Account-Wide Achievements (Or why some ideas can be bad)

Skjaldbjorn

Hey, folks.

As someone who is considering returning after a long break, I've had my eye on the PTS notes, and been listening to what some folks are saying, checking screenshots, etc.

By and large, I actually agree with a lot of the direction Zos is taking here. But, as always, there's a sticky widget and Zos goofed pretty damn hard in a critical area.

Overall, I think merging most achievements to an account-wide system is actually pretty solid! I'm sure it'll *** off hardcore completionists who want to get every. single. achievement. on every single toon, but for most of us, seems fine. Since I began in Morrowind, it always seemed the general population had one "main" toon they cared about achievements on, and everything else was whatever.

Where this idea flops dead in the street is when it comes to end-game PVE. Two issues.

1. Achievement recorded date/source is being tracked as the first toon you log into

I am not currently on PTS, not downloading it. I'm waiting to see what people discover. However, from what I (and many others) can tell, in your achievement panel, let's say you have Gryphon Heart on five characters. Whichever you log into first will be the one "credited" with the achievement. Not your first source, but whichever you happen to log into first. This is goofy, but a small sin and one that people who like to track their individual character accomplishments don't love. I think this is passable, however, the next one...

2. Trifecta Tracking

This...this is an issue. Aside from the aforementioned problem, individual characters can now no longer track trifectas as far as I can tell. If I have Gryphon heart on Bob, Tom and Andy, it now means nothing if I go and acquire it on Cindy and Jimbo. There's no gain. For many end-game PVE players, the appeal of returning to older content was to push achievements on characters that did not previously have it. I personally brought four different tanks to four different Kyne's progs for this exact reason. I enjoyed the idea of "stacking" Trifectas, as do many in the end-game community.

In fact, as I have been working on returning, several players I have spoken to are borderline ready to quit, or outright are quitting over this change, particularly the second aspect.

I don't hate the idea. I think, by and large, it's a good change. But trifectas should be a "special" achievement. Let the title be shared. That's fine. That makes sense to show the world, "Hey, I did this thing". Nobody is arguing against that. But for the love of all things competitive and completion-y, do NOT track trifectas this way. You have a list of achievements this doesn't apply to. Trifectas need to be on this list, or you're going to lose even more end-game PVE players.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk, or whatever.

Xebov

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

Katheriah

Isn't the fix for this issue that you'd have an extra tab for achievements per character?

SeaUnicorn

1. Achievement recorded date/source is being tracked as the first toon you log into

I don't think this is the case, I logged on my Sorc who had GH some time last year and then on Warden who had GH 2 years ago and it updated from Sorc to Warden in the tracker. It looks like it takes toon who achieved it 1st for the tracker.

I would like to see each toon name in the tracker or just number of the achieves I have gotten. A lot of people are motivated to do 2nd and 3rd trifectas on alternative toons. And that toon name tracking would be a good substitute for that type of incentive.

Some alternative incentive would also work, for example rare Style Pages that only drop when you complete the trifecta, or collectible components that you can morph into something cool akin to event morphable pets.

kind_hero

Erasing the date of the achievements you unlocked with your chars and keeping only the 1st date the system finds is the worst implementation I have heard!

Why did we bothered all these years?

I don't care if they are account wide, IF I CAN SEE WHICH CHAR DID THEIR ACHIEVEMENTS AND WHEN

So, yeah, merge everything, but keep the history of these achievements for each char!!! Otherwise many many players will be upset and you will annoy your playerbase even further because you are doing this in a year when your expansion brings nothing new besides content, and throws in a card game instead of any other more desired features! The forums are full with reactions on these topics. I am baffled by this decision and by this implementation. The only things that were QoL in terms of achievements were the grinds that you keep char bound!

Please read the feedback and implement this idea wisely!
You did so many things right, like the curated drops and "sticker book", please do this right!

IrishOphidia

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

Very incorrect. A large number of the true end-game players use trifecta tracking as a way of tracking how efficient players are at different content. “I want to push x in x trial.” and someone has 3-4 titles on different characters for that trial then I’m going to take them due to experience. Also, this will inherently make it far more difficult for newer players to get these titles because experienced players will have no reason to join those progressions to help those groups. This will heavily affect a lot of progression groups that rely on those experienced players.

Getting trifectas IS valuable and more prestigious than a vast majority of the content simply due to difficulty alone. Saying they aren’t is simply laughable. Same applies to PvP. “Oh you got Emperor and Grand Overlord on 18 characters?!” No, they got it once. That’s less impressive. You belittling the time and effort other people put into achieving these titles on multiple characters is simple arrogance.

