set changes in q4...so much for diversity

CoronHR

bahsei's and kinras's on a multitude of builds, both magicka and stamina. i thought the point of merging weap and spell dmg together was to add MORE diversity to sets? and the idea that mages will wear medium armour...maybe i'm just not used to it, but it seems off. feel free to disagree

edit: i suppose bahsei's doesn't show up on stam builds, but kinras's is everywhere

NettleCarrier

The players that min/max everything are always going to find one combination that works best. If you think outside the box and are willing to take a 1-5% damage hit then you'll have plenty more options.

CoronHR

NettleCarrier wrote: »

The players that min/max everything are always going to find one combination that works best. If you think outside the box and are willing to take a 1-5% damage hit then you'll have plenty more options.

that is true, we could always 'think for ourselves' and make our own builds. but i think a lot of players follow the guides and go with it, which is fine, but i think now there's going to be even less diversity than before. i swear they said in a twitch video that these changes were meant to add diversity. i suspect the opposite will occur

Muttsmutt

CoronHR wrote: »

i think now there's going to be even less diversity than before.

indeed, there will be less diversity in the top 1% of builds (as tiered by performance). however, let's not forget that this 1% innately lacks diversity because of how min-maxing works. to seek to add diversity at the very top of the meta pillar is a fool's errand.

the next best thing a dev can try, is to cram as much diversity into, say, the 9% of builds below the top 1%; as well as to make that 9% perform within a very close margin to the 1%.

i believe that with these changes, the distance between the performance of the 1% and the 9% below it, is going to become smaller, while the mass of builds that come close to the 1%'s performance will be able to perform within a hardly distinguishable margin compared to the 1%.

thus, end result- more diversity overall.
anybody who knows how MMOs work will know that sacrificing diversity at the top of the meta pillar is a small price to pray, in order to attain a greather breadth of diversity right below it. the top of the meta pillar will always get power creeped, or stagnate. it's how min-maxing works.

if we can have large number of builds that sacrifice a small percentage of min-maxing for a sizeable increase in diversity- i think that's fantastic and i applauld ZOS for it. for "killing the diversity" in the top 1% of the meta, to move it to a large percentage right below it.

CoronHR

this is a little off-topic, but how is it that a medium armour build is going to be bis for mages? i know they've got the weap-and-spell dmg thing carrying over, but i guess the light armour-medium armour passives just don't work anymore? and maybe i'm just old school but i don't like a mage wearing medium armour. this is going to take some studying on my part i'm afraid. and man alive do i hate numbers and studying

jaws343

CoronHR wrote: »

this is a little off-topic, but how is it that a medium armour build is going to be bis for mages? i know they've got the weap-and-spell dmg thing carrying over, but i guess the light armour-medium armour passives just don't work anymore? and maybe i'm just old school but i don't like a mage wearing medium armour. this is going to take some studying on my part i'm afraid. and man alive do i hate numbers and studying

You would run Kinra's on your jewelry and front bar inferno and wear a light armor set on your body. You shouldn't be on your back bar for more than a few seconds, so you will always be able to build stacks on your front bar.

Vaoh

NettleCarrier wrote: »

The players that min/max everything are always going to find one combination that works best. If you think outside the box and are willing to take a 1-5% damage hit then you'll have plenty more options.

Well it really depends. ESO has a lot of very boring sets. A lot of times there is no point in “thinking outside the box” to use weird sets when the only thing that is changing is a stat sheet you’ll never look at.

Now if you want to use certain proc sets that thematically match your character then it’s different. You can have some fun but you’ll be taking a much bigger hit than 1-5% unfortunately.

CoronHR

jaws343 wrote: »

CoronHR wrote: »

this is a little off-topic, but how is it that a medium armour build is going to be bis for mages? i know they've got the weap-and-spell dmg thing carrying over, but i guess the light armour-medium armour passives just don't work anymore? and maybe i'm just old school but i don't like a mage wearing medium armour. this is going to take some studying on my part i'm afraid. and man alive do i hate numbers and studying

You would run Kinra's on your jewelry and front bar inferno and wear a light armor set on your body. You shouldn't be on your back bar for more than a few seconds, so you will always be able to build stacks on your front bar.

oh right! good point