line. Lastly I don't think either classes have spells which have a particularly necromantic feel about them.. Nightblades have a 'Siphoning' tree which is more vampiric / blood mage and the Sorcerers have a 'Dark Magic' tree tree which is simply that, dark magic mixed with Daedric influence. The only real necromantic spell I see is 'Dark Deal'.. but I get your point.

navystylz_ESO · May 2014

Yes, there definitely need to be a class... not a skill.. I mean, I suppose a line can be as robust as the devs want, but unless the skill line is emaciated, to balance it with every class would be too nightmarish. I don't want a gutted concept because they have to take into account that Nightblade, Templar, Sorcerer and Dragonknight might use it. And it just wouldn't make sense for a Dragonknight or Nightblade to use necromancer. Maybe necromantic type abilities tailored to their own roles, but not necromancy as a robust casting line.

Laura · May 2014

I tend to agree that it would be best done as a class itself but I forsee them doing a world class line or something like that. Hopefully they do something along the lines of making a choice between saving a paladin or sacrificing him. Your choice would lead you down a different guild line (paladin/dawnguard or necromancy) I'd like more choices that matter.

Making necromancy a lich line and making it sort of like werewolf/vampire might be cool too

Screenrocker · May 2014

May be someday they will make a Daedra or a Daedra-Alliance playable for Players. And then, I think, there can be a Necromancer senseful.

The_Sadist · May 2014

navystylz_ESO wrote: »

Yes, there definitely need to be a class... not a skill.. I mean, I suppose a line can be as robust as the devs want, but unless the skill line is emaciated, to balance it with every class would be too nightmarish. I don't want a gutted concept because they have to take into account that Nightblade, Templar, Sorcerer and Dragonknight might use it. And it just wouldn't make sense for a Dragonknight or Nightblade to use necromancer. Maybe necromantic type abilities tailored to their own roles, but not necromancy as a robust casting line.

Completely agree, a world skill line would be way too small and a guild skill line would potentially be a cramped and perhaps underwhelming as a result. However, like I mentioned previously, a Lich world skill line paired with a Necromancy guild skill line and the Sorcerer class isn't unappealing.
I personally don't see the relation to necromancy and Dragonknights and while a Templar can go 'dark' they still have access to their healing spells and other 'light' magic, which is sort of odd. The Sorcerer and Nightblade classes make the most sense in relation to necromancy, however, only one skill line in each class seems particularly relevant (Dark Magic and Siphoning) . That being said I don't see why we can't brainstorm and potentially make something amazing! I have uni and whatnot so this probably won't progress at a pace I want, but between the regular posters it might develop rapidly.

Laura wrote: »

I tend to agree that it would be best done as a class itself but I forsee them doing a world class line or something like that. Hopefully they do something along the lines of making a choice between saving a paladin or sacrificing him. Your choice would lead you down a different guild line (paladin/dawnguard or necromancy) I'd like more choices that matter.

Making necromancy a lich line and making it sort of like werewolf/vampire might be cool too

Like I mentioned previously, a world skill line would be incredibly small in terms of spells, depth and all that sort of nonsense. Furthermore, I think it would clash with the Lich concept for a world skill line discussed in a different topic(http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/95491/lich-concept). Typically a Lich is a Necromancer but not all Liches ARE Necromancers and not all Necromancers strive to be Liches. I was also under the impression that the world skill lines were a 'pick x and you can't be y or z, pick z and you can't be x or y' sort of thing. A guild might work, but a world skill line? I'm not that confident.

Screenrocker wrote: »

May be someday they will make a Daedra or a Daedra-Alliance playable for Players. And then, I think, there can be a Necromancer senseful.

I doubt that will actually happen and I don't see why individuals can't be Necromancers. Not all Necromancers are evil, the concept of Necromancy is distasteful and perverted to some, but not inherently evil. Enemies are also rangers, pyromancers, warriors, healers and other such combinations.. I don't see why Necromancy has to be off limits because the antagonist is a Necromancer.

