I've never felt more irrelevant as a HEALER in ESO...

the1andonlyskwex

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

The main problem is tanks having access to health-scaling heals. The way that most encounters work in ESO is that the tank absorbs damage while everyone else just avoids getting one-shotted (or really damaged at all). This would work out fine if the tanks then had to rely on healers to sustain their health, but instead they have self-heals that scale off the same stat that lets them avoid getting one-shotted in the first place. This relegates "healers" to one of the following:
1) Being buff-bots for DPS (which is a terrible power fantasy compared to actual healing)
2) Respeccing as DPS
3) Playing in PuGs where their teammates aren't very good at the game (which can get very frustrating very fast, because it also usually comes with very low group DPS that makes clearing content a chore)

Furthermore, the health scaling heals mess up PvP too, because they contribute to the unbelievable survivability of high-health builds. One spec shouldn't have access to high burst resistance (i.e. high health) and high health sustain (i.e. strong self-healing) at the same time (and nevermind the fact that those specs currently also have access to decent damage too, in the form of proc sets).

I main tank and I'll let you know if you remove self heals from Tanks you'll have people who'll seriously start raging at their healer's.

9/10 healers I play with are completely incapable of keeping me alive if I don't have self heals.

Just one BLOCKED hit from an elite add will have you lose 15.000 - 20.000 health.

Sometimes you're holding 3-4 of these fellas and a boss.

If I'm hit with two heavy attacks from elite adds within 1-2 seconds and lose 35-40k health goodluck to the healer to get my back in the fight.

Healer will have to stand ready to babysit their Tanks with burst heals and stacked HOTS.
Leave Tanks lives entirely in the hands of healer's and they can't take their eye of the Tank in endgame to rez or do anything else.

Trust me, any Tank who's doing endgame content will let you know you can't rely on your healer. How do you think we learned to tank with 3dds to begin with? Bad experiences with Healer's. But it isn't entirely their fault. The amount of sheer punishment and incoming damage you take in certain hardmodes, DLC vet with low dps team, and trials within the blink of an eye.. Healer can not keep up if you take away Tanks health based heals.

Tanks are not the problem though. Tanks are not taking the healer's spot - DDs are because their self heals are too strong and healers are more than capable of healing squishies.

Problem is Damage is king and there's next to no healing checks in dungeons.

Some sustained DOT damage on team to force DDs to choose between burning their ressources on damage (and die) or use up their ressource pool on constantly having to self heal (and do abysmal damage as a result) would bring the healer's back really quick.

So the solution to bad healers is to make the healer role useless? Let's also make tanks do 100k DPS, that will solve problems with poor DD, or maybe we should just give medium armor a 99% mitigation passive so we don't have to worry about bad tanks any more.

Additionally, if healers can't do enough healing to keep up with the needs of a tank, that sounds like an argument to buff healers, not an argument to give tanks huge self-heals.

All of that said, part of the reason that you encounter so many poor healers is that the role is so unnecessary. In organized groups, "healers" are speccing as buff bots (mostly for DPS, but also to feed tanks resources), while in PuGs half of the "healers" are fakes because people expect tanks to heal themselves. If ZoS actually made healers useful/necessary, I guarantee you'd see a lot more "healers" actually healing.

People are barely playing Tank as is, if you nerf tanks even more by taking away their heals entirely you might aswell kill the role in PVE.

From your post you make it seem like you don't play endgame Tank.
You don't seem to have a concept of how much incoming damage there is in endgame, the amount of pressure on Tanks is already insane - you don't want to add to it.

Also...
As it stands now as Tank you're entirely at the mercy of your DD's to not be in dungeons 2 hours and hope they do damage.
Imagine if you tank stuff and you don't get healed and can't heal yourself either.

You don't progress due to low damage.
and you die to stuff that isn't your fault because your healer isn't aware.

Nobody will touch that role ever again and can't blame them.
People barely play them endgame right now.

So, in summary, you don't like having to rely on other people. Why are you even playing an MMO?