Skjaldbjorn

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

There is a vast difference between a trifecta, whether dungeon or trial, and a clear, or an achievement because you ate a lot of cheese.

You can't relate the two. They are not measureable on the same scale by any metric. The time, investment and effort to acquire trifecta achievements alone makes them "special".

Skjaldbjorn

SeaUnicorn wrote: »

1. Achievement recorded date/source is being tracked as the first toon you log into

I don't think this is the case, I logged on my Sorc who had GH some time last year and then on Warden who had GH 2 years ago and it updated from Sorc to Warden in the tracker. It looks like it takes toon who achieved it 1st for the tracker.

I would like to see each toon name in the tracker or just number of the achieves I have gotten. A lot of people are motivated to do 2nd and 3rd trifectas on alternative toons. And that toon name tracking would be a good substitute for that type of incentive.

Some alternative incentive would also work, for example rare Style Pages that only drop when you complete the trifecta, or collectible components that you can morph into something cool akin to event morphable pets.

I'd be fine with that. Or a badge on the achievement if that toon specifically received the trifecta. There is simply no reason to eliminate trifecta tracking entirely on a per-character bases.

Fazuszek

Kinda gonna be strange to see lvl 1 godslayers lol

SeaUnicorn

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

Exception works for skyshards, so its not impossible. From tech perspective its not impossible either. In addition some of the solutions we have offered are not exception but can be universally applied, such as list of toon names who got the achieves. This will be equally nice for 7-times Godslayer and 30-times master angler.

luen79rwb17_ESO

Fazuszek wrote: »

Kinda gonna be strange to see lvl 1 godslayers lol

Lol! Think outside the box please!

willymancer69

Right now, incentive exists to replay vet content in the form of plunder. Incentive exists to replay HM content in the form of gold gear drops. With the new achievement system, no incentive and thereby replayability exists for trifecta content.

Prior, many of us played to unlock unique titles on different toons, encouraging us to play 6-9 hours a week for months to push this content per raid team. It kept us in the game, buying more character slots, and helping progression groups of players without the title because we still got the title on a new toon in return.

As someone who comfortably sits in the player group that pushes trifectas but not trifecta scores (which is even much smaller subgroup), I'm considering leaving ESO because it feels like I'm being pushed out.

Please refer to @skinnycheeks video below that offers some great solutions to the incentive gap issue for trifectas, such as loot tables and title appearance changes. A Pithka-esque add-on that's part of the base game would also be amazing and solve a lot of community issues.

https://youtu.be/WggNrMeWfPc

Csleia

The backbone of eso endgame (especially at the trifecta level) were players with experience going back to help other players get their achievements.

Repeatable achievements were a core incentive for people that already got one trifecta to get it again while helping others get their first.

This change makes us UNABLE to get repeat achievements (trifectas) on any of our characters. It also deletes all of the repeat trifectas we have already achieved except for the first character that did it.

ZOS,
you could have kept the individual dates that each character completed the achievement
you could have kept the "achieved by: character name" for EACH character that achieved it
you could have added a counter/list of characters and dates for repeated achievements
any way to keep the ability to track individual character trifecta clears would have saved this

New players seem to be happy that they wont "have to" do a challenge again on other characters, but they do not yet see that they will be UNABLE to get that achievement again if they were to accomplish it. People do not want to perform a task for no reward or any sign that it was ever done more than once. Get it once and move on forever, no reason to get it again on another character. Good luck on your quest for first time trifectas everyone because almost nobody who already has them will want to.

Rex-Umbra

I don't do trials but can someone tell me what a trifecta is?

Csleia

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

I don't do trials but can someone tell me what a trifecta is?

Hardmode, Speedrun, Nodeath, for all 12 players in a single run. Depending on the trial these challenges can take months for each.

Rex-Umbra

Oh wow yeah guess that would be tough.

Dark_Lord_Kuro

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

There is a vast difference between a trifecta, whether dungeon or trial, and a clear, or an achievement because you ate a lot of cheese.

You can't relate the two. They are not measureable on the same scale by any metric. The time, investment and effort to acquire trifecta achievements alone makes them "special".

Special to the few poeple that go for them, absolutly non special for everybody else

Xebov

IrishOphidia wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

Very incorrect. A large number of the true end-game players use trifecta tracking as a way of tracking how efficient players are at different content. “I want to push x in x trial.” and someone has 3-4 titles on different characters for that trial then I’m going to take them due to experience. Also, this will inherently make it far more difficult for newer players to get these titles because experienced players will have no reason to join those progressions to help those groups. This will heavily affect a lot of progression groups that rely on those experienced players.