The_Sadist · May 2014

Once the week is out I'll start working on potential spells and whatnot, have a few assignments and some hurdle simulations to pass for university.. fun stuff. Feel free to start suggesting ideas and concepts but bear with me.

Tessitura · May 2014

1- Rot Worms: Applies a rotting disease of worms to the target dealing 300 damage over10 secounds. Ticks every one sec.

Morphes.

1-- Flesh Worms: The worms now consume faster decreasing the time it takes for them to complete their meal. reduces the time it takes to finish from 10 secounds to 8 secounds.

2-- Festering Worms: The worms now apply a debuff, Which weakens the targets spell resistance and armor by 500.

The_Sadist · May 2014

Tessitura wrote: »

1- Rot Worms: Applies a rotting disease of worms to the target dealing 300 damage over10 secounds. Ticks every one sec.

Morphes.

1-- Flesh Worms: The worms now consume faster decreasing the time it takes for them to complete their meal. reduces the time it takes to finish from 10 secounds to 8 secounds.

2-- Festering Worms: The worms now apply a debuff, Which weakens the targets spell resistance and armor by 500.

Added minus the specifics.

Lord_Hev · May 2014

My few cents on the reanimation ultimate:

I'd prefer something a bit different and "fun." As someone whom gets annoyed at seeing every single sorcerer with the same summons and can all summon the same identical, immobile Storm Atronach... How about we make things a little interesting here? Instead of a set summon for the ultimate? We mix things up a bit?

Summon Elite Undead: With this, you have an equal chance to summon one of these powerful undead(complete with their own unique abilities) with equal random chance?

So on each summoning you can get either:

Bone Colossus: Tanky and durable. They do good AOE melee damage. Allies can activate a synergy that summons a few weak skeletons(Bone-flayers)

Flesh Atronach: Decent durability. They do very good single-DPS with their melee, and with a decent ranged AOE flame burst from their left-hand cannon thingy. Allies can activate a synergy that causes a lava-plume that creates a trail of fire that can trap enemies.

Lich: They are locked and bound in-place, unable to move. They are the least durable.They do pure range-DPS as well as AOE CC stuns and snares. Allies can activate a synergy that causes the Lich to summon a quartet of weak Ghosts to harass enemies with frost magic.

Ancient Skeletal Champion: They are melee champions that will relentlessy chase down and taunt the most threatening enemy into a 1v1 duel. Allies can activate a synergy that causes a massive Talons-esque CC in a massive radius.

All ultimate summons have a base duration of 20 seconds. Improves with skill-increase and appropriate passives/morphs.

With this we get diversity. All of these summons have an equal threat value, yet at the same time, they have weakness and strengths over each other. I'll leave the number-crunching to the Devs. But regardless, no matter which one you get in a fight. They will serve a vital purpose. And you, must adapt.

Samadhi · May 2014

Still_Mind wrote: »

I'd rather have Necromancy as a World\Guild skill line. Tharn himself said that he'll "make a Necromancer out of you (Vestige) yet".

I would definitely use Necromancy as a Guild skill line.

I would not roll up a new character to play as a Necromancer class.

The_Sadist · May 2014

Lord_Hev wrote: »

My few cents on the reanimation ultimate:

I'd prefer something a bit different and "fun." As someone whom gets annoyed at seeing every single sorcerer with the same summons and can all summon the same identical, immobile Storm Atronach... How about we make things a little interesting here? Instead of a set summon for the ultimate? We mix things up a bit?

Summon Elite Undead: With this, you have an equal chance to summon one of these powerful undead(complete with their own unique abilities) with equal random chance?

So on each summoning you can get either:

Bone Colossus: Tanky and durable. They do good AOE melee damage. Allies can activate a synergy that summons a few weak skeletons(Bone-flayers)

Flesh Atronach: Decent durability. They do very good single-DPS with their melee, and with a decent ranged AOE flame burst from their left-hand cannon thingy. Allies can activate a synergy that causes a lava-plume that creates a trail of fire that can trap enemies.

Lich: They are locked and bound in-place, unable to move. They are the least durable.They do pure range-DPS as well as AOE CC stuns and snares. Allies can activate a synergy that causes the Lich to summon a quartet of weak Ghosts to harass enemies with frost magic.

