Potential items to improve the PvE experience in Cyrodiil/IC

Maitsukas

Yet again PvE players are struggling with getting dailies done, with them constantly being killed over and over again. Meanwhile I've been doing some thinking for possible additions to get the PvE players to enjoy questing a bit more:
1. Tabard of Neutrality (Cosmetic Slot)

Antiquity (Mythic, 5 pieces)
While wearing this item you are marked safe from other players in the Cyrodiil and Imperial City campaigns. All alliances can heal and resurrect you. Alliance Guards and Honor Guards will not attack you. You cannot use Siege Engines, Capture Keeps, Outposts, Resources, Towns and Imperial City Districts. You can only equip and un-equip it inside your Alliance Border Keeps, Alliance Sewer Base, outside of Cyrodiil and Imperial City.

2. Tome of Neutality (Interactable open world item, idea came from the Veteran Hard Mode Dungeon triggers.)

"This tome bears the insignia of the Imperial Legion and a potent spell. When invoked, the tome will make you appear as a regular citizen of Tamriel to the fighters of Cyrodiil." — Tome of Neutrality
Can be found next to the Border Keep Transitus Shrines and at your alliance's respawn shrine in the Imperial City Sewers.
Effect:
You are marked safe from other players in the Cyrodiil and Imperial City campaigns. All alliances can heal and resurrect you. Alliance Guards and Honor Guards will not attack you. You cannot use Siege Engines, Capture Keeps, Outposts, Resources, Towns and Imperial City Districts. You can only equip and un-equip it inside your Alliance Border Keeps, Alliance Sewer Base, outside of Cyrodiil and Imperial City.

3. Meal/Drink of Neutrality (Won't replace your buff-food)

Purchasable from Alliance vendors.
Effect:
You are marked safe from other players in the Cyrodiil and Imperial City campaigns. All alliances can heal and resurrect you. Alliance Guards and Honor Guards will not attack you. You cannot use Siege Engines, Capture Keeps, Outposts, Resources, Towns and Imperial City Districts. You can only equip and un-equip it inside your Alliance Border Keeps, Alliance Sewer Base, outside of Cyrodiil and Imperial City.

If these ideas are good or bad, leave a reply to discuss it further.

iksde

dont leave alone pvp playerbase!
if we are at it give also "agressive" version of this or something to make viable pvp for players who want outside just lagged zerged cyrodil or dead IC without events

Emmagoldman

Other

None, its a pvp event......

Just like the Loooooooong list of pve events that pvpers do.

My advice, do the ic zone quest and get out. Then do the scouting missing in cyro and get out.

I do the same for a lot of pve events. Do what I need at minimum and peace out

VaranisArano

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

ArchMikem

Thing is, campaigns have limited populations for each faction. Nuetral players taking up spots would create unfair ratios among the active PvP players in the camp.

Ackwalan

There's already enough people doing shady stuff, no need to have them marked as "safe".

Sarannah

None of those ideas should happen. This would imbalance the factions in those PvP areas, as they would have 'neutral' players hold a PvP player's spot.

If ZOS ever does something to aid PvE players in regards to PvP zones, they should simply make it a new zone with full PvE.

What I would like to see changed about the IC: Allow us to respawn in the district we died in, to remove the load to sewerbase and load to correct district loadings. And place ALL three alliance spawn spots the same distance from the flag in each district.

etchedpixels

You'd need to add a fourth "non-faction" of fighters guild, turn off all the PvP rewards, prevent them from being in castles, stop them buying stuff from any faction aligned supplier. Then how would travel work - all the fast travel is factional ?

For IC it's probably workable but I can't see it happening.

AlnilamE

Other

It's a PvP event. If you want to do it without PvP, then prepare ahead of time by doing the IC dailies and scouting missions on all your characters and handing them in once a day.

Kaartinen

Other

Other, meaning none, as there is no option to leave things alone. It's PvP. No risk, no reward.

Vevvev

Other

None of the above because if you can take that stuff off it will be exploited BIG TIME!!! I don't trust giving players any sort of get out of jail free card in PVP zones outside of the invulnerability given in certain spots to avoid spawn camping. Also you have to realize that people could also use this stuff to get free scouting information. I can already see people tailing groups and announcing their position in zone chat for all to see and you couldn't kill them.

spartaxoxo

Tabard

VaranisArano wrote: »

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp. It's one of the biggest reasons PvP has received little new content since Morrowind, because new people joining is at a trickle. And a MASSIVE part of that is people participating in events having a disgustingly infuriating time and never stepping foot into pvp again.

This solution should change that. Agree about AP and Telvar, but the pve quests should still give their non-telvar rewards including event tickets. Skyshards should also be gettable.

