We'll be able to have a mini Molag Bal following us but I still can't buff myself as a necro in town

CameraBeardThePirate · January 10

Come on. If you're going to enforce silly RP rules, at least be consistent about them.

There was literally a Daedric invasion helmed by Molag Bal. Why on earth would it be permissible, in lore, to have a miniature illusion of him following you around?

It's beyond frustrating that I can't even tweak my build and check my buffed stats as a necro in town without getting a bounty "bECaUsE rP", and yet, people will be allowed to run around with an illusion of the Daedric Prince that nearly ended Tamriel? Such a joke.

Erickson9610 · January 10

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

For instance, you could make your character look and act like a zombie via the Collections menu, but that doesn't mean that your character actually is one. Conversely, you could become infected with vampirism or lycanthropy, and that fundamentally changes how your character plays via skill lines.

If it can be toggled off easily with the Collections menu, then it isn't real. If you have to do something outside the Collections menu, then it is real. That doesn't explain why Companions can react to things you equip from the Collections menu, but that's just one oddity.

CameraBeardThePirate · January 10

Erickson9610 wrote: »

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

OK, then how about the fact that there's a Daedric Invasion, and an entire guild dedicated to fighting Daedra, but Sorcs are allowed to summon them in town?

There's no consistency at all, and the whole bounty thing amounts to nothing more than a waste of time and inconvenience.

LunaFlora · January 10

it's an imp

CameraBeardThePirate · January 10

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's an imp

An imp that looks like the thing that killed and enslaved a good portion of Tamriel's population. I'm sure law enforcement would have no problem with that.

And either way, Imps are still considered Daedra. If necromancy isn't allowed, neither should the summoning of Daedra during a Daedric War.

Erickson9610 · January 10

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

OK, then how about the fact that there's a Daedric Invasion, and an entire guild dedicated to fighting Daedra, but Sorcs are allowed to summon them in town?

There's no consistency at all, and the whole bounty thing amounts to nothing more than a waste of time and inconvenience.

Because Sorcerers bind Daedra to their will. Summoning Daedra isn't illegal, and it's widely practiced. Conjuration magic isn't illegal the way Necromancy magic is.

CameraBeardThePirate · January 10

Erickson9610 wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

OK, then how about the fact that there's a Daedric Invasion, and an entire guild dedicated to fighting Daedra, but Sorcs are allowed to summon them in town?

There's no consistency at all, and the whole bounty thing amounts to nothing more than a waste of time and inconvenience.

Because Sorcerers bind Daedra to their will. Summoning Daedra isn't illegal, and it's widely practiced. Conjuration magic isn't illegal the way Necromancy magic is.

Necromancy isn't even banned until the 3rd Era, and even then, only in Morrowind.

Necromancers also bind the undead to their will just the same as Daedric Summoners.

Syldras · January 10

Actually, the Planemeld isn't even over, dark anchors are still dropping. So, yeah, it's a very weird design decision.

If it was up to me, I'd replace that imp with something less illogical. But then again, I would also ban rotting undead horses, and spriggans in cities. Plus all polymorphs that would normally scare Tamriel's population to death.

Erickson9610 · January 10

Syldras wrote: »

Actually, the Planemeld isn't even over, dark anchors are still dropping. So, yeah, it's a very weird design decision.

If it was up to me, I'd replace that imp with something less illogical. But then again, I would also ban rotting undead horses, and spriggans in cities. Plus all polymorphs that would normally scare Tamriel's population to death.

Just gotta make sure they're legal only during the Witches Festival, otherwise the playerbase will complain that they can't dress up for it without being assaulted by guards...

CameraBeardThePirate · January 10

Syldras wrote: »

Actually, the Planemeld isn't even over, dark anchors are still dropping. So, yeah, it's a very weird design decision.

If it was up to me, I'd replace that imp with something less illogical. But then again, I would also ban rotting undead horses, and spriggans in cities. Plus all polymorphs that would normally scare Tamriel's population to death.

This is exactly my point though. There's a plethora of collections - and no, they're not 'outside of canon' like some people suggest as evidenced by the in-lore descriptions given for each one.