Grandchamp1989

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

The main problem is tanks having access to health-scaling heals. The way that most encounters work in ESO is that the tank absorbs damage while everyone else just avoids getting one-shotted (or really damaged at all). This would work out fine if the tanks then had to rely on healers to sustain their health, but instead they have self-heals that scale off the same stat that lets them avoid getting one-shotted in the first place. This relegates "healers" to one of the following:
1) Being buff-bots for DPS (which is a terrible power fantasy compared to actual healing)
2) Respeccing as DPS
3) Playing in PuGs where their teammates aren't very good at the game (which can get very frustrating very fast, because it also usually comes with very low group DPS that makes clearing content a chore)

Furthermore, the health scaling heals mess up PvP too, because they contribute to the unbelievable survivability of high-health builds. One spec shouldn't have access to high burst resistance (i.e. high health) and high health sustain (i.e. strong self-healing) at the same time (and nevermind the fact that those specs currently also have access to decent damage too, in the form of proc sets).

I main tank and I'll let you know if you remove self heals from Tanks you'll have people who'll seriously start raging at their healer's.

9/10 healers I play with are completely incapable of keeping me alive if I don't have self heals.

Just one BLOCKED hit from an elite add will have you lose 15.000 - 20.000 health.

Sometimes you're holding 3-4 of these fellas and a boss.

If I'm hit with two heavy attacks from elite adds within 1-2 seconds and lose 35-40k health goodluck to the healer to get my back in the fight.

Healer will have to stand ready to babysit their Tanks with burst heals and stacked HOTS.
Leave Tanks lives entirely in the hands of healer's and they can't take their eye of the Tank in endgame to rez or do anything else.

Trust me, any Tank who's doing endgame content will let you know you can't rely on your healer. How do you think we learned to tank with 3dds to begin with? Bad experiences with Healer's. But it isn't entirely their fault. The amount of sheer punishment and incoming damage you take in certain hardmodes, DLC vet with low dps team, and trials within the blink of an eye.. Healer can not keep up if you take away Tanks health based heals.

Tanks are not the problem though. Tanks are not taking the healer's spot - DDs are because their self heals are too strong and healers are more than capable of healing squishies.

Problem is Damage is king and there's next to no healing checks in dungeons.

Some sustained DOT damage on team to force DDs to choose between burning their ressources on damage (and die) or use up their ressource pool on constantly having to self heal (and do abysmal damage as a result) would bring the healer's back really quick.

So the solution to bad healers is to make the healer role useless? Let's also make tanks do 100k DPS, that will solve problems with poor DD, or maybe we should just give medium armor a 99% mitigation passive so we don't have to worry about bad tanks any more.

Additionally, if healers can't do enough healing to keep up with the needs of a tank, that sounds like an argument to buff healers, not an argument to give tanks huge self-heals.

All of that said, part of the reason that you encounter so many poor healers is that the role is so unnecessary. In organized groups, "healers" are speccing as buff bots (mostly for DPS, but also to feed tanks resources), while in PuGs half of the "healers" are fakes because people expect tanks to heal themselves. If ZoS actually made healers useful/necessary, I guarantee you'd see a lot more "healers" actually healing.

People are barely playing Tank as is, if you nerf tanks even more by taking away their heals entirely you might aswell kill the role in PVE.

From your post you make it seem like you don't play endgame Tank.
You don't seem to have a concept of how much incoming damage there is in endgame, the amount of pressure on Tanks is already insane - you don't want to add to it.

Also...
As it stands now as Tank you're entirely at the mercy of your DD's to not be in dungeons 2 hours and hope they do damage.
Imagine if you tank stuff and you don't get healed and can't heal yourself either.

You don't progress due to low damage.
and you die to stuff that isn't your fault because your healer isn't aware.

Nobody will touch that role ever again and can't blame them.
People barely play them endgame right now.

So, in summary, you don't like having to rely on other people. Why are you even playing an MMO?

In the way ESO is right now would never work

zvavi

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

The main problem is tanks having access to health-scaling heals. The way that most encounters work in ESO is that the tank absorbs damage while everyone else just avoids getting one-shotted (or really damaged at all). This would work out fine if the tanks then had to rely on healers to sustain their health, but instead they have self-heals that scale off the same stat that lets them avoid getting one-shotted in the first place. This relegates "healers" to one of the following:
1) Being buff-bots for DPS (which is a terrible power fantasy compared to actual healing)
2) Respeccing as DPS
3) Playing in PuGs where their teammates aren't very good at the game (which can get very frustrating very fast, because it also usually comes with very low group DPS that makes clearing content a chore)

Furthermore, the health scaling heals mess up PvP too, because they contribute to the unbelievable survivability of high-health builds. One spec shouldn't have access to high burst resistance (i.e. high health) and high health sustain (i.e. strong self-healing) at the same time (and nevermind the fact that those specs currently also have access to decent damage too, in the form of proc sets).