If people couldn't get rare drops, telvar, ap, non-quest achievements that should be enough incentive to want to turn on pvp.

Sanctum74

Other

If you want something bad enough, you work for it.

ArchMikem

Ackwalan wrote: »

There's already enough people doing shady stuff, no need to have them marked as "safe".

Nuetral toggled players wouldn't earn AP though.

rpa

Other

No. And I don't even PvP.

techyeshic

Other

As soon as I have an item to just walk to the loot at the end of dungeons and arenas so I don't have to PVE.

Firstmep

Other

spartaxoxo wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp. It's one of the biggest reasons PvP has received little new content since Morrowind, because new people joining is at a trickle. And a MASSIVE part of that is people participating in events having a disgustingly infuriating time and never stepping foot into pvp again.

This solution should change that. Agree about AP and Telvar, but the pve quests should still give their non-telvar rewards including event tickets. Skyshards should also be gettable.

If people couldn't get rare drops, telvar, ap, non-quest achievements that should be enough incentive to want to turn on pvp.

Most events are pve focused.
You get more than enough tickets from those to buy whatever you want.
But if you want this implemented, I want to earn tickets by doing pvp during pve events.
Which defeats the purpose of those events, which is drive players to those locations.
So no.
The current system is fine.
You can sit this one out if you want to avoid pvp at all cost.
Eso had pvp since its launch, and it's contained in a couple of zones, it's about time pve players accepted that.

Chaos2088

I get the idea, but this could be used to help people spy on other factions etc......could get into a keep and not be able to kick you out while you report to your friends who are in a grp to take the keep when no one is there etc etc....

Ackwalan

ArchMikem wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

There's already enough people doing shady stuff, no need to have them marked as "safe".

Nuetral toggled players wouldn't earn AP though.

Neutral toggled player could sit in a town or Keep and give the number of defenders.

spartaxoxo

Tabard

Firstmep wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp. It's one of the biggest reasons PvP has received little new content since Morrowind, because new people joining is at a trickle. And a MASSIVE part of that is people participating in events having a disgustingly infuriating time and never stepping foot into pvp again.

This solution should change that. Agree about AP and Telvar, but the pve quests should still give their non-telvar rewards including event tickets. Skyshards should also be gettable.

If people couldn't get rare drops, telvar, ap, non-quest achievements that should be enough incentive to want to turn on pvp.

Most events are pve focused.
You get more than enough tickets from those to buy whatever you want.
But if you want this implemented, I want to earn tickets by doing pvp during pve events.
Which defeats the purpose of those events, which is drive players to those locations.
So no.
The current system is fine.
You can sit this one out if you want to avoid pvp at all cost.
Eso had pvp since its launch, and it's contained in a couple of zones, it's about time pve players accepted that.

Unlike earning tickets by being in cyrodil with this suggestion, you're asking to earn them at a completely different place, not the same thing.

I have no trouble earning my tickets. Get them each time and have earned a lot of AP and the Boston Terrier for my alliance already.

So I am good either way. But this attitude is why pvp has not had new content in years.

The amount of difficulty required of PVE players in PVP does NOT match the level of difficulty asked of PVP players in PVE. They already cater to pvp players during pve events and everyone else who can't be bothered to learn or build a pve character by not requiring clears of even semi-difficult content.

erio

Other

Its a pvp zone..... you step in it unprepared, you die. End of story. Dont take this away from us too.

CrashTest

Other

No, and I say this as a PvE player.

Leave the PvP zones open to PvP bc that's what they're designed for. Having PvE quests in there doesn't change this or warrant non-PvP.

VaranisArano

spartaxoxo wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp. It's one of the biggest reasons PvP has received little new content since Morrowind, because new people joining is at a trickle. And a MASSIVE part of that is people participating in events having a disgustingly infuriating time and never stepping foot into pvp again.

This solution should change that. Agree about AP and Telvar, but the pve quests should still give their non-telvar rewards including event tickets. Skyshards should also be gettable.

If people couldn't get rare drops, telvar, ap, non-quest achievements that should be enough incentive to want to turn on pvp.

Its a PVP event taking place in a PvPvE zone. Why do you think you deserve event tickets after you turn off the intended risk of PvP?

Those skyshards are in a PvPvE zone. 4 of them require PvP actions on the part of your alliance to gain access. Why do you think you deserve skyshrds after you turn off the intended risk of PVP?

Those towns are PvPvE battle zones. 3 of them are capturapble transit points for their alliance. The other two are along scroll running routes. Their quests are short because of the risk of enemy players, and they sometimes involve delves, which grant an AP buff that's important for emperorship. Why do you think you deserve town quest rewards after you turn off the intended risk of PVP?


