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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8235739/
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8235739/
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Radiant nerf
jrgray93
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Having tested the changes to radiant oppression, the claim that it retains "roughly the overall maximum power of the morph" just isn't true.
Despite magplars getting a damage boost from more spell damage, the max hits in my testing dropped from ~105k on my live magplar to ~91k on the PTS, or 0.866x the damage. This is nearly a 15% damage nerf. That's actually substantial.
Assuming I know how the damage is calculated, let's say you hit for 10k base damage. On live, with the max potential 20% damage from magicka, and the max potential 480% damage from execute, you're looking at 69,600 damage. On the PTS, with 500% execute alone, you're looking at 60,000 damage, or 0.862x the damage. Sounds pretty close to the 0.866x of my results.
This change directly benefits players who use Bahsei's Mania and directly nerfs everyone else, including those of us who know how to sustain well.
Magplar sustain also becomes significantly better in execute range, due to the low cost per second of radiant.
Radiant accounts for such a significant portion of a magplar's DPS that this actually impacted my max DPS about as much as the spell damage buff and backlash buff increased it.
I'm really sad to say goodbye to those six digit crits, and I'm really starting to believe the people who claim you nerf everything to make the sets in your new content worth buying. Please do not blatantly lie to us when you make changes. This is not "roughly the overall maximum power." This is a significant reduction in maximum power.
Despite magplars getting a damage boost from more spell damage, the max hits in my testing dropped from ~105k on my live magplar to ~91k on the PTS, or 0.866x the damage. This is nearly a 15% damage nerf. That's actually substantial.
Assuming I know how the damage is calculated, let's say you hit for 10k base damage. On live, with the max potential 20% damage from magicka, and the max potential 480% damage from execute, you're looking at 69,600 damage. On the PTS, with 500% execute alone, you're looking at 60,000 damage, or 0.862x the damage. Sounds pretty close to the 0.866x of my results.
This change directly benefits players who use Bahsei's Mania and directly nerfs everyone else, including those of us who know how to sustain well.
Magplar sustain also becomes significantly better in execute range, due to the low cost per second of radiant.
Radiant accounts for such a significant portion of a magplar's DPS that this actually impacted my max DPS about as much as the spell damage buff and backlash buff increased it.
I'm really sad to say goodbye to those six digit crits, and I'm really starting to believe the people who claim you nerf everything to make the sets in your new content worth buying. Please do not blatantly lie to us when you make changes. This is not "roughly the overall maximum power." This is a significant reduction in maximum power.
EP: Slania Isara : Harambe Was an Inside Job
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the1andonlyskwex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Edit: Nevermind, I misremembered the change.Edited by the1andonlyskwex on July 16, 2021 3:24AM0 -
Firstmep✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Having tested the changes to radiant oppression, the claim that it retains "roughly the overall maximum power of the morph" just isn't true.
Despite magplars getting a damage boost from more spell damage, the max hits in my testing dropped from ~105k on my live magplar to ~91k on the PTS, or 0.866x the damage. This is nearly a 15% damage nerf. That's actually substantial.
Assuming I know how the damage is calculated, let's say you hit for 10k base damage. On live, with the max potential 20% damage from magicka, and the max potential 480% damage from execute, you're looking at 69,600 damage. On the PTS, with 500% execute alone, you're looking at 60,000 damage, or 0.862x the damage. Sounds pretty close to the 0.866x of my results.
This change directly benefits players who use Bahsei's Mania and directly nerfs everyone else, including those of us who know how to sustain well.
Magplar sustain also becomes significantly better in execute range, due to the low cost per second of radiant.
Radiant accounts for such a significant portion of a magplar's DPS that this actually impacted my max DPS about as much as the spell damage buff and backlash buff increased it.
I'm really sad to say goodbye to those six digit crits, and I'm really starting to believe the people who claim you nerf everything to make the sets in your new content worth buying. Please do not blatantly lie to us when you make changes. This is not "roughly the overall maximum power." This is a significant reduction in maximum power.
You are comparing the max hits of radiant, when the devs said the Overall damage should be similar and then call them liars.
Okay.0 -
jrgray93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Having tested the changes to radiant oppression, the claim that it retains "roughly the overall maximum power of the morph" just isn't true.
Despite magplars getting a damage boost from more spell damage, the max hits in my testing dropped from ~105k on my live magplar to ~91k on the PTS, or 0.866x the damage. This is nearly a 15% damage nerf. That's actually substantial.
Assuming I know how the damage is calculated, let's say you hit for 10k base damage. On live, with the max potential 20% damage from magicka, and the max potential 480% damage from execute, you're looking at 69,600 damage. On the PTS, with 500% execute alone, you're looking at 60,000 damage, or 0.862x the damage. Sounds pretty close to the 0.866x of my results.
This change directly benefits players who use Bahsei's Mania and directly nerfs everyone else, including those of us who know how to sustain well.
Magplar sustain also becomes significantly better in execute range, due to the low cost per second of radiant.
Radiant accounts for such a significant portion of a magplar's DPS that this actually impacted my max DPS about as much as the spell damage buff and backlash buff increased it.
I'm really sad to say goodbye to those six digit crits, and I'm really starting to believe the people who claim you nerf everything to make the sets in your new content worth buying. Please do not blatantly lie to us when you make changes. This is not "roughly the overall maximum power." This is a significant reduction in maximum power.