Getting trifectas IS valuable and more prestigious than a vast majority of the content simply due to difficulty alone. Saying they aren’t is simply laughable. Same applies to PvP. “Oh you got Emperor and Grand Overlord on 18 characters?!” No, they got it once. That’s less impressive. You belittling the time and effort other people put into achieving these titles on multiple characters is simple arrogance.

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

There is a vast difference between a trifecta, whether dungeon or trial, and a clear, or an achievement because you ate a lot of cheese.

You can't relate the two. They are not measureable on the same scale by any metric. The time, investment and effort to acquire trifecta achievements alone makes them "special".

Its prestigious for the players that care about them. You have a part of the community that cares about these achievments and works towards them. They spend time to get it, so do others with other parts of the game. Its a piece of content that some are more interested in than others, but expecting that its viewed as some sort of pinacle that should get special treatment is plain and simple wrong.

Players play the game and they have fun and what everyone has to understand is that everyone sets their own challenges and likes different things. Trying to elevate some sort of content over the other is a wrong approach.

SeaUnicorn wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

Exception works for skyshards, so its not impossible. From tech perspective its not impossible either. In addition some of the solutions we have offered are not exception but can be universally applied, such as list of toon names who got the achieves. This will be equally nice for 7-times Godslayer and 30-times master angler.

Iam not saying its impossible. I simply dont like the stance "hey i can do this content and my rewards deserve special treatment because what i do is the pinacle of the game". Everything should be treated the same way. Otherwise we end up with ppl feeling unfairly treated because whatever they do is viewed as lesser content.

Skjaldbjorn

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

There is a vast difference between a trifecta, whether dungeon or trial, and a clear, or an achievement because you ate a lot of cheese.

You can't relate the two. They are not measureable on the same scale by any metric. The time, investment and effort to acquire trifecta achievements alone makes them "special".

Special to the few poeple that go for them, absolutly non special for everybody else

I personally don't view Master Angler as worth my time investment. It's grindy, hugely time consuming and offers limited rewards.

When I see someone with the title, I still have respect for the time, effort and energy, and view that as a "special" achievement.

SeaUnicorn

Xebov wrote: »

Iam not saying its impossible. I simply dont like the stance "hey i can do this content and my rewards deserve special treatment because what i do is the pinacle of the game". Everything should be treated the same way. Otherwise we end up with ppl feeling unfairly treated because whatever they do is viewed as lesser content.

Planesbreaker takes 12 people to invest 8-9 hours a week for 2-4 months to achieve. If you have not done it you can't judge people who did. And nobody says Master Angler is inferior. But you can do Master Angler on your own, you don't need 11 other people to commit time to it. Planesbreaker does. So if you take out motivation to replay that particular achievement - people who want to do it few patches after (i.e. new players or players who progress *** slowly, i.e. casual gamers) will have hella hard time getting a group for it. Cuz without incentive why would people who already have it commit 100+ hours of their lives to re-prog it again?.. Currently you have GS progs where 7 players already have it and getting it on alts, and 5 fresh players. Try to roster prog 7 people. That is a death for a raiding team, god forbid you have supports among those 7, your group is done for...
Basically as all the other changes its not the end game players top 1% who gets punished, its the mid tier players....

Necrotech_Master

ive been kind of wanting them to do account wide achievements for quite a long time now

i initially started trying to get as many achievement on my main as possible, however, there were some i just knew i wasnt going to be able to get with him

this led to me just trying to get achievements on whatever toon was able to complete the content the best with their current build to earn the achievement at least once

with titles i was just using whatever the "hardest" title was to get on that particular toon, instead of trying to be creative with them or theming because majority of the titles were on my main

willymancer69

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

ive been kind of wanting them to do account wide achievements for quite a long time now

i initially started trying to get as many achievement on my main as possible, however, there were some i just knew i wasnt going to be able to get with him

this led to me just trying to get achievements on whatever toon was able to complete the content the best with their current build to earn the achievement at least once

with titles i was just using whatever the "hardest" title was to get on that particular toon, instead of trying to be creative with them or theming because majority of the titles were on my main

Now, would you ever redo those achievements again on another toon? In short, is there any replayability that exists for you for those achievements?

Many of us, RPers who love the mainland stories or people who push trial clears, stay on this game for their unique ability to allow us to "re-earn" achievements. This has been removed from the game, removing many sectors of the playerbase's motivation to keep playing after many years of playing.