I see two reasons given:
1. New players will have a better introduction to PvPvE zones if they get the rewards they want with none of the risk they don't want. Or shorter, new players will have a great time if they don't actually have to deal with PVP in a PvPvE zone.
2. Look, I just want the event tickets, skyshards, and quest rewards without the risk of PvP, okay?

spartaxoxo

Tabard

VaranisArano wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp. It's one of the biggest reasons PvP has received little new content since Morrowind, because new people joining is at a trickle. And a MASSIVE part of that is people participating in events having a disgustingly infuriating time and never stepping foot into pvp again.

This solution should change that. Agree about AP and Telvar, but the pve quests should still give their non-telvar rewards including event tickets. Skyshards should also be gettable.

If people couldn't get rare drops, telvar, ap, non-quest achievements that should be enough incentive to want to turn on pvp.

Its a PVP event taking place in a PvPvE zone. Why do you think you deserve event tickets after you turn off the intended risk of PvP?

Those skyshards are in a PvPvE zone. 4 of them require PvP actions on the part of your alliance to gain access. Why do you think you deserve skyshrds after you turn off the intended risk of PVP?

Those towns are PvPvE battle zones. 3 of them are capturapble transit points for their alliance. The other two are along scroll running routes. Their quests are short because of the risk of enemy players, and they sometimes involve delves, which grant an AP buff that's important for emperorship. Why do you think you deserve town quest rewards after you turn off the intended risk of PVP?


I see two reasons given:
1. New players will have a better introduction to PvPvE zones if they get the rewards they want with none of the risk they don't want. Or shorter, new players will have a great time if they don't actually have to deal with PVP in a PvPvE zone.
2. Look, I just want the event tickets, skyshards, and quest rewards without the risk of PvP, okay?

I already gave the reason, to make pvp an enjoyable experience you opt-in to for the chance of pvp exclusive rewards. Not something you feel forced into to get the kinds of minor rewards that you get everywhere else without trouble doing PvE.

I have seen other games have a healthier pvp base when people don't feel forced into it. Forcing people seldom works, enticing them and then rewarding them does better at making an activity more enjoyable.

But go ahead and cling to the skyshards and tickets for pvp, I guess. Just know that they are a big reason so few people want to pvp. They feel forced into their first experiences to get pve stuff done, have an absolutely horrendous time, and vow not to do it outside events. It's a metric ton of pve'ers with that experience.

You can toss the all the outrageous ad hominem you want about people being "entitled" but at the end of the day, if people aren't having fun they aren't gonna play the content. And if nobody plays that content, new stuff don't get added. It's that simple

Eedat

Other

I voted "other" because there was no "none of the above" option

Starlock

Tabard

The tabard is a really cool idea!

The Midyear Mayhem event is just weird in general. Some players will claim it is a PvP event, when in reality it is a PvPvE event. That's where part of the problem lies, with the other part of the problem being that our events have been monetized. With monetized events, accessibility becomes more of an issue because the implementation of an event can give the appearance of (if not have the actual goal of) coercing players into the cash shop to finish event items. Even though it is relatively easy to get tickets without issue in this PvPvE event, an mechanism to increase accessibility becomes more important because of this landscape.

Edaphon

Other

Other = none

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp.

No, it doesn't. Quite the opposite, actually.

spartaxoxo

Tabard

Edaphon wrote: »

Other = no

spartaxoxo wrote: »

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp.

No, it doesn't. Quite the opposite, actually.

If that were the case, Cyrodiil wouldn't be so empty after each event. And PvP would have gotten substantial new content already, the last time that happened was in Morrowind. For every person that stays, more people quit it entirely. And every year there is tons of threads laying out exactly why, with the number of people who had a miserable experience and vowing not to touch it again vastly outweighing the ones that say they were nervous but had a good time and will rejoin.

They had to flat out give away Imperial City.

jle30303

For me the problem with PVP - in any game that has it - isn't "new players are always dying", it's that "new players can't even kill". I mean, they don't even get to kill other new players because said kills are always being stolen by veterans. And if you can't *do* anything in PVP, then you don't want to PVP, which reduces the number of "weaker" players in PVP which means that weak players are always dumped in among a multitude of strong players with no option to play among others of their own skill and capability level.

Consider that in chess, you don't put newbies up against grandmasters in the same arena. You have carefully constructed tiers and rankings.

VaranisArano

spartaxoxo wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Sure. Mark yourself safe from PVP in a PvPvE zone so you can quest and explore to your heart's content in safety. But there needs to be one additional effect.

