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Old outdated sets revisions
MacRibs
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Introduction
With hybridization and now the update 35 intention of making buffs and debuffs as well as dots easier to manage there are some older sets that new to be updated to be in line with the game direction.
Some of these sets have barely been touched ever since they came out leaving them forgotten with no place in today's game, with some archaic proc conditions other unmanageable buffs specially when compared with newer sets.
The idea is not to make them meta sets or bis but only to make them more viable or at least work decently because while I applaud the notion of having new sets being added to the game there's is also a gigantic list of sets that simply put have no use whatsoever other than filling sticker books and deconstruction.
By having these older sets updated we would be increasing build diversity while also add a incentive to run older dungeons and trials.
Proc Conditions
Some these set's original proc condition idea is to have the player close to the target/s making them have to go up close and taking risks to use them and not to procc them from safe distance, others are so that they only proc when enemies are nearby or on contact with the player which result in multiple outdated proc conditions which honestly should all be the same, they should all have the proc conditions changed to "in melee range" which is about 5m and is a proc condition already in the game making them more intuitive, easier understand and manage to all players.
Right now we have:
Some of these conditions lead to some situations that don't really make much sense since there are classes that no matter if you play magicka or stamina builds requires the players to be up close to their targets (for example thunderbug proccing from someone hitting you with Brawler but not from Carve, Puncturing Sweeps, Molten Whip which all have the enemy standing in similar range) and goes against the hybridization goal the game has been following in which most players use a variety of types of damage with some skills now even costing a mix of magicka and stamina.
The following sets are:
Alessia's Bulwark
Knightmare
Note:This set now applies Major Cowardice instead of Minor Maim and now procs when dealing damage in melee range instead of when the user takes damage from a Martial melee attack.
Dragon's Defilement
Note: This set now also applies Minor Defile, decrease this set cooldown to 3 seconds, down from 5 and now procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes damage from a melee attack
Night Terror
Note: This set now has 1 second cool down per target and procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes damage from a melee attack.
Thunderbug's Carapace
Note: Increase the radius to 6 meters, from 5 and this set now procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes Physical Damage.
Hand of Mephala
Note: Increase the radius to 8 meters up from 4 meters, this set now procs in 4+4 seconds down from 5, increase the snare potency to 40% up from 33%, increase the cooldown to 8 seconds, up from 5 and this set now procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes Damage.
Aegis Caller
Note:Reduced the time delay of the Lesser Aegis spin to 2 seconds, down from 2.5 and this set now procs when dealing critical damage in melee range Instead of dealing Critical Martial melee damage.
The following sets have very limiting proc condition: "Whenever you kill an enemy" which although simple is hindered when doing group content since they require the user to do deal the killing blow to the target which when grouping with other players becomes harder the more people the player is grouping with.
As such the following sets should have their proc condition changed to "When an enemy you have recently damaged dies", a condition already in the game which would make their proc condition easier to achieve and make the sets easier to use in group content.
Low duration Buffs
These are some sets that have outdated proc conditions with very low duration buffs who need to have both updated to be in line with some recent sets and standardized buffs duration.
Storm Knight's Plate
Note: This set now also grants Minor Expedition for the duration, increase the set duration and cooldown to 12 seconds up from 6, increase the radius to 6 meters from 5 and this set now procs when you take Ranged Damage instead of non-Physical Damage.
Embershield
Note: Reduced the Physical and Spell Resistance gained to 3000 down from 3300, increased the duration to 12 seconds from 6 secs, increase the radius to 6 meters up from 5 and this set now procs when you deal damage with a Heavy Attack instead of complete a fully-charged Heavy Attack.
Seventh Legion Brute
Note: Reduced the Weapon and Spell Damage and Health Recovery to 321, from 341, and increased the duration to 20 seconds, from 15 sec, which is the shorter duration between all major resolve granting abilities, with the previous 15 sec cooldown this would make most classes have to recast those abilities 5/10 sec before their effect ended in order to maintain the buff. Also in order to make this set more viable as a back bar set the third and forth line have been switched.
Armor Master
Note: Reduced the resistances gained to 4000 down from 5940, and increased the duration to 20 seconds up from 10 seconds so as to being closer to the duration of most Armor abilities .
