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Duels !!! Improve the PvP, Social, and Fun of ESO!
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frwinters_ESO wrote: »how many of these "we need dueling" threads do we need. I wouldn't mind dueling but its not needed. Most people duel when they are bored waiting for everyone to get to the dungeon your waiting to start.
I am purely responding to Brian Wheeler's request that "If enough people want a certain mode of pvp we may implement it." statement. So i thought i would voice my opinion.
I think the last bit magnifies that it is something to do in a small amount of time. And is easily accessible to players of all levels.
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Ragnar_Lodbrok✭✭✭✭✭
✭drktksnub18_ESO wrote: »Hello I am Astrosan, a Templar Healer/Dps in the Ebonheart Pact! Also Guild Leader of the 3PL.
Here are some reasons why Dueling should be implemented into ESO. Please show your support and comment so Brian Wheeler Lead PvP Designer can see that we want dueling!!
I greatly enjoy the game and the current PvP content. The massive scale battles in Cyrodiil are awesome and the info on what is to come such as the PvP dungeon in the Imperial City.. (Awesome.) Well, I would like to make a case for another type of PvP.. Duels. Which I believe can mechanically can be implemented into Cyrodiil. One concern that has come to light is that we do not want to splinter the population that is in Cyrodiil, I believe that I have a few solutions to actually strengthen the community in Cyrodiil through dueling and promote the social aspects of dueling in ESO. Lead PvP Designer Brian Wheeler asked for people to voice their opinions on other modes of PvP so I am hoping that he sees this. I believe that Dueling should be a high priority mode for PvP in the near future.
The Duel
What is a duel?
A duel is where two players fight head to head with no outside interaction.
What a duel mechanic can/should consist of..
- A short time usually lasting under a minute. Otherwise a Draw.
- A duel should be engaging and not excessively kiting around the other player.
- Should have mechanics such as being fully healed after the duel.
- No Gear Damage (recurve254)
- Should Be able to activate the duel instantly and repeatedly. (Ex:open option wheel, ask for duel> Player X kills Player Y> Full heal mechanic> Open option wheel, ask for duel> Player Y kills Player X> Full heal mechanic)
- Balance.. This is for the player base to decide. I believe that Cyrodill is the main place where the balance should stay and that dueling is more of a optional feature to improve your skills for Cyrodiil. Competitive balance should be the LAST thing the developers should worry about for dueling.
- FUN. There are no place for elitist or whiners in the dueling area. If this is your excuse for not adding duels, then you have flaws as a human being.
Who can do it?
With friends.. Guildies.. Other people in your Alliance.. Possibly people from other alliances?
Why should I want Duels in ESO?
There are several reasons that someone would want to duel another person.
At the top of my list would be to test out my skills and how they work against other people and the millions of build combinations. The ability to instantly try out a new build/combination of skills and practice them into oblivion is a very large Benefit to heighten the overall skill cap of yourself and the player base. I cannot stress how engaging and fun it is to try out new builds vs your friends or even meet new people. Losing DOES NOT matter, it is all about learning your class!!! HOW can we pass this up!?
So you think your build is the best in Tamriel? Why not duel to prove it? Actions speak a lot louder than words, and this would be an awesome way to show it. Sure, Cyrodiil is 100% where PvP should be balanced around, but it would still be fun to go head to head to further your own skill and silence those haters who don't believe in your playstyle. Community organized tournaments could/should be made and who knows.. place bets on your duel and maybe you could make yourself some gold. The endless possibilities are in the players hands. (See community aspect)
Community Aspect
From my experience in PvP oriented games that have Open World Dueling you start to see a community formed around the dueling area. Certain areas in the game become the place where the best of the best come together and duke it out. In my experience I have found that it is just as enjoyable to watch the high skilled players show off their sweet combos and battle it out against the best. You start to find people who fit your play style in PvP and who knows maybe you will even form a Guild! an Alliance of Guilds! or even better a whole community centered around Dueling!! In my past experiences I was able not only able to learn so much about my own play style but also the play style of those around me just by dueling them over and over again. Every Duel and moment will be different and it allows you to create memorable experiences with your friends in such a small amount of time!
How Should Dueling be implemented in ESO?
This is where we can definitely open up the discussion. The different mechanics behind how duels become a part of ESO can do quite a few things to the population if we are not careful. As Brian Wheeler has stated we want to add more options to PvP, but keep Cyrodiil as the main focus. So why not implement dueling into Cyrodiil itself. The location can be at one of the main wayshrines for each alliance in Cyrodiil instanced off like a dungeon. We could still feed information about the war in Cyrodiil for your own faction so that you know what is going on while you are dueling. This leads me to the naming of the instanced area which i believe should be called the Training Grounds. I believe that people from any alliance should all come to the same Training Grounds so that they may take part of the dueling and test their skills against anyone. Again this is up for discussion and we could limit that to instanced off alliance-only Training grounds.
Benefits of the Training Grounds method of dueling.
The Player
- Learn your class
- The ability to test new builds.
- The ability to quickly practice and refine your playstyle.
- Improve your PvP skills.
Social Aspect
- Duel your friends!!!
