Please at least change Barrier back?

Cireous

I can't believe I cannot use Barrier in the Overland, at Harrowstorms, Dragons, and World Bosses any longer. This is a staple on every one one of my characters and now it's completely useless. Please reconsider all of these changes you are making to skills and sets, forcing us to only use healing/support while in a group. So much of group play in this game is played outside of a group. The barrier change, along with others, is just making things so unfun right now. Also, the direction of healing in general, with such short timers on all our skills and buffs, is making healing in this game a total headache with all the constant recasting we have to do. I really hope the direction you are taking is reversed here. I know you need to fix performance, but there has to be a way you can do this without gutting this playstyle entirely.

Kadoin

Cireous wrote: »

I can't believe I cannot use Barrier in the Overland, at Harrowstorms, Dragons, and World Bosses any longer. This is a staple on every one one of my characters and now it's completely useless. Please reconsider all of these changes you are making to skills and sets, forcing us to only use healing/support while in a group. So much of group play in this game is played outside of a group. The barrier change, along with others, is just making things so unfun right now. Also, the direction of healing in general, with such short timers on all our skills and buffs, is making healing in this game a total headache with all the constant recasting we have to do. I really hope the direction you are taking is reversed here. I know you need to fix performance, but there has to be a way you can do this without gutting this playstyle entirely.

True and it's a shame that PvE and Cyro will now be completely useless for "solo" healers. It's funny because I considered Greymoor to be the worst patch ever in this game, but after PTS changes, I am wondering if its possible to rate the game 0/10 instead of 1/10.

Vevvev

I agree OP and I kind of wish they didn't increase the cost on the Greymoor patch. Even though it was only effecting groups at least it was cheap enough for personal use. Now it's so expensive it's better to slot something else for a defensive ultimate, especially on my vampire character where the price gets rediculous at higher stages.

Cronopoly

Was this done because of the passive regen...in PVE ? 😕

AcadianPaladin

I am another healer who spends much more time ungrouped than grouped - WBs, dolmens, dragons, geysers. . . . When Barrier was changed from supporting 'allies' to supporting 'group members only', the skill instantly and permanently came off my bar.

Looking ahead at the PTS patchnotes, it seems many sets will be changing from 'helps allies' to 'helps group members'. If it works out that way, both Earthgore and Winter's Respite will go into my 'grind up' pile.

The same concern applies to tanks; that is why mine will not wear Ebon Armory.

The lesson going forward seems to be 'embrace 'selfish' sets'. Fine.

Taleof2Cities

In before all the "nerf cross-heals" and "nerf purge" trolls start posting in this thread ...

Spartabunny08

Been playing for years and completely can't understand what they're thinking in terms of the changes over the past year. I used to have so much fun and it's like Zos has decided to nerf fun. They hate on tanks and healers. They just keep making it harder for both to function in any capacity. Play as you want? Not anymore. I have had to step away from this game. Block has been butchered and is no longer working correctly. Healing butchered no longer worth it. I must say this direction just doesn't sit well with me. I was another that always had Barrier slotted was a great anti bomber tool now useless. It's just sad. Wr want to have fun Zos. Buff things stop the nerfing please. This game was better before. The player base liked the 1.6 update the most lets build around that and have fun. Games are for fun please let us have fun or risk the end of a once great game. We don't need every 3 months a new meta. How about Zos work on making those expensive houses functional. I want a stable master, writ boards, able to grow the alchemical ingredients for my potions... so much potential and the focus is so not where it needs to be. Let tanks and healers have fun doing the job they love.

VaranisArano

This barrier change and the support set changes are a slight buff to my raid healer...when I'm raiding with my PVP guild.

It still pointless in a PUG raid (sorry, PUGs, but you scatter too far apart to take advantage of most support buffs), and now I'm nerfed for zerg-surfing.

I hope that the changes help with performance, because I'm not seeing the benefits for balance.

laksikus

if zerg surfing is nerfed. its good

Spartabunny08

laksikus wrote: »

if zerg surfing is nerfed. its good

So no solos or small groups...?

Wandering_Immigrant

I kind of miss the days when MMOs encouraged grouping outside of designated group areas. I always thought it was cool/convenient that we could use our full support kit on people outside our group, but I also always thought it felt impersonal. As someone who often heals at WBs and runs solo in cyrodiil I'd also sometimes feel under appreciated, no one really knows where that support is coming from it's just there.