Trinimac's Valor
Elemental Damage Sets
With the new LA and HA damage change coming in update 35 the following sets should have their 5 piece bonus Weapon and Spell Damage increased to 600:
Note: The reason behind why these sets could not have a 600 Weapon and Spell Damage bonus much like War Maiden was that it would also buff destruction staves LA and HA damage however with the recent intended changes to LA and HA having flat damage values instead of scaling with Weapon and Spell Damage there is no reason for them not to have the 600 bonus.
Edited by MacRibs on July 21, 2022 5:57PM With hybridization and now the update 35 intention of making buffs and debuffs as well as dots easier to manage there are some older sets that new to be updated to be in line with the game direction.
Some of these sets have barely been touched ever since they came out leaving them forgotten with no place in today's game, with some archaic proc conditions other unmanageable buffs specially when compared with newer sets.
The idea is not to make them meta sets or bis but only to make them more viable or at least work decently because while I applaud the notion of having new sets being added to the game there's is also a gigantic list of sets that simply put have no use whatsoever other than filling sticker books and deconstruction.
By having these older sets updated we would be increasing build diversity while also add a incentive to run older dungeons and trials.
Proc Conditions
Some these set's original proc condition idea is to have the player close to the target/s making them have to go up close and taking risks to use them and not to procc them from safe distance, others are so that they only proc when enemies are nearby or on contact with the player which result in multiple outdated proc conditions which honestly should all be the same, they should all have the proc conditions changed to "in melee range" which is about 5m and is a proc condition already in the game making them more intuitive, easier understand and manage to all players.
Right now we have:
- "When you take damage from a Martial melee attack"
- "When you take damage from a melee attack"
- "When you take Physical Damage"
- "When you take damage from a nearby enemy"
- "When you deal Martial melee damage"
- "When you deal damage with a melee Light Attack"
Some of these conditions lead to some situations that don't really make much sense since there are classes that no matter if you play magicka or stamina builds requires the players to be up close to their targets (for example thunderbug proccing from someone hitting you with Brawler but not from Carve, Puncturing Sweeps, Molten Whip which all have the enemy standing in similar range) and goes against the hybridization goal the game has been following in which most players use a variety of types of damage with some skills now even costing a mix of magicka and stamina.
The following sets are:
Alessia's Bulwark
- (2 items)Adds 1487 Armor
- (3 items)Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- (4 items)Adds 1487 Armor
- (5 items)When you take damage in melee range, you apply Major Maim to the attacker for 5 seconds reducing their damage dealt by 10%.
Knightmare
- (2 items) Adds 1487 Armor
- (3 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- (4 items) Adds 1487 Armor
- (5 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health, When you deal damage in melee range, you apply Major Cowardice to all enemies within 8 meters of you for 5 seconds, reducing their Weapon and Spell Damage 430. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
Note:This set now applies Major Cowardice instead of Minor Maim and now procs when dealing damage in melee range instead of when the user takes damage from a Martial melee attack.
Dragon's Defilement
- (2 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
- (3 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
- (4 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- (5 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health, When you take damage in melee range, gain a corrupting aura for 5 seconds that applies Minor Breach and Minor Defile to all enemies within 8 meters of you, reducing their Physical and Spell Resistance by 2974. This effect can occur every 3 seconds.
Note: This set now also applies Minor Defile, decrease this set cooldown to 3 seconds, down from 5 and now procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes damage from a melee attack
Night Terror
- (2 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
- (3 items) Reduces the radius you can be detected while Sneaking by 2 meters. Reduces the cost of Sneak by 27%.
- (4 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- (5 items) When you take damage in melee range, you deal 285 Poison Damage to the attacker. This effect can occur once every 1 second per target and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.
Note: This set now has 1 second cool down per target and procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes damage from a melee attack.
Thunderbug's Carapace
- (2 items) Adds 1487 Armor
- (3 items) Adds 1487 Armor
- (4 items) Adds 129 Weapon and Spell Damage
- (5 items) When you take damage in melee range, you deal 714 Shock Damage in a 6 meter radius around you. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.
Note: Increase the radius to 6 meters, from 5 and this set now procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes Physical Damage.