I main tank and I'll let you know if you remove self heals from Tanks you'll have people who'll seriously start raging at their healer's.

9/10 healers I play with are completely incapable of keeping me alive if I don't have self heals.

Just one BLOCKED hit from an elite add will have you lose 15.000 - 20.000 health.

Sometimes you're holding 3-4 of these fellas and a boss.

If I'm hit with two heavy attacks from elite adds within 1-2 seconds and lose 35-40k health goodluck to the healer to get my back in the fight.

Healer will have to stand ready to babysit their Tanks with burst heals and stacked HOTS.
Leave Tanks lives entirely in the hands of healer's and they can't take their eye of the Tank in endgame to rez or do anything else.

Trust me, any Tank who's doing endgame content will let you know you can't rely on your healer. How do you think we learned to tank with 3dds to begin with? Bad experiences with Healer's. But it isn't entirely their fault. The amount of sheer punishment and incoming damage you take in certain hardmodes, DLC vet with low dps team, and trials within the blink of an eye.. Healer can not keep up if you take away Tanks health based heals.

Tanks are not the problem though. Tanks are not taking the healer's spot - DDs are because their self heals are too strong and healers are more than capable of healing squishies.

Problem is Damage is king and there's next to no healing checks in dungeons.

Some sustained DOT damage on team to force DDs to choose between burning their ressources on damage (and die) or use up their ressource pool on constantly having to self heal (and do abysmal damage as a result) would bring the healer's back really quick.

So the solution to bad healers is to make the healer role useless? Let's also make tanks do 100k DPS, that will solve problems with poor DD, or maybe we should just give medium armor a 99% mitigation passive so we don't have to worry about bad tanks any more.

Additionally, if healers can't do enough healing to keep up with the needs of a tank, that sounds like an argument to buff healers, not an argument to give tanks huge self-heals.

All of that said, part of the reason that you encounter so many poor healers is that the role is so unnecessary. In organized groups, "healers" are speccing as buff bots (mostly for DPS, but also to feed tanks resources), while in PuGs half of the "healers" are fakes because people expect tanks to heal themselves. If ZoS actually made healers useful/necessary, I guarantee you'd see a lot more "healers" actually healing.

People are barely playing Tank as is, if you nerf tanks even more by taking away their heals entirely you might aswell kill the role in PVE.

From your post you make it seem like you don't play endgame Tank.
You don't seem to have a concept of how much incoming damage there is in endgame, the amount of pressure on Tanks is already insane - you don't want to add to it.

Also...
As it stands now as Tank you're entirely at the mercy of your DD's to not be in dungeons 2 hours and hope they do damage.
Imagine if you tank stuff and you don't get healed and can't heal yourself either.

You don't progress due to low damage.
and you die to stuff that isn't your fault because your healer isn't aware.

Nobody will touch that role ever again and can't blame them.
People barely play them endgame right now.

So, in summary, you don't like having to rely on other people. Why are you even playing an MMO?

It is not relying, it is being overly dependant. There are phases in which u take massive damage in the hard content, of twice your health over 3 seconds, when healer and tank need to both spam heals for the tank to survive. Negating tanks of self heals will do one of the two things, either dumb down the role to the point they need only minor heals to survive, or to be miserable entities that are dependent on a good healer to survive. As if we don't lack tanks as it is.

Waffennacht

I praise all healers. I tried it once; omg if you dont have a .... Knowledgeable.... team, just omg...

I tip my hat off to all heealers; needed or not.

Please dont stop being awesome healers

gatekeeper13

When you try to do challenging content with 1t 2dd 1h only to find out that you can do it easier with 1t 3dd, you can understand what a totally unbalanced game we are talking about. We ve reached the point where even vet dungeons are soloable.

All these are proof of how unbalanced the game is.

And wanna know why? Because game does not kill you through incoming damage but through silly 1-shot mechanics. If you can skip mechanics, no healer needed.