Ancient Skeletal Champion: They are melee champions that will relentlessy chase down and taunt the most threatening enemy into a 1v1 duel. Allies can activate a synergy that causes a massive Talons-esque CC in a massive radius.

All ultimate summons have a base duration of 20 seconds. Improves with skill-increase and appropriate passives/morphs.

With this we get diversity. All of these summons have an equal threat value, yet at the same time, they have weakness and strengths over each other. I'll leave the number-crunching to the Devs. But regardless, no matter which one you get in a fight. They will serve a vital purpose. And you, must adapt.

I'm going to have to disagree with this concept.. as a Necromancer knows what they're preparing and what they're rising. However, the concept is interesting and if they went down that route I wouldn't disagree.. my issue is changing passives simply to increase it's duration. Alternative make it so one morph increases duration and another increases damage or something. More over, what were you anticipating? Of course everyone can summon the same things, it's like getting annoyed that the same classes use the same spells. If there were 10-20 classes you'd see less of an individual class and this might break the 'oh look a winged twilight.. and another.. and another' that's currently happening. That being said I'm normally quite indifferent when it comes to that sort of thing though.
I can foresee one issue, people complaining about the random nature of the spell.. so you really needed the Lich but got a Atronach and this caused you to die, you know people and how they love to complain!

Samadhi wrote: »

Still_Mind wrote: »

I'd rather have Necromancy as a World\Guild skill line. Tharn himself said that he'll "make a Necromancer out of you (Vestige) yet".

I would definitely use Necromancy as a Guild skill line.

I would not roll up a new character to play as a Necromancer class.

Well that's your loss. If they made it so a Necromancer was a class and you refused to re-roll for it, I don't think you'd be entitled to complain as the option was given to everyone.
Like I said, I feel a guild would be less restrictive compared with a world guild line and wouldn't mind it.. but as it stands I'll probably get this class concept done before writing a guild concept/

Lord_Hev · May 2014

The_Sadist wrote: »

I'm going to have to disagree with this concept.. as a Necromancer knows what they're preparing and what they're rising. However, the concept is interesting and if they went down that route I wouldn't disagree.. my issue is changing passives simply to increase it's duration. Alternative make it so one morph increases duration and another increases damage or something. More over, what were you anticipating? Of course everyone can summon the same things, it's like getting annoyed that the same classes use the same spells. If there were 10-20 classes you'd see less of an individual class and this might break the 'oh look a winged twilight.. and another.. and another' that's currently happening. That being said I'm normally quite indifferent when it comes to that sort of thing though.
I can foresee one issue, people complaining about the random nature of the spell.. so you really needed the Lich but got a Atronach and this caused you to die, you know people and how they love to complain!

Hmmm, why not just have all of them as an option? 4 summon ultimates to choose from/specialize. Not sure what would be bad about that.

Maybe it's just me, but I thought a random elite summon would be cool and refreshing to play around with. Maybe better suited for a conjurer instead? Pulling Daedra from Oblivion and what-not. Where-as the Necromancer knows exactly what he's resurrecting from the corpses and spirit energy around him.

methjester · May 2014

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

Lord_Hev · May 2014

methjester wrote: »

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

How about they utilize their massive development team to multi-task which is what large companies usually do?

methjester · May 2014

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

How about they utilize their massive development team to multi-task which is what large companies usually do?

They can't seem to focus on fixing anything important let alone research and develop something new. Dream all you want and make up all the fanciful skills you wish you could have. All the classes are currently broken in some form, some more than others. Passives don't work. There isn't any balance.

Be my guest though with all of their problems to divert resources to make a brand new class. How about they take the bot removal team and put them on Team Necro?

Lord_Hev · May 2014

methjester wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

How about they utilize their massive development team to multi-task which is what large companies usually do?

They can't seem to focus on fixing anything important let alone research and develop something new. Dream all you want and make up all the fanciful skills you wish you could have. All the classes are currently broken in some form, some more than others. Passives don't work. There isn't any balance.