- A centralized pace for Dueling so it is easy to find another player who wants to duel.
- A place to form communities. The possibilities for social interaction are HUGE. (Something that some people believe ESO is lacking)
- A place for people to come watch and learn how to PvP from others.
Mechanical/Technical Aspect
- An area that is instanced off of any PvE aspect or Cyrodiil aspect of the game. (I believe it would be cool to still be fed information about the war and have the opportunity to take a wayshrine into the battle at any moment.)
- Be able to teleport to it like any other wayshrine.
- The potential for this to be a staging area for a guild to practice and warm up before taking the fight to Cyrodiil.
- Does not have to Effect XP Gains/Skill Gains/Alliance Points Gains or any aspect other than pure fun.
- The opportunity to add things such as a temporary respec capability while in the dueling area. Or perhaps rewards for dueling to respec?
- Instanced Dueling.. As soon as you accept the duel all other players are phased out and you can only see the person you are dueling. No Lag duels. I suggest that you still enable other people to see so that others can watch and learn.
- The potential for deathmatches or arenas to be added in at a later time.
- Add competitive aspects later on. ( First add the mechanics, then we can worry about competition.)
What ideas do you have for the Training Grounds? Do you support this? How can we implement Dueling in other ways?
A lot of requests have been made towards the idea of dueling anywhere. Perhaps a defaulted option set to OFF that you can turn ON for Duels anywhere?
I love Dueling! Please halp get this added to ESO.
You should really read the way forward interview. Zenimax already said in that that their will be NO duels, arenas, or battlegrounds. You can go qq now.
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Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »
You should really read the way forward interview. Zenimax already said in that that their will be NO duels, arenas, or battlegrounds. You can go qq now.
In Brian Wheeler's latest Teso interview he explicitly stated it is not out of the question. In fact he said if there is enough support it is a possibility that it will be worked on. Please don't QQ when there are clearly people who support duels.
Edited by drktksnub18_ESO on May 12, 2014 6:21PM0 -
Ragnar_Lodbrok✭✭✭✭✭
✭drktksnub18_ESO wrote: »Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »
You should really read the way forward interview. Zenimax already said in that that their will be NO duels, arenas, or battlegrounds. You can go qq now.
In Brian Wheeler's latest Teso interview he explicitly stated it is not out of the question. In fact he said if there is enough support it is a possibility that it will be worked on. Please don't QQ when there are clearly people who support duels.
The only people who support duels are baddies who hang outside of the starter areas sending duel requests to lvl 3 people while they are vr100 -
Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »drktksnub18_ESO wrote: »Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »
You should really read the way forward interview. Zenimax already said in that that their will be NO duels, arenas, or battlegrounds. You can go qq now.
In Brian Wheeler's latest Teso interview he explicitly stated it is not out of the question. In fact he said if there is enough support it is a possibility that it will be worked on. Please don't QQ when there are clearly people who support duels.
The only people who support duels are baddies who hang outside of the starter areas sending duel requests to lvl 3 people while they are vr10
That is very narrow minded thinking. What if we were to limit dueling to veteran ranks? What would be your excuse then? In my opinion dueling would be used for practice and fun competition.0 -
Sihnfahl✭✭✭✭
Due to the massive fighting, a lot of the front-line troops are little more than conscripts with minimal training. (Really, talk to a few; one Nord even asks what's the best way to hold a sword!) They get minimal training before being tossed into the grind. Some of them duel in camp, but the rest are just wondering how they survived.Dueling is a must, where else do you think the daggerfall, Dominion, and Ebonheart trained? They didn't just go to war without training.
To be fair, when EP and AD are facing down DC, they're not going to spend a lot of time training fodder. If you read and listen, you find that DC's mages are feared for the reason of being able to decimate front lines...0 -
JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO✭✭✭✭dueling is for people who need an epeen ego boost. I dont miss the lvl50s challenging my lvl30 to a duel every time I ran through stormwind.
Sounds like someone is angry because they suck at PvP.
Whenever I duel a higher level it didn't really bother me because guess what it's just a duel it isn't the end of the world.
So many basic MMO features ESO is missing like why was this not something staple only MMO I can't duel in are horrible under funded MMO like neverwinter but this game has millions of dollar in it and it missed this. At least chat bubbles are on the way for the RP community
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JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO✭✭✭✭Literally spamming a duel request is already do able since you can spam trade toward another player.
Balancing is another bad objection since three forums are already a balancing QQ cesspool.
"Seeing people duel each other upsets me" is another weak argument.
Seeing people /dance upset me it should be removed.
There is literally 0 reason to object dueling with a true reason other then being a little carebear that gets upset that your character can't beat that person's character, so you get demoralized and then call them names just because you can't duel them by calling them children or claiming duels is for epeen ego raising or whatever.
ESO is supposed to be a game about options with very little options.
Reroll feels the same since you play through the exact same zone.
One form of PvP.
One form of PvE.
Only options I can see in this game is thr character progressions and builds.
A guy that maxed out blacksmithing is literally the same as the other guy that maxed it out why isn't their options to make your crafting more specialized so all crafters aren't the same
Edited by JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO on May 12, 2014 9:01PM0 -
JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »Literally spamming a duel request is already do able since you can spam trade toward another player.
