So ZOS any word on if original hairstyles and adorments will become gender neutral?

ZaroktheImmortal

There are so many long hair styles I'd love to use on my male toons that are still gender restricted. I made a post about this about a month ago and it got positive reactions and got a ZOS response that it would be passed on to the relevant team. So I'm wondering if there's any update on that if anyone from ZOS would care to respond? I know us players don't have an answer but I really would love to be able to use more hairstyles on my toons.

SydneyGrey

I would LOVE if the Long Pulled-Back Pony hair was made available for males. It would look great on guys, but they can't wear it.

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

[snip] Things like the Long Pulled-Back Pony hair are not specifically female hairs, but are only available for females.
Now, I wouldn't want beards being unlocked for females, but hair ... come on. It's just hair.

Shadowspawn42

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. [snip] Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

[Edited to remove Baiting]

Amunari

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. [snip] Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

This is a very sensitive topic, but you will need to learn to accept that not everyone supports these things and nor do they have to. Some people do not want to play a game with guys running around in dresses, or other such things.

This is the world we live in.


That being said, i have strict positions on these types of things as a designer. I also believe that religion does not belong in games (so xmas holiday sales, etc). I believe as designers we are hurting the game by not making its own holidays, completely isolated from the real world ones. Sure there may be some tie like "timing" for example, a elven holiday mid dec, but it should not be or fall on xmas, or any other RL such holiday.

[snip] because ultimately that is not part of the lore, and it should not be. This would massively devalue the game, and work to rob the races, and the games lore of its identity.

This not as a disrespect to anyone, just a belief that such things should not be intentionally worked into game design. [snip]

Companies should show their support or lack there of through real life attend events like blizz-con etc.

[Edited to remove Offensive Content]

ZaroktheImmortal

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

Umm how is hairstyles political exactly? I didn't know the length of ones hair was a political matter. You do realise men can grow long hair and women can have short hair right? How exactly does the length of ones hair devalue a gender? I'm a guy with long hair in the real world. It's not political at all.

ZaroktheImmortal

Amunari wrote: »

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. I happen to think your weird sexist opinion “doesn’t belong in games”. Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

This is a very sensitive topic, but you will need to learn to accept that not everyone supports these things and nor do they have to. Some people do not want to play a game with guys running around in dresses, or other such things.

This is the world we live in.


That being said, i have strict positions on these types of things as a designer. I also believe that religion does not belong in games (so xmas holiday sales, etc). I believe as designers we are hurting the game by not making its own holidays, completely isolated from the real world ones. Sure there may be some tie like "timing" for example, a elven holiday mid dec, but it should not be or fall on xmas, or any other RL such holiday.

[snip] because ultimately that is not part of the lore, and it should not be. This would massively devalue the game, and work to rob the races, and the games lore of its identity.

This not as a disrespect to anyone, just a belief that such things should not be intentionally worked into game design. [snip]

Companies should show their support or lack there of through real life attend events like blizz-con etc.

Err there literally are dress costumes you can get if you want your male toons to wear a dress. I'm pretty sure they aren't gender bound. Funny thing is there already are long hair styles for men but it's rather limiting.

ZaroktheImmortal

Mostly I want more of the female ones cause they have more variety of long hairs.

SpaceElf

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

Characters in a game do not have a sex. They're not real. There is no reason to restrict the appearance of these characters because of a label that doesn't actually apply in a fake world. There are plenty of hairstyles that work on both, so there is no reason the restricted styles cannot be used on one 'sex' versus the other.

Shadowspawn42

Amunari wrote: »

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. I happen to think your weird sexist opinion “doesn’t belong in games”. Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

This is a very sensitive topic, but you will need to learn to accept that not everyone supports these things and nor do they have to. Some people do not want to play a game with guys running around in dresses, or other such things.

This is the world we live in.