You are comparing the max hits of radiant, when the devs said the Overall damage should be similar and then call them liars.
Okay.
Uhhh there is no magical scaling happening earlier on to make what you said make sense. The overall damage is reduced. I used max damage as a means of direct comparison to control the execute scaling variable.
They also said "maximum power." That was a direct quote.
You could not be more wrong. Sorry.EP: Slania Isara : Harambe Was an Inside Job0 -
kojou✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is a good thing. If nothing gets over-buffed then we will avoid the nerf hammer, and when they get out the nerf hammer Templars get the triple whammy nerf that makes life miserable for the next 3 patches.
Also, did you compare damage at max magicka vs empty magicka? I was thinking that having consistent damage no matter where your magicka pool is, was a good thing.Edited by kojou on July 16, 2021 1:28PMPlaying since beta...0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes. An additional (up to) 20% bonus of some total amount is generally going to be larger than adding an extra 20% to something that is already increased by 480%.
PS @kojou I know ZOS's history of nerfs and templars, but that doesn't mean we should root for weaker skills in fear of getting larger nerfs.Edited by Joy_Division on July 16, 2021 1:55PM1 -
tonyblack✭✭✭✭✭
In pve templars are already at the bottom among other magicka classes and this nerf will push it even further down. Class need more substantial buffs, slightly more spell damage and changes to backlash didn’t even address class performance in high end content.This is a good thing. If nothing gets over-buffed then we will avoid the nerf hammer, and when they get out the nerf hammer Templars get the triple whammy nerf that makes life miserable for the next 3 patches.
Also, did you compare damage at max magicka vs empty magicka? I was thinking that having consistent damage no matter where your magicka pool is, was a good thing.
The only good thing about radiant nerf is that now bansei will be as decent for templars as it is for other classes.1 -
jrgray93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is a good thing. If nothing gets over-buffed then we will avoid the nerf hammer, and when they get out the nerf hammer Templars get the triple whammy nerf that makes life miserable for the next 3 patches.
Also, did you compare damage at max magicka vs empty magicka? I was thinking that having consistent damage no matter where your magicka pool is, was a good thing.
No, I did not, because my only source of sustain is from clockwork filets and I never have sustain issues. I'm at 95-100% magicka any time I'm in radiant range. It's a non-issue for magplar late in a fight, because beams are so cheap.EP: Slania Isara : Harambe Was an Inside Job0 -
jrgray93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Oh, and on top of all of the bonkers mitigation changes, max potential damage is a huge factor in PvP. This is a PvE nerf, but it's also potentially a death sentence to magplar viability as a duelist.
On the other hand, my cancerous pariah healing build will require a dozen players attacking me to die. So that's... something.EP: Slania Isara : Harambe Was an Inside Job0 -
DrSlaughtr✭✭✭✭✭
✭Funny thing about radiant for when I play my templar, which admittedly isn't often anymore, is the damage increase for how much mag you have left. By execute I'm lucky if I'm at 50% mag. Usually closer to 25% because templar sustain isn't great.I drink and I stream things.0 -
the1andonlyskwex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is a good thing. If nothing gets over-buffed then we will avoid the nerf hammer, and when they get out the nerf hammer Templars get the triple whammy nerf that makes life miserable for the next 3 patches.
Also, did you compare damage at max magicka vs empty magicka? I was thinking that having consistent damage no matter where your magicka pool is, was a good thing.
No, I did not, because my only source of sustain is from clockwork filets and I never have sustain issues. I'm at 95-100% magicka any time I'm in radiant range. It's a non-issue for magplar late in a fight, because beams are so cheap.TheEndBringer wrote: »Funny thing about radiant for when I play my templar, which admittedly isn't often anymore, is the damage increase for how much mag you have left. By execute I'm lucky if I'm at 50% mag. Usually closer to 25% because templar sustain isn't great.
Looks like this change could be a nerf for some, and a buff for others.0 -
WrathOfInnos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭the1andonlyskwex wrote: »This is a good thing. If nothing gets over-buffed then we will avoid the nerf hammer, and when they get out the nerf hammer Templars get the triple whammy nerf that makes life miserable for the next 3 patches.
Also, did you compare damage at max magicka vs empty magicka? I was thinking that having consistent damage no matter where your magicka pool is, was a good thing.
No, I did not, because my only source of sustain is from clockwork filets and I never have sustain issues. I'm at 95-100% magicka any time I'm in radiant range. It's a non-issue for magplar late in a fight, because beams are so cheap.TheEndBringer wrote: »Funny thing about radiant for when I play my templar, which admittedly isn't often anymore, is the damage increase for how much mag you have left. By execute I'm lucky if I'm at 50% mag. Usually closer to 25% because templar sustain isn't great.
Looks like this change could be a nerf for some, and a buff for others.
If you can sustain the first ~65% of a fight then sustain should be great through execute. I don’t know how you would even get to execute if you don’t have the sustain to spam beam. Many, many heavy attacks?
This is still a problem with Bahsei’s. Templar sustain is terrible before execute, so when you start beaming the set bonus damage may be close to 15%. However, by the time you reach those high powered 10%-0% health beams your Magicka bar has filled up and Bahsei gives 0% damage.0