Balancing is another bad objection since three forums are already a balancing QQ cesspool.
"Seeing people duel each other upsets me" is another weak argument.
Seeing people /dance upset me it should be removed.
There is literally 0 reason to object dueling with a true reason other then being a little carebear that gets upset that your character can't beat that person's character, so you get demoralized and then call them names just because you can't duel them by calling them children or claiming duels is for epeen ego raising or whatever.
ESO is supposed to be a game about options with very little options.
Reroll feels the same since you play through the exact same zone.
One form of PvP.
One form of PvE.
Only options I can see in this game is thr character progressions and builds.
A guy that maxed out blacksmithing is literally the same as the other guy that maxed it out why isn't their options to make your crafting more specialized so all crafters aren't the same
I think the issue that most people are scared of is the what-if scenario of someone coming to complain on the forums about balance in duels. Or they didn't actaully read the post about my suggestion of an instanced dueling/staging area for Cyrodiil. In reality Dueling in the "Training Grounds" method has a very huge potential for many aspects of character progression and a non-linear experience while not taking away from the Cyrodiil immersion.0 -
Samadhi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭drktksnub18_ESO wrote: »...
I agree Kiting is a mechanic. What i meant was excessive kiting.. likkeee running for 20 minutes.. perhaps limiting the dueling area? but not so much as to prevent at least some type of kiting.
Thank you for clarifying, I can agree with your sentiment in that case.
Due to the massive fighting, a lot of the front-line troops are little more than conscripts with minimal training. (Really, talk to a few; one Nord even asks what's the best way to hold a sword!) They get minimal training before being tossed into the grind. Some of them duel in camp, but the rest are just wondering how they survived.Dueling is a must, where else do you think the daggerfall, Dominion, and Ebonheart trained? They didn't just go to war without training.
...
So why haven't we got the option of being like those ones that duel in camp?
@ General topic
I'm not super partial to dueling and normally only do it for fun on occasion, so I'm not terribly put out by it not being in game.
I do, however, see it as a simple solution to a pretty basic issue in the game -- if I want to play around and fight with my friends or guildmates just for fun it currently requires us to roll alts into the other alliances in order to do so.
I get that the people who don't like dueling probably don't consider that a valid concern; however, why should we be expected to build entire alt characters for something as basic as wanting to screw around among friends?
Edited by Samadhi on May 13, 2014 12:16AM"If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion." -- the 14th Dalai Lama
Wisdom is doing Now that which benefits you later.
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@ General topic
I'm not super partial to dueling and normally only do it for fun on occasion, so I'm not terribly put out by it not being in game.
I do, however, see it as a simple solution to a pretty basic issue in the game -- if I want to play around and fight with my friends or guildmates just for fun it currently requires us to roll alts into the other alliances in order to do so.
I get that the people who don't like dueling probably don't consider that a valid concern; however, why should we be expected to build entire alt characters for something as basic as wanting to screw around among friends?
I totally want to bash my friend in the face in a fast and efficient way. =P0 -
Just put it already ingame...
Dont know wheres the problem ... really.
Give the players who dont wanna duelling a "ignore duel" option, and make duels only possible in cyd, or a specific "arena" like thing.
If you are a serious PvP player you need to test things, you need to test counters to other builds, you need to test *** damnit.
WHERE IS THE PROBLEM ?!
No one get hurt ...
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That should not be the problem:AlexDougherty wrote: »I don't miss duelling, in fact not being asked to duel is a huge bonus for this game in my opinion.
Options --> Deny Duel Request
(If there will not be this option, there will at least be an Addon for that, for sure!)
But actually i am agreeing with you. Why requesting a duel if you can just kill a player without sending any request?!
Suits me well. Whoooo that would be fun! :-P
Edited by Sanguinantis on May 13, 2014 11:14AM0 -
isengrimb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I think this is an issue that the "justice system" is meant to address. That's why there will be "wanted criminals" and "guards" - player guards duel the player criminals, without the usual pain of people bugging you to duel them everywhere you go.
Basically, "Cops 'n' Robbers".
-Edited by isengrimb16_ESO on May 13, 2014 11:16AM0 -
While insightful, it would be a great pain to have to use this feature as a work around.. And in theory to me would splinter the population and clutter the possible dueling experience we are looking for. I don't know the details of the justice system so I cannot say much. Thanks for your reply.isengrimb16_ESO wrote: »I think this is an issue that the "justice system" is meant to address. That's why there will be "wanted criminals" and "guards" - player guards duel the player criminals, without the usual pain of people bugging you to duel them everywhere you go.
Basically, "Cops 'n' Robbers".
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NordJitsu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭We absolutely need an Arena, a dueling system, or preferably both.
If they don't add some form of small scale PvP, I'll have a real decision to make when it comes to renewing my sub after my 3 months are up.
I'm not saying I will rage quit because they're not doing what I tell them or anything. Its simply that I enjoy skill based PvP. Right now, its very hard to come by in this game.
If I don't get it, I might lose interest.0