If I'm allowed to ride a Zombie mount into town following my friend that's just summoned a Daedra from the very plane Molag Bal is attempting to meld with Tamriel, I should be allowed to check my buffed stats at the crafting table by summoning a Ghost that heals people.

Syldras · January 10

Erickson9610 wrote: »

Just gotta make sure they're legal only during the Witches Festival, otherwise the playerbase will complain that they can't dress up for it without being assaulted by guards...

I'd be fine with that. And yeah, I know, people would complain if these things were suddenly banned so they couldn't use them anymore, including many that they paid real money for. That's why I would have never released all that immersion- and lore-breaking stuff.

Erickson9610 · January 10

Personally, I'd prefer if the concept of "criminal acts" was dropped altogether. No people getting angry at you for using Necromancer, Vampire, or Werewolf abilities. At least then I'd be able to duel another player in town without a guard swaying the battle in my opponent's favor.

Since I can't imagine ZOS would punish players for using certain cosmetics bought from the Crown Store, we'll have to live with this inconsistency. I personally wouldn't want to be arrested just for showing up in town using the Werewolf Lord polymorph.

Dagoth_Rac · January 10

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

it's an imp

An imp that looks like the thing that killed and enslaved a good portion of Tamriel's population.

Where are you seeing this? The publicity photo looks like a run of the mill imp to me. I think it might be bound in some kind of ghostly chains, perhaps as a reference to dark anchor chains? But it doesn't seem to look like a miniature Molag Bal. Personally, I'd love it if it did! But just looks like an imp to me...

Syldras · January 10

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Where are you seeing this? The publicity photo looks like a run of the mill imp to me. I think it might be bound in some kind of ghostly chains, perhaps as a reference to dark anchor chains? But it doesn't seem to look like a miniature Molag Bal. Personally, I'd love it if it did! But just looks like an imp to me...

Look here:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Molag_Bal_Illusion_Imp

spartaxoxo · January 10

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

OK, then how about the fact that there's a Daedric Invasion, and an entire guild dedicated to fighting Daedra, but Sorcs are allowed to summon them in town?

There's no consistency at all, and the whole bounty thing amounts to nothing more than a waste of time and inconvenience.

There are people who fight in their armies using daedra. The mages guild also uses them. There are people using them for both "good" and ill in Tamriel. Daedra worship is common. Daedra are neither man or mer and therefore not subject to the same rights and protections as them. Meanwhile, necromancy is not generally practiced. And the citizens of Tamriel don't take kindly to you desecrating their dead family members.

It is absolutely consistent to how Tamriel views the issue.

sharquez · January 10

Doctor Ghost Ph.D. (Phantom Haunted Doctor) has been unjustly banned from visiting his patients in public and it's a travesty.
He should be allowed to practice in public. After all how many times do we summon ghosts to help us as non necros?

Dagoth_Rac · January 10

Syldras wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Where are you seeing this? The publicity photo looks like a run of the mill imp to me. I think it might be bound in some kind of ghostly chains, perhaps as a reference to dark anchor chains? But it doesn't seem to look like a miniature Molag Bal. Personally, I'd love it if it did! But just looks like an imp to me...

Look here:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Molag_Bal_Illusion_Imp

Wow! Love it! It's adorable! Not sure why they have the actual flying imp in the PR photo. Due to that photo, I read the article as showing a Coldharbour-ish imp that is in thrall to Molag Bal, or something like that. Not a mini-me Molag Bal. Cool!

Syldras · January 10

spartaxoxo wrote: »

There are people who fight in their armies using daedra. The mages guild also uses them. There are people using them for both "good" and ill in Tamriel. Daedra worship is common. Daedra are neither man or mer and therefore not subject to the same rights and protections as them. Meanwhile, necromancy is not generally practiced. And the citizens of Tamriel don't take kindly to you desecrating their dead family members.
It is absolutely consistent to how Tamriel views the issue.