"You get no AP, no event tickets, no leads, no loot, no quest rewards, no skyshards, and no achievements."

What? No rewards?!

Yeah! Why do you think you deserve rewards when you marked yourself safe from most of the intended risk of getting those rewards?

If you really just want to quest and explore, then you'll be happy to let those be their own reward. If you really want those other rewards after all, then what you are really asking for is the rewards of a PvPvE zone with none of the risk of PVP.


And giving the context of the event going on right now and the OP's comment that "yet again PVE players are struggling with the dailies"... I'm sorry, but players don't get to mark themselves safe from PVP and still reap the rewards of Midyear Mayhem, a celebration of all things PVP.

You want the rewards? You need to get them as intended - with the risk of PVP.

The entire point of this suggestion is to let pve people get their event tickets in imo, as that's an annual issue and drives a metric ton of people away from pvp. It's one of the biggest reasons PvP has received little new content since Morrowind, because new people joining is at a trickle. And a MASSIVE part of that is people participating in events having a disgustingly infuriating time and never stepping foot into pvp again.

This solution should change that. Agree about AP and Telvar, but the pve quests should still give their non-telvar rewards including event tickets. Skyshards should also be gettable.

If people couldn't get rare drops, telvar, ap, non-quest achievements that should be enough incentive to want to turn on pvp.

Its a PVP event taking place in a PvPvE zone. Why do you think you deserve event tickets after you turn off the intended risk of PvP?

Those skyshards are in a PvPvE zone. 4 of them require PvP actions on the part of your alliance to gain access. Why do you think you deserve skyshrds after you turn off the intended risk of PVP?

Those towns are PvPvE battle zones. 3 of them are capturapble transit points for their alliance. The other two are along scroll running routes. Their quests are short because of the risk of enemy players, and they sometimes involve delves, which grant an AP buff that's important for emperorship. Why do you think you deserve town quest rewards after you turn off the intended risk of PVP?


I see two reasons given:
1. New players will have a better introduction to PvPvE zones if they get the rewards they want with none of the risk they don't want. Or shorter, new players will have a great time if they don't actually have to deal with PVP in a PvPvE zone.
2. Look, I just want the event tickets, skyshards, and quest rewards without the risk of PvP, okay?

I already gave the reason, to make pvp an enjoyable experience you opt-in to for the chance of pvp exclusive rewards. Not something you feel forced into to get the kinds of minor rewards that you get everywhere else without trouble doing PvE.

I have seen other games have a healthier pvp base when people don't feel forced into it. Forcing people seldom works, enticing them and then rewarding them does better at making an activity more enjoyable.

But go ahead and cling to the skyshards and tickets for pvp, I guess. Just know that they are a big reason so few people want to pvp. They feel forced into their first experiences to get pve stuff done, have an absolutely horrendous time, and vow not to do it outside events. It's a metric ton of pve'ers with that experience.

You can toss the all the outrageous ad hominem you want about people being "entitled" but at the end of the day, if people aren't having fun they aren't gonna play the content. And if nobody plays that content, new stuff don't get added. It's that simple

The way I see it, you "opt-in" when you queue for a PvPvE zone.

I'm sympathetic to the "fear of missing out" with event tickets, but I don't agree that it makes sense therefore to allow players to get the rewards of an event explicitly about celebrating all forms of PVP and all PvPvE zones once they've turned off the risk of PVP.

As for the other rewards:
Don't forget that Cyrodiil is the base game PVP zone and deliberately included in the achievements like Master Angler and Tamriel Skyshard Hunter. ZOS intends for players to experience PVP if they want ALL the rewards. Don't forget that Imperial City, too, was designed as a PvPvE zone built around a mechanic that encourages killing players to steal their Tel Var. PVP is integral to their design.


Now, you can tell me that me clinging to the idea that PvPvE zones ought to involve the intended risk of PVP is going to result in the death of PVP, but frankly, I'm pretty sure that PVP isn't dying because players who don't like PVP only come out during Midyear Mayhem (and the Anniversary Event, and the IC event, even though both of those have PVE options).

PVP is struggling primarily because persistent performance issues sap the will of players who love PVP to keep playing and make it that much harder for new players who like PVP to enjoy playing. And since that's an issue that started back when ZOS made dramatic code changes to counter cheaters, and since ZOS is still working on tests for performance fixes, its hard to agree that PVP is suffering because its insufficiently welcoming to players who don't really want to PVP in the first place.

WySoSirius

Other

Other meaning. Keep pvp pvp. No need to infect purpose built pvp with pve. Can run pvp as a pve and still get all the dailies done. I have gone from a pver to a pvper.