That being said, i have strict positions on these types of things as a designer. I also believe that religion does not belong in games (so xmas holiday sales, etc). I believe as designers we are hurting the game by not making its own holidays, completely isolated from the real world ones. Sure there may be some tie like "timing" for example, a elven holiday mid dec, but it should not be or fall on xmas, or any other RL such holiday.

[snip] because ultimately that is not part of the lore, and it should not be. This would massively devalue the game, and work to rob the races, and the games lore of its identity.

This not as a disrespect to anyone, just a belief that such things should not be intentionally worked into game design. [snip]

Companies should show their support or lack there of through real life attend events like blizz-con etc.

I am not asking for anyone to “support” men with long hair (or whatever this discussion was originally about). If you feel that strongly about men having long hair, then by all means give your male characters short hair. But some people DO want males with long hair, or dresses, or whatever. Why should you be the one to decide what everyone else does? I happen to agree about the religion thing, but the two aren’t at all related. Having a holiday in the game that comes from a real life religion affects EVERYONE. Having the hairstyle or clothing you want ONLY AFFECTS YOU. This is an RPG, which means people can play the way they want to, even if you don’t like it.

Shadowspawn42

@ZaroktheImmortal I am truly sorry for turning your thread into some crazy debate. As to your original question, I am sorry to say that I do not know. But I’ve been hoping for the same thing for a while now. Again, apologies.

ZaroktheImmortal

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

@ZaroktheImmortal I am truly sorry for turning your thread into some crazy debate. As to your original question, I am sorry to say that I do not know. But I’ve been hoping for the same thing for a while now. Again, apologies.

Not your fault. Amunari was the one who decided it was a 'political' matter which just comes down to him saying 'I don't like men having long hair'. Though by his same standard I could claim that male toons having short hair is a "political matter"

SpaceElf

satanio wrote: »

SpaceElf wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

Characters in a game do not have a sex. They're not real. There is no reason to restrict the appearance of these characters because of a label that doesn't actually apply in a fake world. There are plenty of hairstyles that work on both, so there is no reason the restricted styles cannot be used on one 'sex' versus the other.

[Quoted post was removed]

Not literally, don't be silly. I was addressing the previous 'point' stating sex and gender roles don't apply to his argument for restricting design choice because of perceived character 'sex'.

Nord_Raseri

SpaceElf wrote: »

satanio wrote: »

SpaceElf wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

Characters in a game do not have a sex. They're not real. There is no reason to restrict the appearance of these characters because of a label that doesn't actually apply in a fake world. There are plenty of hairstyles that work on both, so there is no reason the restricted styles cannot be used on one 'sex' versus the other.

[Quoted post was removed]

Not literally, don't be silly. I was addressing the previous 'point' stating sex and gender roles don't apply to his argument for restricting design choice because of perceived character 'sex'.

To be fair, upon creating a character you're given a definitive choice of said character's sex. Male or female. That being said, if you can wear a dress, why not syle your hair like a princess? Whatever floats your goat, I say!

Nairinhe

To, so to say, promote staying on topic, I would love to finally see Rolis's/Veya's hair available. It's more elegant that simple long male hair, but not as, I don't know, pompous?, as "coil with long fall"

Nord_Raseri

That's a long asked for hairstyle on these forums

SlimeBro1

Personally, I hope not. I can get why people want it tho, I just don't.

But no there hasn't been any official word on such.

satanio

SpaceElf wrote: »

SpaceElf wrote: »

Characters in a game do have a sex. They're real. There is no reason to restrict the appearance of these characters because of a label that doesn't actually apply in a fake world. There are plenty of hairstyles that work on both, so there is no reason the restricted styles cannot be used on one 'sex' versus the other.

Not literally, don't be silly. I was addressing the previous 'point' stating sex and gender roles don't apply to his argument for restricting design choice because of perceived character 'sex'.

Be more careful about saying what is and what is not real next time...

//Edit to edit the edit to actually not make the post out of context by the edit. Also haircuts for everyone.

Syldras

Everytime someone complains about long hair being a "woman thing", I wonder what century they're from. Can't be the 21th. But can't be the

18th



or the 15th



either.