Hand of Mephala
- (2 items) Adds 4% Healing Taken
- (3 items) Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- (4 items) Adds 1487 Armor
- (5 items) When you take damage in melee range, you encase the ground beneath you in webs for 4 seconds, reducing the Movement Speed of enemies within a 8 meter radius by 40% and applying Minor Breach to them, reducing their Physical and Spell Resistance by 2974. After 4 seconds the webs burst into venom, dealing 0 Poison Damage. This effect can occur once every 8 seconds and scales off the higher of your Physical or Spell Resistance.
Note: Increase the radius to 8 meters up from 4 meters, this set now procs in 4+4 seconds down from 5, increase the snare potency to 40% up from 33%, increase the cooldown to 8 seconds, up from 5 and this set now procs when taking damage in melee range instead of when the user takes Damage.
Aegis Caller
- 2 items: Adds 129 Weapon and Spell Damage
- 3 items: Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
- 4 items: Adds 129 Weapon and Spell Damage
- 5 items: When you deal critical damage in melee range, summon a Lesser Aegis for 11 seconds. After 2 seconds, the Lesser Aegis spins its blades, dealing 478 Bleed Damage every 1 second. This effect can occur once every 12 seconds and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.
Note:Reduced the time delay of the Lesser Aegis spin to 2 seconds, down from 2.5 and this set now procs when dealing critical damage in melee range Instead of dealing Critical Martial melee damage.
The following sets have very limiting proc condition: "Whenever you kill an enemy" which although simple is hindered when doing group content since they require the user to do deal the killing blow to the target which when grouping with other players becomes harder the more people the player is grouping with.
As such the following sets should have their proc condition changed to "When an enemy you have recently damaged dies", a condition already in the game which would make their proc condition easier to achieve and make the sets easier to use in group content.
- Dead-Water's Guile- Reduce ultimate gain to 10 per enemy down from 15.
- Dreugh King Slayer
- Oblivion's Edge
- Pelinal's Wrath
- Pestilent Host
- Sithis' Touch- Reduce the duration to 20 seconds down from 30.
Low duration Buffs
These are some sets that have outdated proc conditions with very low duration buffs who need to have both updated to be in line with some recent sets and standardized buffs duration.
Storm Knight's Plate
- 2 items: Adds 1487 Armor
- 3 items: Adds 1487 Armor
- 4 items: Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- 5 items: When you take Damage from a ranged attack, you gain Minor Expedition and deal 357 Shock damage to all enemies within 6 meters of you every 2 seconds for 12 seconds. This effect can occur once every 12 seconds and scales off the higher of your Weapon or Spell Damage.
Note: This set now also grants Minor Expedition for the duration, increase the set duration and cooldown to 12 seconds up from 6, increase the radius to 6 meters from 5 and this set now procs when you take Ranged Damage instead of non-Physical Damage.
Embershield
- 2 items: Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- 3 items: Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- 4 items: Adds 1487 Armor
- 5 items: When you deal damage with a Heavy Attack, you increase your Physical and Spell Resistance by 3000 and deal 0 Flame damage to all enemies within 6 meters of you every 1 second for 12 seconds. The damage scales off the higher of your Physical or Spell Resistance.
Note: Reduced the Physical and Spell Resistance gained to 3000 down from 3300, increased the duration to 12 seconds from 6 secs, increase the radius to 6 meters up from 5 and this set now procs when you deal damage with a Heavy Attack instead of complete a fully-charged Heavy Attack.
Seventh Legion Brute
- (2 items) Adds 129 Weapon and Spell Damage
- (3 items) Adds 657 Critical Chance
- (4 items) Adds 129 Health Recovery
- (5 items) When you cast an ability that increases your Physical or Spell Resistance while in combat, you gain 321 Weapon and Spell Damage and 321 Health Recovery for 20 seconds. This effect can occur every 20 seconds.
Note: Reduced the Weapon and Spell Damage and Health Recovery to 321, from 341, and increased the duration to 20 seconds, from 15 sec, which is the shorter duration between all major resolve granting abilities, with the previous 15 sec cooldown this would make most classes have to recast those abilities 5/10 sec before their effect ended in order to maintain the buff. Also in order to make this set more viable as a back bar set the third and forth line have been switched.