It's not like it's difficult to group up, we just don't do it because we can get/give full group support without grouping. If these changes encourage more grouping then cool, if they improve performance on top of that then win-win. If people aren't grouping more casually after this then I guess all that support myself and others have been providing was never needed anyway so no loss.

tsaescishoeshiner

What we might see is more grouping in group content. If you're doing dragon fights or healing, just /zone or /yell that you're a healer lfg.

Milli_Rabbit

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

What we might see is more grouping in group content. If you're doing dragon fights or healing, jusr /zone or /yell that you're a healer lfg.

I agree. This encourages grouping and if it improves performance its great.

Zabagad

I'm 100% pro performance, but I'm 100% against "start a group everywhere and cancel the group 1-5min later"
As a former barrier-lover I have no problem in normal overland content with that change, but it hurts in every keep fight in Cyro.

I see only one solution to fit both (performance and PUG-support) - get back to the start of all this mess and revert the block change.
Instead they changed healing, support, sets and all that stuff - I don't understand why....?

mikikatze

I'm confused... when did barrier ever heal/shield people outside of a group?

Cireous

mikikatze wrote: »

I'm confused... when did barrier ever heal/shield people outside of a group?

It has always healed allies, outside a group, until the Greymoor patch, where the claim is that they simply 'fixed it'.

Greymor Update 26 Patch Notes:

Barrier: Increased the cost of this Ultimate and its morphs to 250, up from 200, to ensure it meets standards with other Ultimates that apply to 12 targets.
Replenishing Barrier (morph): Fixed an issue where this ability could apply to non-grouped targets.

Cireous

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

What we might see is more grouping in group content. If you're doing dragon fights or healing, jusr /zone or /yell that you're a healer lfg.

Except this won't happen at all. We'll simply replace our skills/sets that no longer allow us heal/support "non" group members with the leftover skills and sets that do, no matter how annoying it is, and how shittier the other skills/sets are. Once these options are eventually also rendered unuseable, us Overlanders and solo Cyrodil healer/supporters will likely find another, less restrictive game to play.

I remember, in Rift, they had a mechanic, I think, where once you entered an event location in a questing zone, you were automatically joined into a large raid group. If this were to be implemented in ESO (granted, on a much smaller scale), at World Bosses and static event areas, I wouldn't see a problem with sets having "group only" qualifications for usability. However, forcing us to go through the hassle of forming groups for short, very temporary content out in our immersive world is super unappealing. No one but the healers would be interested in this, because everyone can just heal themselves, really, if they want, and they would likely just ignore group invites. This is our questing content after all. Most people just want to be left alone. Alone, together; it's how we MMO out here in the Overland. I wouldn't be interested in this, too, because grouping up for every little thing is awkward and unimmersive, especially when the difficulty level of a lot of this content just doesn't require grouping to begin with (I still, however, want to support and heal regardless).

Man, this is a bummer. I did not see all this crap coming.

Grianasteri

Do the passives from slotting Barrier (Support skill) still work?

Cireous

Grianasteri wrote: »

Do the passives from slotting Barrier (Support skill) still work?

Like Magicka Aid? I don't see why not, if you have it slotted.

Vevvev

Grianasteri wrote: »

Do the passives from slotting Barrier (Support skill) still work?

Yes

peacenote

Cireous wrote: »

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

What we might see is more grouping in group content. If you're doing dragon fights or healing, jusr /zone or /yell that you're a healer lfg.

Except this won't happen at all. We'll simply replace our skills/sets that no longer allow us heal/support "non" group members with the leftover skills and sets that do, no matter how annoying it is, and how shittier the other skills/sets are. Once these options are eventually also rendered unuseable, us Overlanders and solo Cyrodil healer/supporters will likely find another, less restrictive game to play.

I remember, in Rift, they had a mechanic, I think, where once you entered an event location in a questing zone, you were automatically joined into a large raid group. If this were to be implemented in ESO (granted, on a much smaller scale), at World Bosses and static event areas, I wouldn't see a problem with sets having "group only" qualifications for usability. However, forcing us to go through the hassle of forming groups for short, very temporary content out in our immersive world is super unappealing. No one but the healers would be interested in this, because everyone can just heal themselves, really, if they want, and they would likely just ignore group invites. This is our questing content after all. Most people just want to be left alone. Alone, together; it's how we MMO out here in the Overland. I wouldn't be interested in this, too, because grouping up for every little thing is awkward and unimmersive, especially when the difficulty level of a lot of this content just doesn't require grouping to begin with (I still, however, want to support and heal regardless).