Grandchamp1989

zvavi wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

The main problem is tanks having access to health-scaling heals. The way that most encounters work in ESO is that the tank absorbs damage while everyone else just avoids getting one-shotted (or really damaged at all). This would work out fine if the tanks then had to rely on healers to sustain their health, but instead they have self-heals that scale off the same stat that lets them avoid getting one-shotted in the first place. This relegates "healers" to one of the following:
1) Being buff-bots for DPS (which is a terrible power fantasy compared to actual healing)
2) Respeccing as DPS
3) Playing in PuGs where their teammates aren't very good at the game (which can get very frustrating very fast, because it also usually comes with very low group DPS that makes clearing content a chore)

Furthermore, the health scaling heals mess up PvP too, because they contribute to the unbelievable survivability of high-health builds. One spec shouldn't have access to high burst resistance (i.e. high health) and high health sustain (i.e. strong self-healing) at the same time (and nevermind the fact that those specs currently also have access to decent damage too, in the form of proc sets).

I main tank and I'll let you know if you remove self heals from Tanks you'll have people who'll seriously start raging at their healer's.

9/10 healers I play with are completely incapable of keeping me alive if I don't have self heals.

Just one BLOCKED hit from an elite add will have you lose 15.000 - 20.000 health.

Sometimes you're holding 3-4 of these fellas and a boss.

If I'm hit with two heavy attacks from elite adds within 1-2 seconds and lose 35-40k health goodluck to the healer to get my back in the fight.

Healer will have to stand ready to babysit their Tanks with burst heals and stacked HOTS.
Leave Tanks lives entirely in the hands of healer's and they can't take their eye of the Tank in endgame to rez or do anything else.

Trust me, any Tank who's doing endgame content will let you know you can't rely on your healer. How do you think we learned to tank with 3dds to begin with? Bad experiences with Healer's. But it isn't entirely their fault. The amount of sheer punishment and incoming damage you take in certain hardmodes, DLC vet with low dps team, and trials within the blink of an eye.. Healer can not keep up if you take away Tanks health based heals.

Tanks are not the problem though. Tanks are not taking the healer's spot - DDs are because their self heals are too strong and healers are more than capable of healing squishies.

Problem is Damage is king and there's next to no healing checks in dungeons.

Some sustained DOT damage on team to force DDs to choose between burning their ressources on damage (and die) or use up their ressource pool on constantly having to self heal (and do abysmal damage as a result) would bring the healer's back really quick.

So the solution to bad healers is to make the healer role useless? Let's also make tanks do 100k DPS, that will solve problems with poor DD, or maybe we should just give medium armor a 99% mitigation passive so we don't have to worry about bad tanks any more.

Additionally, if healers can't do enough healing to keep up with the needs of a tank, that sounds like an argument to buff healers, not an argument to give tanks huge self-heals.

All of that said, part of the reason that you encounter so many poor healers is that the role is so unnecessary. In organized groups, "healers" are speccing as buff bots (mostly for DPS, but also to feed tanks resources), while in PuGs half of the "healers" are fakes because people expect tanks to heal themselves. If ZoS actually made healers useful/necessary, I guarantee you'd see a lot more "healers" actually healing.

People are barely playing Tank as is, if you nerf tanks even more by taking away their heals entirely you might aswell kill the role in PVE.

From your post you make it seem like you don't play endgame Tank.
You don't seem to have a concept of how much incoming damage there is in endgame, the amount of pressure on Tanks is already insane - you don't want to add to it.

Also...
As it stands now as Tank you're entirely at the mercy of your DD's to not be in dungeons 2 hours and hope they do damage.
Imagine if you tank stuff and you don't get healed and can't heal yourself either.

You don't progress due to low damage.
and you die to stuff that isn't your fault because your healer isn't aware.

Nobody will touch that role ever again and can't blame them.
People barely play them endgame right now.

So, in summary, you don't like having to rely on other people. Why are you even playing an MMO?

It is not relying, it is being overly dependant. There are phases in which u take massive damage in the hard content, of twice your health over 3 seconds, when healer and tank need to both spam heals for the tank to survive. Negating tanks of self heals will do one of the two things, either dumb down the role to the point they need only minor heals to survive, or to be miserable entities that are dependent on a good healer to survive. As if we don't lack tanks as it is.

This guy understand how it works.

Cireous

In my opinion, forcing us to form groups, which is not happening, or we are unable to heal using many of our healing skills and most of our set bonuses in open world PVE content "was the biggest middle finger to ALL my classes in the game to date."

...

KaGaOri

Will go against popular opinion here and say I prefer running dungeons with real healer nearly every time. While 3 dd + tank might be (slightly) faster, runs with healer are smoother and much less stressful.