I completely agree with this. Having that Molag Bal effigy pet seems unfitting, though. I mean, realistically seen, many families must have been affected by the Planemeld, many lost their relatives due to all that. And it's not even over yet! I can't imagine they'd like to see small Molag Bals running around in town. Except for ritually burning or stomping them or something.

spartaxoxo · January 10

Syldras wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

There are people who fight in their armies using daedra. The mages guild also uses them. There are people using them for both "good" and ill in Tamriel. Daedra worship is common. Daedra are neither man or mer and therefore not subject to the same rights and protections as them. Meanwhile, necromancy is not generally practiced. And the citizens of Tamriel don't take kindly to you desecrating their dead family members.
It is absolutely consistent to how Tamriel views the issue.

I completely agree with this. Having that Molag Bal effigy pet seems unfitting, though. I mean, realistically seen, many families must have been affected by the Planemeld, many lost their relatives due to all that. And it's not even over yet! I can't imagine they'd like to see small Molag Bals running around in town. Except for ritually burning or stomping them or something.

It's not actually Molag Bal, it's an illusion. I'm sure opinions would vary on its appropriateness. Some might like to see him brought to heel, so to speak. And might like it if you made it act the fool. Others would find it in poor taste. Nevertheless, even the ones that dislike it are likely to like it more than you raising their grandma's corpse to do your bidding.

LunaFlora · January 10

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Where are you seeing this? The publicity photo looks like a run of the mill imp to me. I think it might be bound in some kind of ghostly chains, perhaps as a reference to dark anchor chains? But it doesn't seem to look like a miniature Molag Bal. Personally, I'd love it if it did! But just looks like an imp to me...

Look here:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Molag_Bal_Illusion_Imp

Wow! Love it! It's adorable! Not sure why they have the actual flying imp in the PR photo. Due to that photo, I read the article as showing a Coldharbour-ish imp that is in thrall to Molag Bal, or something like that. Not a mini-me Molag Bal. Cool!

the official photo is this

Dagoth_Rac · January 10

LunaFlora wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Where are you seeing this? The publicity photo looks like a run of the mill imp to me. I think it might be bound in some kind of ghostly chains, perhaps as a reference to dark anchor chains? But it doesn't seem to look like a miniature Molag Bal. Personally, I'd love it if it did! But just looks like an imp to me...

Look here:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Molag_Bal_Illusion_Imp

Wow! Love it! It's adorable! Not sure why they have the actual flying imp in the PR photo. Due to that photo, I read the article as showing a Coldharbour-ish imp that is in thrall to Molag Bal, or something like that. Not a mini-me Molag Bal. Cool!

the official photo is this

Yes, and I interpreted that as Molag Bal looking up at his "Illusion Imp" pet, not a miniature Molag Bal looking at an even more miniaturerer imp!

LunaFlora · January 10

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Where are you seeing this? The publicity photo looks like a run of the mill imp to me. I think it might be bound in some kind of ghostly chains, perhaps as a reference to dark anchor chains? But it doesn't seem to look like a miniature Molag Bal. Personally, I'd love it if it did! But just looks like an imp to me...

Look here:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Molag_Bal_Illusion_Imp

Wow! Love it! It's adorable! Not sure why they have the actual flying imp in the PR photo. Due to that photo, I read the article as showing a Coldharbour-ish imp that is in thrall to Molag Bal, or something like that. Not a mini-me Molag Bal. Cool!

the official photo is this

Yes, and I interpreted that as Molag Bal looking up at his "Illusion Imp" pet, not a miniature Molag Bal looking at an even more miniaturerer imp!

ohhh i get it now

CameraBeardThePirate · January 10

spartaxoxo wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

OK, then how about the fact that there's a Daedric Invasion, and an entire guild dedicated to fighting Daedra, but Sorcs are allowed to summon them in town?

There's no consistency at all, and the whole bounty thing amounts to nothing more than a waste of time and inconvenience.

There are people who fight in their armies using daedra. The mages guild also uses them. There are people using them for both "good" and ill in Tamriel. Daedra worship is common. Daedra are neither man or mer and therefore not subject to the same rights and protections as them. Meanwhile, necromancy is not generally practiced. And the citizens of Tamriel don't take kindly to you desecrating their dead family members.

It is absolutely consistent to how Tamriel views the issue.

Following this logic, I'm sure many people would look the other way if one of the high ranking generals of the factions army was summoning undead.