Be my guest though with all of their problems to divert resources to make a brand new class. How about they take the bot removal team and put them on Team Necro?

Broken? They all seem to be working fine. Even the Nightblade class which everyone just assumes is broken. Fun fact, the creative director plays on a VR 13 Nightblade tank.

methjester · May 2014

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

How about they utilize their massive development team to multi-task which is what large companies usually do?

They can't seem to focus on fixing anything important let alone research and develop something new. Dream all you want and make up all the fanciful skills you wish you could have. All the classes are currently broken in some form, some more than others. Passives don't work. There isn't any balance.

Be my guest though with all of their problems to divert resources to make a brand new class. How about they take the bot removal team and put them on Team Necro?

Broken? They all seem to be working fine. Even the Nightblade class which everyone just assumes is broken. Fun fact, the creative director plays on a VR 13 Nightblade tank.

Most Nightblade passives do not work at the moment. So they are far from fine.

Lord_Hev · May 2014

methjester wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

How about they utilize their massive development team to multi-task which is what large companies usually do?

They can't seem to focus on fixing anything important let alone research and develop something new. Dream all you want and make up all the fanciful skills you wish you could have. All the classes are currently broken in some form, some more than others. Passives don't work. There isn't any balance.

Be my guest though with all of their problems to divert resources to make a brand new class. How about they take the bot removal team and put them on Team Necro?

Broken? They all seem to be working fine. Even the Nightblade class which everyone just assumes is broken. Fun fact, the creative director plays on a VR 13 Nightblade tank.

Most Nightblade passives do not work at the moment. So they are far from fine.

The Creative Director of ESO seems fine with them. He's leveled all the way to VR 13 on his Nightblade. If they really are broken. Then I'm sure he would notice it, and therefore, already have plans for it.

methjester · May 2014

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

How about they fix the 4 they have now?

How about they utilize their massive development team to multi-task which is what large companies usually do?

They can't seem to focus on fixing anything important let alone research and develop something new. Dream all you want and make up all the fanciful skills you wish you could have. All the classes are currently broken in some form, some more than others. Passives don't work. There isn't any balance.

Be my guest though with all of their problems to divert resources to make a brand new class. How about they take the bot removal team and put them on Team Necro?

Broken? They all seem to be working fine. Even the Nightblade class which everyone just assumes is broken. Fun fact, the creative director plays on a VR 13 Nightblade tank.

Most Nightblade passives do not work at the moment. So they are far from fine.

The Creative Director of ESO seems fine with them. He's leveled all the way to VR 13 on his Nightblade. If they really are broken. Then I'm sure he would notice it, and therefore, already have plans for it.

Super!! Keep discussing your super neet necro class. I'm sure they'll be adding it shortly. I'm glad to hear there are zero problems for them to work out and there are spare devs to go around.

Toodles.

Lord_Hev · May 2014

methjester wrote: »

Super!! Keep discussing your super neet necro class. I'm sure they'll be adding it shortly. I'm glad to hear there are zero problems for them to work out and there are spare devs to go around.

Toodles.

Yes. Your off-topic concerns about other classes unrelated to a topic waxing discussion on future content was most appreciated.

methjester · May 2014

Lord_Hev wrote: »

methjester wrote: »

Super!! Keep discussing your super neet necro class. I'm sure they'll be adding it shortly. I'm glad to hear there are zero problems for them to work out and there are spare devs to go around.

Toodles.

Yes. Your off-topic concerns about other classes unrelated to a topic waxing discussion on future content was most appreciated.

No problem. I really hope they get the lich skills and pet conjuring right. I'd hate for them to mess that up. Most important!

Lord_Hev · May 2014

methjester wrote: »

No problem. I really hope they get the lich skills and pet conjuring right. I'd hate for them to mess that up. Most important!

No one is going to take your strawman arguments seriously. Especially not the developers whom actually play the classes that you accuse of being completely broken... in VR 10+ content.

If there are problems with the classes, then the developers have been aware and are already testing fixes on the PTS servers. Stop derailing this thread please.