Got magsorc with critical surge, which is awsome, since all I have to do to self-heal is hit stuff. Rarely ever dies unless screwing up on mechanics. The problems start when ever hitting stuff isn't possible, mainly due dungeon mechanics (think cages at WGT first boss) and - mainly - while resing. There are boss fights in vet dungeons where if there's no healer having my back and somebody dies, then sorry, but they're staying dead for rest of the fight. Can solo (or duo with tank) a lot of these bosses if necessary, but DoTs and AoEs just won't return enough heals to keep me alive durring res, or it will be very close call.

Yes, healer won't do as much damage as dd. You know who does even less damage than healer? Dead dd.

ThreeXB

I feel bad for healers in Cyrodiil , no out of group healing and only 12 man groups now . AP is harder than ever for you guys and your heals are missed

Strider__Roshin

You are correct. Healers are useless outside of trials. But with OP proc sets, and the fact that damage and healing scale off of the same stats what do you expect.

LadyNalcarya

zvavi wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

The main problem is tanks having access to health-scaling heals. The way that most encounters work in ESO is that the tank absorbs damage while everyone else just avoids getting one-shotted (or really damaged at all). This would work out fine if the tanks then had to rely on healers to sustain their health, but instead they have self-heals that scale off the same stat that lets them avoid getting one-shotted in the first place. This relegates "healers" to one of the following:
1) Being buff-bots for DPS (which is a terrible power fantasy compared to actual healing)
2) Respeccing as DPS
3) Playing in PuGs where their teammates aren't very good at the game (which can get very frustrating very fast, because it also usually comes with very low group DPS that makes clearing content a chore)

Furthermore, the health scaling heals mess up PvP too, because they contribute to the unbelievable survivability of high-health builds. One spec shouldn't have access to high burst resistance (i.e. high health) and high health sustain (i.e. strong self-healing) at the same time (and nevermind the fact that those specs currently also have access to decent damage too, in the form of proc sets).

I main tank and I'll let you know if you remove self heals from Tanks you'll have people who'll seriously start raging at their healer's.

9/10 healers I play with are completely incapable of keeping me alive if I don't have self heals.

Just one BLOCKED hit from an elite add will have you lose 15.000 - 20.000 health.

Sometimes you're holding 3-4 of these fellas and a boss.

If I'm hit with two heavy attacks from elite adds within 1-2 seconds and lose 35-40k health goodluck to the healer to get my back in the fight.

Healer will have to stand ready to babysit their Tanks with burst heals and stacked HOTS.
Leave Tanks lives entirely in the hands of healer's and they can't take their eye of the Tank in endgame to rez or do anything else.

Trust me, any Tank who's doing endgame content will let you know you can't rely on your healer. How do you think we learned to tank with 3dds to begin with? Bad experiences with Healer's. But it isn't entirely their fault. The amount of sheer punishment and incoming damage you take in certain hardmodes, DLC vet with low dps team, and trials within the blink of an eye.. Healer can not keep up if you take away Tanks health based heals.

Tanks are not the problem though. Tanks are not taking the healer's spot - DDs are because their self heals are too strong and healers are more than capable of healing squishies.

Problem is Damage is king and there's next to no healing checks in dungeons.

Some sustained DOT damage on team to force DDs to choose between burning their ressources on damage (and die) or use up their ressource pool on constantly having to self heal (and do abysmal damage as a result) would bring the healer's back really quick.

So the solution to bad healers is to make the healer role useless? Let's also make tanks do 100k DPS, that will solve problems with poor DD, or maybe we should just give medium armor a 99% mitigation passive so we don't have to worry about bad tanks any more.

Additionally, if healers can't do enough healing to keep up with the needs of a tank, that sounds like an argument to buff healers, not an argument to give tanks huge self-heals.

All of that said, part of the reason that you encounter so many poor healers is that the role is so unnecessary. In organized groups, "healers" are speccing as buff bots (mostly for DPS, but also to feed tanks resources), while in PuGs half of the "healers" are fakes because people expect tanks to heal themselves. If ZoS actually made healers useful/necessary, I guarantee you'd see a lot more "healers" actually healing.

People are barely playing Tank as is, if you nerf tanks even more by taking away their heals entirely you might aswell kill the role in PVE.