Armor Master
- 2 items: Adds 1206 Maximum Health
- 3 items: Adds 1487 Armor
- 4 items: Adds 1487 Armor
- 5 items: While you have an Armor ability slotted, your Max Health is increased by 5%. When you use an Armor ability while in combat, your Physical and Spell Resistance is increased by 4000 for 20 seconds.
Note: Reduced the resistances gained to 4000 down from 5940, and increased the duration to 20 seconds up from 10 seconds so as to being closer to the duration of most Armor abilities .
Trinimac's Valor
- 2 items: Adds 129 Magicka Recovery
- 3 items: Adds 1096 Maximum Magicka
- 4 items: Adds 129 Magicka Recovery
- 5 items: When you cast a damage shield, you call down a fragment of Trinimac that heals you and your group members for 1396 Health and damages enemies for 1396 Magic damage in a 8 meter radius after a 2 second delay. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds and scales with the higher of your Max Magicka or Stamina.
Elemental Damage Sets
With the new LA and HA damage change coming in update 35 the following sets should have their 5 piece bonus Weapon and Spell Damage increased to 600:
- Silks of the Sun
- Ysgramor's Birthright
- Netch's Touch
Note: The reason behind why these sets could not have a 600 Weapon and Spell Damage bonus much like War Maiden was that it would also buff destruction staves LA and HA damage however with the recent intended changes to LA and HA having flat damage values instead of scaling with Weapon and Spell Damage there is no reason for them not to have the 600 bonus.
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El_Borracho✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I agree with the change to Aegis Caller is needed after the hybridization. Berserking Warrior needs the same change. But the change to Alessia's Bulwark still doesn't make it useful, unless there is no cooldown. Bani's Torment, Silver Rose Vigil, Kynemarcher's and Lady Thorn all have longer durations and grant a secondary buff or damage. If anything, Alessia's would have to go up to 20 seconds for anyone to use it over those sets1 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think it is important to not overlook that some of the damage type conditionals are meant to curb proccing with certain skills, like ranged skills. You can't just remove those limits without completely overhauling the proc, because those conditions keep things somewhat balanced.
Allessia, for example, is meant to defend against melee attackers. Not all attackers in melee range (it's an important distinction). It is meant to specifically target melee. Changing it to also provide major maim to anyone attacking with any skills within that distance is drastically buffing the proc.2 -
MacRibs✭✭✭I think it is important to not overlook that some of the damage type conditionals are meant to curb proccing with certain skills, like ranged skills. You can't just remove those limits without completely overhauling the proc, because those conditions keep things somewhat balanced.
"When you take damage from a Martial melee attack"
"When you take damage from a melee attack"
"When you take Physical Damage"
They are all the same idea with different outdated conditions, which is when melee attackers hits you the set proccs, however there are magicka based abilities that use melee range and should proc those sets and dont which makes no sense whatsoever.
Allessia for example when the game came out it probably made sense because there was a bigger separation between magicka and stamina nowadays not so much, the same DK that hits you with Dizzy Swings can also hit you with Molten Whip right after how the first procs it and the latter doesn't is something that does not feel right in the state the game is right now and is probably difficult for newer players to understand.
Some older sets like these don't need to be the best sets in the game they need to have their procc conditions and buffs reviewed, updated while also be made easier to manage and to understand.
What they did with the Crusader set was, i believe, a step in the right direction, giving flair to an old outdated set which still is not a fantastic set but has way more use than it had and is more fun to play with.
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MacRibs✭✭✭El_Borracho wrote: »I agree with the change to Aegis Caller is needed after the hybridization. Berserking Warrior needs the same change. But the change to Alessia's Bulwark still doesn't make it useful, unless there is no cooldown. Bani's Torment, Silver Rose Vigil, Kynemarcher's and Lady Thorn all have longer durations and grant a secondary buff or damage. If anything, Alessia's would have to go up to 20 seconds for anyone to use it over those sets
Yeah, no cooldown.0 -
Mr_Stach✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think there's a lot of sets that Zos needs to update, they love to bring out exciting new sets, which is great but a lot of these older sets are showing their age.Altoholic, Frost Warden Sympathizer and Main
Glacial Guardian - Main - Frost Warden Zealot
The Frost Man Cometh - PC Frost Backup0 -
El_Borracho✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭El_Borracho wrote: »I agree with the change to Aegis Caller is needed after the hybridization. Berserking Warrior needs the same change. But the change to Alessia's Bulwark still doesn't make it useful, unless there is no cooldown. Bani's Torment, Silver Rose Vigil, Kynemarcher's and Lady Thorn all have longer durations and grant a secondary buff or damage. If anything, Alessia's would have to go up to 20 seconds for anyone to use it over those sets
Yeah, no cooldown.