MagicalLija

We have like barely any good Long hairstyles for men. Its just straight annoying.

I just want man buns. And like better longer braids for guys. Is that so much to ask for

NotaDaedraWorshipper

Syldras wrote: »

Everytime someone complains about long hair being a "woman thing", I wonder what century they're from. Can't be the 21th. But can't be the

18th

or the 15th

either.

They can't be playing ESO either, or any Elder Scrolls game, or any fantasy game for that matter. Because they are filled with men that have long hair.

Syldras

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

They can't be playing ESO either, or any Elder Scrolls game, or any fantasy game for that matter. Because they are filled with men that have long hair.

Plot twist: They thought every NPC with long hair was a woman with a weirdly deep voice

ArchangelIsraphel

Amunari wrote: »

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. [snip] Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

This is a very sensitive topic, but you will need to learn to accept that not everyone supports these things and nor do they have to. Some people do not want to play a game with guys running around in dresses, or other such things.

This is the world we live in.


That being said, i have strict positions on these types of things as a designer. I also believe that religion does not belong in games (so xmas holiday sales, etc). I believe as designers we are hurting the game by not making its own holidays, completely isolated from the real world ones. Sure there may be some tie like "timing" for example, a elven holiday mid dec, but it should not be or fall on xmas, or any other RL such holiday.

[snip] because ultimately that is not part of the lore, and it should not be. This would massively devalue the game, and work to rob the races, and the games lore of its identity.

This not as a disrespect to anyone, just a belief that such things should not be intentionally worked into game design. [snip]

Companies should show their support or lack there of through real life attend events like blizz-con etc.

[Edited to remove Offensive Content]

Where in the lore does it say that hair styles and cosmetic items can't be worn by male characters? Besides, in every single culture, you are going to have someone who wishes to do what may be considered "taboo" by others- its simply the way life works. And they have my support in it, because there's no reason why a hairstyle or article of clothing should ever be limited to gender, IRL or in a videogame. It has nothing to do with politics. It's common sense. ESO is already a videogame that expresses tolerance and understanding, why not extend that understanding to these things as well?

And you have my full support in wanting these hairstyles, and more, for men. I found it frustrating that I couldn't use them in the character creator. (I would ESPECIALLY love some hair styles that weren't completely pulled back from the male's face, and gave him some sweeping bangs with a pony tail, for example, or something else equally rougeish and charming.)

LadySinflower

Amunari wrote: »

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. [snip] Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

This is a very sensitive topic, but you will need to learn to accept that not everyone supports these things and nor do they have to. Some people do not want to play a game with guys running around in dresses, or other such things.

This is the world we live in.


That being said, i have strict positions on these types of things as a designer. I also believe that religion does not belong in games (so xmas holiday sales, etc). I believe as designers we are hurting the game by not making its own holidays, completely isolated from the real world ones. Sure there may be some tie like "timing" for example, a elven holiday mid dec, but it should not be or fall on xmas, or any other RL such holiday.

[snip] because ultimately that is not part of the lore, and it should not be. This would massively devalue the game, and work to rob the races, and the games lore of its identity.

This not as a disrespect to anyone, just a belief that such things should not be intentionally worked into game design. [snip]

Companies should show their support or lack there of through real life attend events like blizz-con etc.

[Edited to remove Offensive Content]

No offense intended, but this post strikes me as funny. We can't have more long hair styles for men because lots of people don't want to see a game where men walk around in dresses, yet how many male orcs in wedding dresses have I seen just this week? Obviously the hair style restrictions are not stopping people from dressing their male characters in female outfits. How about we take the male/female designation off the hairstyles and move it over to the dresses? Not the formal suits, because female toons can wear them without looking like men. Just the dresses and obvious female outfits.

Grianasteri

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

You make a valid and important point about there being only two sexes (also important to note that in modern parlance gender and sex are not the same).

But seriously, I really dont care if all the hair styles are available to both "sexes" in game. Hair style surely isnt sexed/gendered.