From your post you make it seem like you don't play endgame Tank.
You don't seem to have a concept of how much incoming damage there is in endgame, the amount of pressure on Tanks is already insane - you don't want to add to it.

Also...
As it stands now as Tank you're entirely at the mercy of your DD's to not be in dungeons 2 hours and hope they do damage.
Imagine if you tank stuff and you don't get healed and can't heal yourself either.

You don't progress due to low damage.
and you die to stuff that isn't your fault because your healer isn't aware.

Nobody will touch that role ever again and can't blame them.
People barely play them endgame right now.

So, in summary, you don't like having to rely on other people. Why are you even playing an MMO?

It is not relying, it is being overly dependant. There are phases in which u take massive damage in the hard content, of twice your health over 3 seconds, when healer and tank need to both spam heals for the tank to survive. Negating tanks of self heals will do one of the two things, either dumb down the role to the point they need only minor heals to survive, or to be miserable entities that are dependent on a good healer to survive. As if we don't lack tanks as it is.

This. Nerfing tanks is a horrible idea, there's already not enough of them. And if you nerf their self heals, no one would want to risk playing with random pugs.

Sarannah

Maybe there is a way to fix healers, while at the same time shorten dungeonqueue times for everyone... By merging healer and tank into one role. Just change tanking abilities to incorporate AOE groupheals, and make queues consist of 3DD and 1TH.

Edit: Not sure about how this would impact PvP. Maybe keep tank and healer seperate for PvP.

GreenhaloX

Huh.. what? Come on.. You'll be allright. No need to take this game so seriously. Sensible people surely aren't laughing at you or any ESO gamers of any shape, size or class (love the fat Orc toons or the fat Breton trashy look toons running around in there Tamriel, by the way. Ha ha.) Video game/ESO = entertainment. Video game/ESO "not" life or a job.

Yes, sure, MMO, but it doesn't mean you are bound to play any group content. Heck, as a lonegunner, ESO is just right for me to play as a solo MMO. Haven't played trial in a few year now, and I'm good with that. Don't need any of the trial gear and the playstyle for trials is not to my liking. Plenty of things to do in the game, other than trials. Plus, trials are more suited for the full-time gamers. Well, unless you're one of those; then, cool, if such helps you all get through the day better. Otherwise, there are loads of other things to do and enjoy, and plenty of solo healers running around wreaking havoc as well on overland stuff like world bosses, dragons, harrowstorms, geysers and whatnots. Besides, you or any healers are surely not irrelevant. Ever seen those dds running around with a staff and greatsword or staff and DW? Ha ha ha.. sigh..

idk

I have been in ESO since the day it launched on PC. My main role when I started this game was as a healer. Even then I found that being a pure healer in ESO is not needed outside of trials.

It is something I found refreshing since I enjoyed being able to do damage that was not akin to slapping a boss with a wet noodle as I have experienced in other MMORPGs. My first clear of vDSA when it was new and shiny was as a 50/50 healer which was the typical leaderboard design. I still did almost as much damage as the damage dealers. It was amazing.

angrydrew

Used to enjoy playing committed healer not just dung/trials but in cyro also..Looks like eso's fix for lagg spikes was to destroy healer builds. Have you even tried healing yourself in cyro its totally pointless they might as well just free up space on their little server and wipe the healer skilz and armors totally..They destroyed a skill line and ruined lots of fun for as usual people who bought the game.
p.s leave the Gingers out of it gingers matter..lol

DT-ARR

Raideen wrote: »

The ring of pale order was a HUGE mistake. I am actually bewildered at how it got past the brain storm stage in development to being full on coded into the game.

What the ring SHOULD do is attach its heal to the ZOS chosen spammable in each classes toolkit. This way every class gets the heal they want from Templars jabs and healers can maintain healing in a raid/dungeon with no issues.

Ring of the pale order should require vampirism and the heal % should scale with stage.

DarkPicture

redspecter23 wrote: »

If the members of your party don't want you because of the ring, they are ignoring the powerful buffs and debuffs a healer can bring to the party.

No, u are wrong. Stuff which healer can offer u, tank can do the same. You want healer mostly for dmg buffs which tank can use as sets.

DarkPicture

Thats how it game works and devs cant change it. If u remove healing from classes and other skills and u make only restro as healing then u kill most of content. Solo pvp will be impossible same as overland content and many mechanics in trials like e.g. portals where u dont take healer.