And again, in-lore Necromancy isn't even outlawed until the 3rd Era, and it only gets outlawed within Morrowind.

Necrotech_Master · January 10

i personally always found that making certain player skills "criminal acts" to be overly punishing

necromancers cant use like 1/3 of their skills in towns which is just annoying

i have had cases where i was in the overland killed a mob and then got a bounty from a wandering merchant because the heal ghost was still active, like thats just stupid

if your a vampire and you feed on someone in broad daylight in the middle of a town, yeah that makes sense to get a bounty, i would even think being a WW in a town makes more sense to get a bounty (though its still kind of just annoying as the necromancer skills)

spartaxoxo · January 10

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

To my understanding, everything in the Collections menu isn't canon or real the way the skill lines and abilities are real.

OK, then how about the fact that there's a Daedric Invasion, and an entire guild dedicated to fighting Daedra, but Sorcs are allowed to summon them in town?

There's no consistency at all, and the whole bounty thing amounts to nothing more than a waste of time and inconvenience.

There are people who fight in their armies using daedra. The mages guild also uses them. There are people using them for both "good" and ill in Tamriel. Daedra worship is common. Daedra are neither man or mer and therefore not subject to the same rights and protections as them. Meanwhile, necromancy is not generally practiced. And the citizens of Tamriel don't take kindly to you desecrating their dead family members.

It is absolutely consistent to how Tamriel views the issue.

Following this logic, I'm sure many people would look the other way if one of the high ranking generals of the factions army was summoning undead.

And again, in-lore Necromancy isn't even outlawed until the 3rd Era, and it only gets outlawed within Morrowind.

No, that doesn't follow that logic because it only it focuses on a singular reason (and not even the biggest one) while I gave multiple.

Beyond that, Necromancy isn't only outlawed in the 3rd era. It has been allowed and made illegal at various points throughout Tamriel's history.

Syldras · January 10

spartaxoxo wrote: »

It's not actually Molag Bal, it's an illusion.

I know. But I'm sure that someone whose family had been killed wouldn't find it less tasteless because of that. It's still a depiction of a Daedric Prince that caused a lot of grief to the people.

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Nevertheless, even the ones that dislike it are likely to like it more than you raising their grandma's corpse to do your bidding.

That's out of question. Still it's a bad design decision in my opinion, and it's a bit sad that who decided to create this probably didn't think much about immersion or lore consistency, but only "Woah, looks cool and it's linked to the original story, so it's great for the anniversary". Nothing new, I know. A big portion of the crown store is filled with flashy, "cool" looking items that don't make much sense in the world of ESO.

francesinhalover · January 10

If only i had some cool eyes to use with all this nice cosmetics...

Eyes of s'rendarr i waited half a year for them and they are glitched

Maybe ill just paint my necromancers hair white! and give him gray eyes!

Honestly! i love it's molag ball year. I will use the pet sometimes for the fun of it! but my main love is that nice tatoo and personality

Tyrant_Tim · January 10

francesinhalover wrote: »

If only i had some cool eyes to use with all this nice cosmetics...

Eyes of s'rendarr i waited half a year for them and they are glitched

ZOS actually came out and stated that the Eyes of S’rendarr aren’t glitched and are inspired by cats of two different eye colors.

Tyrant_Tim · January 10

My take on this topic is that I believe at the very least, your Necromancy skills should not grant a bounty in any Daedric realm.

I’m looking specifically at Fargrave, I absolutely hate how Coldharbour is the only city in the game where I can run around freely with my Necromancer without a fear of building up a massive bounty.

spartaxoxo · January 10

Syldras wrote: »

I know. But I'm sure that someone whose family had been killed wouldn't find it less tasteless because of that. It's still a depiction of a Daedric Prince that caused a lot of grief to the people.

The argument isn't whether they'd find it tasteful though. It's whether they'd report it as a crime like with Necromancy. And I don't think that's consistent with the lore to attack over a clear illusion, regardless of taste.

Soarora · January 10

I mean, functionally, it'd be difficult to make a non-combat pet a crime. I had played before Necro was added as a werewolf and I found it super weird that I could just walk around in town as a werewolf.