Skjaldbjorn

Xebov wrote: »

Iam not saying its impossible. I simply dont like the stance "hey i can do this content and my rewards deserve special treatment because what i do is the pinacle of the game". Everything should be treated the same way. Otherwise we end up with ppl feeling unfairly treated because whatever they do is viewed as lesser content.

You're missing the point entirely. It's not about just trifectas, but they are most assuredly on average the biggest time investment, gold sink, energy sink and teamwork-themed accomplishment in ESO. However, I view dungeon trifectas the same. I view achievements like Master Angler the same. I view achievements like the Adventurer lines that state you've completed every quest the same.

You think all I care about is trifectas. They are what's personal to me, absolutely. I care about important, difficult achievements. If you want your game to lose what's left of its end-game player base, carry on. That's all you're encouraging. Kill the MMO you like, I guess.

soulreaper1213

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

This is a *** reason to remove the ability to individually get a trifecta per character. The people who have 1 trifecta do not lose anything from individual trifecta/title tracking. The people who have multiple trifectas lose a physical, in-game reason to pursue another trifecta but on a different character. Most of end-game pve players want individual title tracking as that is the reason to do a piece of content multiple times.

Instead, you should stop diminishing the importance that people place into the individual character tracking of trifectas. Trifectas exist, my level 3 warden didn't get TTT.

honglatongla

Turns out endgame raiders might actually big one of the bigger roleplayers of all.

Jokes aside, just add all character names that have earned the respective achievement to the "Earned by" section of the popup.

Necrotech_Master

willymancer69 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

ive been kind of wanting them to do account wide achievements for quite a long time now

i initially started trying to get as many achievement on my main as possible, however, there were some i just knew i wasnt going to be able to get with him

this led to me just trying to get achievements on whatever toon was able to complete the content the best with their current build to earn the achievement at least once

with titles i was just using whatever the "hardest" title was to get on that particular toon, instead of trying to be creative with them or theming because majority of the titles were on my main

Now, would you ever redo those achievements again on another toon? In short, is there any replayability that exists for you for those achievements?

Many of us, RPers who love the mainland stories or people who push trial clears, stay on this game for their unique ability to allow us to "re-earn" achievements. This has been removed from the game, removing many sectors of the playerbase's motivation to keep playing after many years of playing.

i dont see why you cant still redo the requirements of those achievements, from the way i see it, your still doing the same content just on a different toon, to me it would be more about the enjoyment of the group of people you are running it with

i personally havent gotten any of those trifecta achievements yet, but if i wanted a challenge i would still try to do them, even if i had already completed them (i may want to help a friend get it, or just because i wanted to do it again)

to me the achievement should be a representation of the first time you accomplished something in the game, but not necessarily the entire reason you were running the content in the first place

under your logic i should never even bother doing dungeon HMs for any dungeon even FG1 again, even though ive done that many many times and not just for undaunted pledges

i mean no disrespect if you want to keep achievements tracked per character, i personally would have just been happy if they had touched up the achievement page to see how much you had completed in total and which characters had which achievement, but im also not unhappy with the way they are implementing it, as it wont change the way im going to play

SeaUnicorn

willymancer69 wrote: »

Many of us, RPers who love the mainland stories or people who push trial clears, stay on this game for their unique ability to allow us to "re-earn" achievements. This has been removed from the game, removing many sectors of the playerbase's motivation to keep playing after many years of playing.

Do you see some sort of solution that would work from RPer perspective?
I am guessing list/number would not be enough? End Game PVErs have pretty simple needs - we just flex stuff, bigger - better (higher score, bigger # of trifectas and so on)
But I am thinking it does not work like that for RP purposes. You probably want more intricate tracking.

Zymcio

soulreaper1213 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

This is a *** reason to remove the ability to individually get a trifecta per character. The people who have 1 trifecta do not lose anything from individual trifecta/title tracking. The people who have multiple trifectas lose a physical, in-game reason to pursue another trifecta but on a different character. Most of end-game pve players want individual title tracking as that is the reason to do a piece of content multiple times.

Instead, you should stop diminishing the importance that people place into the individual character tracking of trifectas. Trifectas exist, my level 3 warden didn't get TTT.

Then write on paper ?? i did let say 5 Trifecta in SG + 2 TTT + 3 IR etc... on one same char this mean i lose something ? no i play for fun ... and who cares how much trifecta you got... Then i guess when you play games like dark souls you buy 3 copies on 3 different steam account to have full 100% achiv on mage build + warrior build + archer build ??