+ in every scroll games even single player u are usually using healing skills and do dmg or being tank.

BisDasBlutGefriert

You're amazing just the way you are @Austacker !!!

~huuuuuuug~
😁

Athan1

Healers are indeed useless. Zos needs to rethink this policy bc the players that spend the most money on this game tend to play as healers - most crafters,house maniacs etc play healer when and if they fight.

Pauwer

In pvp organized groups healers are very much needed and appreciated. I play one in guild group and it's great.

The pale order ring is much loved by me, because when i play my dd chars in cyro and i can't get into any group, it is great. I love it. The silly changes to group sizes and the no healing unless you are grouped makes the ring awesome. I'd be willing to give up the ring only if those changes are cancelled.

SickDuck

Healers are not really needed which is good because it means solo players are supported by the game. But the healer as a support role can be very useful in group content, just not focused on healing any more, but resource management and buffing/debuffing. A good tank+healer combo in a vet dungeon can be more effective than a 3dd setup.

BoraxFlux

I lost a great bit of my appetite in Cyro PvP, not being able to buff and heal my own alliance outside grouped play. I have two PvP damage dealers now, to see whether I could adjust to the new situation, one being a DK and not even igneous shield works outside group play.
Still happy when our alliance advances, but It just doesn't feel like AvA to me any more.

Still hope there will be a way to enjoy Cyro again, I just haven't found the right format yet.

DarkPicture

Athan1 wrote: »

Healers are indeed useless. Zos needs to rethink this policy bc the players that spend the most money on this game tend to play as healers - most crafters,house maniacs etc play healer when and if they fight.

Thats not true, otherwise prove it. Its only your imagination.

DarkPicture

SickDuck wrote: »

A good tank+healer combo in a vet dungeon can be more effective than a 3dd setup.

So u telling that healer + 2 dds is better than 3 dds with 130k+ on nuke setup? xD

Snow_White

Browart wrote: »

SickDuck wrote: »

A good tank+healer combo in a vet dungeon can be more effective than a 3dd setup.

So u telling that healer + 2 dds is better than 3 dds with 130k+ on nuke setup? xD

Which is the minority of players.

Once you can pull 80k+ as a DD, when you do dungeons you’re guaranteed to have at least on 80k DD in the group, which really skews your perception of how difficult the dungeons are for others. Run dungeons with a pair of DPS that are struggling with low numbers and it’s a completely different experience... but, players need to gear up/skill up somehow, and focusing on the strategies used players that are already wearing BIS isn’t really doing the remainder of the player base any favours.

I rolled my first healer a few weeks ago and levelled it up through the DF. It’s now completed a bunch of vet HM and one trial. There’s only been one dungeon run where I felt useless, and that was due to a tank/healer hybrid wearing Winter’s Respite and casting Budding Seeds on himself. Made my job easy so I switched to DPS gear and threw out an orb every once in awhile. In hindsight, it wasn’t the most efficient as the group lacked sustain and the tank focused completely on himself, but we got through it.

I originally intended on building a Healer/DPS hybrid, but after awhile I found a straight up healer/buffer/debuffer was more efficient. For every dungeon where I get a couple of heavy hitters that can sprint to the end, there’s two or three dungeons where the DPS needs the help and another where the fake tank sprints off ahead without the skill to solo and dies on one of the bosses, then rage quits.

Counter to this thread, over the last few weeks I’ve actually been thanked running randoms for healing the group. Joined a couple of dungeons in progress because the original healer quit and was thanked at the end for sticking it out with them. Had a tank quit in vUG and the replacement immediately wanted to know if the group had a real healer or not. I’m not saying I’m a particularly good healer, but I do think the demand is out there for people willing to take the roll seriously.

As a DPS I don’t use the Ring of Pale Order because it nerfs my DPS. I think the ring is a bit of a gimmick. I can see where it would be useful in specific situations, but I think players are misusing it and it’s becoming a crutch. One of the more entertaining runs I’ve been on was with a tank I couldn’t heal because of one, and he didn’t hit hard enough to heal himself through the damage he was taking.

I originally rolled a healer so that I’d understand their roll and thus be a better DPS in trials, and it’s taught me a lot about their mechanics and group support, and how much I was nerfing my own DPS/sustain/survivability by not knowing where to position myself to best benefit from them. I’d recommend everyone who wants a deeper understanding of the game give one a try... IMO, you’ll be a better DPS for it.