Man, this is a bummer. I did not see all this crap coming.

I was going to write almost exactly this. Yep it was Rift and it was a really nice QoL mechanic.

Something to keep in mind, too, is that it isn't just about making a group. Often it is about disbanding a group of friends to make the group and then have to re-group when the larger group goes its separate ways.

It isn't worth it and it won't change grouping behavior. It will just make fun dynamic temporary groups happen less and less. Being a healer and jumping in quick is part of what makes healing fun. Grrr.

Cireous

peacenote wrote: »

I was going to write almost exactly this. Yep it was Rift and it was a really nice QoL mechanic.

Something to keep in mind, too, is that it isn't just about making a group. Often it is about disbanding a group of friends to make the group and then have to re-group when the larger group goes its separate ways.

It isn't worth it and it won't change grouping behavior. It will just make fun dynamic temporary groups happen less and less. Being a healer and jumping in quick is part of what makes healing fun. Grrr.

Agreed. And the PVPer's are going super hard on wanting healing to be a group only mechanic, period. As it stands currently, we still have a bunch of stuff left that hits "allies nearby" instead of just group members, but what will the landscape look like 6 months from now. Will there be anything left for us at all? If not, I wish they would seriously consider, and, better yet, quickly implement some kind of dynamic group creation in the Overland (at World Bosses and Harrowstorms and the like). And, in cases like you have described, once leaving the location, your previous group should still be maintained.

Sergykid

i would so much like people with this kind of topics to also post the link from where they got the info

honey_badger82

Spartabunny08 wrote: »

Been playing for years and completely can't understand what they're thinking in terms of the changes over the past year. I used to have so much fun and it's like Zos has decided to nerf fun. They hate on tanks and healers. They just keep making it harder for both to function in any capacity. Play as you want? Not anymore. I have had to step away from this game. Block has been butchered and is no longer working correctly. Healing butchered no longer worth it. I must say this direction just doesn't sit well with me. I was another that always had Barrier slotted was a great anti bomber tool now useless. It's just sad. Wr want to have fun Zos. Buff things stop the nerfing please. This game was better before. The player base liked the 1.6 update the most lets build around that and have fun. Games are for fun please let us have fun or risk the end of a once great game. We don't need every 3 months a new meta. How about Zos work on making those expensive houses functional. I want a stable master, writ boards, able to grow the alchemical ingredients for my potions... so much potential and the focus is so not where it needs to be. Let tanks and healers have fun doing the job they love.

I second everything you said. There is no play as you want only play as meta dictates. There is hardly any fun in playing anymore. [snip]

[edited for bashing]

Ryath_Waylander

Sergykid wrote: »

i would so much like people with this kind of topics to also post the link from where they got the info

It's in the Greymoor patch notes. A loooong way down under "Alliance War" https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/528633/pc-mac-patch-notes-v6-0-5-greymoor-update-26#latest

BXR_Lonestar

TBH, when I'm running around overland on my healer, I usually slot Desto Ult rather than barrier anyways, but now I'll probably run Nova and Desto Ult rather than Warhorn/Desto Ult.

I appreciate what they are trying to do, but I definitely agree with the sentiment that this is not the way to do it. I can see content like the overland dragons becoming nearly impossible to do unless you actually join a group, and not everyone wants to join a group full of randoms. I mean, have you ever sat in zone chat and just watched for a while? Some people are pretty nice, but there are many toxic players out there that I just want nothing to do with - and that is the pool of players we'd be drawing from to do more difficult overland content like the dragons and harrowstorms - no thanks man.

IMO, I think they're trying to do do technical yoga to try to get around the need to 1) upgrade their engine and 2) upgrade their servers. Both of which are going to be necessary IMO for the long-term health of the game. And I DO hope this game is around for the long-term.

AcadianPaladin

As a PvE player, I've already made my dislike for transitioning from 'help allies' to 'help group only' sets/skills. The end result for my healer will be complete 'selfish' sets instead of help group (AND NEARBY ALLIES) sets. As I said above, Barrier is long removed from my skill bar.

If there is some for the changes in PvP, could they not be limited to take effect only in the PvP environment? Is that not the purpose of 'battle spirit'?

Scarkii

honestly the healing changes have made it way more enjoyable for me, i hated it when you had to spam healing springs that was the most annoying thing ever and just made buffing allies a lot harder