This is only a game and if someone is saying he is losing something here i think he need to go outsite like rly...

One more thing before this "achiv" era which comes i think from xbox , ppl just enjoy playing the game. Now i think most of them lost the idea of playing the game...

willymancer69

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

willymancer69 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

ive been kind of wanting them to do account wide achievements for quite a long time now

i initially started trying to get as many achievement on my main as possible, however, there were some i just knew i wasnt going to be able to get with him

this led to me just trying to get achievements on whatever toon was able to complete the content the best with their current build to earn the achievement at least once

with titles i was just using whatever the "hardest" title was to get on that particular toon, instead of trying to be creative with them or theming because majority of the titles were on my main

Now, would you ever redo those achievements again on another toon? In short, is there any replayability that exists for you for those achievements?

Many of us, RPers who love the mainland stories or people who push trial clears, stay on this game for their unique ability to allow us to "re-earn" achievements. This has been removed from the game, removing many sectors of the playerbase's motivation to keep playing after many years of playing.

i dont see why you cant still redo the requirements of those achievements, from the way i see it, your still doing the same content just on a different toon, to me it would be more about the enjoyment of the group of people you are running it with

i personally havent gotten any of those trifecta achievements yet, but if i wanted a challenge i would still try to do them, even if i had already completed them (i may want to help a friend get it, or just because i wanted to do it again)

to me the achievement should be a representation of the first time you accomplished something in the game, but not necessarily the entire reason you were running the content in the first place

under your logic i should never even bother doing dungeon HMs for any dungeon even FG1 again, even though ive done that many many times and not just for undaunted pledges

i mean no disrespect if you want to keep achievements tracked per character, i personally would have just been happy if they had touched up the achievement page to see how much you had completed in total and which characters had which achievement, but im also not unhappy with the way they are implementing it, as it wont change the way im going to play

I get where you're coming from, but I think there are different barriers to entry for some of the things listed. Some of the achievements you listed take 6-9 hours of people pushing their peak performance for months while others take a few hours or weeks (a HM clear for dungeons).

Respectfully, the point I was trying to make is we're now missing incentive to push for prestigious achievements a second time, achievements from trifectas to Master Angler to Master Crafters etc. This game uniquely gave you a reward for pushing these high investment achievements a second time (title unlocked, achievement unlocked and date) where other games don't recognize and reward that effort (ex. WoW). That now won't exist in ESO, pushing many of us away. Personally, I play this game to re-earn achievements on different toons, by class or role. I no longer have any incentive.

I hope this better clarifies what I meant.

Skjaldbjorn

honglatongla wrote: »

Turns out endgame raiders might actually big one of the bigger roleplayers of all.

Jokes aside, just add all character names that have earned the respective achievement to the "Earned by" section of the popup.

I'd be fine with that outcome, too. But to just erase the work is absurd.

Skjaldbjorn

Zymcio wrote: »

soulreaper1213 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

2. Trifecta Tracking

You guys should stop trying to elevate the importance of this content beyond anything else. Trifectas exist, a few ppl get them, fewer do them a number of times, but they are not more valueable than someone spending the time for something else. Expecting an exception for this is basically saying "Iam fine with your content becoming account wide but i want an exception for mine". This is not going to work.

This is a *** reason to remove the ability to individually get a trifecta per character. The people who have 1 trifecta do not lose anything from individual trifecta/title tracking. The people who have multiple trifectas lose a physical, in-game reason to pursue another trifecta but on a different character. Most of end-game pve players want individual title tracking as that is the reason to do a piece of content multiple times.

Instead, you should stop diminishing the importance that people place into the individual character tracking of trifectas. Trifectas exist, my level 3 warden didn't get TTT.

Then write on paper ?? i did let say 5 Trifecta in SG + 2 TTT + 3 IR etc... on one same char this mean i lose something ? no i play for fun ... and who cares how much trifecta you got... Then i guess when you play games like dark souls you buy 3 copies on 3 different steam account to have full 100% achiv on mage build + warrior build + archer build ??

This is only a game and if someone is saying he is losing something here i think he need to go outsite like rly...

One more thing before this "achiv" era which comes i think from xbox , ppl just enjoy playing the game. Now i think most of them lost the idea of playing the game...

There is a level of accomplishment. If I can get these trifectas across multiple classes/builds/metas, that shows my ability to play through different climates and still thrive.

As it stands, a player can literally one trick, get every achievement/trifecta once, but looks the same on the surface as someone who can play every class at a high level.