That would make it a legitimate dual set for PVE and PVP. Major Main is great for tanks0 -
AcadianPaladin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The set change I'd like to see is to revert all sets that were changed from 'help nearby allies' to 'help group members' back to helping nearby allies. This includes Earthgore and Winter's Respite. Would love to see similarly changed skills like Barrier revert back to helping nearby allies as well. My healer does more ungrouped healing than grouped healing - like WBs.PC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo0 -
YandereGirlfriend✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭For the elemental sets: you missed Strength of the Automaton for Physical and Bleed Damage.
There are also the Weapon Line sets like Sword-Singer, Spider Cultist, etc. that are also losing out on buffing Light/Heavy Attacks and should probably be pushed up to like +800 (or more) from the current +600.0 -
quinten1221✭✭To be honest, there are just wayyy to many sets right now. Changing all of them every update is just to much wasted time. I would want other things to be improved instead of tens of older sets.0 -
Stx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭600 damage on silks of the sun would be nuts especially since DKs have minor brutality.
You have to keep in mind that DK is really the only class where literally all their damaging abilities are one school of magic, and also inferno staves are the go to dps option over frost and lightning. There is also DK breath and encratis to consider.
Basically what I'm getting at is 600 fire spell damage =/= 600 shock spell damage in this game,0 -
MacRibs✭✭✭600 damage on silks of the sun would be nuts especially since DKs have minor brutality.
You have to keep in mind that DK is really the only class where literally all their damaging abilities are one school of magic, and also inferno staves are the go to dps option over frost and lightning. There is also DK breath and encratis to consider.
Its as nuts as 600 damage on War Maiden since Templars damaging abilities are 90% magic damage and also have access to minor sorcery.
Or on Wardens whose entire Animal Companions skill line deals magic damage and have a +10% magic damage increase bonus passive.
Also the only class to literally have all their damaging abilities be one school of magic are Nightblades and guess what school is that? Magic damage.
PVE wise there are still better sets and regarding PVP the 600 damage only applies to a specific damage type it does not affect heals which is a great downside.
Warden and Sorcerers would also benefit from the 600 frost/shock damage bonus.0 -
Stx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭600 damage on silks of the sun would be nuts especially since DKs have minor brutality.
You have to keep in mind that DK is really the only class where literally all their damaging abilities are one school of magic, and also inferno staves are the go to dps option over frost and lightning. There is also DK breath and encratis to consider.
Its as nuts as 600 damage on War Maiden since Templars damaging abilities are 90% magic damage and also have access to minor sorcery.
Or on Wardens whose entire Animal Companions skill line deals magic damage and have a +10% magic damage increase bonus passive.
Also the only class to literally have all their damaging abilities be one school of magic are Nightblades and guess what school is that? Magic damage.
PVE wise there are still better sets and regarding PVP the 600 damage only applies to a specific damage type it does not affect heals which is a great downside.
Warden and Sorcerers would also benefit from the 600 frost/shock damage bonus.
And yet DKs out dps Mag NB by a mile and templars too. War maiden is a great set but even NBs and templars had significant portions of their dps as elemental, mainly light attacks and wall. In u35 if the light attack changes go through, maybe War maiden will see more use.
But silks of the sun is different specifically because DKs literally have only fire damage now. So the set may as well just be a passive 600 spell damage, which obviously isn't balanced...
When these sets were created, they weren't created with the idea that any one class would be using strictly one element. Netch and ysgramor at 600 would be fine, because there still isn't even a shock spammable and sorcs still use non shock abilities, and wardens still use non frost abilities.
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