Id draw the line at facial hair though, lets not be silly.

Nirntrotter

My IRL hairstyle is marked 'male' in this game. I'm a woman. My male SO on the other hand has butt length ringlets that could sweep you off your feet. So far no one's tried to police him or me for our hair growth and styling. Please get rid of this gendered item nonsense, it's a disservice to the neutral and non-judgmental vibe that this game series has always had to it.

relentless_turnip

[snip]

I am just joking, I don't care either way 👍

[Edited to removed Offensive Content]

Syldras

Grianasteri wrote: »

Id draw the line at facial hair though, lets not be silly.

They're fake beards. Otherwise you couldn't equip them within a few seconds

ethuiliel wrote: »

My IRL hairstyle is marked 'male' in this game.

At least yours is available for player characters

NotaDaedraWorshipper

Syldras wrote: »

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

They can't be playing ESO either, or any Elder Scrolls game, or any fantasy game for that matter. Because they are filled with men that have long hair.

Plot twist: They thought every NPC with long hair was a woman with a weirdly deep voice

And wearing fake beards/stubble is a trend among them!

Syldras

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »

They can't be playing ESO either, or any Elder Scrolls game, or any fantasy game for that matter. Because they are filled with men that have long hair.

Plot twist: They thought every NPC with long hair was a woman with a weirdly deep voice

And wearing fake beards/stubble is a trend among them!

Yes. This has to be a woman - she's even wearing a circlet!

Aztrias

I just want longer hair and more braided options like we had in Skyrim

Sephyr

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

Shadowspawn42 wrote: »

Amunari wrote: »

[Quoted post was removed]

I fail to understand how a male character having long hair (or a female one having short hair) is “politics”. [snip] Hair length is not an inherent trait of one’s sex. Pointed ears or eyes on Mer are an inherent trait because all Mer have them. Hairstyle is an aesthetic choice that can be made in real life. Plenty of real men have long hair (and plenty of real women have short hair).
Seriously, why do people feel so threatened by the idea of gender neutral clothing/hairstyles/etc that they can’t even handle them in a game?

This is a very sensitive topic, but you will need to learn to accept that not everyone supports these things and nor do they have to. Some people do not want to play a game with guys running around in dresses, or other such things.

This is the world we live in.


That being said, i have strict positions on these types of things as a designer. I also believe that religion does not belong in games (so xmas holiday sales, etc). I believe as designers we are hurting the game by not making its own holidays, completely isolated from the real world ones. Sure there may be some tie like "timing" for example, a elven holiday mid dec, but it should not be or fall on xmas, or any other RL such holiday.

[snip] because ultimately that is not part of the lore, and it should not be. This would massively devalue the game, and work to rob the races, and the games lore of its identity.

This not as a disrespect to anyone, just a belief that such things should not be intentionally worked into game design. [snip]

Companies should show their support or lack there of through real life attend events like blizz-con etc.

[Edited to remove Offensive Content]

Where in the lore does it say that hair styles and cosmetic items can't be worn by male characters? Besides, in every single culture, you are going to have someone who wishes to do what may be considered "taboo" by others- its simply the way life works. And they have my support in it, because there's no reason why a hairstyle or article of clothing should ever be limited to gender, IRL or in a videogame. It has nothing to do with politics. It's common sense. ESO is already a videogame that expresses tolerance and understanding, why not extend that understanding to these things as well?

And you have my full support in wanting these hairstyles, and more, for men. I found it frustrating that I couldn't use them in the character creator. (I would ESPECIALLY love some hair styles that weren't completely pulled back from the male's face, and gave him some sweeping bangs with a pony tail, for example, or something else equally rougeish and charming.)

Not only that, there's just tons of cultures that high fantasy games are based on (loosely) that long hair on men is pretty much the norm. If ESO wishes to remain tolerant, they're eventually going to have to get rid of genderlocked cosmetics. Especially when there's already so much inconsistency to begin with.